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Yarnides
2010-10-27, 09:04 PM
so, i'm playing final fantasy tactics again, and decided to create a lancer class for me and my pals; feel free to comment, criticise etc.

P.S.: grammar nazis can keep the mistakes they might stumble over :smallbiggrin:


lancer: a master of leaping through the air, delivering devastating strikes to his enemies with reach weapons when landing.

hit die: d10
BAB: fighter
saves: fort good, ref&will bad
weapon proficiency: all simple, all martial melee, ell exotic polearms
armor proficiency: heavy
skill pts: 4
class skills: diplomacy, heal, intimidate, jump, knowledge (nobility&royalty, history, geography), profession (any), sense motive, spot

lvls&class abilities

1 jump(+2/*2, delay 1d8), overbear gravity
2 weapon focus (polearms)
3 /
4 weapon specialization (polearms)
5 /
6 initiative boost
7 /
8 greater weapon focus (polearms)
9 jump(+3/*3, delay 1d10)
10 /
11 /
12 initiative boost, greater weapon specialization (polearms)
13 /
14 whirlwind alight
15 /
16 improved critical (polearms)
17 jump(+4/*4, delay 1d12)
18 initiative boost
19 /
20 double jump

class ability descriptions:



jump(+X*X, delay 1dY):

the lancer's core class ability; as a full-round action, he can leap into the air, landing onto a chosen enemy in a square he could reach using the jump skill;
to initiate a jump, just roll a jump check based on your and your target's momentary positions (to affect a target, you have to choose a square it occupies; landing within your weapon's reach won't suffice).
when the jumping distance determined by the roll is enough to affect your target, make an attack roll with +X as a bonus; when hit, your target recieves *X times the amount of damage your weapon would normally deal, including bonuses from STR, power attack etc.;
this multiplication follows both the rules for stacking multipliers in DnD 3.5 (so *2*2 would result in*3 in total, not *4) and the rules for critical damage (magical fire damage of 1d6 is not doubled/tripled etc.).

this technique follows some restrictions:
first - it doesn't affect enemies who have already acted in this round.
second - the time between taking off and landing/striking your foe is called delay(1dY); each jump involves a 1dY roll, wherein Y determines the initiative count the lancer's target has to be "slower" than him; example: harold the lancer has an INI of 20 and attempts to use jump on goblin warrior 1 (INI 13; harold doesn't exactly know the goblin warriors INI, but noticed that he was always one of the last of the battle's participants to act); he attempts to jump(+4/*4, delay 1d12), gets "4" as his Y result, and after a successful jump&attack roll are made, harold resolves his jump as if having INI 16 (20-4=16; his INI count is reset to 20 again next round), therefor striking goblin warrior 1, dealing quadruple damage. if he would have targeted goblin warrior 2 (INI 18) having the same results on his tolls, his attempt would be wasted, if goblin warrior 2 decided to move into another square on his turn (because INI18>INI16, an the goblin warrior really doesn't want to be impaled by that polearm-wielding armored jumper if he sees him coming). the lancer would then land in his targeted square, not dealing any damage.
third: jumping elevation is half the amount of distance crossed; so you probably wouldn't be able to make a 60-ft.-jump in a long but low-ceilinged corridor, because you would bump your head.
fourth: all the lancer's class abilities including jump can only be executed in heavy armor; for it was essential part of his supernatural training and exercise, having your "second skin" on means more to you than the laws of physics.
fifth: your target for the jump has to be in a square 15 or more feet away from your current position.

should you fail your jump check, you remain in your square, become flat-footed and your full-round-action is wasted.
should you fail your attack roll after a successful jump check, you can either land in a square adjacent to your target, or use a swift action to return to your original square- provided you succeed on another jump check with the same difficulty (if not, you waste your swift action, remain in the square next to your target, and become flat-footed).
should attack roll and jump be successful, but your target have disappeared in the delay time, you land in the targeted square, not dealing any damage.
should attack roll and jump be successful, and your target not have disappeared in the delay time, you deal *X damage, and land in a square adjacent to your target, or use a swift action to return to your original square- provided you succeed on another jump check with the same difficulty (if not, you waste your swift action, remain in the square next to your target, and become flat-footed).

a lancer's jump abilities do not overlap, so a lvl 17 lancer can choose between a jump(+2/*2, delay 1d8), jump(+3/*3, delay 1d10) or jump(+4/*4, delay 1d12), whatever he assumes to be most appropriate for the current combat situation.

overbear gravity:

lancers ignore their AC penalty whenever using the jumping skill, and recieve a competence bonus to jump equal to their class level. they are always considered to have a running start for the
purpose of determining a jump check DC.

weapon focus (polearms)

as the fighter feat, recieve +1 to your attack roll whenever using polearms.

weapon specialization (polearms)

as the fighter feat, recieve +2 to your damage roll whenever using polearms.

