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Lucid
2010-09-29, 09:53 AM
I'm looking for some advice how to roleplay a character that isn't really smart, but still cunning. The character is a Wild Elf Swift Hunter with Int 8 and Wis 18.

I realize that he shouldn't be terribly dumb, though he wouldn't be using any big words. I'm also wondering how these stats would relate to using tactics, since I envision him to be quite smart when it comes to those, being a hunter and all.

I hope the playground can give me some suggestions.
Thanks in advance.

hamishspence
2010-09-29, 09:59 AM
Maybe stress Int as "book smarts" and Wis as insight, cunning, and whatnot.

The character might be slow-thinking- but that doesn't mean poor thinking processes.

They may come across as yokel-ish- having trouble finding the words for what they mean, but "no fool".

It's probably a pretty common archetype.

Sir Enigma
2010-09-29, 10:01 AM
High Wisdom should indicate being intuitive and perceptive, while low Intelligence would mean being less analytic. My feeling would be that the character shouldn't go in for elaborate plans and long-term strategy, but should be good at seeing the holes in other people's plans, and good at short-term tactics and at making good decisions when rushed. You might also have a hard time explaining exactly why you think something is a good idea.

Quietus
2010-09-29, 10:02 AM
I'd say, play off of instincts. You KNOW that guy is lying, you just can't say when when pressed for it. You can look at a mushroom/plant/animal in the wild, possibly having never seen it before, and can usually guess correctly if eating it will kill you - but it's because you've had things similar to them before, not because that pattern of brown and off-white means it's of the fungiris family, a highly delicious mushroom poisonous only to one variety of rodent native to the next continent over.

subject42
2010-09-29, 10:16 AM
To expand on Quietus's post, you shouldn't have any problem knowing the answer to things, but you should have a very hard time saying why the answer is what it is.

CarpeGuitarrem
2010-09-29, 10:20 AM
To expand on Quietus's post, you shouldn't have any problem knowing the answer to things, but you should have a very hard time saying why the answer is what it is.
Spot-on. High Wis means you notice things, but low Int means you're not very rationalist. You don't know how to construct an argument. You're not learned, and you use simple words. It's the wise old guy in the village who just knows things, but never explains why.

mucat
2010-09-29, 10:26 AM
I'm looking for some advice how to roleplay a character that isn't really smart, but still cunning. The character is a Wild Elf Swift Hunter with Int 8 and Wis 18.

I realize that he shouldn't be terribly dumb, though he wouldn't be using any big words. I'm also wondering how these stats would relate to using tactics, since I envision him to be quite smart when it comes to those, being a hunter and all.

Wolves are quite smart tactically, and this guy is four times as smart as a wolf! :smallwink:

Seriously, I wouldn't make a big deal out of his low intelligence (and I'm a stickler for roleplaying a character's mental stats, rather than ignoring them except for die rolls) because 8 simply isn't that low. Hell, 8 Int is exactly average for a Wild Elf, and I don't think they were ever meant to be dumb...just wild, with minds more centered in the immediate situation than in long-term plans or academic abstractions.

In the wilderness, play him as cunning, resourceful, and perceptive. Extremely so, given that super-high Wisdom. The below-average Int can mean that he's slower to learn new things, and should become evident when he's in the city or some other fish-out-of-water situation...but in his forest, he doesn't need to learn new things fast, because he's confident with what he already knows.

GoatToucher
2010-09-29, 10:35 AM
A cowboy.

Good at what he does, but not much for book learnin' and areas outside his immediate skill set. Cunning, but not very analytical.

Note that Clint Eastwood style cowboys don't really fit the bill for this, as they tend to be pretty sharp. We're talking more 1950's style cowboys.

RandomLunatic
2010-09-29, 10:40 AM
Forrest Gump is a classic low INT, high WIS character.

Prime32
2010-09-29, 10:43 AM
"The mayor seems nervous. And slightly shorter. And his breath smells vaguely of brimstone.

...He must have been in an accident."

HenryHankovitch
2010-09-29, 11:08 AM
An 8 Int is a good reason for the character to have poor grammar or a difficult accent, also. Especially since your character is a wild elf. It's not necessarily that he's too dumb to speak properly; he's just not that good at speaking multiple languages fluently.

You can even emphasise this by having him speak normally when he gets a chance to "talk elven" with somebody, but having not-so-great grammar in common/humantalk/whatever.

Peregrine
2010-09-29, 11:51 AM
A cowboy.

I'd say more like the "noble savage" stereotype than a cowboy. He's wise and insightful and believes that the ways of the wild and the cycles of nature are all the knowledge he needs to get by in the world. Accordingly, he disdains "civilised" learning and asks people whether it's ever brought them one step closer to happiness.

Tactically, he doesn't analyse situations; he uses tactics that are known to work without worrying too much about why. These tactics might be based on animals ("Wolf Pack", "Stooping Falcon", "Spider in her Lair"), or they might just be traditional and/or "common sense" methods. He understands and predicts the enemy rather than outthinking them.

(Maybe that last one needs more explanation. A high-Int, low-Wis tactician doesn't really have a knack for predicting what his enemies are going to do, but he can prepare contingency plans for all possibilities instead. A low-Int, high-Wis tactician doesn't think it out and prepare contingencies; he's more likely to foresee his enemy's real plans and just address those.)

