Number of encounters between rests?

[Rubikx]

This question is really quick, but I can't find the answer in any of the books:

I just bought the fourth edition rule books, and I can't find any advice for how many encounters I should throw at the characters before they have to take an extended rest.

I know in 3.X, the recommendation was 4 encounters of the party's level. Does anyone know if that holds for 4e as well?

Thanks in advance.

Cheers,
Rubikx

[ninja_penguin]

Depends a lot on the group composition and what level they are at. And how hard of encounters you're throwing at them. My group can sometimes burn through quite a few without a rest, but they're pretty good at wholloping thing I thought would be tough.

[Aron Times]

Yeah, it depends on how difficult the combat encounters are, but most groups I've played with take an extended rest when everyone is out of dailies and healing surges. Party teamwork and optimization is also important. Of the two, teamwork is more important, as long as the players do not go out of their way to gimp their characters.

[PopcornMage]

Page 41 of the DMG suggests a short rest after each encounter.

Extended Rest...yeah, it depends on the group I think.

[Rubikx]

Wow, thanks for the fast replies! :smallsmile:

Ok, so it basically depends on the group? I guess the only thing for me to do is play more games. What a shame... :smallwink:

Does anyone else have PCs that like to sleep in the dungeons? Do you usually let them get a full rest, or do intelligent monsters counter-attack?

[tyckspoon]

No Dailies + No Surges would be the absolute deadline, I think, because getting in any serious fight at that point is almost certain to TPK. There shouldn't be a recommended number of fights between encounters, because 4e's structure pretty much ensures that different fights and different groups will expend their resources differently, but a pretty safe bet would be "however many fights it takes to make the party's primary Defender(/Controller/whoever ends up taking primary responsibility for absorbing or preventing damage to the group) feel unsafe about continuing." So throw a few fights against the party, pay attention to when and how quickly they burn their Surges and other limited-use effects, and you should pick up a pretty good idea of how long they can fight (and, incidentally, what kind of foes may throw them for a loop and exhaust them more rapidly than they're used to, if you've really been following their tactics.)

[valadil]

I just go with what makes sense for the adventure and don't worry about the numbers. If the group needs an extended rest, they'll make it happen.

[bloodtide]

3E started the whole idea that the characters must be at full power(with access to all their spells, abilities and items) for every encounter. For a player to fight in an encounter at less then full power would be 'unfair' and 'no fun'. Every attack a character does must be at maximum effectiveness and damage.

If you have this type of gamer, then you can only have three medium encounters and one hard encounter before they must rest.

For 4E, it depends how fast the characters burn out. One they have used up their Daily powers and healing, they must rest
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In a more classic game, the characters simply had unlimited encounters a day. And should a player run out of 'cool' things to do, they would just shrug their shoulders and keep playing.
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Quite often groups rest in dungeons or other areas. Most often, smart players will hide in a safe place. Such as in a hidden secret room that they know no one has entered in years.

Unlike bad video games, and bad 4E games, you can't just 'stand in a hallway and rest a day'.

If they rest in the open, they are sure to get attacked.

[Crow]

I just go with what makes sense for the adventure and don't worry about the numbers. If the group needs an extended rest, they'll make it happen.

I'll second this answer.

[Tengu_temp]

In 4e, the best number of encounters per extended rest is 3 if you ask me - you get an Action Point back with each even encounter so stopping then would be a waste, but having 5 encounters is too much. A short rest between each is a given, of course.

[ninja_penguin]

Yeah, I forgot to mention that generally a short rest is considered standard DM protocol between encounters. Now, sometimes you can have things jump them in the middle of a short rest if you want to increase the pressure on them, but don't make a habit of it, you'll come off as a bit of a jerk.

[hewhosaysfish]

Yeah, I forgot to mention that generally a short rest is considered standard DM protocol between encounters. Now, sometimes you can have things jump them in the middle of a short rest if you want to increase the pressure on them, but don't make a habit of it, you'll come off as a bit of a jerk.

IIRC, having the opportunity to take a short rest is the definition of when an encounter actually ends. So if something jumps the PCs while they're trying to rest then it may would technically be the same encounter, just with some enemy reinforcements arriving when the party thought they'd won...
(Also, this is why powers that last "until the end of the encounter" also end after 5 minutes; so that your buffs will still run out even if you keep pressing on and on.)

[dsmiles]

For 4E, it depends how fast the characters burn out. One they have used up their Daily powers and healing, they must rest.

I disagree. There is no 'must rest' time. The players are free to push on as they see fit.

But, yeah, resting in dungeons can be dangerous. Very dangerous.

[Lev]

I believe ECL to ER is set between 1 and 5 encounters before an extended rest, separate ones with downtime to heal that is.

Of course, that's for an average group, not one where the average AC and HP are 40HP and 18AC at 4th level with a cleric.

I'd always recommend building an encounter chain with an escape plan that can end the encounter chain at any point after 3 of them, say a side door in the ruins of a temple to make a quick exit, that way its in the hands of the players.