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Drakevarg
2010-10-04, 09:55 PM
Having grown tired of several members of my campaign who just seem to be along for the ride, I've decided to give them all compulsory homework: a questionnaire intended to illuminate their personality, background, and motivations. I'm shooting for 100 questions, but am aiming high intentionally and expecting much less.

Since this is a lot of work, I'm gonna try to spread to work around a bit and ask the Playground for question suggestions. I'll be compiling my own list at the same time. :smalltongue:

Here's a random question to get things moving. I'll be extending this list as I come up with more.

1. [OPTIONAL] Go to TVTropes.org, and select three tropes that accurately describe your character. List them here.

2. List every member of your immediate family (living or deceased), and your relationship with them.

3. Describe your hometown in as much detail as possible.

4. Who taught you your class skills? If you were self taught, how did you do so?

5. Why did your character decide to start this particular adventure?

6. Why do you travel with the rest of the party?

7. Have you ever killed anyone before? If so, what happened?

8. Have you ever had any romantic interests? If so, what happened?

9. Name two close friends, and your relationship with them.

10. List any enemies you've made, and how they became such.

11. What is your name? If it has any particular meaning, explain that here as well.

12. Are you associated with any particular organizations? If so, who are they and what are they like? (Noble families count as organizations for the purposes of this question.)

13. What does your character ultimately want to accomplish in life?

14. What are your views on killing?

15. What are your religious views?

16. How do you feel about interacting with members of the opposite faith? If you don't adhere to a particular faith, how do you feel about interacting with the faithful?

17. How do you feel about interacting with embodiements of the opposite faith? (Demons, angels, undead, etc.?) If you don't adhere to a particular faith, how do you feel about these sort of entities in general?

18. What are some of your character's fears? Why are they afraid of that?

Jallorn
2010-10-04, 10:55 PM
I like how step one probably takes about ten hours.

You should check this (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19713850/The_Ten-Minute_Background--Post_your_characters!) out too.

Drakevarg
2010-10-04, 11:52 PM
I like how step one probably takes about ten hours.

A fact I'm getting all too familiar with right now... hell, I don't even remember what I was looking up in the first place.

Hallavast
2010-10-05, 12:03 AM
Those first 4 are a good start. But really, the important thing about character backgrounds is how it feeds into the "Group Template". That is, "how well does the character fit in with the rest of the party" and "why will the PC continue to adventure with this group of people?" Far too often the rp problems from characters comes from the fact that their characters are just random people who don't fit in at all with the DM's micro setting or with the other characters' stories.

Credit for the Group Template concept goes to Fear the Boot at feartheboot.com

Mando Knight
2010-10-05, 01:00 AM
...
...
...That's too much work. I like to start with ones, then work from there. The below numbering is a suggested order.

1.) Pick one class. Alignment, race, gender, etc. can also be picked at this or any point.
2.) Pick one central trope, as if it were the character's only defining trait if he/she were a one-dimensional character (i.e. an NPC).
3.) Decide on one aspect of your character's background: what his family was like, whatever.
4.) Pick out one ultimate goal.

Then, flesh this character out. This can be done over a period of time, even during play.
-Link the central trope to the class (if necessary). Then hang random tropes on the character, like a Christmas tree. Also like a Christmas tree, organized randomness is better than full randomness.
-Link the background to the central trope and class. And race (and gender, if necessary).
-Link the ultimate goal to the central trope and class.
-Add in extra nuances (possibly via tropes) to both the background and personality. Likely via tropes.

After all, most characterization I've put a character through has always popped up from fleshing out a one-dimensional character in-game, much like a character in a novel or film or whatever is characterized over time. I don't even like the Ten-Minute-Backgrounds method... it suggests too diverse a start for me. I like ones.

Dust
2010-10-05, 01:04 AM
Having grown tired of several members of my campaign who just seem to be along for the ride, I've decided to give them all compulsory homework
I'm going to go ahead and just say this now because the thread is going to dissolve into a discussion about it anyway.

You're in the wrong here.

The fact that your players are not bringing enormously, ridiculously-expansive backstories to your game (which will, of course, never come up...I mean honestly, what difference does it make to your plot the methods which the PCs self-taught themselves class abilities? You're not going to be re-enacting the training scene from A Knight's Tale here.) is unfortunate, sure, but you're just going to push players away with your unreal expectations.

Milskidasith
2010-10-05, 01:18 AM
Sidenote here: Assuming these four questions are average, and giving conservative time estimates for them...

15 minutes for tvtropes.
45 minutes for the family stuff (less if you're intentionally having no knowledge of people, or if relationship just means a couple sentences.)
At least three hours for the hometown. If you only mean "in reasonable detail, rough draft outline style", then about thirty minutes.
How you were taught: At least thirty minutes, again.

So, assuming you massively cut down the work for the hometown, that's still thirty minutes per question... or fifty hours for the entire list of 100. That is more time than you an reasonably expect to actually be actively roleplaying your character in a year of play (assuming you are actively roleplaying for an hour every session, which is rather unlikely since snack breaks, combat, NPC actions, and other PCs tend to take time as well) at a session a week.

Mystic Muse
2010-10-05, 01:21 AM
Since this is a lot of work, I'm gonna try to spread to work around a bit

This is spreading it around a bit? your first four questions alone will take about two hours.

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 01:22 AM
Sidenote here: Assuming these four questions are average, and giving conservative time estimates for them...


Apart from the more elaborate ones, like "describe your hometown," I was only expecting a short paragraph each. (Counting each family member as a seperate question for those purposes.) If that would take an average of half an hour per question for you, I think it's time you worked on your writing skills. :smallconfused:

If you're assuming a short essay for each question, then yes that would be totally unreasonable and I'd only be asking ten questions, tops.


This is spreading it around a bit? your first four questions alone will take about two hours.

By Milskidasith's estimate, apparently yes.

But I was referring to spreading the workload away from me. :smallamused:

Mystic Muse
2010-10-05, 01:29 AM
Apart from the more elaborate ones, like "describe your hometown," I was only expecting a short paragraph each. (Counting each family member as a seperate question for those purposes.) If that would take an average of half an hour per question for you, I think it's time you worked on your writing skills. :smallconfused:

They all seem fairly elaborate to me.

10 different non conflicting tropes? That would actually be longer for me.

the different family members question would depend on how many you had.

the hometown is going to take way too long to be worth it. I'd just say it's a pile of ashes right now.

How long the fourth would take would depend on the character I was playing.



If you're assuming a short essay for each question, then yes that would be totally unreasonable and I'd only be asking ten questions, tops.

Why not just do that instead of asking for 100+ Paragraphs you're probably not going to actually ever read? Not the short essay part, the ten question part.

Hallavast
2010-10-05, 01:31 AM
I'm going to go ahead and just say this now because the thread is going to dissolve into a discussion about it anyway.