NeoRetribution
2010-09-29, 12:10 PM
To add to the amounts of information already presented, when I have roleplayed such characters, my leanings are that the character learns from their errors ( of most any kind ) more frequently and more permanently than other characters. To further explain, Intelligence for a character is the capacity for the character to reason-out ( to postulate; to think ) about why a thing might be dangerous ( or some other trait ) and then learn of that thing's nature. Wisdom, conversely, is to simply know that a thing is the way it is because it has either been witnessed personally, sensory data has been assimilated about that thing's effects on someone else, or tales have been assimilated ( verbal or otherwise ) about how that thing functions.

Wise characters have been there, done that, or heard about it. They have Experience ( no Points, sorry ) and are usually capable of relating that experience to others through conversation or teaching.

Street Smarts is Savvy ( understanding ), and not strictly Wisdom by my own definition.

But no matter which method you choose, try to have fun. You are welcome.

lsfreak
2010-09-29, 01:34 PM
An 8 Int is a good reason for the character to have poor grammar or a difficult accent, also. Especially since your character is a wild elf. It's not necessarily that he's too dumb to speak properly; he's just not that good at speaking multiple languages fluently.


I would argue that. Many of the people you know are probably Int8. They're the people who were maybe a year behind in math or scraped by with C's, or liked sociology but couldn't really grasp physics.

I'd say high Wis is more apt to know a lot about generalities, rather than specifics. You're facing three large monsters of some kind: you may not know what they are or what they're vulnerable to, but you know that separating them, luring them into traps, attacking them with a terrain advantage and a flanking buddy, etc would be good ideas. You may know that the best place to find the information would be an assassin's guild, and while you don't know if there is one or who to contact, you would know the right ways to ask around town without arousing suspicion.

HenryHankovitch
2010-09-29, 01:42 PM
I would argue that. Many of the people you know are probably Int8. They're the people who were maybe a year behind in math or scraped by with C's, or liked sociology but couldn't really grasp physics.

That's why I said a multiple languages. So, his wild elf speaks elven (or whatever dialect thereof) fluently, but may not be so good at the human-talk. Alternatively, he could simply have picked up the equivalent of a slang or pidgin dialect (like Spanglish) and never bothered with refining his speech to King James Common. Maybe he just constantly has to drop words in Elven because the Common term isn't coming quite to mind. "Aethylinri. We go to the caves, plenty of darthiir waiting, gonna ambush, aye? Uff-dah."

This also gives someone the amusing roleplaying note of spending lots of time saying stuff like "we go now yes," but when the opportunity comes to speak Elven, he suddenly comes up with normal, fluent language. "Ah, brother, it has been too long. Trying to converse with these folk is like hitting my head against a tree..."

JonestheSpy
2010-09-29, 06:18 PM
K'leiss the lizardman is just the exmple you're looking for (http://www.goblinscomic.com/09072010/).

ericgrau
2010-09-29, 06:23 PM
Observant and attentive but not able to analyze what you notice well.
Opposite of the classic low wis / high int "absent minded professor" given in the PHB.

But as said int 8 isn't low and wis 18 is amazing. 8 is still close to average, perhaps getting C's as said. I'd focus more on role-playing your wis and almost ignore the int.

Lucid
2010-09-29, 06:31 PM
Thanks for the replies, some good ideas here!.:smallsmile:

I was thinking about him being more 'in the moment' than thinking long-term myself. I also like the idea of just knowing things instead of thinking about it (if that makes sense)
Definitely going to use the language barrier, it's something I hadn't really thought of and sounds like a lot of fun to roleplay.

edit
Jonesthespy: K'seliss is not someone I would've thought of, but it makes sense. I even thought of the character as someone who would have no problems eating humanoids when the need arises, seeing survival as the most important.

Talbot
2010-09-29, 07:40 PM
Famous characters I'd suggest as reference points:

Mal Reynolds from Firefly, Mad Martigan from Willow, The Thing from Marvel comics, Marv from Sin City, Conan the Barbarian, Connor McCloud from Highlander, King Arthur, Silent Bob, Jesse Custer from Preacher, Han Solo from Star Wars, Wolverine (depending very much on the writer) from Marvel Comics.

Of course, the exact meanings of Wis and Int vary from DM to DM, so it all depends on which stats you think represent what.

Snake-Aes
2010-09-29, 07:44 PM
There's some stuff here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=166876). Don't reply on THAT thread though. This one is good.

World Eater
2010-09-29, 08:07 PM
"He doesn't talk much, but when he does, everybody stops to listen."

Dark_Nohn
2010-09-29, 08:23 PM
I had quite a similar problem with a barbarian that I wanted to become a Pious Templar (If I remember right)... INT was 6 and WIS was 16... and his CHA score wasn't bad, like 13 or 14-ish. I found it more in character to be able to explain things well because of the relatively high charisma. Note that "explaining things well" does not mean scientifically, or even with proper grammar, but someone with a high CHA should be able to get someone else to understand that something else is a good idea with more than a "Trust me" line.

AslanCross
2010-09-29, 09:51 PM
I've had a low-Int, high-Wis Ranger and a high-Int, low-Wis rogue in the same party before.

The ranger always stepped in to give counsel to the others without referring to books, but used common sense and experience. She left the complex problem solving to the wizard, but she was there to point out things everyone else had overlooked.

The Rogue made lots of quips about things using rather educated-sounding terms, but she tended to pretty much have ADHD and also had very little common sense. Naturally, she got herself into trouble more than anyone else.