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big teej
2010-10-06, 04:37 PM
such as

whats DND?
response: dungeons and dragons
whats that?
:smalleek:

I have been describing it as a combination of
-lord of the rings
-group storytelling
-choose your own adventure book
-drama club, with rules
"remember how when you were a little kid and played cops and robbers? 'bang bang, you're dead?' and argued over it? kinda like that, but we have rules for who's dead"

examples also include
'dungeon crawl'

'concept of looting and/or loot'

'homebrew'


and so on

so basically

what are terms you've had to define for non gamers and/or new gamers, and how did you do so.

if you see a explanation you feel you can improve on.
go for it.

Keld Denar
2010-10-06, 04:49 PM
I just explained it to the girl I started dating as "cops and robbers, except with dice and rules crossed with cooperative story telling". She picked it up just fine with that example.

Kaww
2010-10-06, 04:55 PM
DnD: You know how you play games on your computer? Well, we don't have the money to buy computers, so we do it in person by talking.

A collective storytelling game. You munch and hang out with people and usually have a good time. Heh, I almost forgot, you play once a fortnight for months/years and a single session lasts for 7-12 hours.

Dungeon crawl:

Chop chop.

Loot:

When you kill people taking their stuff is perfectly legit.

Homebrew:

You know how you don't like that smoking/drinking law? Well here we can change the rules and usually suffer for it...

Greenish
2010-10-06, 04:59 PM
Loot: anything that isn't nailed down and on fire that you can carry away, after killing it's owners.

Looting: putting out the fires and removing the nails if necessary, then walking away with said possession.

Ref. thieving, robbery, muggery.

AslanCross
2010-10-06, 05:00 PM
The "make believe, except with rules" is the one I end up using the most. Many people I meet still think it's a computer game.

Katana_Geldar
2010-10-06, 05:00 PM
I explained the principles of roleplaying games to my grandfather in about five minutes by rolling dice in front of him. Roll my d20 and add the dice roll to my "attack a monster with a sword ability" and compare against the monster's ability to withstand or avoid my attack. If my number is higher, I then roll the dice for my sword (and this can vary) to see how much damage the monster takes.

Thems the basic principles, people! And he understood it when I said it just got more complicated from there, but it's basically roll, add, compare then roll again and subtract from the hp total.

Greenish
2010-10-06, 05:04 PM
I explained the principles of roleplaying games to my grandfather in about five minutes by rolling dice in front of him. Roll my d20 and add the dice roll to my "attack a monster with a sword ability" and compare against the monster's ability to withstand or avoid my attack. If my number is higher, I then roll the dice for my sword (and this can vary) to see how much damage the monster takes.

Thems the basic principles, people! And he understood it when I said it just got more complicated from there, but it's basically roll, add, compare then roll again and subtract from the hp total.I thought the basic principle of roleplaying was pretending to be someone else (and not because of a distant relative you didn't particularly like spotted you on the street). :smallamused:

Katana_Geldar
2010-10-06, 05:05 PM
Yeah, but I was explaining the basics of game mechanics, not just roleplaying in general which a lot of people understand anyway. The two go hand in hand, after all.

Ozreth
2010-10-06, 05:07 PM
One person writes up a world with locations and characters, the players interact with this world and its characters with rules and guidelines laid out in a books. Dice are rolled for the outcome of most decisions.

Kaww
2010-10-06, 05:10 PM
Yeah, but I was explaining the basics of game mechanics, not just roleplaying in general which a lot of people understand anyway. The two go hand in hand, after all.

No they don't. You have people who like to roll and don't like/know how to rollplay. Iamb has lots or rolling and no rollplay, computer games also.

Snake-Aes
2010-10-06, 05:10 PM
My opening statement is "It's make-believe, but with rules to determine what works and what doesn't"
Generally, that springs "then you can't do anything you want", which gets "You can. Succeeding is at stake, not acting".
"But is there no winner?" "Not in the competitive sense of the word. The game ends when we stop having fun."
"And what if your character die?" "then I make another one, or get resurrected, or take control of another one. Anything that makes for the most fun story".

TheThan
2010-10-06, 05:13 PM
Easiest explanation I’ve ever come across is to simply ask them if they’ve ever played pretend (cops and robbers/cowboys and Indians). When they say “yes”, then simply say that is what role-playing is, only we’ve added rules for determining who wins.