You're in the wrong here.

The fact that your players are not bringing enormously, ridiculously-expansive backstories to your game (which will, of course, never come up...I mean honestly, what difference does it make to your plot the methods which the PCs self-taught themselves class abilities? You're not going to be re-enacting the training scene from A Knight's Tale here.) is unfortunate, sure, but you're just going to push players away with your unreal expectations.

The specifics of how they learned ability X is not important. What's important is giving a bit of detail to a potential "mentor" from the character's past. To real people, the individuals who teach and train us are often important in our lives. When you risk your life based on your skills, then the manner in which you learned them is probably important to you. For an example, I'll point to the classic bildungsroman in the Poke'mon cartoon. Think of how many mentors and teachers Ash Ketchum had on his way to becoming a "Pokemon Master". The lessons learned from Professor Oak, Brock, Gary, and even Pikachu are integral to who Ash is midway through his quest to "catch 'em all!".

The real fun for a DM at that point is using what the player has provided to create real life character moments and interactions with party members, authority figures, lovers, and friends from the past. The more a player provides, the more a DM can reap to create a real life experience in a fantasy world.

And that should do it for cheesy inspirational speeches today.

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 01:35 AM
10 different non conflicting tropes? That would actually be longer for me.

Given that it's TVTropes, that's probably the most time-consuming question on the list. :smalltongue: Of course, I've been on the site enough to have a near-encylopedic knowledge of it, so it would be relatively simple for me to answer that.


the different family members question would depend on how many you had.

With immeadiate family members? It'd be suprising if you had more than four. Short paragraph each... 20 minutes maybe.


the hometown is going to take way too long to be worth it. I'd just say it's a pile of ashes right now.

That would get half a page at least, yeah, if they didn't decided to write a damn splatbook about it. With my players? Half an hour, sure.


How long the fourth would take would depend on the character I was playing.

Another short paragraph. 5 minutes maybe.


Why not just do that instead of asking for 100+ Paragraphs you're probably not going to actually ever read? Not the short essay part, the ten question part.

I would read it. I like reading.

But given that I set 100 as my "high mark" in the same since that I set the works of Shakespeare and J.R.R. Tolkien as my "high mark" in writing, and given that I have two days to actually compile this list, the actual results will be MUCH lower.

Mystic Muse
2010-10-05, 01:38 AM
With immeadiate family members? It'd be suprising if you had more than four. Short paragraph each... 20 minutes maybe.




In real life I have 6 just in my immediate family. Including extended, without actually counting I probably have around 70.

This question really depends on how in depth you want to go.

I don't even bother with backstories in my 4E campaign because my character death rate is so high. Heck, my new character may have essentially died in the first session with him.

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 01:48 AM
In real life I have 6 just in my immediate family. Including extended, without actually counting I probably have around 70.

I've got a pretty large extended family, myself. 'S why I knew it'd be a bit unreasonable to ask that.

Four siblings, huh? Must be fun. :smallsigh:


I don't even bother with backstories in my 4E campaign because my character death rate is so high. Heck, my new character may have essentially died in the first session with him.

Which would be exactly the sort out outlook I'd like to avoid. Leading a bunch of shiftless bints around by the nose with no particular goal in mind is boring. And about half of my party is pretty much exactly like that. Two of them behave like idiot fratboys and the other two just kind of watch until combat happens. :smallannoyed:

Two new questions added.

Godskook
2010-10-05, 01:52 AM
Apart from the more elaborate ones, like "describe your hometown," I was only expecting a short paragraph each. (Counting each family member as a seperate question for those purposes.) If that would take an average of half an hour per question for you, I think it's time you worked on your writing skills. :smallconfused:

Its the research times that are far more gratuitous. TV tropes is poorly laid out and highly intoxicating, asking someone to draw character traits from it is like asking them to open nine thousand bottles of vodka, and determine which tastes best. Alone. In both cases, about half way through, you're so disoriented and confused, that you forget who you are, what you're doing, and who's dead body is lying on the floor.

Hallavast
2010-10-05, 01:53 AM
In real life I have 6 just in my immediate family. Including extended, without actually counting I probably have around 70.

This question really depends on how in depth you want to go.

I don't even bother with backstories in my 4E campaign because my character death rate is so high. Heck, my new character may have essentially died in the first session with him.

I have 3 in my immediate family. So 5 minutes each means 30 mins for you. 15 for me. Big deal. If your character has 12 brothers and 8 sisters, you could probably sum that up in 2 paragraphs easily. Just write about the ones you want to potentially include in the game. And if you don't want to make your character's parents/siblings a big part of the game, then you won't. But at least this question forces you to consider parents/siblings as a source of content.

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 01:54 AM
Its the research times that are far more gratuitous. TV tropes is poorly laid out and highly intoxicating, asking someone to draw character traits from it is like asking them to open nine thousand bottles of vodka, and determine which tastes best. Alone. In both cases, about half way through, you're so disoriented and confused, that you forget who you are, what you're doing, and who's dead body is lying on the floor.

TVTropes only applies to the first question, and is the only one that requires any research. I said it was the one that would take the longest to answer for a reason. :smallbiggrin:

Mystic Muse
2010-10-05, 01:56 AM
Which would be exactly the sort out outlook I'd like to avoid. Leading a bunch of shiftless bints around by the nose with no particular goal in mind is boring. And about half of my party is pretty much exactly like that. Two of them behave like idiot fratboys and the other two just kind of watch until combat happens. :smallannoyed:


I don't really play like this though. I'm more than happy to make a background if it's actually going to come up* But when it's not actually going to come up and my character is likely to die within two sessions anyway** I just don't see the point.

* Like in this one campaign I was playing online with Archpaladin Zousha.
** My character contracted A level 16 disease at level 10 and I had a 10% chance of not contracting it. Now, since I'm pretty sure the party doesn't have remove disease I need to roll a natural 20 to get rid of it. If I don't I then have to roll 2 natural 20s or a 15 when I don't have all my stuff on to stay stable. If I don't, I die.



I have 3 in my immediate family. So 5 minutes each means 30 mins for you. 15 for me. Big deal. I
I agree. However, when there are 99 other questions I have to answer, even assuming the rest only take 5 minutes each, that's 525 minutes or roughly 8 and a half hours of preparation on a character's background.

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 02:02 AM
I agree. However, when there are 99 other questions I have to answer, even assuming the rest only take 5 minutes each, that's 525 minutes or roughly 8 and a half hours of preparation on a character's background.

I'll remind you again that 100 questions was the (intentionally) unrealistically high mark I set for myself. Honestly, if I come up with 20 by Wednesday, I'll be suprised.

Mystic Muse
2010-10-05, 02:03 AM
I'll remind you again that 100 questions was the (intentionally) unrealistically high mark I set for myself. Honestly, if I come up with 20 by Wednesday, I'll be suprised.