initiative boost

a reaction ability, triggered by enemies successfully attacking the lancer in combat. each successful trigger of initiative boost grants the lancer a +1 on his initiative, beginning the next round; multiple initiative boosts and boosts from different occasions stack. the exact type of trigger can vary, see below;
whenever you are granted one sort initiative boost from lancer class levels, choose one type:
initiative boost (physical damage): each time the lancer gets successfully HP damaged by physical means, e.g. a sword slash, a beast's claw etc., he gains +1 initiative on the next round.
initiative boost (magic damage): each time the lancer gets successfully HP damaged by magic, e.g. a wizard's fireball etc., he gains +1 initiative on the next round. a DM may allow to expand the trigger to psionics, spell-like abilities, supernatural abilities etc., as long as they deal HP damage.
initiative boost (adverse condition): each time an enemy bestows an adverse condition upon the lancer that is not direct HP damage, such as poisoned, frightened, dazzled, fatigued, ability damaged, level drained etc., the lancer gains +1 initiative on the next round.

initiative boosts last until the end of an encounter.

greater weapon focus (polearms)

as the fighter feat, recieve +2 to your attack roll whenever using polearms. doesn't stack with weapon focus, but overlaps the +1 bonus.

greater weapon specialization (polearms)

as the fighter feat, recieve +4 to your damage roll whenever using polearms. doesn't stack with weapon specialization, but overlaps the +2 bonus.

whirlwind alight

immediately after successfully dropping a creature with a jump (= below 0 HP), a lancer gains the benefit of the great cleave feat, even if he does not meet the prerequisites;
he can only cleave if using a polearm, and only subsequent to a jump (e.g. not with attacks of opportunity later that round).

improved critical (polearms)

as the feat, doubles the critical threat range of any held polearm.

double jump

once per day, make two jumps as a full-round action; you recieve a second swift action on that turn, which can only be used to return to your original position if you wish to.

Innis Cabal
2010-10-27, 09:04 PM
This needs formatting. Badly. On top of that, there are like 20 Lancer/Dragoon classes on this board.

AugustNights
2010-10-28, 05:43 AM
so, i'm playing final fantasy tactics again, and decided to create a lancer class for me and my pals; feel free to comment, criticise etc.

P.S.: grammar nazis can keep the mistakes they might stumble over :smallbiggrin:


lancer: a master of leaping through the air, delivering devastating strikes to his enemies with reach weapons when landing.

hit die: d10
BAB: fighter
saves: fort good, ref&will bad

I'd give them a good will. They tend to be holy warrior-esk.



weapon proficiency: all simple, all martial melee, ell exotic polearms

Bad idea. All exotic polearms begs for cheese.



armor proficiency: heavy
skill pts: 4
class skills: diplomacy, heal, intimidate, jump, knowledge (nobility&royalty, history, geography), profession (any), sense motive, spot

Room for more skill options, I think you may be on par with the Cleric, this is a bad thing.



lvls&class abilities

jump(+X*X, delay 1dY):

the lancer's core class ability; as a full-round action, he can leap into the air, landing onto a chosen enemy in a square he could reach using the jump skill;
to initiate a jump, just roll a jump check based on your and your target's momentary positions (to affect a target, you have to choose a square it occupies; landing within your weapon's reach won't suffice).
when the jumping distance determined by the roll is enough to affect your target, make an attack roll with +X as a bonus; when hit, your target recieves *X times the amount of damage your weapon would normally deal, including bonuses from STR, power attack etc.;
this multiplication follows both the rules for stacking multipliers in DnD 3.5 (so *2*2 would result in*3 in total, not *4) and the rules for critical damage (magical fire damage of 1d6 is not doubled/tripled etc.).

Eh, midly powerful, but not enough to break the game I guess.




this technique follows some restrictions:
first - it doesn't affect enemies who have already acted in this round.

What?



second - the time between taking off and landing/striking your foe is called delay(1dY); each jump involves a 1dY roll, wherein Y determines the initiative count the lancer's target has to be "slower" than him; example: harold the lancer has an INI of 20 and attempts to use jump on goblin warrior 1 (INI 13; harold doesn't exactly know the goblin warriors INI, but noticed that he was always one of the last of the battle's participants to act); he attempts to jump(+4/*4, delay 1d12), gets "4" as his Y result, and after a successful jump&attack roll are made, harold resolves his jump as if having INI 16 (20-4=16; his INI count is reset to 20 again next round), therefor striking goblin warrior 1, dealing quadruple damage. if he would have targeted goblin warrior 2 (INI 18) having the same results on his tolls, his attempt would be wasted, if goblin warrior 2 decided to move into another square on his turn (because INI18>INI16, an the goblin warrior really doesn't want to be impaled by that polearm-wielding armored jumper if he sees him coming). the lancer would then land in his targeted square, not dealing any damage.

Overly complicated. Adding unnecessary bookwork, there must be an easier way to do this.



third: jumping elevation is half the amount of distance crossed; so you probably wouldn't be able to make a 60-ft.-jump in a long but low-ceilinged corridor,because you would bump your head.