Thajocoth
2010-10-06, 05:16 PM
If I say "D&D" to someone and they ask what it is, I say "Dungeons & Dragons". If they ask a second time, I say "Nerds with dice."

If I were trying to really explain it, I'd say "Ever play pretend when you were little? Imagine that, but instead of arguing with your friend about whether or not you did what you said, you rolled dice to decide."

Paladineyddi
2010-10-06, 05:20 PM
[QUOTE=Kaww;9496013]DnD: You know how you play games on your computer? Well, we don't have the money to buy computers, so we do it in person by talking.
/QUOTE]

BWHAHAHA go poor people ^^
gonna use this explanation from now on

LibraryOgre
2010-10-06, 05:39 PM
Depends on the person. One of my most common explanations is "Have you ever wanted to do something in a CRPG, but couldn't because the computer wouldn't let you? Well, in RPGs, the computer is a person, and you can do it if he... and the dice... let you."

KillianHawkeye
2010-10-06, 05:40 PM
Actually, playing computer games is probably cheaper unless you really don't have a computer. (But in that case, how are you using the Internet??)

LibraryOgre
2010-10-06, 05:42 PM
Actually, playing computer games is probably cheaper unless you really don't have a computer. (But in that case, how are you using the Internet??)

Library. You can log into most websites at your local library, but most won't let you install games. Similarly, you have work or school computers.

Kallisti
2010-10-06, 05:46 PM
Actually, playing computer games is probably cheaper unless you really don't have a computer. (But in that case, how are you using the Internet??)

By exploiting this simple fact. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zi8VTeDHjcM)

KenderWizard
2010-10-06, 06:33 PM
I always try to emphasise the social side of it, because if I'm trying to explain, I'm talking to a non-nerd friend, and they usually only have a passing knowledge of videogame RPGs anyway.

I say: You and some friends get together. One person is in charge, and all the other people get to make up a character in the story that they control. The person in charge controls all the other people in the story, but the players have all the main characters. Then you tell the story together, with the person in charge saying what happens and you saying how your character reacts. Your characters can talk to each other all they like and they usually have a goal to achieve. If there's something with an element of chance, you simulate the uncertainty by rolling dice to see if you succeed or fail. Sometimes you get to add numbers because you have a better chance, like if you're really good at lockpicking and you're picking a lock.

Then I give an example of play, like
The DM might say "There's a door at the end of the corridor, what to you do?"
You say "I go down the corridor and try to open the door!"
The DM tells you the door is locked, so you tell him you're going to try to open it, and you roll a 20-sided-die and add your lockpicking ability. The DM compares that number with how good a lock it is, and tells you how you did.
"It takes a few minutes, but finally you hear a click and the door swings open..."

Usually by this stage they've gone through interest, confusion, boredom, regret for asking in the first place, and finally, vacancy of mind. :smalltongue:

Actually, on the contrary, I've found that most people are genuinely intrigued by the sound of it, even people who are the complete opposite of nerds!

Katana_Geldar
2010-10-06, 06:40 PM
Actually, on the contrary, I've found that most people are genuinely intrigued by the sound of it, even people who are the complete opposite of nerds!

Like my grandfather, he sounded interested until I told him it does get trickier from there.

Fax Celestis
2010-10-06, 06:41 PM
I just explained it to the girl I started dating as "cops and robbers, except with dice and rules crossed with cooperative story telling". She picked it up just fine with that example.

"It's improvisational acting in a fantasy setting, using dice to determine what you can and can't do."

Flickerdart
2010-10-06, 06:42 PM
Depends on the person. One of my most common explanations is "Have you ever wanted to do something in a CRPG, but couldn't because the computer wouldn't let you? Well, in RPGs, the computer is a person, and you can do it if he... and the dice... let you. you buy him pizza."
Fixed. :smallbiggrin:

big teej
2010-10-06, 09:09 PM
Fixed. :smallbiggrin:

heeeeeeeeeeeeeey.....