Don't know how I missed that.

Still, I say just ten questions should be enough to cover anything that'll come up.

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 02:09 AM
Four more questions added.

Mystic Muse
2010-10-05, 02:13 AM
is number 8 really ever going to come up? I guess it will if you're bringing it up but it doesn't seem like something that's going to happen very often.

Instead of ten tropes on TVtropes how about ten adjectives to describe your character? Those are easier to find without losing 5 hours of your life in the process.

ranagrande
2010-10-05, 02:13 AM
I don't know how your players feel about it, but I probably wouldn't be willing to do that.

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 02:21 AM
is number 8 really ever going to come up? I guess it will if you're bringing it up but it doesn't seem like something that's going to happen very often.

Vengeful ex-lover? Beloved twoo wuv murdered for extra angst? Romance has an interesting habit of being a gold mine for plot hooks.


Instead of ten tropes on TVtropes how about ten adjectives to describe your character? Those are easier to find without losing 5 hours of your life in the process.

Tell me honestly; have you ever regretted those wasted hours except in retrospect? :smallcool:

Mystic Muse
2010-10-05, 02:24 AM
Tell me honestly; have you ever regretted those wasted hours except in retrospect? :smallcool:

No, but then I had time to spare. If I don't because I have school and a job for example, my DM telling me "Go waste 5 hours looking up stuff for a character that's probably going to die in two sessions anyway" I'd kindly remind him that there are things that are more important in life than D&D.



Vengeful ex-lover? Beloved twoo wuv murdered for extra angst? Romance has an interesting habit of being a gold mine for plot hooks.


Really? those both seem incredibly boring to me. In a movie maybe but I don't actually want to play that guy in a D&D game.

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 02:27 AM
No, but then I had time to spare. If I don't because I have school and a job for example, my DM telling me "Go waste 5 hours looking up stuff for a character that's probably going to die in two sessions anyway" I'd kindly remind him that there are things that are more important in life than D&D.

Then perhaps you should not have set aside your afternoon to show up and fill out my questionnaire until you did have the time to spare.

And my players tend to last a bit longer than two sessions. Maybe four. :smalltongue: And it's getting better as I figure out the exact location of the breaking point. Heart surgery with a sledgehammer and all.


Really? those both seem incredibly boring to me.

It's all in the execution. :smallwink:

Mystic Muse
2010-10-05, 02:32 AM
I'm going to hold off on any more comments until I see what the finalized list looks like. Right now though, I have the feeling it'll drive your players away.

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 02:37 AM
I'm going to hold off on any more comments until I see what the finalized list looks like.

Chances are the finalized list will look like whatever's in that first post by the time I fall asleep tomorow.


Right now though, I have the feeling it'll drive your players away.

Oh, I most certaintly hope so. :smallamused: To be honest, the two fratboy-types I'd rather just be rid of, but it's a bit uncooth to just request that they **** off.

And one of the apathetic ones is the girlfriend of one of the fratboys, I wouldn't be suprised if she left too. Though she does seem to be rather fond of the game despite not taking a very active role.

Mystic Muse
2010-10-05, 02:41 AM
Oh, I most certaintly hope so. :smallamused: To be honest, the two fratboy-types I'd rather just be rid of, but it's a bit uncooth to just request that they **** off.

as opposed to saying "make a character sheet that'll take 8 hours to make or **** off"?

bokodasu
2010-10-05, 08:34 AM
Yeah, there's no way I'd do this and I like doing character backgrounds. But that's not important, since I'm not one of your players; what's important is that your players, as described, do not want this sort of game.

Take hold of your reproductive organs of choice and tell them to **** off, if you don't want to play with them. Weirdly passive-aggressive character building demands are... weirdly passive-aggressive. And not at all going to make anyone say, "oh my, I've been playing wrong all this time! I shall now work up a fully-fleshed character and begin striving for the Oscars of Role Playing!"

kamikasei
2010-10-05, 08:50 AM
Oh, I most certaintly hope so. :smallamused: To be honest, the two fratboy-types I'd rather just be rid of, but it's a bit uncooth to just request that they **** off.
Your options are not limited to "rudely tell them to shove off" and "passive-aggressively drive them to quit in frustration at unreasonable demands". If you don't enjoy playing with these people, don't play with them. You seem to want different things from the game; tell them that, politely.

You might even try "talk to the players about the fact that they don't seem all that interested, see if you could make changes to engage their interest".

(You're not obliged to change the game to suit the players - you may prefer to have the game you wanted with fewer or different players, instead. But it can hardly hurt to check, first. For one thing, some players are just quiet, and may be enjoying the game a lot but not visibly showing it. For another, if they really aren't enjoying the game, articulating some of the reasons may be a path for them to leave amicably. And if they don't leave right away, but say they'll try X or Y, then discovering that that doesn't work is another path to an amicable split. And at each step, of course, you may instead end up with a happier player still in the game, which is nice.)

A questionnaire like this can be really handy, by the way, if presented not as "answer these questions! There will be a test!" but as "try reading through this and thinking about how your character would answer - it'll help you flesh them out in your mind". It takes a lot less time to think up answers in your own head than to write them out for others, and you can then present the character appropriately when questions come up in play without having to nail everything down in advance.

Amphetryon
2010-10-05, 09:11 AM
Which would be exactly the sort out outlook I'd like to avoid. Leading a bunch of shiftless bints around by the nose with no particular goal in mind is boring. And about half of my party is pretty much exactly like that. Two of them behave like idiot fratboys and the other two just kind of watch until combat happens. :smallannoyed:

Two new questions added.
I seem to recall a long thread with you as the OP not long ago where the mortality rate of characters in your campaigns was discussed at length. Something like a 20% expected character mortality rate in a 6 person party, if memory serves? If I had the expectation of needing a new character roughly every 3 - 4 sessions, I'd be disinclined to put a ton of effort into backstory, too. Having the DM run a high lethality game and also insisting that I spend a couple of hours per character on an elaborate and unique backstory is simply not a combination of factors I can possibly perceive as the most fun way to spend my time in an RPG.

It's possible your players have different opinions, of course, but given your comment about 'idiot fratboys and the other two ... watch until combat' I'd say the odds are slim.

Psyx
2010-10-05, 09:18 AM
You're in the wrong here.
The fact that your players are not bringing enormously, ridiculously-expansive backstories to your game (which will, of course, never come up...I mean honestly, what difference does it make to your plot the methods which the PCs self-taught themselves class abilities? You're not going to be re-enacting the training scene from A Knight's Tale here.) is unfortunate, sure, but you're just going to push players away with your unreal expectations.

Backgrounds aren't there to be used. They're there so that one THINKS about a character and is better able to react in their shoes. back-stories are essential tools for actors, and they're great tools for roleplayers too.


