[4e] Races of Kurohiem

[Ceiling009]

This is a campaign setting I'm working on, and I sort of wanted to ursurp the normal races; I dunno, I just don't want any of the standard races to show up...

If anyone is interested, I might even to posting the campaign setting too...

Anyway; I have 4 out of at least 9 of the "base" races more or less finished up, and I want some feedback on them. Please be as thorough as you want to be...

1) The Dolls (https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B3_qWeuu5gtSNDdlMWU1NTctNmYxZS00MDAwLWJmO TUtZmU2OTAxMGMyNjRi&sort=name&layout=list&num=50), are an android race; built to serve but have since grown into their own.

2) The Hantu (https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B3_qWeuu5gtSNmM4ZDgwZjAtOWIwNi00MDI5LWIzY mQtM2VjNzJiODg3MjQ2&sort=name&layout=list&num=50), are a race of the Undead of sorts. While not truly dead, they're not quite alive either.

3) The Seiryu (https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B3_qWeuu5gtSMzY1ZmFmMGMtZDIxMC00ODY1LTk5N jctN2M2YmJkODAxMDU4&sort=name&layout=list&num=50), a dragonblooded race of people, once an empire, now just a outpost of their former glory.

4) The Zho (https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B3_qWeuu5gtSMWZmYTA5M2MtN2NjNi00ODliLWJlY TItM2FlNWU3Y2I0ZDA2&sort=name&layout=list&num=50), a nomadic merchant people who travel all over the world, creating connections and exploring wilds.

I'll get to posting some of the works in progress...

[Ceiling009]

Reserved for work in progress races.

[Crossfiyah]

Dolls:

I'd make it a +2 bonus to any effects with the charm or psychic keyword. I'm not sure why psychic, but whatever.

The racial ability, though, is boring. Attacks in general are a bad way to go with racial powers because if they miss, nothing happens.

How about something like:

Defensive Matrix
You manifest a shield, deflecting an incoming attack from causing you serious harm
Immediate Reaction, when an enemy hits you
Encounter
Effect: Gain temporary hit points equal to 3 + one half your level. You gain a +2 to all defenses until the start of your next turn.

Hantu:

Skills: Is this all charisma-based skill checks, or just charisma checks? I really am not sure when you would just make a charisma check. I'd honestly drop this and instead give a +2 to Diplomacy or something, like a normal race.

Living Dead: This is really way too good of a feature. The closest thing to this is the Reverent, who doesn't achieve this until epic level and 3 feats. My recommendation is to instead daze them, and allow them to remain conscious for one turn after being reduced to 0 hit points. Then they fall like normal. You can add feats to give them more versatility if you so desire.

For the record, that's also two races that never have to sleep, and can both trance. Not a good sign for the next two, I must admit.

Soul Eater: Once again, straight attacks are not good ideas. I'm also not sure why it has the necrotic key word, since it doesn't do necrotic damage. How about..

Soul Eater
You draw forth a small part of their soul energy in order to fuel your own existence.
Minor action
Encounter
Special: You must have hit the opponent on your turn
Effect: You gain a +2 bonus to all damage rolls until the end of your next turn.
11th level: +4 bonus to damage rolls
21st level: +6 bonus to damage rolls

Seiryu:

Leap of Heaven: That's an odd number to choose. It's going to get messy real fast. Keep the running start stuff if you want, but just make it roll twice and take the higher result. Easier on everyone.

Heaven's Landing: ...So...You could drop from a mile in the air, and land it? That's...sort of ridiculous. How about "You reduce the distance you fall by a number of feet equal to your level. If this number is greater than the distance you would fall, you do not fall prone."

Star Soldier: I'm not that familiar with those feats, but this strikes me as ripe for cheese. Give me an hour and I'm positive I could break this, especially since Martial is already considered the best power source, by far. Just get rid of this completely.

Star Serpent Lineage: Ok, major problem for you. This is useful to about half of the classes in the game. The reason that WotC doesn't include proficiencies with races anymore is because it leaves some races better suited for some classes than others. Any ranged class or magical class will never want to be this, ever.