I live on pizza!!:smalltongue:

kathal
2010-10-06, 09:19 PM
ya its all nice and good Till the DM buys the pizza, Now how will i get my free re-rolls?!?!
Mostly i explain it as a very complicated board game for nerds....

amaranth69
2010-10-06, 09:20 PM
DnD: You know how you play games on your computer? Well, we don't have the money to buy computers, so we do it in person by talking.

The problem with this assumption is that I have FAR more money wrapped up in D&D books than I do in computers, games, gaming consoles, cars, house...come to think of it anything I have.

Katana_Geldar
2010-10-06, 09:30 PM
Yeah, like they say on TV tropes Crack is Cheaper (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/CrackIsCheaper)

The Big Dice
2010-10-06, 09:37 PM
I just explained it to the girl I started dating as "cops and robbers, except with dice and rules crossed with cooperative story telling". She picked it up just fine with that example.

I've used that exact explanation myself, and people just kind of go "Oh, is that all?" when you tell them it's just like kids playing at superheroes, except with more sitting down and eating snack food.

Shpadoinkle
2010-10-06, 10:06 PM
"It's kind of like a play, except all the actors are ad-libbing everything, and the director also plays all the bad guys and bit parts (one at a time, of course)."

MrLich
2010-10-06, 10:13 PM
[QUOTE=Kaww;9496013]DnD: You know how you play games on your computer? Well, we don't have the money to buy computers, so we do it in person by talking.
/QUOTE]

BWHAHAHA go poor people ^^
gonna use this explanation from now on


The problem with this assumption is that I have FAR more money wrapped up in D&D books than I do in computers, games, gaming consoles, cars, house...come to think of it anything I have.

Um yea I was about to say at this point I have far more invested in books (including multiple copies of the important ones), minis, battle mat, vis-a-vies, dice, and other accessories then I do in my now 5 year old compy. My fiancé and I actually have a "D&D" section of our budget no more than one book and a few boxes of mini's per month. This has become less prevalent due to 4ed, our dislike of it so far, and the destruction/hard to findedness of 3.5 material.

Though it brings a smile to my face knowing my 3.5 library is near completion. Just a few more splat books and I will have achieved a goal I've had since high school. A personal first :D

Kaje
2010-10-06, 10:15 PM
Ok, so there's a group of guys sitting at a table, and they're all pretending they're fighting monsters with swords and magic, and they're rolling dice to see if they can, and one of the guys is basically God, and he controls all the monsters and stuff.

shadow_archmagi
2010-10-06, 10:17 PM
You know how sometimes you play a video game and there's kind of an obvious solution and so you're like "Computer why do I have to murder eighteen spoggleworts just so this dwarf will open the gate? Can't I just burn the gate? Or punch him?" and the computer is like "BEEEP BOOP?"

Well D&D is like that only instead of a computer it's me and I say "sure why not" but I have to admit my graphics are not as pretty.

Kaww
2010-10-07, 02:03 AM
The problem with this assumption is that I have FAR more money wrapped up in D&D books than I do in computers, games, gaming consoles, cars, house...come to think of it anything I have.



Um yea I was about to say at this point I have far more invested in books (including multiple copies of the important ones), minis, battle mat, vis-a-vies, dice, and other accessories then I do in my now 5 year old compy. My fiancé and I actually have a "D&D" section of our budget no more than one book and a few boxes of mini's per month. This has become less prevalent due to 4ed, our dislike of it so far, and the destruction/hard to findedness of 3.5 material.

Though it brings a smile to my face knowing my 3.5 library is near completion. Just a few more splat books and I will have achieved a goal I've had since high school. A personal first :D

Ok, so I took the -4. Humor doesn't translate, darn you Tasha! I know that having all the books and miniatures is expensive. We only have some and they did not come cheap. Try making miniatures. It's fun, especially if you used to play warhammer... :smallwink:

LibraryOgre
2010-10-07, 10:43 AM
Fixed. :smallbiggrin:

Works less well with grown-ups... I can buy my own pizza. Your anguish, however, is truly valuable. ;-)

kestrel404
2010-10-07, 12:58 PM
So, when I'm asked about this kind of thing by a complete non-gamer I usually explain thusly:

Role Playing is a cross between improv acting and a board game. You're pretending to be a single character in an epic story, and all of your friends are other characters in that story, with on of them acting as the Narrator and playing various bit parts representing minor characters. Sometimes, you get into tricky situations - like running into a monster or finding yourself stuck in the villian's trap - and then the game part comes up and you follow the rules of whatever game system your playing to figure out what happens to your character.