I really don't see the issue with asking players to put two to three hours work into backstory. Any more than that is extreme, but considering how many hours GMing takes to plan, it's not unreasonable to do so in the name of improving the game.

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 12:28 PM
Backgrounds aren't there to be used. They're there so that one THINKS about a character and is better able to react in their shoes. back-stories are essential tools for actors, and they're great tools for roleplayers too.

I really don't see the issue with asking players to put two to three hours work into backstory. Any more than that is extreme, but considering how many hours GMing takes to plan, it's not unreasonable to do so in the name of improving the game.

Excellent point, which I'm pretty sure was part of my thought process when deciding to do this. Though last time I was talking it was 2:00 in the morning and my brain wasn't quite on straight, so I didn't point it out.

Though on top of helping the PCs get into character, backgrounds are also fun to torture them with. :smallamused:


(You're not obliged to change the game to suit the players - you may prefer to have the game you wanted with fewer or different players, instead. But it can hardly hurt to check, first. For one thing, some players are just quiet, and may be enjoying the game a lot but not visibly showing it. For another, if they really aren't enjoying the game, articulating some of the reasons may be a path for them to leave amicably. And if they don't leave right away, but say they'll try X or Y, then discovering that that doesn't work is another path to an amicable split. And at each step, of course, you may instead end up with a happier player still in the game, which is nice.)

The silent ones I can deal with, even if I disapprove somewhat. It's the loud obnoxious once I want change in. :smallannoyed:


A questionnaire like this can be really handy, by the way, if presented not as "answer these questions! There will be a test!" but as "try reading through this and thinking about how your character would answer - it'll help you flesh them out in your mind". It takes a lot less time to think up answers in your own head than to write them out for others, and you can then present the character appropriately when questions come up in play without having to nail everything down in advance.

The "this is a test" bit is just a bit of sadistic humor built out of irritation towards the fratboys. When I actually give them the questions and put my DMing hat on (Note to Self: Get actual DMing Hat. :smalltongue:), I'll be more expressing it as an opportunity for character expansion.

Tyndmyr
2010-10-05, 12:36 PM
1. Go to TVTropes.org, and select ten tropes that accurately describe your character. List them here.[/qupte]

No. Just no. I opt not to have my life sucked away, and don't feel that tropes are necessary to describe anyone.

[quote]2. List every member of your immediate family (living or deceased), and your relationship with them.

Orphan. All are unknown and dead.


3. Describe your hometown in as much detail as possible.

I grew up in a small, dark place. It was square. They slid food in through a slot. That place is gone now.


4. Who taught you your class skills? If you were self taught, how did you do so?

Self Taught. One day, I willed fire into existance. That place is gone now.


5. Why did your character decide to start this particular adventure?

Well, he used to live somewhere, but that place is gone now. He must find a new place.


6. Why do you travel with the rest of the party?

Because they're here, and have not yet tried to put me in a dark place.


7. Have you ever killed anyone before? If so, what happened?

Yes. They are gone now.


8. Have you ever had any romantic interests? If so, what happened?

Does the dark place count? I'll let you guess what happened.


9. List all of your friends (living or deceased), and your relationship with them.

This "friend" word is confusing. Is this like the last question? Deceased, though, I understand.


10. List any enemies you've made, and how they became such.

There was screaming. Then the burning. Then the red stuff came out. Then, more screaming. Does this mean enemy? I screamed for hours and hours in the dark place. Am I an enemy?

Mystic Muse
2010-10-05, 12:40 PM
I approve of your background Tyndmyr and would actually love to have that character in my game.

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 12:42 PM
No. Just no. I opt not to have my life sucked away, and don't feel that tropes are necessary to describe anyone.

Orphan. All are unknown and dead.

I grew up in a small, dark place. It was square. They slid food in through a slot. That place is gone now.

Self Taught. One day, I willed fire into existance. That place is gone now.

Well, he used to live somewhere, but that place is gone now. He must find a new place.

Because they're here, and have not yet tried to put me in a dark place.

Yes. They are gone now.

Does the dark place count? I'll let you guess what happened.

This "friend" word is confusing. Is this like the last question? Deceased, though, I understand.

There was screaming. Then the burning. Then the red stuff came out. Then, more screaming. Does this mean enemy? I screamed for hours and hours in the dark place. Am I an enemy?

Despite seeming like aggressive compliance, this actually sounds like an interesting character. :smallamused:

As for TVTropes, lets see what I can think of just from what I've heard...
Psychopathic Manchild (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/PsychopathicManchild)
Pyro Maniac (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/PyroManiac)
What Is This Thing You Call Love (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/WhatIsThisThingYouCallLove)
Raised By Wolves (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/RaisedByWolves)
Conveniently An Orphan (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ConvenientlyAnOrphan)
Walking The Earth (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/WalkingTheEarth)
Dark And Troubled Past (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DarkAndTroubledPast)
Where I Was Born And Razed (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/WhereIWasBornAndRazed)
Orphanage Of Fear (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/OrphanageOfFear)
Sealed Badass In A Can (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SealedBadassInACan)

Two new questions added.

Mystic Muse
2010-10-05, 12:53 PM
While a few of these seem extreme, I agree it's a problem if their characters don't even have names

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 01:10 PM
While a few of these seem extreme, I agree it's a problem if their characters don't even have names

They have names. I was mostly thinking in terms of Meaningful Names. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MeaningfulName)

(Yes, I know a link to TVTropes over something as simple as that is a bit Egregious (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Egregious), but I'm on the site anway so what the hey.)

kamikasei
2010-10-05, 01:26 PM
The silent ones I can deal with, even if I disapprove somewhat. It's the loud obnoxious once I want change in. :smallannoyed:
Right, and 90% of what you quoted from me was me saying that this seemed like a bad way to get that change.

onthetown
2010-10-05, 01:32 PM
Might have already been said, but... If your players seem like they're just coasting along, improve your campaign or throw a surprise wrench in the plot at them. It might not be them.

The questionnaire is the sort of thing I would do on my own, but I wouldn't do it for a DM if he asked me to just out of spite. Whether or not I want to expand my characters is my own choice, and I've played campaigns where it wasn't even necessary to have a background. These were usually the most fun, often being short and sweet.

Here's one that might be a little shorter than spending hours on Tv Tropes. (http://www.uncleanarts.com/writing/tutorial/tutorialcharacter.htm) There are tons of other templates for these things around the internet -- using a pre-made one will save you just as much "homework" as it will for the players in the long run. Really, 10 tropes? That's like a week of picking and choosing and browsing and pondering.

I'm not trying to be mean-spirited, but D&D is just a game. If people don't want to expand their characters, it should be fine as long as they're having fun.

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 01:36 PM
Really, 10 tropes? That's like a week of picking and choosing and browsing and pondering.

I pulled it off in less than an hour. :smalltongue:


I'm not trying to be mean-spirited, but D&D is just a game. If people don't want to expand their characters, it should be fine as long as they're having fun.

