PDA

View Full Version : The Aethernet!



TechnOkami
2010-10-26, 07:22 PM
So, I've had a sudden surge of creativity, and I want to know how I could do this using the 3.5 rules. I basically want to make my own version of the internet in D&D, except powered by magic, hence, the Aethernet.

What classes would enable me to make such a wondrous monstrosity?

Will I have to make a plane to keep magical memory servers in and keep the information flowing?

Just how?

Play on little Giants, play on.

KaganMonk
2010-10-26, 07:27 PM
Not sure there's a way to do this by the books, but someone (Fax maybe) had plans for it in an Artificer game that nearly started. It was all homebrewed, and I'm not sure it had costs, but its been conceptualized.

hotel_papa
2010-10-26, 07:30 PM
The autonomy of the Internet actually lends itself to a more outer-worldly source. An outsider race that can cast "sending" at will... I'm seeing a sort of altered Formorian that speaks in a fantasy parallel of binary, enslaved en-masse Matrix style to transfer packets of information along their hive-mind. The wizards that did it could stand to make an insane amount of money off of it, and the dark origin could lend itself to an exceptional plot hook, especially if the 'net itself is being used for some good...

Just what came to mind, messing with the shapesand in the playground....

Ranielle
2010-10-26, 07:33 PM
Consider these ideas stolen!

tahu88810
2010-10-26, 07:48 PM
There was a thread on this once, but my search-fu fails me.

Basically, someone decided that a bunch of commoners or semi-intelligent undead (like ghouls) standing next to each other could become a rough approximation of the very early internet. Though I only see it in the sense that 1's and 0's are exchanged.

Fuzzie Fuzz
2010-10-26, 07:51 PM
I don't think that it would work very well for a player creation mid-game, (though it might be doable) but would make a brilliant idea for some world background from a DM's campaign-designing perspective.

Tyndmyr
2010-10-26, 07:52 PM
I believe we previously used a large rock with a grid pattern on it and prestidigitation as a data storage medium, contingency abuse as logical operators, and designed a turing complete system within D&D. Obviously, you need a decently leveled caster to engage in such shenanigans, but once you can replicate computers, there's no particular reason you can't also use contingency for sending information and the rest.

Searching might turn it up.

gallagher
2010-10-26, 07:53 PM
what ever happened to having a bard? i mean, they are practically wikipedia...

in a game that i am currently running, i gave the party an item called the broken clock. it is right twice a day. twice per day you can ask it a question, and it makes a bardic knowledge check of like +28 (10th level, full skills, 20 INT).

yeah, i like throwing stupid items at them. i also gave them a bouncy ball that would always return from the exact point at which it was dropped. soooooo useful...

Claudius Maximus
2010-10-26, 08:31 PM
twice per day you can ask it a question, and it makes a bardic knowledge check of like +28 (10th level, full skills, 20 INT)

Wouldn't that only be +17?

Arbane
2010-10-26, 08:32 PM
You could always steal Terry Pratchett's Clacks Network - it's not quite the Internet, but a multinational network of semaphore towers could be very useful for fast communication.

For a Internet-like thing, how about this?

A set of books, all enchanted so that anything written in one appears in all the others. Potentially useful for anyone who needs to send long messages or diagrams over a distance. (The big problem is filling up the book and having to make more, and possibly adding more books to the 'set'.)

Hm... are there any spells in D&D that would make sense for making those?

DragonOfUndeath
2010-10-26, 08:38 PM
The big problem is filling up the book and having to make more.

autowipe pages 30 days old and just copy stuff you want to keep onto regular books

gallagher
2010-10-26, 08:46 PM
Wouldn't that only be +17?
isnt it 5 (intelligence) + Bard Level (10) + Skills ranks (13)?

Reluctance
2010-10-26, 08:47 PM
The internet is defined largely by the huge numbers of people on it. Magical internet, unless you can bring the masses of low-level nobodies to it, won't do much that magical telephone doesn't do better. And magical telephone is much easier to reproduce.