Tukka
2010-10-07, 01:51 PM
Here's how I'd tell it. Of course I wouldn't go into this spiel all at once, but would give them time to ask questions:

It's a game that involves working together with the other players to create a kind of adventure story. One of the players, called the DM, creates and controls the setting, including all of the story's villains and supporting characters, while all of the other players each create one hero/protagonist character that they control throughout the game. Most games are set in a world of swords and sorcery, and there is a lot of action and combat (though this isn't always the case). The heroes are generally expected to cooperate with each other and adventure as a group, gradually growing in power and resources as the story unfolds.

A set of rules govern the capabilities of the characters in the story, and most events that have an element of chance are settled by rolling dice and adding appropriate modifiers -- so as you'd expect, an experienced warrior will generally have more success with a blade than a fresh conscript, and if a cunning but uneducated thief steals an ancient silver tablet from a museum, chances are slim that he'd be able interpret the symbols on it, which a scholarly priest almost certainly could decipher.

The rules are generally followed, but may sometimes be treated as mere guidelines. Both the players and the DM are free to improvise to try to do things that aren't explicitly defined by the rules outlined in the D&D rulebooks, with the DM acting as the final arbiter of what happens when a character tries to do something. The DM can also decide to break, bend or amend the rules if he thinks it would be good for the game and the story, though that's a privilege he has to exercise with care.

Different games of D&D can differ greatly in style and tone. Some play very freeform "sandbox" type adventures, where the DM encourages the players to drive the story by setting goals and following whatever motivations develop organically out of the backstories developed by the players for their characters, and the events that take place in the game itself.

In such a game, the player characters might be traveling together as part of a trade caravan, which is waylaid by bandits (controlled by the DM) -- if the players' characters manage to defeat the bandits and subdue one of them, they might choose to interrogate him -- which, if they are successful in doing, could reveal info about the bandits' nearby camp -- although the players might just as easily choose to kill or run off all the bandits, and immediately continue on to their original destination, where other challenges await.

If the players do end up investigating the camp, they might discover things which give them new options to consider. Among the things they find is a crate of goods marked with some sort of tradesman's mark (that one of the players might recognize if his knowledge skill is high enough and his roll is good enough), a map of the region which has a particular town circled, and a peculiar letter written to someone named Lord Darkover; the contents of the letter seem innocuous enough, but an intelligent character might realize it is written in some sort of code, which he might or might not be able to crack. The players can then choose whether to try to find the rightful owner of the crate of goods, go to the city circled on the map, investigate meaning of the letter, return to the trade caravan, or do something else entirely.

The DM throws out lots of little "hooks" providing different story avenues and the players decide which ones they want to explore, or whether they want to ignore the hooks and just do something totally out of the blue. Running this type of game successfully often requires a DM that's has prepared a detailed and robust setting, and that he is skilled at improvisation.

In other games, the DM may define the primary objectives of the game, which the players are more or less "forced" to pursue, and many or most of the story points will be planned in advance. This has the advantage of allowing the DM to prepare very detailed encounters and plots for the players to navigate, and many commercially published adventures are available for DMs that lack the time or inclination to design one themselves. The disadvantage is that the players will often try to do something reasonable that the DM or publisher didn't anticipate, which may end up spoiling the DM's careful preparations -- the DM may be forced to either abandon his work, or "railroad" the players back onto the path he has prepared, something that is often frowned upon by players.

In this more rigid adventure style, the PCs may still encounter bandits, but the DM may predetermine that they somehow end up at the bandit camp and investigate the mysterious letter, by eliminating the other "hooks," by drawing the player's attention to the path he wants them to take, and by presenting obstacles to any other course of action.

Games also differ in tone. Some games are dark and gritty, where the heroes might start out as relatively unremarkable people beset by challenges that are almost too great for them to overcome. Other games have a style of heroic high fantasy, where the characters start out as powerful wizards and warriors and may achieve demigod-like levels of power.