Not if they're keeping the rest of the party from having fun. :smallannoyed:

onthetown
2010-10-05, 01:38 PM
I pulled it off in less than an hour. :smalltongue:

Depending on how attached to the character I am, I'd be hard-pressed to only choose 10. I would spend hours on that question alone, and you would get closer to 76.


Not if they're keeping the rest of the party from having fun.

That's when you talk to them and tell them they're ruining the other people's game experience and ask for a bit of change. Not give them questionnaires that they might not even be interested in anyway.

If you want these guys to leave, tell them to leave.

Mystic Muse
2010-10-05, 01:42 PM
I pulled it off in less than an hour. :smalltongue:



and you admitted you have almost encyclopedic knowledge of the site. What about somebody who's never heard of the site before? Heck, I know some people who don't even know what the word trope means.

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 01:42 PM
Depending on how attached to the character I am, I'd be hard-pressed to only choose 10. I would spend hours on that question alone, and you would get closer to 76.

You could apply that logic to any of the questions.


That's when you talk to them and tell them they're ruining the other people's game experience and ask for a bit of change. Not give them questionnaires that they might not even be interested in anyway.

If you want these guys to leave, tell them to leave.

This idiots are too dense to respond to polite requests, and just telling them to **** off makes me look like a jerk.

At least I can give these bints a personality to go with the dumbass behavior. :smallannoyed:

Susano-wo
2010-10-05, 01:46 PM
@godskook: Thank you. That describes the way feel about TV tropes. I love it, but oh my god I would get sucked in)

@Kamikasei: And you very nicely summed up how I feel about his motivations for this questionaire. Thanks for saving me work :P

@Amphetryon: I'm glad someone else remebered that and found it relevant. I was reading this post, thinking to myself "Man, this guy just does not want to accept advice. It reminds me of..." And then my brain switched off of sleep mode, and I looked at the poster's name. Then I metaphorically facepalmed.

Now, in the interest of being productive, RE your questions, Psycho:


1. Go to TVTropes.org, and select ten tropes that accurately describe your character. List them here.

Can be waaaay too much work. Much better would be something like"describe your character without relating to class levels of specifically to class abilities. Holy Warrior would be fine, but smite evil would be out [Paladin would be fine if it refered to a specific group, but only then]. What you are going for is something descriptive of a character.

(sorry for the huge post)

Like "idealistic knight searching for his missing brother. Grapples with issues of what truly is honorable," or "wandering bard crushed by the death of his love. He has lost purpose in his life, but the spark of goodness still lives."


2. List every member of your immediate family (living or deceased), and your relationship with them.

Don't really have a problem with this, as long as you don't really expect a paragraph per family member. Good question, actually, as I find family ties are a part of character generation that are easily forgotten.


3. Describe your hometown in as much detail as possible.

Again, a good question, though I would leave out in "as much detail as possible", and instead come up with a few questions to answer, such as 'how big is it,' what is its source(s) of susitence,' or 'what are they proud of about thier town?'
(incidentally, I would ask them to give a sentence or two regarding one or two people in that town they have a strong connection with, good or bad.)


4. Who taught you your class skills? If you were self taught, how did you do so?

Good question. I would tweak it to be more general, though. Who taught you your talents and abilities, and what is your relationship to him/her/them?


5. Why did your character decide to start this particular adventure?

6. Why do you travel with the rest of the party?


Pretty much the same question, or should be tied in together. (For this question, I am assuming you are running a quite party based game. IN a less party-focused game I would ask what their relationship to the other characters is, and ask them to come up with a reason or two that they might be inclined to cooperate at least occasionally with the other party members)


7. Have you ever killed anyone before? If so, what happened?

Fantastic question. Pair it up with what their attitudes about killing are.



8. Have you ever had any romantic interests? If so, what happened?
Good question.


9. List all of your friends (living or deceased), and your relationship with them.

Wouldn't go quite that far. List two good friends, or explain why you don't have two good friends. (PC's can certainly be those two good friends)


10. List any enemies you've made, and how they became such.

ANother good question


11. What is your name? If it has any particular meaning, explain that here as well.

Actually, I like asking the person how they got the name they have, and giving it a meaning. Helps flesh out the parentage and explains odd names like Axeking :D


12. Are you associated with any particular organizations? If so, who are they and what are they like? (Noble families count as organizations for the purposes of this question.)

Good question.

Really, this seems like a good list, aside from the first question, and a few of the questions that should proably be toned down in scope.

Let's see, if I am going to ask more questions...
Religion: Do they have particularly strong religious leanings (for or against religion(s)), or are they within the norm for their culture?

How far are they willing to go to:
-help a firend/lover
-uphold the law
-gain power/wealth/etc

What are their major goals/values, and what are exceptable losses for them. (IE would they allow a child to be killed, kill a child, allow the land to be tainted, make deals with demons, etc)

But I think it bears emphasis.[disclaimer: phrased in the imperative to emphasize that I feel strongly about it. Any sort of commanding tone is not intentional] Don't approach the people you are playing with in an overbearing manner, or passive agressive manner. Simply let them know what kind of games you enjoy running/playing, and tell them that you want them to fill out these sheets to facilitate this. Fix problems with obnoxious players by either asking them to adjust behavior, asking them to leave, or leaving yourself.

Tyndmyr
2010-10-05, 01:47 PM
Yeah, I pulled it off in a heartbeat only because I avoided the site. It would have chewed up hours of time, and resulted in "am I more X or Y?". Probably with random derailments.

The point of a backstory is not to punish your players, but to get a feel for their characters. Doing this does not require extensive length, and can be poorly served by searching for tropes. Yes, tropes CAN describe things...but it's not efficient for someone to learn all of tvtropes in order to describe a single character.

My above description started off as an effort to fulfill the minimal critera, but as usual, I got distracted with an interesting idea. It's still pretty terse, but it lets you understand a bit about who he is, and why he's that way. That, plus some in gameplay development, and he could be a pretty complex character.

onthetown
2010-10-05, 01:50 PM
This idiots are too dense to respond to polite requests, and just telling them to **** off makes me look like a jerk.

At least I can give these bints a personality to go with the dumbass behavior. :smallannoyed:

They're apparently ruining the fun for everybody else, they're driving you up the wall, and they're acting like dumbasses.

Keeping them in the group makes you look like more of a jerk. The players who are trying to have fun might leave before the other guys do.

You also don't just tell players to **** off. You tell them what's happening in no unclear terms, and tell them that they'll have to change their behavior so that you guys can all share the fun. If they don't change or they put up a fight, you ask them to leave. Not "Hey, **** off, you're out of the group," you say something along the lines of, "This really isn't working out, I think you would be better in another group," or "I think it's time for you to leave." If they still don't leave, you can repeat the reasons why you're kicking them out. Only if they put up a fight do you tell them to **** off.