Claudius Maximus
2010-10-27, 12:18 AM
isnt it 5 (intelligence) + Bard Level (10) + Skills ranks (13)?


Bardic Knowledge

A bard may make a special bardic knowledge check with a bonus equal to his bard level + his Intelligence modifier to see whether he knows some relevant information about local notable people, legendary items, or noteworthy places. (If the bard has 5 or more ranks in Knowledge (history), he gains a +2 bonus on this check.)

So it's level (10) + int mod (5) +2 (synergy with K: History). Knowledge skills are otherwise not involved, and it might be possible to roll both a knowledge skill check and a bardic knowledge check about the same thing.

Noircat
2010-10-27, 12:56 AM
Maybe feature it as a sentient demiplane that requires some sort of gold/animal sacrifice/feat to graft into it/ritual to use. Shouldn't be available until level 5 just to keep it from utterly changng the setting.

Ormur
2010-10-27, 01:16 AM
It depends on how accurately you want to simulate the internet as a ubiquitous decentralized and chaotic environment filled with everything there is to know.

A simpler more centralized version could be like some kind of a extra-planar library that you could borrow from remotely. There would be shelves of books organized by subject and all the content would be provided by the users. You call a book to you (like instant summons) after finding the relevant category (with a magical map or an index), write in a query or an article on the proper page, return it and the next person responds. Something like usenet except with books.

The next step could be some kind of an real-time updating illusion that functioned like a computer screen. There could be more demiplanes to store the information, users could add sections to it by interacting with their illusion and so forth.

You just have to establish the mechanics of this. A sentient demiplane, a race of outsiders, a cabal of public minded high level wizards? Are they using instant summons, sending, programmable image scrying, divinations or will you homebrew it?

Yuki Akuma
2010-10-27, 05:12 AM
I believe we previously used a large rock with a grid pattern on it and prestidigitation as a data storage medium, contingency abuse as logical operators, and designed a turing complete system within D&D. Obviously, you need a decently leveled caster to engage in such shenanigans, but once you can replicate computers, there's no particular reason you can't also use contingency for sending information and the rest.

Searching might turn it up.

This sounds awesome and I must know more.

Cipher Stars
2010-10-27, 06:10 AM
I would lawl if there was a % chance penalty of getting addicted to strange images of nude elves....


EDIT:

http://fairytail.wikia.com/wiki/Archive

Souhiro
2010-10-27, 06:18 AM
what ever happened to having a bard? i mean, they are practically wikipediaEvolve or Die..


In fact, there IS a proto-aethernet, and is the Spellpool of the "Mage of the Arcane Order" PRC. As I remember, any Mage of the Order must pay some taxes and spend some of their XP working for the order (Imparting courses to the novices, writing scrolls, dousing fires in farms... whatever boring task they take) but received a trinquet that is both the "Membership Badge" and the way to access the SpellPool.


So, the AetherNet can be a corporatio... er... a guild of psychics, and for a small fee, they can rent you a trinket wich gives you access to whatever you search. If you have banks, you can even make avaiable to have an "Ae-Bay", and for another little fee, they can teleport whatever junk you buy.

But beware! as a GM you should use the Aethernet wisely, or your campaing will turn too 4ed-like.

faceroll
2010-10-27, 06:21 AM
Wouldn't that only be +17?

+17 is like +28 in that they are both positive integers.


The internet is defined largely by the huge numbers of people on it. Magical internet, unless you can bring the masses of low-level nobodies to it, won't do much that magical telephone doesn't do better. And magical telephone is much easier to reproduce.

Aren't there an infinite number of very magical outsiders in existence?



Evolve or Die..

What a silly phrase. :smallfurious:

Prime32
2010-10-27, 06:22 AM
There was a thread on this once, but my search-fu fails me.

