Character page

[Ted The Bug]

I'm not sure if this has been brought up (or answered) recently, but are there any plans to create a new character page? I'm sure that many people arrive at the site, read the newest comic and feel completely lost, and check out the character page to see who's who. While the page is fine for a gag-a-day strip with a threadbare plot of "go to end of dungeon and kill skeleton guy", the immense complexity of the plot and characters over the past few years has outdated it pretty badly. Who's the helmet guy? Is he the older version of the Elan guy on the page? But then why are Roy and Belkar looking the same age?
While those questions could be answered with a brief read, if someone's just casually browsing the internet looking for a new webcomic, they're not going to take the time needed just to get a handle on the characters, let alone the amount of time needed to get the plot, unless they see that it could really pay off. Rich has a lot on his plate (and the faster updates are awesome, we love it!), and I hope this isn't interpreted as some whiney "You have to do everything I say because I am one of the thousands of people who bought your books and therefore represents the entire community!!" kind of topic. Just wondering if there were any plans to kind of 'modernize' the character page (and maybe the FAQ).

[Fargazer]

I wouldn't have looked at the cast page as something to benefit those that are starting with the LAST comic. Its there to benefit those who are reading from the very beginning. If you want to get all the character development in a750 page webcomic, read the comic. We don't need to know about the characters personalities from the summary now that we've read it. Those that start fresh probably do.

[Nimrod's Son]

Why would he want people to find out who Tarquin is from a summary paragraph, rather than through actually reading the story? It's supposed to be read from the beginning. If you're diving in somewhere in the mid-seven-hundreds then you don't have any right to expect things to make sense.

He has posted to say a new FAQ is on his to-do list, though, so we'll get one at some point. I don't see any point to a new cast page though. It'd spoil the joke from #647 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0649.html) for a start.

[Dr.Epic]

I'm sure that many people arrive at the site, read the newest comic and feel completely lost, and check out the character page to see who's who.

Why would you read the most recent page first? Would you read the last page/chapter of a book before the rest of it?

As for your question, I don't think Rich has considered making a new one (he even lampshaded it in a strip). It be nice if he did (it be interesting to see all the other dozens of characters) but I'm sure he has enough time with the comic strips.

[factotum]

I agree there isn't much point in this, and I don't know of any other webcomic that does it either. Try reading the latest Schlock Mercenary strip and understanding it without having read the previous few hundred, for a start! You simply can't condense all that plotting and character into a short enough form that it would be helpful, and besides, it helps the Giant if people read the whole strip anyway because they're more likely to purchase the ancillary material if they get into it that way.

[Cizak]

Why would you read the most recent page first? Would you read the last page/chapter of a book before the rest of it?

I agree with the doctor here. If you've never heard of a comic/book/movie before, why would you read the last page/chapter/watch the last 10 minutes of it and expect to fully understand everything?

[NerfTW]

It was that exact "Ooh, whos' this floating guy with the goatee?" reaction that made me go through the strip from the beginning. (It was Nale sending to Roy about kidnapping his sister)

Really, your issue makes no sense. Forcing someone to read through from the beginning? Well, yes, that's normally how one reads a story. Your comparison to a gag a day strip implies the exact opposite that you're saying. A gag a day strip needs a page for new characters, since one can be expected to read from a random point in the history. An ongoing story just needs the initial characters explained, although the strip does that pretty well itself. Reading from the middle of the story and complaining that you don't understand it is just ludicrous.

[137beth]

Yea, I don't see much point to listing every character in the 753+ strips so far. Not when that would take almost as long to read and explain as it would to read the whole series. And don't even get me started with writing that page:smallwink:

[ThePhantasm]

I don't judge whether I'll read a webcomic or not by the cast page. When I first started reading OOTS I didn't even know the cast page was there until I was at like strip 200.

In short, I don't think adding characters to the OOTS cast page would make or break whether anyone decides to read the comic. They don't need the SparksNotes before the book. Besides, the entire comic is right there for FREE - they just have to start with #001 and see if they like it!

[NerfTW]

Indeed. "The story so far..." pages are great and necessary for TV shows or comic books, where it's expected that new viewers/readers will not have ready access to previous material, and in the case of comics, you want them buying the comic on the shelf right now, not back issues.

As a webcomic, though, all the previous material is right there for free at any time.

[Marnath]

I also don't see this. If you start reading at page 753 of a series, you don't DESERVE to understand whats going on.:smallconfused:

[KillItWithFire]

In my opinion, the magnifficance of oots that seperates it from the average webcomic is its superior writng and the development that goes on with the characters, the development of the story itself. This is something you have to watch happen, you can't just see the end result. While I think the early bits of oots might need something to nudge new readers to get to the good bits, it should not be so strong a push that it shoves them all the way to the end. Read the whole thing, or not at all. (no one reads the cast page anyway)

[Asthix]

No one may read the cast page, but I accidentally went to it yesterday while trying to show something to someone who had never read the comic.

The cast page looks... quaint by the standards of the recent comics. For that reason alone it should be updated as it is not a stretch of the imagination for someone to consider it lame by today's standards, IMO.

[Thanatosia]

Haha, I never knew until now that the Giant actually updated the Character Page to have Haley holding an "IOU" slip from herself instead of the diamond, Genius!

[NerfTW]

No one may read the cast page, but I accidentally went to it yesterday while trying to show something to someone who had never read the comic.

The cast page looks... quaint by the standards of the recent comics. For that reason alone it should be updated as it is not a stretch of the imagination for someone to consider it lame by today's standards, IMO.