Put another point into your Charisma and max out your Diplomacy skill; it's useful.

Susano-wo
2010-10-05, 01:51 PM
and you admitted you have almost encyclopedic knowledge of the site. What about somebody who's never heard of the site before? Heck, I know some people who don't even know what the word trope means.

My wife is (if I may say so :P) a fantastic roleplayer, and puts a lot of effort into developing her characters. I had to explain to her what a trope was. And I had to have it explained to me, when my brother informed me of this little internet blackhole known as "Tvtropes.com."

And don't forget epople who visit the site, but *don't* hve an encyclopedic knowledge of it. Its going to suck up a lot of time jumping from trope to trop finding ones they think fit. (especially if that is the first quesiton. If you are goin to do that question, *at least* put it last, after they have already fleshed out character details[wish I had a pleading smiley :P])

kamikasei
2010-10-05, 01:52 PM
This idiots are too dense to respond to polite requests, and just telling them to **** off makes me look like a jerk.
Honestly? If you're incapable of letting people you consider "idiots" and don't want to play with that you'd rather not have them in the game in a way that doesn't "make you look like a jerk" (or if you can't suck up that hit to your image in order to take necessary action), you probably shouldn't be trying to organize a social event (which, by running a game, you are). This is part of the skill set and if you lack it, you need to acquire it.

"Too dense to respond to polite requests"? What, if you tell them you don't think they're working out as players and you'd like them to leave the game, they're going to show up anyway because they're too stupid to remember they were disinvited? No, if you only ever hint at your dissatisfaction they may not take the hint. That's when you state it outright (but diplomatically), not when you jump straight to "telling them to **** off".

valadil
2010-10-05, 02:00 PM
I'm going to go ahead and just say this now because the thread is going to dissolve into a discussion about it anyway.

You're in the wrong here.


I half agree. I think this questionnaire is too much, but I'm also a strong proponent of a good backstory. I don't think these questions will necessarily elicit good answers. I'd spend days just naming the people involved in my character's background, let alone defining the relationships with those people.

The problem is that too many answers will be irrelevant. You might find gold in 10% of the answers, but the rest will be ignored. I feel like you need to get to the juicy and strong opinions and skip over the mundane bits.

For instance, I'd replace question 2 with "Which parent was your favorite? Why?" That'll get your players thinking like their characters and not like their characters' biographers.

I'd also cut question 1 down to three tropes and remove the tvtropes.com limitation (although I'd suggestion a link to it for players who don't know what you mean by tropes).

Beyond 1, 2, and 4 I'd make the other questions optional. Tell the players to answer those three questions and two more. I'd hope that they'd answer the interesting questions rather than the shortest ones, but I wouldn't actually expect it.

For number 4, I'd have them pick a single skill and the mentor for that skill.

As another idea, why are you doing all of this before people play their characters? I found a list of 100 questions a while ago. They were all interesting, but I didn't want to give my players homework. So I ask 1 question at the beginning of each session. I try to make it a juicy one, at least for one or two players. They're a lot more willing to think about things like this if it only happens for 5 minutes each game than for several hours ahead of time.

Last session I told them I was out of questions. They whined and made me come up with more. Apparently they really liked thinking about their characters when it wasn't done in a homework setting.

Caliphbubba
2010-10-05, 02:03 PM
I don't know how well this would work in a D&D game, but back when I ran and played in oWoD games pretty often we would do something called a

Prelude Session where each player would get ran through a small sceen or series of sceens that helped flesh out the types of things you are asking for. It was all very rules-light, and mostly me asking the players questions about things and running sceens to delvope them and/or help them over a particular part of their origin story they were having trouble completeing.

I found it to be a pretty useful tool in my storytelling basket of tricks.

To me it's more useful than doing a questionnaire because it is more interactive. Maybe it'll work better for you that assigning homework.

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 02:03 PM
Honestly? If you're incapable of letting people you consider "idiots" and don't want to play with that you'd rather not have them in the game in a way that doesn't "make you look like a jerk" (or if you can't suck up that hit to your image in order to take necessary action), you probably shouldn't be trying to organize a social event (which, by running a game, you are). This is part of the skill set and if you lack it, you need to acquire it.

If I didn't care what happened to them in the grand scheme of things (i.e., they weren't really friends of mine), I'd tell them to leave without a moment's hesitation. The problem I have with these guys is mostly that they suck at behaving properly in a social setting that requires a good bit of concentration. When it comes to other things, like Magic cards or video games, they're fun to have around and I'd rather not overly offend them. :smallsigh:


"Too dense to respond to polite requests"? What, if you tell them you don't think they're working out as players and you'd like them to leave the game, they're going to show up anyway because they're too stupid to remember they were disinvited? No, if you only ever hint at your dissatisfaction they may not take the hint. That's when you state it outright (but diplomatically), not when you jump straight to "telling them to **** off".

What I mean is that if I ask them to shape up, they won't. If I politely asked them to leave, then yes they'd listen, but I'd rather not do that unless I have to for the above reasons.


I'd also cut question 1 down to three tropes and remove the tvtropes.com limitation (although I'd suggestion a link to it for players who don't know what you mean by tropes).

I'll cut it down to three and make the question optional.

Amphetryon
2010-10-05, 02:08 PM
If I didn't care what happened to them in the grand scheme of things (i.e., they weren't really friends of mine), I'd tell them to leave without a moment's hesitation. The problem I have with these guys is mostly that they suck at behaving properly in a social setting that requires a good bit of concentration. When it comes to other things, like Magic cards or video games, they're fun to have around and I'd rather not overly offend them. :smallsigh:



What I mean is that if I ask them to shape up, they won't. If I politely asked them to leave, then yes they'd listen, but I'd rather not do that unless I have to for the above reasons.
By passive-aggressively forcing them out with detailed questionnaires that you know they won't like - and that, with your stated playstyle preference, they'd have to replicate at least once a month for a new character - you end up coming off as more of a jerk than you would by politely explaining why it's not working out to have these particular friends partake in this particular activity with you. Just throwing that out there.

Thrawn4
2010-10-05, 02:09 PM
I realize that it's not the OPs priority to actually derive a decent questionnaire, but I already fetched my quick guide for creating my NPCs and might as well write down the most important part.

What is the reason for the characters
-dreams (the character's version of utopia)
- goals (what the character actually tries to achieve)
- nightmares (would mentally destroy him)
- anathemas (things he utterly despises)
- habits/recreation (everthing he does in his freetime or has nothing to do)
- flaws (everybody has flaws)
- general opinion on mankind, the world and meaning in life
- individual aspects (friends, acquaintances; also sth. that's really unexpected)

mucat
2010-10-05, 02:11 PM
Psycho, the whole tone of your questionnaire seems aggressive and insulting toward the player. "All right worms! Get down and give me ten tropes!" There's a strong implication that they'll slack off if you don't tell them specifically what to include.