Basically, someone decided that a bunch of commoners or semi-intelligent undead (like ghouls) standing next to each other could become a rough approximation of the very early internet. Though I only see it in the sense that 1's and 0's are exchanged.It was an extension of the commoner railgun - I was the one who pointed out that undead chokers could ready two actions per round, allowing for routing. They're undead so that they don't need to take breaks. Just keep a bunch of them in a demiplane where time goes faster, and you can use the portal as a calculator.

The Society Mind (http://dsp-d20-srd.wikidot.com/society-mind) (and related classes) also has something like this.

faceroll
2010-10-27, 06:25 AM
It was an extension of the commoner railgun - I was the one who pointed out that undead chokers could ready two actions per round, allowing for routing. They're undead so that they don't need to take breaks. Just keep a bunch of them in a demiplane where time goes faster, and you can use the portal as a calculator.

The Society Mind (http://dsp-d20-srd.wikidot.com/society-mind) (and related classes) also has something like this.

You would need 200 square feet per byte. You'd need something bigger than a demiplane.

Prime32
2010-10-27, 06:38 AM
You would need 200 square feet per byte. You'd need something bigger than a demiplane.Or you could shrink them down and have them stand on top of each other.

faceroll
2010-10-27, 06:43 AM
Or you could shrink them down and have them stand on top of each other.

You could, but there are more elegant solutions that don't require stupendously large amounts of space to replicate a pocket calculator's capabilities.


[edit]
There's a FR monster that eats creatures and creates clones of them. You could have them eat a Chronotryn. Those could then cast Wish to emulate that Wu Jen spell that makes you fine. They also get 2 actions/round, along with 20th level wizard casting (or something close). That'd be one hell of a computer.

The White Knight
2010-10-27, 07:06 AM
autowipe pages 30 days old and just copy stuff you want to keep onto regular books

Ha! Usenet!

I love this thread!

Cipher Stars
2010-10-27, 07:10 AM
http://fairytail.wikia.com/wiki/Archive

Comment, darn it!

Archive is the perfect example of a magical mimic of tech- Internet.

Jack_Simth
2010-10-27, 07:26 AM
Just how?Depends on what, exactly, you wish to do.

If you simply wish to be able to post information in such a way that anyone equipped can see it if they know the address? Third Eye Sense (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/items/universalItems.htm#sense) for the reader, Permanent Image (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/permanentImage.htm) to make the pages (which the caster can update later on).

panaikhan
2010-10-27, 07:36 AM
I like the idea of the next-generation Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy - an artifact-level 'book' that contains immense amounts of information, and can exist in multiple places at once.
Anything added to the book, would be instantly available to all the other 'owners'. The book would ALWAYS have ten blank pages at the back, no matter how much information was added, and the spine never grew over 2" thick (it stored pages in an alternate universe / pocket dimention)

Radar
2010-10-27, 08:47 AM
I believe we previously used a large rock with a grid pattern on it and prestidigitation as a data storage medium, contingency abuse as logical operators, and designed a turing complete system within D&D. Obviously, you need a decently leveled caster to engage in such shenanigans, but once you can replicate computers, there's no particular reason you can't also use contingency for sending information and the rest.

Searching might turn it up.
So very much this. Contingency loops are a great basis for computer programing. They can even fork without limitations thanks to Arcane Fusion and Sanctum Spell abuse!
So the library server has a main loop [1] that will essentialy catch events (somebody trying to connect) and activate other loops for the client from a prepared list of instructions (visual interface, search engines etc.). The client will then interact with the interface loop and through it could scry on specific books and things like that. He might also have access to some shared memory on the server and generate content. It all goes down as usual from that.

[1] Contingency: If signal X is detected, then cast Greater Arcane Fusion (Contingency [1] + Contingency [User Interface with variable: sender of signal X])
(Or something along these lines. It might require substantial RAW abuse, to overcome limitations of Greater Arcane Fusion)

The only problem is the communication. I'd figure, that clients would have some sort of a node device, that would have it's own Contingency loop system inside. Most long-distance communication spells have a creature as a target, so those nodes and some part of the server might have to be constructs (mindless would suffice). The most efficient would be Message spell (0th level, no long casting time and long duration). Make it a transdimensional spell (metamagic feat for that) and place large ammount of rally points on the Ethereal Plane around the whole planet. For serious transdimensional access, more complicated spell would be needed.