Especially not in Heavy Armor, when your character would be making a 40ft jump check in one round, and ending it in the next.



fourth: all the lancer's class abilities including jump can only be executed in heavy armor; for it was essential part of his supernatural training and exercise, having your "second skin" on means more to you than the laws of physics.

This seems silly, why restrict them to heavy armor?



fifth: your target for the jump has to be in a square 15 or more feet away from your current position.

This ability is getting so restricted it will be less likely to be used at all, and if so, you have a weaker fighter. Bad thing indeed.



should you fail your jump check, you remain in your square, become flat-footed and your full-round-action is wasted.

More penalties? These guys won't be very fun to play. Loosen up the mechanics. I'd recommend looking at Leap attack, and its functions.



should you fail your attack roll after a successful jump check, you can either land in a square adjacent to your target, or use a swift action to return to your original square- provided you succeed on another jump check with the same difficulty (if not, you waste your swift action, remain in the square next to your target, and become flat-footed).

A lot of movement distance in one round, and free-ish spring attack at first level. Probably not the best way to go.



should attack roll and jump be successful, but your target have disappeared in the delay time, you land in the targeted square, not dealing any damage.

I know its like the game, but players are not going to want to waste rounds with mischances based on initiative and numbers they don't know.



overbear gravity:
lancers ignore their AC penalty whenever using the jumping skill, and recieve a competence bonus to jump equal to their class level. they are always considered to have a running start for the
purpose of determining a jump check DC.

Good for the class. A bit powerful, but not breakable.



weapon focus (polearms)

as the fighter feat, recieve +1 to your attack roll whenever using polearms.

This is kind of weak, The Weapon Focus Tree doesn't make terribly good class features. Players want more options in combat, not more numbers. (+1 is particularly weak with full bab, and a charge bonus... does the Jump charge attack bonus stack with charging?)



weapon specialization (polearms)

as the fighter feat, recieve +2 to your damage roll whenever using polearms.

Likewise.



initiative boost

a reaction ability, triggered by enemies successfully attacking the lancer in combat. each successful trigger of initiative boost grants the lancer a +1 on his initiative, beginning the next round; multiple initiative boosts and boosts from different occasions stack. the exact type of trigger can vary, see below;
whenever you are granted one sort initiative boost from lancer class levels, choose one type:
initiative boost (physical damage): each time the lancer gets successfully HP damaged by physical means, e.g. a sword slash, a beast's claw etc., he gains +1 initiative on the next round.
initiative boost (magic damage): each time the lancer gets successfully HP damaged by magic, e.g. a wizard's fireball etc., he gains +1 initiative on the next round. a DM may allow to expand the trigger to psionics, spell-like abilities, supernatural abilities etc., as long as they deal HP damage.
initiative boost (adverse condition): each time an enemy bestows an adverse condition upon the lancer that is not direct HP damage, such as poisoned, frightened, dazzled, fatigued, ability damaged, level drained etc., the lancer gains +1 initiative on the next round.

initiative boosts last until the end of an encounter.

Actually this I kind of like. You don't really have to spell out what damage means so thoroughly. This is very much like the game, and a new mechanic that seems like it would run fairly smoothly.




greater weapon focus (polearms)

as the fighter feat, recieve +2 to your attack roll whenever using polearms. doesn't stack with weapon focus, but overlaps the +1 bonus.

greater weapon specialization (polearms)

as the fighter feat, recieve +4 to your damage roll whenever using polearms. doesn't stack with weapon specialization, but overlaps the +2 bonus.

Same as before.



whirlwind alight

immediately after successfully dropping a creature with a jump (= below 0 HP), a lancer gains the benefit of the great cleave feat, even if he does not meet the prerequisites;
he can only cleave if using a polearm, and only subsequent to a jump (e.g. not with attacks of opportunity later that round).

A light ability, and not a terribly bad one. You could clean up the language by replicating Cleave's explanation, but all the same.



improved critical (polearms)

as the feat, doubles the critical threat range of any held polearm.


Mmm, it's alright. Passable though.



double jump

once per day, make two jumps as a full-round action; you recieve a second swift action on that turn, which can only be used to return to your original position if you wish to.


Need to clean up jump before this is really PEACHable.


All in all the big question is 'how can you make this class distinguished' Distinguished from a Fighter?
Distinguished from a Mount-Paladin (sans the mount in this case)
Distinguished from a Psionic Warrior? (sans the psychic)
So far you have initiative and Jump-attack.
It's a start but it needs a lot of work. Right now it would be better off as a PrC. Think creatively, go for new but simple mechanics. Think of fun abilities.
Oh also, the boards tend to frown on 'Dead Levels,' I'm in that boat. Every level up should be exciting, even if the new ability is more for flavor than for combat.


Anyway that's my 2 copper painted wood pieces.

Morph Bark
2010-10-28, 08:43 AM
This needs formatting. Badly. On top of that, there are like 20 Lancer/Dragoon classes on this board.

Guilty (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=168962)! Admittably the original is over 2 years old though.

The formatting could use work here. Here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10313) you can easily copy one of the class tables from.