And your estimates on how long this would take really imply they will do a slapdash, superficial job; you're asking for quantity of details rather than quality. You want to know about my character's sister? Cool; sit down and I'll tell you some stories about her. It's not a three-minute job.

And you ask about "every immediate family member, living or dead" and then say you don't think there will be more than four? Parents, brothers and sisters, spouse, kids, possibly grandkids...it doesn't add up to four unless the character is quite young and has a small family.

And "every friend, living or dead"?!

This will give you nothing but a long, superficial list of facts. If you want a background that paints a vivid picture of the character, it's likely to focus on a few of those questions, but use them in ways that leave a strong impression. Think of any short story you like for its unforgettable characters -- at the end, you probably don't know the answers to half the things in your list, but you will remember the character forever.

For example, a recent character background I really liked writing was essentially two long scenes, set years apart, seen from the eyes of others who know the character. Took me about 8 hours to write, and was lots of fun; I don't regret the time spent at all. But by the end of it, you still don't know the answer to most of the questions on your list.

However, I like to think the character is vivid enough that the DM can still bring her past into play whenever he wants. You don't meet all her friends and enemies, but you know exactly what kind of person she makes friends with, what bonds them together, what might force them apart. You know what kind of person she can't stand, and which ones she can't resist messing with until they become her enemies.

If the DM wants to bring an old friend or enemy into play, it'll be easy to invent one who meshes perfectly with her background...and they'll be a lot more interesting than entry #27 on a long list of "homework" answers.

kamikasei
2010-10-05, 02:26 PM
If I didn't care what happened to them in the grand scheme of things (i.e., they weren't really friends of mine), I'd tell them to leave without a moment's hesitation. The problem I have with these guys is mostly that they suck at behaving properly in a social setting that requires a good bit of concentration. When it comes to other things, like Magic cards or video games, they're fun to have around and I'd rather not overly offend them. :smallsigh:
So because you enjoy their company in one context, you feel obliged to share their company in this other context where neither of you enjoy it?

It should be possible to explain to them that you'd rather not game with them without their refusing to do anything else with you out of offense. (It'll be easier to do this if they don't think your not liking their gaming style is a judgment of them as people. That might be easier to convey if you don't think of them as "idiot fratboys".)

Originally I was saying "you need to learn to politely remove people from a game as part of your DMing skillset", but now I think I need to say you need to learn that you don't have to have all your friends along for every group activity, regardless of whether they enjoy it or you enjoy their being in it, for the sake of your social life and general happiness.

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 03:09 PM
So because you enjoy their company in one context, you feel obliged to share their company in this other context where neither of you enjoy it?

The annoying thing is they do enjoy it; just in a way that makes it less enjoyable for the rest of us. :smallannoyed:


It should be possible to explain to them that you'd rather not game with them without their refusing to do anything else with you out of offense. (It'll be easier to do this if they don't think your not liking their gaming style is a judgment of them as people. That might be easier to convey if you don't think of them as "idiot fratboys".)

They're incessantly stoned or drunk in character, start fiddling with their Magic cards any time the spotlight isn't on themselves, and find "kill the NPC" an acceptable solution to any social dilemma. If you can think of a way to describe their playstyle in a positive manner, I'm all ears.

Chaotic Stupid (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ChaoticStupid) describes them almost perfectly.


Originally I was saying "you need to learn to politely remove people from a game as part of your DMing skillset", but now I think I need to say you need to learn that you don't have to have all your friends along for every group activity, regardless of whether they enjoy it or you enjoy their being in it, for the sake of your social life and general happiness.

I'm going to keep that in mind for future campaigns. This time I foolishly thought "the more, the merrier." I was quickly proven wrong.


Psycho, the whole tone of your questionnaire seems aggressive and insulting toward the player. "All right worms! Get down and give me ten tropes!" There's a strong implication that they'll slack off if you don't tell them specifically what to include.

Reduced the number and made it optional. Less harsh?


And your estimates on how long this would take really imply they will do a slapdash, superficial job; you're asking for quantity of details rather than quality. You want to know about my character's sister? Cool; sit down and I'll tell you some stories about her. It's not a three-minute job.

Perhaps not for someone who actually cared. If half of the people involved aren't Convieniently An Orphan (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ConvenientlyAnOrphan), I'll be suprised.


And you ask about "every immediate family member, living or dead" and then say you don't think there will be more than four? Parents, brothers and sisters, spouse, kids, possibly grandkids...it doesn't add up to four unless the character is quite young and has a small family.

Grandkids aren't immeadiate family. And everyone in my campaign is early 30's at the oldest, despite half of them being elves. (Elves age differently in this setting, no kindergardner jokes please.)


And "every friend, living or dead"?!

This will give you nothing but a long, superficial list of facts. If you want a background that paints a vivid picture of the character, it's likely to focus on a few of those questions, but use them in ways that leave a strong impression. Think of any short story you like for its unforgettable characters -- at the end, you probably don't know the answers to half the things in your list, but you will remember the character forever.

True. Someone else mentioned "two close friends." I think I'll do that one.

Dust
2010-10-05, 04:04 PM
You've taken a very holier-than-thou approach to the whole situation, Psycho. Take a step back and realize that you could be at least party responsible for this situation.

Yes, good players wouldn't respond with 'kill the NPC!' in every social dilemma.
But a good GM wouldn't dub his players 'Chaotic Stupid,' act passive-aggressively toward them in hopes they'll go away and stop ruining his perfect plot, and not take his players' roleplaying style into account when inviting them to join.

You have at least one person in your group who, as you put it, seems to be enjoying the game in a very quiet, passive way. And your response is to take a course of action which, you understand perfectly, will make her leave.

Stop trying to justify your own bad behavior by masking it with 'well, this is why the players deserve to get treated like this!'

Thrawn4
2010-10-05, 04:09 PM
You've taken a very holier-than-thou approach to the whole situation
This quote always reminds me to Morte from Planescape:Torment. Did you use it coincidentally?

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 05:15 PM
But a good GM wouldn't dub his players 'Chaotic Stupid,' act passive-aggressively toward them in hopes they'll go away and stop ruining his perfect plot, and not take his players' roleplaying style into account when inviting them to join.

It's not a sign of a bad DM to call it like it is. They're literally textbook examples of Chaotic Stupid. And it's hard to take someone's roleplaying style into account when they literally don't have one, since this is their first time roleplaying. :smallannoyed:


You have at least one person in your group who, as you put it, seems to be enjoying the game in a very quiet, passive way. And your response is to take a course of action which, you understand perfectly, will make her leave.

I understand that she may leave if her boyfriend, one of the Chaotic Stupids, leaves. This questionnaire isn't intended to scare her off, it's to scare those two off.