Screen is actually realy easy: it's either a Silent/Minor/Major Image or just a bunch of pixels colored with Prestidigitation.

SlyGuyMcFly
2010-10-27, 09:41 AM
There was a thread on this once, but my search-fu fails me.

Basically, someone decided that a bunch of commoners or semi-intelligent undead (like ghouls) standing next to each other could become a rough approximation of the very early internet. Though I only see it in the sense that 1's and 0's are exchanged.

I seem to recall a similar thread (or, more probably, thread derail) that involved using severed chunks of a Troll as an instantaneous communication medium. Don't remember any details beyond that.

Radar
2010-10-27, 02:24 PM
I seem to recall a similar thread (or, more probably, thread derail) that involved using severed chunks of a Troll as an instantaneous communication medium. Don't remember any details beyond that.
It was based on the fact, that only the biggest part of the troll regenerates, so if you fragmentate a troll and give the second smallest chunk to someone far away, then you can send a single bit of information instantly by making your chunk smaller, then the one sent. It does have some shortcomings:
1. One-way communication, unless you use more trolls.
2. Your troll chunk is spent after sending one bit (it technically just changes the direction of information transfer, but each iteration of the proces makes both chunks successively smaller, so they are used up quickly).
3. Information transfer is limited by your hacking abilities, which is for most cases up to 5 attacks per round - not nearly enough.

Frosty
2010-10-27, 02:29 PM
Comment, darn it!

Archive is the perfect example of a magical mimic of tech- Internet.
Hmm...and here I was expecting a link to some Harry Dresden wiki site. :smallamused:

In any case, I think the Aethernet need to start with a bunch of Modrons forming a hive cluster and telepathically networking together...

PairO'Dice Lost
2010-10-27, 04:40 PM
This sounds awesome and I must know more.

Here you go (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=126223&highlight=prestidigitation).

Lifeson
2010-10-27, 04:59 PM
I'm surprised no one brought up the Neverwinter Nights series of modules "Penultima" that had "The Interplane", which was basically the internet fashioned as a modifiable series of demi-planes that did all of the coding as physics.

Yes. :P

Jack_Simth
2010-10-27, 05:40 PM
The only problem is the communication. I'd figure, that clients would have some sort of a node device, that would have it's own Contingency loop system inside. Nah. Use Detect Remote Viewing (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/detectRemoteViewing.htm) or Detect Scrying (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/detectScrying.htm) and have it with at least a +20 caster level vs. whatever connection method is used - and the Third Eye Sense (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/items/universalItems.htm#sense) has an effective caster level of 3, and can target a location. So you can set everything up at the 'server', and just have it automatically return-scry anyone who 'logs in' and gather it's information that way. The user sits there scrying, and talking to thin air.

cheezewizz2000
2010-10-27, 06:13 PM
I homebrewed an internet-like plane that I've never got the chance to use. Here it is for posteriority:

Spoilered, for avoidance of walls of text

The ‘Web

Ever since technology was replaced by magic, information became much harder to obtain. In an effort to counteract this, a group of dedicated individuals performed a great ritual. The ritual was designed to produce a plane filled with the information of all of its visitors. In essence, they tried to create the internet with magic. While it succeeded, the group lost their individuality. They now wander as mere shells through the world they have created. Their collective knowledge is available to all willing to traverse The ‘Web.

The ‘Web is coexistant with the Prime and is made up of tens of millions of rooms, called fora (forum, singular) connected by billions of trillions of tubes. Each forum is different and filled with many words and images that can interest or horrify the visitors. Spending too long amongst them can result in desensitisation to life as a whole. Despite the fact that each forum is connected to every other forum, there appear to be only 6 tubes connected to each forum, one at each cardinal direction (N, W, E, S, up and down). This is due largely to the non-Euclidian, and indeed non-Escherian nature of The 'Web. Suffice to say, using True-Seeing is hazardous, but one needs to know which tube to use to get to their desired Forum. Guessing the correct one is no guaruntee that you will reach your destination unless you knew that that was the correct tube.

