A changeling warshaper

[realbombchu]

This was one of the only good build ideas I've ever had. I don't know who thought of it first, only that I thought of it on my own. But, when I shared the idea here a while back, it sparked a debate about whether changelings could use the class features.

I say they can, even if it is kind of cheesey. Has this debate ever been settled, or is it still a big can of worms?

[GoodbyeSoberDay]

I don't have any of the Eberron books handy, but if I recall correctly, the changeling has the same Change Shape [Su] ability that the doppelganger has. If so, the changeling does indeed qualify for Warshaper (after attaining +4 BaB anyway).

[Coidzor]

It's been bandied about online like it qualifies due to the subtype, so, yeah.

[Snake-Aes]

Changelings have the shapechanger subtype.
The pre-requisite is access to wildshape, the polymorph line or the shapechanger subtype.

There's no need to make any sort of cheesy or art-major-physics interpretation of it. They qualify fair and clearly.


The shapechanger subtype is handy, you know? If someone casts any sort of polymorph (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/balefulPolymorph.htm) on a shapechanger, he just nulls it with a standard action!

[grarrrg]

I say they can, even if it is kind of cheesey. Has this debate ever been settled, or is it still a big can of worms?

Here is the official answer to end all answers, it is the ultimate answer to the question posed, no other answer can come close to equaling its answer-ish-ness.

Wait for it...

Ask your DM

TA-DA!!

[Dr.Epic]

I don't see how they wouldn't be able to use any of the warshaper class features, but that feature they get at level I could never figure out how that would work for a changeling.

[Prime32]

I don't see how they wouldn't be able to use any of the warshaper class features, but that feature they get at level I could never figure out how that would work for a changeling.You don't see how a changeling who has chosen to speciliase in shapechanging could change the shape of their nails to make them pointy?

Shifters also qualify for the class, and likely have better stats.

[Snake-Aes]

You don't see how a changeling who has chosen to speciliase in shapechanging could change the shape of their nails to make them pointy?

Shifters also qualify for the class, and likely have better stats.

The class even says that you DEVELOP the natural weapons. And in the case you already have them, they get better.

Funny how some things are doubted, isn't it? The warforged wizard "deserves" to be a warshaper because he has (omg) polymorph, but the natural born shapechanger with the shapechanger subtype, the shapechange-like supernatural ability and the story of doppleganger (A SHAPECHANGER!!!11one) ascendancy doesn't "deserve" it.

[Raging Gene Ray]

I say they can, even if it is kind of cheesey. Has this debate ever been settled, or is it still a big can of worms?

What do you mean? It's not cheesy at all unlees you interpret the Morphic Weapons ability as allowing you to grow an unlimited number of tentacles, giving you infinity + 1 attacks. And doesn't it say something about you being limited to 1 natural attack at a time anyway?

[Thrice Dead Cat]

Changelings get full benefit of the Warshaper class. They qualify via their subtype and when not in their natural form, which is explicitly called out to be a generic gray-skinned gendered humanoid of X feet and Y weight, they get everything that Warshaper says they do as their racial shapechanging ability is called out to be a physical change in form despite mimicking the same changes in appearance that Disguise Self/ Does.

Yes, this means that a Changeling with naturally green eyes who makes them blue could grow claws by virtue of being a warshaper. Said Changeling, if sufficiently high enough in the Warshaper class, would also gain the bonuses to strength and constitution.

[realbombchu]

See, these are the arguements I pointed out last time: about how clearly it said they qualified, how they physically changed form (no illusory effects), and that any form that wasn't your own counted as a transformation.

I'm glad it's been settled, and I agree with you all that keeping the changeling out of the warshaper class is kind of counter-intuitive.

Last time though, there were people saying that Minor Change Shape is not enough to qualify as transformed. That's what made me doubt myself.

[Jjeinn-tae]

See, these are the arguements I pointed out last time: about how clearly it said they qualified, how they physically changed form (no illusory effects), and that any form that wasn't your own counted as a transformation.

I'm glad it's been settled, and I agree with you all that keeping the changeling out of the warshaper class is kind of counter-intuitive.

Last time though, there were people saying that Minor Change Shape is not enough to qualify as transformed. That's what made me doubt myself.

To add further to that, it's pretty much been answered already:


Changelings have the shapechanger subtype.
The pre-requisite is access to wildshape, the polymorph line or the shapechanger subtype.

There's no need to make any sort of cheesy or art-major-physics interpretation of it. They qualify fair and clearly.


The shapechanger subtype is handy, you know? If someone casts any sort of polymorph (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/balefulPolymorph.htm) on a shapechanger, he just nulls it with a standard action!

Shapechanger subtypetype qualifies you, changelings are shapechangers, they qualify.