And I doubt it will, anyway. Despite the fact that the Playground's opinion of me seems to be that of a walking pile of DMing horror stories, my party seems to thoroughly enjoy the abuse. :smallconfused:

Besides, the primary intent is to force them to put some damn consideration into their characters, not get rid of them entirely. If they DO leave, it's just a bonus.

Thrawn4
2010-10-05, 05:58 PM
Despite the fact that the Playground's opinion of me seems to be that of a walking pile of DMing horror stories, my party seems to thoroughly enjoy the abuse. :smallconfused:
Nobody is judging you. It's just that your approach isn't the right one, IMHO. You are trying to solve a problem (which is good), but the problem is that a questionnaire won't change the players' behavior. If they are friends of yours, then you can surely tell them that you prefer a different style of roleplaying without offending them. Maybe they change if they realize that not everybody is content with their way.
There is also a DM guide for those situations: http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=76474

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 06:14 PM
You are trying to solve a problem (which is good), but the problem is that a questionnaire won't change the players' behavior.

No, but it will result in characters with more depth than if I hadn't given this questionnaire.

Five new questions up.

Mystic Muse
2010-10-05, 07:33 PM
No, but it will result in characters with more depth than if I hadn't given this questionnaire.

It's much more likely to make these players leave than to make them make character backgrounds.

Heck, it might make several of your better players leave too.

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 07:40 PM
It's much more likely to make these players leave than to make them make character backgrounds.

Heck, it might make several of your better players leave too.

People keep saying that to me. If they haven't left by now, I doubt this'll change anything. :smallannoyed:

New question added.

Knaight
2010-10-05, 08:14 PM
OK, fine. That doesn't remove the other problems inherent in a questionaire. It forces immediate character development over gradual character development, which may well yield better results, characters who morph quickly and fully develop over normal play are practically a necessity for some. It focuses all the characters in a specific direction, where what actually matters to who should vary. Lets look at the specifics.



1. [OPTIONAL] Go to TVTropes.org, and select three tropes that accurately describe your character. List them here.
Probably works for just about every character.

2. List every member of your immediate family (living or deceased), and your relationship with them.
Far more relevant for some characters than others. You have the younger sibling trying to live up to the standards of the older, its critical, you have the military deserter on the run, much less so.

3. Describe your hometown in as much detail as possible.
This matters much more for characters who focus on the past as a whole, for those who focus only on a few moments, or for those who prefer to live in the present, its irrelevant.

4. Who taught you your class skills? If you were self taught, how did you do so?
Stuck to D&Ds skill system, with "I picked them up" a valid answer in many cases, particularly when the skills aren't necessarily that important to the character, and some non skill trait is.

5. Why did your character decide to start this particular adventure?
Again, a huge focus on the past, with biased wording that forces an answer that makes this important to the character. I can think of several off the top of my head for whom that represents character destruction.

6. Why do you travel with the rest of the party?
Probably very useful, and something that naturally emerges with collaborative character building.

7. Have you ever killed anyone before? If so, what happened?
Again, there would be characters who hadn't killed anyone and put no thought in it, characters for whom this was very relevant, and those who just killed all the time.

8. Have you ever had any romantic interests? If so, what happened?
Varying importance to the characters, and implies a small amount of romantic interests, as well as spinning all characters towards romance, when it isn't relevant for many.

9. Name two close friends, and your relationship with them.
Expanded to important known figures, this works, but close friends heavily implies characters who tend towards few, lasting, important relationships, ignoring both those who close themselves off and those who have something closer to popularity.

10. List any enemies you've made, and how they became such.
For some characters this is relevant, both in the "Tommy hates me, see long history" sense and the "So maybe I've picked up a few enemies from seducing the married"/"I killed political figure X and now nation Y hates me" sense, but there are characters who either avoid or are ignorant of enemies, and for whom enemies are largely irrelevant.

11. What is your name? If it has any particular meaning, explain that here as well.
Name is a typically necessary trait, but this question pushes a meaningful name, which works best for some characters.

12. Are you associated with any particular organizations? If so, who are they and what are they like? (Noble families count as organizations for the purposes of this question.)
Another good one,

13. What does your character ultimately want to accomplish in life?
This assumes an ultimate goal pursued intently. Characters that quickly flick from one goal to the next, or have short term reactive goals have no use for this.

14. What are your views on killing?
In a high combat campaign, this might be important, though I wouldn't expect more than a quick question.

15. What are your religious views?
If religion is going to be key in the campaign, then this is important. Otherwise, it encourages avoidment of apathy or makes apathy important where characters were previously disconnected, often to their benefit.

16. How do you feel about interacting with members of the opposite faith? If you don't adhere to a particular faith, how do you feel about interacting with the faithful?
Only important for some characters.

17. How do you feel about interacting with embodiements of the opposite faith? (Demons, angels, undead, etc.?) If you don't adhere to a particular faith, how do you feel about these sort of entities in general?
Suddenly, Demons, Angels, and undead are way more important from the out start.

18. What are some of your character's fears? Why are they afraid of that?
This practically demands cheap phobias, without even addressing how a character copes with fear of different varieties.


All in all, this probably gets far less than "List six critical aspects about your character."

onthetown
2010-10-05, 08:37 PM
People keep saying that to me. If they haven't left by now, I doubt this'll change anything. :smallannoyed:

New question added.

They haven't left by now because they're having fun in their own little twisted way.

Your other players haven't left by now because they're apparently able to tolerate it.

Either or both of these groupings might decide that homework for D&D isn't fun, and could leave.


No, but it will result in characters with more depth than if I hadn't given this questionnaire.

So... Do you want nice little in-depth characters for your plot, or do you want players that you can tolerate? If you get the morons to leave, the others will more than make up for the character issues on their own if they decide to stay. There is also the issue that some people don't want to have to put tons of thought into D&D and just want to relax and have fun with Elven Wizard #3 that they rolled up in two minutes. You can't force your own style on them by making them do meticulously detailed backgrounds that they won't enjoy.

To get off the DM-style topic, what if you gave them the option of doing it and made it sound great? "Hey, guys, I just got a great idea. I got this list of questions that you can answer about your characters. It could be a fun break from the game, but it's still D&D-related." You could also encourage it to be light-hearted and something that all of you could do at the table together. A "Chaotic Stupid" player who acts like a dumbass usually loves to hear his or her own voice, and most players in general like talking about their characters, so you're basically encouraging character development by giving them a chance to sit in the spotlight. Doing it at the table would mean that the entire thing isn't just some list of facts that they think you're just going to glance over and then toss out.

Drakevarg
2010-10-05, 09:01 PM
Doing it at the table would mean that the entire thing isn't just some list of facts that they think you're just going to glance over and then toss out.

Perhaps I should have mentioned that it isn't "homework" in the literal sense. It is happening at the table. I said "homework" to imply work put into the campaign that isn't either rolling a character sheet or the game itself.