D&D can be a lot more engaging than any movie or video game, because, with a good DM, you can do anything that is reasonable within the setting, and since the settings can be rather fantastic, it can be a lot of fun.

Magnema
2010-10-07, 02:12 PM
There are a group of people, sitting around a table. One is in charge - the DM - the rest are players. The DM creates a world, which is in most cases a fantasy world, and the players each control a character in said world. The players tell the DM what they want to do, and the DM tells them how the world responds; if there is a chance of failure, dice are rolled to determine the outcome. The system is a lot more complicated than that, but that's how the game works as a whole.

dsmiles
2010-10-07, 04:16 PM
See, I work with a crapton of nerds/geek/whatever we happen to call ourselves that day. Probably 80-90% of us have played DnD at one point or another. They ask what I do on the weekends, I say, "I play Dungeons and Dragons." They get it. (If they don't, they're either pretty good fakers or they just don't care enough to ask.)

The Big Dice
2010-10-07, 10:00 PM
See, I work with a crapton of nerds/geek/whatever we happen to call ourselves that day. Probably 80-90% of us have played DnD at one point or another. They ask what I do on the weekends, I say, "I play Dungeons and Dragons." They get it. (If they don't, they're either pretty good fakers or they just don't care enough to ask.)
They aren't the ones who ask questions that need lengthy, watch the eyes glaze kind of answers. That's why saying something like "It's kind of like Final Fantasy / Oblivion / Fallout 3 / whatever CRPG the person asking might play, but without the computer." can work.

Whatever you do, don't go on and on and on about stuff that's simply going to bore and confuse the person you're talking to. You might be scaring a new player away. Don't get all artsy, talking about improv theater and immersion. Definetly don't get all technical, talking about game mechanics, dice conventions and the maths behind how things work. Those kind of things just put people into the "Don't make eye contact and move slowly away" camp.

Snake-Aes
2010-10-07, 10:30 PM
Whatever you do, don't go on and on and on about stuff that's simply going to bore and confuse the person you're talking to. You might be scaring a new player away. Don't get all artsy, talking about improv theater and immersion. Definetly don't get all technical, talking about game mechanics, dice conventions and the maths behind how things work. Those kind of things just put people into the "Don't make eye contact and move slowly away" camp.
http://www.imgjoe.com/x/shunning.jpg

CockroachTeaParty
2010-10-07, 10:53 PM
You know how sometimes you play a video game and there's kind of an obvious solution and so you're like "Computer why do I have to murder eighteen spoggleworts just so this dwarf will open the gate? Can't I just burn the gate? Or punch him?" and the computer is like "BEEEP BOOP?"

Well D&D is like that only instead of a computer it's me and I say "sure why not" but I have to admit my graphics are not as pretty.

"What do you mean I need the Red Key to open this door? It's made of wood! And I have a ROCKET LAUNCHER!"

:smallfurious:

Knaight
2010-10-07, 11:03 PM
"It's improvisational acting in a fantasy setting, using dice to determine what you can and can't do."

I would probably say fictional instead of fantasy, though fantasy is certainly appropriate to D&D in general. That said I prefer "A hybridization of board games and improvisational theatre.", but I know a huge amount of theatre people, so my perspective is skewed.

Danin
2010-10-08, 01:34 AM
I'm a little surprised I haven't seen this explanation yet, but it has served me well on a number of occasions.

"Think of it much like a novel. There is a lot going on in the book, many people and places, but ultimately there are a few main characters. One person decides all the other stuff. The plot, the side characters, the places, that sort of thing. Everyone else are the main characters, and can decide their actions in the story. Together, you create a story about your characters with rules to govern what you can do. From there its like a board game and a collective story rolled into one. Ultimately though, its an excuse to get friends together, make a lot of jokes and eat more Doritos than is probably healthy."

Moofaa
2010-10-08, 05:31 AM
I usually go with one of the descriptions that goes something like: "A group of people get together, with one being the game master. That person describes the scene, and the players whom each have a character decide what to do."

Its usually followed by crinkled faces of dislike, blank stares of confusion, or indifference. Had to explain it to parents multiple times who kept thinking it was a board game. I've thought about trying to get them to play it but mom just immediately assumes she can't understand it (her typical reaction when faced with ANYTHING new of ANY sort), and dads never shown any interest.