Consider completely revamping that.

Dragon Channel:

It's ok for some reasons and completely broken for others. It's broken because it gives you a minor action attack, once an encounter. The reason Rangers are the best strikers in the game is because they can do minor action attacks.

Change it to a free action, after you hit with an attack. You add two keywords and extra damage. Fixed.

Zho:

Hunter's Instinct: You have this odd habit of making things more complicated than necessary. For example...

Pedigree:

I'm not going individual on this. I feel like you should drop this completely and make one, or two different races instead. Regardless, defense boosts are only used to balance races that share the same NAD with both stat boosts. Like, for instance, Wis and Cha, or Dex and Int, or Str and Con. If you choose Int, give a +1 bonus to Fort. Otherwise, don't.

+2 bonus to attack rolls, even for a healing surge, is too good/
Second one is worthless
Third one isn't worth a healing surge
Fourth one is ok, but it contradicts what the power entails. You raise your defenses to prevent losing healing surges.
Fifth one is probably overpowered, but I don't know, this whole race left me agitated.

Pick two of those clans and do two different racial write-ups. Drop the last three. Or stat all 5 out if you want. But don't cram them all into the one, it's really going in about 9000 directions.




I didn't look at feats or paragon paths, but I can get back to it once some updates are done.

[Ceiling009]

1) Dolls

System Reboot: All constructs have that; (considering there's only one other real construct race) I think the warforged have a +2 bonus to saves against ongoing damage and the take 10 against death rolls. I could change it to +2.

While I appreciate the note on being boring about the racial, I'm not changing it. It's not like the dragonborn are any more or less boring because their racial gives them a gimped version of dragon's breath.

2) Hantu

It is +2 to charisma checks, which aren't attacks; but apply to skill checks.

Note on Living Dead: I hate the way the Revenant works, it just seems so not undead. I'm Okay with giving them dazed while below 0, and dies at negative half healing surge?

Soul Eater: Since it has the necrotic keyword, it does necrotic damage, that's why it has the keyword. Though I should probably reiterate it like they do in powers. I still don't want to change the power, since it wouldn't make sense otherwise; and giving them a Boost instead seems completely out of their character. I might make:

Soul Eater
Encounter; Necrotic
Immediate Reaction Close Burst 1
Trigger: You are bloodied
Target: Creature who triggered attack
Attack: Str, Con, Dex +3 vs Fort; +6 at 11th, +9 at 21st
Hit: 1d6 + Con mod necrotic damage; 2d6 at 11th, 3d6 at 21st
Effect: You gain 5 + Con mod temp hp. 10 at 11th, and 20 at 21st.

3) Seiryu

Leap of Heaven does that because the rules of jumping involve dividing by 5 or whatever, I might change to just "You always have a running start and gain a +5 bonus to Athletics when jumping"

Heaven's Landing only reduces the damage by half. So if you fall a mile, you take half the damage for falling a mile. It doesn't let you not get damaged; in fact, a person trained in acrobatics can do that same thing.

Star Soldier: This isn't cheesy if you're familiar with the feats - They're multiclass; basically allows them to get whip training, net training, and bola training; for a little while spiked chain training was martial only too, and get the rest of the training feats for weapon mastery. It also opens them up for more weapon mastery feats especially since ->

Star Serpent Lineage: I'll drop the weapon proficiencies, and make those multi-class weapon mastery feats. I still don't know if an Elf Cleric would mind that he has proficiency in a bow and short sword even if he'll never use them.

Dragon Channel: It does allow for a minor action attack, but that's why it's an encounter power. It's better than the dilettante of half elf, but is boosted because it's just one your at-wills you chose. I might just change it to free action triggered when you make an attack. I'm not making it a racial striker feature. That's for later.

4) The Zho: They're complicated. But so are Genasi. And there are 9 versions of them. I might change out the racial powers. For while I was happy with them; but now not so much. Might add a multi-class racial thing to allow transformations or something... Though really, have you looked through the Genasi? They're about as complicated. So while I'm willing to change out the racials, I'm not going to split the race into 5 seperate write ups.

Note: I know that same set NADs get defense bonuses and non same set NADs don't get a bonus, but looking through the printed races, that's not always the case. Like I said, look at the Genasi, which I modeled this race after.

Hunter's instinct should be fine. It just allows more for those who choose a class with Perception. Effectively gives three +2 bonuses to skills, much like the Shardmind. Or for those without perception as a class skill, it's a nice skill training. Otherwise I think they're be either lacking or not lacking, since a +5 racial bonus of perception would way too good.

Anyway, thanks for you critique, but some of it will not change, since I like the way the flavor works. Racial attacks, while boring for you, seem about on par for what I'm looking to build for some of these races. I'll probably change out the Zho Racials, since I don't like them at this moment, but most of the everything I disagree with you probably won't.

[Crossfiyah]

In that case, best of luck. Hope your players have lower standards. But just to be fair...


1) Dolls

System Reboot: All constructs have that; (considering there's only one other real construct race) I think the warforged have a +2 bonus to saves against ongoing damage and the take 10 against death rolls. I could change it to +2.

While I appreciate the note on being boring about the racial, I'm not changing it. It's not like the dragonborn are any more or less boring because their racial gives them a gimped version of dragon's breath.

The dragonborn is an example of one of the worst racial powers in the game, so you're already aiming high for comparisons. Their racial power isn't even good unless you heavily invest feats into it, and then only if you're arcane. Strike one.


2) Hantu

It is +2 to charisma checks, which aren't attacks; but apply to skill checks.

So say Charisma skill checks.


Note on Living Dead: I hate the way the Revenant works, it just seems so not undead. I'm Okay with giving them dazed while below 0, and dies at negative half healing surge?

No. It's not ok. Use feats to get them there. As a DM, if I can't incapacitate a character unless they're dead, I'll kill them. End of character.


Soul Eater: Since it has the necrotic keyword, it does necrotic damage, that's why it has the keyword. Though I should probably reiterate it like they do in powers. I still don't want to change the power, since it wouldn't make sense otherwise; and giving them a Boost instead seems completely out of their character. I might make:

Soul Eater
Encounter; Necrotic
Immediate Reaction Close Burst 1
Trigger: You are bloodied
Target: Creature who triggered attack
Attack: Str, Con, Dex +3 vs Fort; +6 at 11th, +9 at 21st
Hit: 1d6 + Con mod necrotic damage; 2d6 at 11th, 3d6 at 21st
Effect: You gain 5 + Con mod temp hp. 10 at 11th, and 20 at 21st.

Still awful, and still only useful for the few that pump Con.


3) Seiryu

Leap of Heaven does that because the rules of jumping involve dividing by 5 or whatever, I might change to just "You always have a running start and gain a +5 bonus to Athletics when jumping"

Good enough.


Heaven's Landing only reduces the damage by half. So if you fall a mile, you take half the damage for falling a mile. It doesn't let you not get damaged; in fact, a person trained in acrobatics can do that same thing.

No, no they can't. They can reduce it by half of their acrobatics check and if they still take damage they still fall prone. So strike two.


Star Soldier: This isn't cheesy if you're familiar with the feats - They're multiclass; basically allows them to get whip training, net training, and bola training; for a little while spiked chain training was martial only too, and get the rest of the training feats for weapon mastery. It also opens them up for more weapon mastery feats especially since ->

So I get full access to nets, bolas, and spiked chains? Yeah. Not overpowered in the slightest. Strike three.


Star Serpent Lineage: I'll drop the weapon proficiencies, and make those multi-class weapon mastery feats. I still don't know if an Elf Cleric would mind that he has proficiency in a bow and short sword even if he'll never use them.


Dragon Channel: It does allow for a minor action attack, but that's why it's an encounter power. It's better than the dilettante of half elf, but is boosted because it's just one your at-wills you chose. I might just change it to free action triggered when you make an attack. I'm not making it a racial striker feature. That's for later.

You said nothing with this. You said you acknowledge that it's better than dilenttante, one of the best racial powers in the game. You also said it was a minor action encounter attack, which I already knew, since I have eyes. Still broken.


4) The Zho: They're complicated. But so are Genasi. And there are 9 versions of them. I might change out the racial powers. For while I was happy with them; but now not so much. Might add a multi-class racial thing to allow transformations or something... Though really, have you looked through the Genasi? They're about as complicated. So while I'm willing to change out the racials, I'm not going to split the race into 5 seperate write ups.

Genasi aren't near as complicated. Their racial powers are also just as awful for the most part.


Note: I know that same set NADs get defense bonuses and non same set NADs don't get a bonus, but looking through the printed races, that's not always the case. Like I said, look at the Genasi, which I modeled this race after.

Hunter's instinct should be fine. It just allows more for those who choose a class with Perception. Effectively gives three +2 bonuses to skills, much like the Shardmind. Or for those without perception as a class skill, it's a nice skill training. Otherwise I think they're be either lacking or not lacking, since a +5 racial bonus of perception would way too good.

You essentially give them the human ability to achieve an additional skill training, except you automatically give them the most useful skill in the game. I just have to ask at this point, what is your thought process?


Anyway, thanks for you critique, but some of it will not change, since I like the way the flavor works. Racial attacks, while boring for you, seem about on par for what I'm looking to build for some of these races. I'll probably change out the Zho Racials, since I don't like them at this moment, but most of the everything I disagree with you probably won't.ith you probably won't.

Seems like to me you're trying to recreate some "highbrow" Otaku world, and I honestly think you shouldn't. Regardless of that however, the points I stressed before, and now, are concerns you should seriously entertain, even if it contradicts or changes your precious fluff. I know, the delete key is really hard to reach, but sometimes the extra mile is worth it.

[Ceiling009]

1)
*sigh*
Considering they're the only one of the 4 with a real standard racial attack. I think I'll leave it.

2) When you say "check" it involves all rolls that aren't attacks, damage or saves (though saves aren't tied to anything). So skill check, stat check, anything with Charisma that you have to roll for, but isn't an attack or damage roll or a save roll. It covers it. That's why its stated as "check".

3) That's okay, kill them off. Seriously, though, I don't like the way that the undead... aren't actually undead. The Dazed condition is the second worst workable condition, considering it lets only take one action, No OA's or immediate actions, and you grant combat advantage. This racial doesn't let you be immune to the unconscious condition, you just have to actually inflict that instead of knocking them down to zero. It models the idea of the undead pretty well I think. Better than, "Oh I can do a round's worth of action then fall down."

4) I'll let you think what you want to think, I might change it to 5 + half level.

5) Okay then, Change to: "You can make an acrobatics check to reduce the damage from your fall, even if you're not trained. You never fall prone, even if you take damage from the fall."

6) I think you misunderstand. They're feats. You gotta spend it. It's a multi-class feat no less. You lose your multi-class. You don't auto get them for being the racial, or even just martial. No. You still gotta spend the feat slot. It just allows you be considered martial to get the weapon mastery feat line. Maybe you should look through Dragon 368. Since you're not at all familiar with them. Also Spiked Chain Training isn't even martial required, just Dex 13. Really, look those up.

7) I'm not sure you can read maybe, or maybe you just skimmed over it... But I mentioned changing it to a free action triggered by an attack (At-will). Or just making it a free action that says "on your next at-will attack" effect happens. I'm not keeping it the way it is.

8) I don't see how they're any less or any more complicated. The Genasi have a slew of random racials depending on your choice to be whatever elemental manifestation you first choose. Some get resistances, 4 of the 9 get +1 to a defense, (2 for fort, 1 for ref, and 1 for will). And yes, their racials are sort of awful, dependent on the manifestation.

9) I wanted a race that actually good at perceiving. Since Listen and what ever the one skill was in 3.5 don't actually exist per se, You can't just give good bonuses for that. Then this is what I'll do, Give them a Choice of either Perception or Athletics in the Skill bonus line, and make Perception always on their class skill list.