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Kantolin
2010-10-21, 06:16 PM
Halfling Outrider, a prestige class in the complete warrior, gets 'Leap from the Saddle'.

I'm not certain if I can quote it legally as it's not OGL. Essentially, by making a fast dismount, I can make a melee attack against someone in a square I threaten with a +2 to-hit and a -2 penalty to AC. It specifics 'just as if the character were making a charge'.

I originally thought it was essentially useless - since it's not /actually/ a charge, it seems like a not terribly useful way to get +2 to-hit / -2 to AC as I don't get lance doublings.

My friend, however, read it as 'If you dismount and an opponent is in a square you threaten after dismounting, you get a free attack'.

It doesn't say what kind of action it takes to do so. Now, that could easily be a broken reading of it, as I could then remount and dismount and keep stabbing someone. At the instant, the DM has ruled that I can use it to get a single extra attack, which I'm content enough with.

But uh... so how does this class ability work? Is it actually 'You get an extra attack'? Is it meant to use up your normal attack and be a crappy charge? Is it meant to let me actually charge someone when there isn't actually room to do so?

Lev
2010-10-21, 06:25 PM
It's a free action dismount and declares you can make a melee attack, that means the melee attack does not count towards your actions, mounting is a move action.
The wording of Free Action in open source declares that there might be a limit to free actions AKA your DM chooses how many times you can use your saddle leap.

Kantolin
2010-10-21, 07:56 PM
That's... well, astonishingly powerful, even if your DM rules that that number is 'one'.

But I suppose it makes sense. Just... wow, I'm surprised it's not mentioned more often, as it's not like halfling outrider is a poor class.

olelia
2010-10-21, 08:23 PM
I believe it has to do with the squishyness of mounts and how it can sometimes be hard to get mounts into dungeons.

Flickerdart
2010-10-21, 08:41 PM
I believe it has to do with the squishyness of mounts and how it can sometimes be hard to get mounts into dungeons.
A halfling can ride a medium mount, so that's not a problem.

Greenish
2010-10-21, 10:28 PM
I believe it has to do with the squishyness of mounts and how it can sometimes be hard to get mounts into dungeons.Halfling Outrider is the basis of many supermount builds, I do believe.

Godskook
2010-10-21, 11:32 PM
That's... well, astonishingly powerful, even if your DM rules that that number is 'one'.

But I suppose it makes sense. Just... wow, I'm surprised it's not mentioned more often, as it's not like halfling outrider is a poor class.

1.A single extra attack is in the 'maybe worth a feat' territory, so not that powerful.

2.halfling outrider + devoted tracker + arcane hierophant. Welcome to a mount that counts as an AC and a familiar.

gorfnab
2010-10-22, 12:25 AM
Halfling Outrider is the basis of many supermount builds, I do believe.
Yes it is.
I'll just leave the basic Supermount build here.

LG Strongheart Halfling
1. Paladin - Mounted Combat, Track
2. Paladin
3. Paladin - Skill Focus: Handle Animal (prereq for Beast Master)
4. Paladin
5. Paladin
6. Beastmaster - Devoted Tracker
7. Beastmaster
8. Wild Plains Outrider
9. Wild Plains Outrider - Mounted Archery
10. Wild Plains Outrider
11. Halfling Outrider
12. Halfling Outrider - Natural Bond
13. Halfling Outrider
14. Halfling Outrider
15. Halfling Outrider - Ride By Attack (or some other feat)
16. Halfling Outrider
17. Halfling Outrider
18. Halfling Outrider - Spirited Charge (or some other feat)
19. Halfling Outrider
20. Halfling Outrider

At 20th Level
Special Mount: 18th level Paladin = Paladin 5 + Wild Plains 3 + Half-Out 10
Animal Companion: 18th level Druid = Beast Master 5 + Natural Bond 3 + Half-Out 10

Kantolin
2010-10-22, 12:35 AM
Oh, I'm aware of the supermount. I'm actually doing an extremely tame version thereof at the instant.

That's actually what makes it more surprising. The class has an ability which is 'you get as many attacks as you want, only limiter being how long before your DM goes and hunts down a ruling to stop you', and is part of a mildly popular build... and I never hear about it.

Either way, thanks - it seems RAW is clear and agrees with my friend.