Oddly enough I can't get them to stop playing games on the Wii, and mom is now into some simple computer puzzle games and some facebook farmville-type game.

They've literally put hundreds of hours into the Wii.

Yuki Akuma
2010-10-08, 07:51 AM
...Why would you want to stop them from playing games on the Wii?

braxsus
2010-10-08, 12:53 PM
A cooperative and interactive story in which the head story teller starts the Plot, story line and backdrop (preface).The players are characters within the Story and their actions influence how the plot progresses and changes and developes. Actions successes or failures are goverend by rules of chance in which a character's skills and abiltiies influence chance through the outcomes of Dice rolls.
The head Story teller is the arbitor of the Rules and controls any characters within the story that are not portrayed by players

Zaq
2010-10-09, 11:42 AM
"We're a group of grown men and women who spend our free time pretending to be dwarves with magic powers."

Kaww
2010-10-09, 11:47 AM
"We're a group of grown men and women who spend our free time pretending to be dwarves with magic powers."

May I sig this?

oxybe
2010-10-09, 12:11 PM
my new roommates are not gamers.

like at all.

so when i was asked what i was up to one wednesday night i did proclaim: "huh? oh just D&D"

so the question of "what's that?" took me by surprise, mostly due to me always hanging out with gamers.

to which i responded: "it's a fantasy game, think of lord of the rings or warcraft, where one guy sets up a story/scenario and our characters try to solve/whatnot. there's usually an ongoing story to keep the characters involved. it's a pretend game like cops and robbers but with rules to decide who shot who."

"how do you play it?" he asked. "all the action is in our imagination as we sit around the table. the GM (the guy running the adventure) puts a task in front of us, we describe how our characters react to the scenario and the GM adjudicates success or failure, sometimes requiring a dice roll. we usually play with a map & tokens to show us who's where and doing what if stuff gets complicated"

"so do you get up and act it out?" he continued from his previous question, more then likely thinking of kids running around ala Cops & Robbers. "you can, and there are definitely people who do run around with fake swords and in full costume, but that doesn't interest us. we're happy sitting around a table."

and he queried "how do you determine who wins?". "you don't really win in a traditional sense. you win if you succeed/overcome/bypass the task given to you. you can die and fail in that sense or simply not succeed at the task, but there's no real scoring like in football or golf."

"huh." he pondered for a moment and left it at that. we then had a couple of shots and watched some Survivorman until we got hungry and ordered pizza.

Zaq
2010-10-09, 12:12 PM
May I sig this?

By all means!

Urpriest
2010-10-09, 12:33 PM
I've found a lot of people get the "it's like a computer RPG, but without the computer" answer, so usually I check if they know the difference between CRPGs and FPS/RTS/etc. If they don't then I break out the storytelling/cops n'robbers/improv explanation.

some guy
2010-10-09, 03:42 PM
I like Jeff Rients (http://jrients.blogspot.com/2010/05/on-swords-sorcery-dungeons-dragons.html)'s description of "You play Conan, I play Gandalf. We team up to fight Dracula.".

I usually use different explainations for different persons. Usually something like: "One person describes the world and thinks of an adventure for the other players who are heroes. The first person is also every adversary and ally."
I usually add: "But mostly it's just a bunch of friends hanging around, drinking beer, eating snacks and having a great old time."



and the computer is like "BEEEP BOOP?
Man, computers are always like that.

big teej
2010-10-11, 06:59 PM
hey guys, these are some really great responses, HOWEVER

I'm noticing a pattern here

so far, we have only defined "dungeons and dragons" for non gamers in this thread

what about homebrew?
or dungeoncrawl?
'the difference between a wizard and a sorcerer?'

etc!?

carry on! :smallcool:

I tend to summarize the difference between sorcerers and wizards to 'paperwork' for new players/non players

Knaight
2010-10-11, 10:52 PM
Well, we have some general RPG definitions as well. That says, homebrew.

"You know how you tweaked monopoly because the game designers are a bunch of incompetent hacks? They aren't the only ones, let alone the worst."

Dungeoncrawl.

"Yeah, that is just videogames on paper. We don't associate with them."

Wiz Sorc difference.

"Academic, intellectual."
"Paperwork" works better though.