Each tube is exactly 10’ wide and 120’ long, no matter where it goes. Anywhere can be accessed from anywhere else and so each forum is connected to every other forum, however finding the correct tube to go down requires a DC40 Search or Gather Information check. If the player casts true seeing successfully, they instantly know which tubes lead where. The tubes are clogged with users and with random piles of garbage that make them difficult to traverse and so travelers going through the tubes may only move at half speed.

In all parts of The ‘Web, there is an overpowering stench of stale sweat and visitors must make a DC14 fortitude save or be nauseated for the duration of their stay and for 1 minute afterwards. Success makes the character immune for that visit alone. Any piece of information can be gained whilst in The ‘Web, though trawling through the many Fora takes a lot of effort. Increase all gather information checks' and search checks' DCs by 20, but give the players a +1 bonus to these checks for every 3 hours spent searching The ‘Web. All gather information and search checks will turn up something, though if it is useful or misleading is up to the DM.

The inhabitants and visitors all look exactly the same: they are androgynous, naked humanoids with a permanently smiling mouth, upturned moustache and small pointy goatee. Only a successful True Seeing spell can reveal what the inhabitants really are. Most are human; however representatives from all races are present. Their vacant, soulless eyes stare endlessly into the middle-distance, and their expressionless faces show no hint of emotion except for occasional flashes of horror or slight mirth in those inhabitants that have not been there long.

The ‘Web has the following traits:
• Subjective directional gravity in the tubes, normal gravity in fora.
• Semi-Timeless. Age, hunger, thirst, poison, and disease don’t appear to function in The ‘Web. Visitors suffer no ill effects while in The ‘Web, however they suffer from all of the effects they missed out on when they leave.
• Entrapping. All visitors to The 'Web suffer increasing apathy the longer they spend here. All visitors must make a Will saving throw every 3 hours (DC 10+ 1 for every 3 hours spent here) or become a member of the anonymous hordes. Failure results in their loosing all personality traits and they can no longer leave of their own volition. The character becomes true neutral and will wander the web at random. If they are attacked, they will defend themselves in the most simple and effective way they have. For example: a high level wizard will encase himself in a cube of force, a warblade will use his most powerful maneuver against his assailant. Only a Wish or Miracle can return such characters to normal.
• Enhanced magic. All spells in the Divination School always give the most beneficial outcome if they work. Casters must roll a d100 when casting any spell from the divination school. If they roll a 1-75, the spell is cast but gives an irrelevant piece of information. On a 76-90 the caster has seen something that cannot be unseen. They must succeed on a DC30 will save or become nauseated for 1 hour. On a 91-95 the spell works but the caster must make a DC30 will save or become confused for 1 hour. On a 96-100 the spell works; if there is a chance for a negative, or useless outcome, this is ignored.

__________________

Example The 'Web Site: Wikipedia

Contrary to the cubes that make up most fora, Wikipedia is more like a giant cyclinder. The room, such as it is, is roughly 50' in diameter Mahogany book-cases line the circular walls and 10' wide platforms attached to the walls provide walking surfaces every 10'. A spiral ramp winds its way up through the center of the room and seems to curve off and out of sight, giving the impression of standing between two mirrors that are not quite parallel. Looking over the edge one gets the impression that if he fell, he would fall forever, constantly re-tracing his path, circling round and round forever.

The anonymous hordes busy themselves by franticly running to a shelf, seemingly pulling a book out at random and feverishly reading it, before dropping it and running off to find another. A rare few cross-out and re-write sentances or entire passages, and rarer still are the anonymous figures that catch others in the act of editing and throwing them down the nearest tube, all while picking up and re-shelving the dropped books. Because of this random vandalism and editing, the books are a mess and require a DC20 decipher script check to tell what the book is about. Gaining any extra information requires a full 5 minutes of study and a DC30 decipher script check. Dispite this, any piece of information can be found here, though its accuracy is likely to be poor.