Considering it's not at all necessary for reading the comic, I'm sure there's far better options for spending his time than updating a seven or so year old bonus strip.

[Bws2cool]

How do you even get to the character page? Did there used to be a link somewhere, but now it got removed cause it's old?

[Cizak]

You just press the question mark above any comic.

[Blackcloak]

oh, look. Another necromancer.

Anyway, Who knows? I joined OOTS a while back, but only joined the forums recently. I do remember, though, that before the Azure City war, they didn't look THAT outdated, though. But now it's just embarrassing. WHEN WILL THEY UPDATE IT?!?!?!

[Blackcloak]

I agree with the doctor here. If you've never heard of a comic/book/movie before, why would you read the last page/chapter/watch the last 10 minutes of it and expect to fully understand everything?

REALLY? The end? Where did T-O-E find that out?

[Bws2cool]

You just press the question mark above any comic.

Oh, thanks. I really need to pay more attention to these types of things.

[Asthix]

Considering it's not at all necessary for reading the comic, I'm sure there's far better options for spending his time than updating a seven or so year old bonus strip.


You just press the question mark above any comic.


I joined OOTS a while back, but only joined the forums recently. I do remember, though, that before the Azure City war, they didn't look THAT outdated, though. But now it's just embarrassing. WHEN WILL THEY UPDATE IT?!?!?!

I think the fact that you can get to the character page from any comic is also a reason why it could be updated.

And welcome to the forums, Blackcloak!

[KillItWithFire]

Or you know what, make the character page the first page of the comic, like page 0000 or something. This way it introduces the characters and no one has to worry about updating it as it's just ment to let you know the characters basic personalities. It allows the page to more easily function for its basic reason for existance too. It just seems like it was ment to be read BEFORE page 1 (Especially since Elan doesn't have his chain shirt yet), making it page 0 forces new readers to read it first.

[Dr.Epic]

Do you think the Giant would be interested in a guest artist character page?

[Nimrod's Son]

God I hope not.

[Trazoi]

Why would you read the most recent page first? Would you read the last page/chapter of a book before the rest of it?
When I discover a webcomic for the first time, I always read the most recent page first. I usually read back a few too, reading the last three or four in reverse order. While that plays merry hell with understanding the story, I'm making a snap judgement about whether this a webcomic worth reading. If the current page is interesting enough to get me hooked, I'll go back to the beginning and work my through the archive at a steady pace.

I usually find the first comic in a webcomic's archive a terrible gauge of its merit. It almost always takes several dozen strips for a webcomic to find its stride.

[Cizak]

God I hope not.

Seconded.10

[NerfTW]

When I discover a webcomic for the first time, I always read the most recent page first. I usually read back a few too, reading the last three or four in reverse order. While that plays merry hell with understanding the story, I'm making a snap judgement about whether this a webcomic worth reading. If the current page is interesting enough to get me hooked, I'll go back to the beginning and work my through the archive at a steady pace.

I usually find the first comic in a webcomic's archive a terrible gauge of its merit. It almost always takes several dozen strips for a webcomic to find its stride.


Reading the current comics to sample it and then going back is different, though. That's normal and to be expected. What's ridiculous is expecting to be brought up to speed so you don't have to go through the archives at all in a story driven, linear comic.

[Dr.Epic]

When I discover a webcomic for the first time, I always read the most recent page first. I usually read back a few too, reading the last three or four in reverse order. While that plays merry hell with understanding the story, I'm making a snap judgement about whether this a webcomic worth reading. If the current page is interesting enough to get me hooked, I'll go back to the beginning and work my through the archive at a steady pace.

I usually find the first comic in a webcomic's archive a terrible gauge of its merit. It almost always takes several dozen strips for a webcomic to find its stride.

So, reading the most recent strips and not knowing any of the characters, plot, or setting helps you understand the comic better than starting from the start, the beginning, the introduction?

[NerfTW]

It does help you know if the writing is any good, or if the plot ever goes anywhere. Many early webcomics, this one included, that didn't start with a plot, are often pretty bumpy in the beginning. It's good to know that they're going to improve.

Order of the Stick, for example, took 44 strips before any real plot came along. Before that, it was pretty generic dungeon hilarity. I had the same issue with not really caring about the comic until the Oracle storyline, which a friend kept sending me links to, and wanting to know who the floaty bearded Elan was. The desire to find out who these characters were is what made me read through the archives.

[malloyd]

Reading the current comics to sample it and then going back is different, though. That's normal and to be expected. What's ridiculous is expecting to be brought up to speed so you don't have to go through the archives at all in a story driven, linear comic.

That said, there are alternative approaches that do work in a long running works. The customary one in a story with plotline/book level divisions is to have a new cast of characters list for each book (which may be at either the beginning or end depending on whether you are going to include events from the current book in it). That does work for some webcomics too.

Another good one more adapted to the medium is to put up the character name, image and a link to the strip they are first introduced.

[Nimrod's Son]

That said, there are alternative approaches that do work in a long running works. The customary one in a story with plotline/book level divisions is to have a new cast of characters list for each book (which may be at either the beginning or end depending on whether you are going to include events from the current book in it). That does work for some webcomics too.
The OotS books do indeed have their own unique cast pages; since they're sold as single volumes then that's only right and proper. But there's no need for them on the net, since the whole thing is there to read for free - plus, little things like that add extra incentive to buy the books, since they're not available online.