[3.5] Rage/Frenzy and Bear Form

[Drakevarg]

You can enter Rage and Frenzy simultaneously, getting the benefits of both.

As a bear warrior, your rage or frenzy turns you into a bear instead.

Can you use rage to enter bear form, and then frenzy on top of that, and vice versa?

Or, as a sillier question, can you rage into bear form, then frenzy into bear form again and get it twice? :smalltongue:

[Morph Bark]

Or, as a sillier question, can you rage into bear form, then frenzy into bear form again and get it twice? :smalltongue:

I'm sorry, but I can't bear to answer that question.

[Frosty]

Have we finally discovered that there is indeed such thing as "too much Bear?"

[Drakevarg]

Have we finally discovered that there is indeed such thing as "too much Bear?"

I'm really just trying to see how much of a STR bonus I can get with the books I have (and keeping ECL below 10 prior to class levels). My current best is +38 with a Half-Dragon Ogre Barbarian 4/Bear Warrior 5/Warshaper 2.

Half-Dragon Orc Were-Ape Barbarian 4/Bear Warrior 5/Warshaper 2 gets me +42.

Depending on what I learn here, that could stay the same, rise to +48, or as high as +58.

[AxeD]

The answer to your question is on the tip of my tongue....

Damn! It's going to be bug(bear)ing me all night!

[Dingle]

While you're at it, add Fist of the Forest (Complete champion I think) for another version of rage, and put those stat bonuses to good use with Con to AC

Doesn't bear warrior need BAB of +7 to enter?

(sorry, didn't see your post about wanting it for strength, it's still interesting for multiple rages, and only 3 levels, and I think its +Con starts at 1 and rage starts at 2)

[Starbuck_II]

Or, as a sillier question, can you rage into bear form, then frenzy into bear form again and get it twice? :smalltongue:

To be serious: no, Bearform is a polymorph effect so no stacking.

If you use Frenzy for Frenzy, it works, but not Frenbzy for bear if you are in bearform.

[The White Knight]

Or, as a sillier question, can you rage into bear form, then frenzy into bear form again and get it twice? :smalltongue:

You dawg, I heard you like bears...

[Drakevarg]

Note to Self: never ask about bears on this forum again. Nothing but puns await. :smallannoyed:

[Greenish]

Note to Self: never ask about bears on this forum again. Nothing but puns await. :smallannoyed:You should've already known how unbearable it can get. :smalltongue:

…Sweet merciful Chtulhu, it's contagious!

[Chambers]

Note to Self: never ask about bears on this forum again. Nothing but puns await. :smallannoyed:

You should really just grin and bear it.

[NEO|Phyte]

For extra fun, note that the spell Rage can be used to trigger bear transformation, and has duration Concentration +1round/level. So if you give a bear warrior an intelligent item that has Rage as an SLA and nothing better to do with its actions, you can be an angry bear all day long.

[Hirax]

I'm really just trying to see how much of a STR bonus I can get with the books I have (and keeping ECL below 10 prior to class levels). My current best is +38 with a Half-Dragon Ogre Barbarian 4/Bear Warrior 5/Warshaper 2.

Half-Dragon Orc Were-Ape Barbarian 4/Bear Warrior 5/Warshaper 2 gets me +42.

Depending on what I learn here, that could stay the same, rise to +48, or as high as +58.

You need the Kensai (CWar) and Berserk (Deities & Demigods) PrCs.

[Drakevarg]

You need the Kensai (CWar) and Berserk (Deities & Demigods) PrCs.

I don't own Deities and Demigods, so that's irrelevent, but how does Kensai help with maximizing strength bonuses? :smallconfused:

[Hirax]

At second level they get an ability that gives them a +8 unnamed bonus to strength, though I think it's a move action to use. The Berserk basically gives another rage like ability, I think it's +6 strength and +6 con.

[Drakevarg]

At second level they get an ability that gives them a +8 unnamed bonus to strength, though I think it's a move action to use. The Berserk basically gives another rage like ability, I think it's +6 strength and +6 con.

Problem being you can't be a cross-class Barbarian/Kensai. Barbarians are always non-Lawful, and Kensai are always Lawful.

[Toptomcat]

You can be an ex-barbarian, but that would make you lose Rage and thus be counterproductive for your purposes. You could be an ex-kensai and lose nothing, but I suspect that qualifying for Kensai with non-barbarian classes would royally screw over your build progression.

You could oscillate between Chaotic and Lawful as needed to grab both without losing anything, but I suspect that that would get you smacked in the face.

[Awnetu]

Wheres the Half-Minotaur?

[Urpriest]

You could also abuse the feat Ordered Chaos (again provided it's within your books available), depending on your position on the "abuse" part.

[Drakevarg]

Wheres the Half-Minotaur?

Not in my books, sadly.

[Awnetu]

Not in my books, sadly.

Nah, it's a Dragon Magazine template, you can find it on Crystal Keep for free though.

[Morph Bark]

Note to Self: never ask about bears on this forum again. Nothing but puns await. :smallannoyed:

It's bearly as bad as on BG, seen right the same thing happen there.

[Tyndmyr]

Note to Self: never ask about bears on this forum again. Nothing but puns await. :smallannoyed:

The very idea should give you paws.

[Drakevarg]

The very idea should give you paws.

:smallannoyed: Did you really need to drag this back up in the name of more puns?

[Tyndmyr]

Yes. It's a grizzly subject, but it must be addressed. Even if it is polar-izing.

[jiriku]

I hope I'm not sticking my snout where it doesn't belong, but I think there's a claws in the forum rules about letting dead bear threads hibernate. Although I'd have to root around some to find it. Things get pretty hairy if you don't bear those rules in mind.

[Drakevarg]

Yes. It's a grizzly subject, but it must be addressed. Even if it is polar-izing.

...

*lights you on fire*

[Person_Man]

Since all the puns have been taken, to answer your question:

Rage provides an unnamed bonus. It stacks with everything except for itself (ie, you cannot Rage twice).
Bear Warrior modifies Rage. You get bigger bonuses, and you turn into a bear.
Frenzy provides an unnamed bonus. It stacks with everything except for itself. (It even explicitly stacks with Rage according to it's description).
The "doesn't stack with itself" rule is true of virtually every bonus in 3.5 D&D.


You probably want to consider some combination of:

Barbarian 1: With the Extra Rage feat, you pretty much have all the Rage you need.
Bear Warrior 1: Levels 2-4 and 6-9 are mostly dead, and you can get better bonuses from other PrC.
Frenzied Berserker
Totemist 2+: Soulmelds and chakra binds work when in any form, and provide extra natural attacks.
Totem Rager X: If you're playing in an ECL 15 or lower game, this provides good Rage and soulmeld progression.
Frenzied Berserker 10: Frenzy, Supreme Power Attack, Inspire Frenzy.


I'm not a huge fan of Barbarian builds, as most of them boil down to "I deal a lot of melee damage," which can be done a million different ways without consuming 90% of your class levels and feats. For example, a Warblade, Crusader, Swordsage, Totemist, Incarnate, Psychic Warrior, Knight, or any Tier 1 or 2 build can deal lots of damage, AND do lots of other things.

[Tiki Snakes]

I hope I'm not sticking my snout where it doesn't belong, but I think there's a claws in the forum rules about letting dead bear threads hibernate. Although I'd have to root around some to find it. Things get pretty hairy if you don't bear those rules in mind.

Yeah, you want to leave those things alone.
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100930180229/reddeadredemption/images/thumb/1/18/Zombie_bear.png/300px-Zombie_bear.png

[Tvtyrant]

But his question has bearly been examined.

[Starbuck_II]

I hope I'm not sticking my snout where it doesn't belong, but I think there's a claws in the forum rules about letting dead bear threads hibernate. Although I'd have to root around some to find it. Things get pretty hairy if you don't bear those rules in mind.

Note: bears do not really hibernate. They just sleep long intervals of time. Hummingbirds truly hibernate. What bears do is called “winter lethargy".
This had been brought to you by science.
The more you know!

[Tyndmyr]

I hope I'm not sticking my snout where it doesn't belong, but I think there's a claws in the forum rules about letting dead bear threads hibernate. Although I'd have to root around some to find it. Things get pretty hairy if you don't bear those rules in mind.

A mere three days isn't enough delay fur a pelting. Why, it had bearly begun to hiber...er...sleep.

[Tvtyrant]

Truly this thread deserves a round of apaws.