The books are heavily cross referenced and each book has a specific number that would work something like the Dewey decimal system, if the Dewey system required a 38 digit number in base 16. A DC 15 raw inteligence check is required to work out what the numbers mean. On a sucessful roll, the character is able to find his way around the shelves with ease. The character gets a +5 competance bonus to gather information checks while in wikipedia.
__________________

Example The 'Web Site: 4 Chan

None who have entered have ever left as anything other than an anonymous drone. This place is a horrible, horrible place in which you will find no remorse, no mercy and no humanity. There is nothing of value to be found here, and the entire place is filled with shoulder-to-shoulder anonymous drones. After 1 minute in 4chan, the player must make a DC10 will save or become confused and nauseated for 5 minutes. Every minute the character must make a new save with the DC increased by 1 for each minute spent in 4chan.
__________________

New Magic item

Search toolbar
This is a long silver rod, around which are nine rings of yellow and one of red. Possession of this rod gives a +30 insight bonus to all gather information and search checks made in The 'Web. It has no use outside of The 'Web. Each time a check is made the red ring disappears and one of the yellow rings becomes red. Once all 10 charges are spent, the toolbar becomes useless. Casters may spend all 10 charges at once in order to allow them to cast divination spells without risk of failure.

Androgeus
2010-10-27, 08:36 PM
There was a thread on this once, but my search-fu fails me.

Basically, someone decided that a bunch of commoners or semi-intelligent undead (like ghouls) standing next to each other could become a rough approximation of the very early internet. Though I only see it in the sense that 1's and 0's are exchanged.

This (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7646871#post7646871) is the thread where I realised that the commoner rail can be used as an "internet"
It can be used to compute, I however believe it is a much better used as a package delivery system.

Psyren
2010-10-27, 09:34 PM
Psionics is way ahead on this :smallsmile:

Thoughts of everything in the world with an Int score - Astral Plane. Local clusters - Worldthought networks from Untapped Potential. You can model everything from routers to proxies to bandwidth to hosting.

Amiel
2010-10-28, 05:25 AM
I have this; it might give you some inspiration?

The Pulse

To those willing enough, the internet is able to be perceived as a reality construct. Marketed as a cybernetic upgrade, the Pulse allows the everyday individual to directly imprint a computer unto his or her brain and traverse cyberspace. It has become exceedingly popular, as it allows a direct wetware-cyberware interface and enables the person to manifest a physical entity within the virtual world and interact with the contents of the internet and with others.

Would it be so that things are so simple. The surgery required to get the implant is curiously inexpensive. With minimal side- and after-effects, millions have flocked to get it implanted, eager to explore and savor the physical delights of the internets.

However, not all is as it seems. To ensure continuation, the integrity and maintenance of the enhancement, consumers are required to consume quantities of the expensive food Cyblex. Essentially a drug, Cyblex forces total addiction upon the consumer, and soon the consumer is focused totally upon the internet. Inevitably, as Cyblex is not a real food and contains no nutritional value, death occurs.

Though such is often a slow, agonising process; the consumer does not feel any physical pain from wasting, muscular dystrophy, etc as the mind is fully fixated upon experiencing cyberspace. Cyblex also prolongs the longevity of the consumer to beyond what would normally be a healthy lifespan. Such are the dark delights of the future.

Radar
2010-10-28, 09:10 AM
Psionics is way ahead on this :smallsmile:

Thoughts of everything in the world with an Int score - Astral Plane. Local clusters - Worldthought networks from Untapped Potential. You can model everything from routers to proxies to bandwidth to hosting.
Hmm... this might allow for remote Psychic Reformation to do a data dump directly into someone's brain. Soo cool! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AOpomu9V6Q) :smallbiggrin: