PDA

View Full Version : Iron Chef Optimization Challenge XIV



true_shinken
2010-11-03, 04:28 AM
Welcome, contestants, judges, and guests to Iron Chef XIV. Here in Optimization Colosseum, contestants will endeavor to create an optimized and flavorful character using a specified D&D3.5 prestige class as a "Secret Ingredient".

Contestants: You will need to present your build at at least one of the following points: 5th level, 10th level, 15th, 20th, and a "sweet spot" that you feel is the high point of the build. Feel free to present as many of these as you like, and please give a rundown of the build's abilities and playability at all of the levels you didn't show. The rules are as follows:

Menu: For most challenges, the "special ingredient" will be drawn from Core plus Completes. There will, from time to time, be special challenges that showcase secret ingredients from other books--for example, the XPH.


32 point-buy is the presumed creation method, but we have generally allowed other levels of point-buy.
If you do use a different point-buy, please make your case for its necessity in your entry. Keep in mind that for using exceptionally large or small point-buys may warrant deductions in elegance and/or power.

Kitchen: Competitors will be free to use any official 3.5 rulebook in constructing their builds. Dragon magazine is disallowed, and Unearthed Arcana is allowed; but see Elegance below. Alternate rule systems from UA such as gestalt are not allowed, as they create a different playing field. Also, item familiars are forbidden because I hate 'em.

Cooking Time: Contestants will have until 11:59pm CUT on Wednesday, November 10th 2010 to create their builds and PM them to the Chairman, true_shinken (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/member.php?u=42176). Builds will then be posted simultaneously, to avoid copying.

Judging: Judging will be based on the following criteria, with each build rated from 1 (very poor) to 5 (exemplary) in each area: Originality, Power, Elegance, Use of Secret Ingredient.


Power level is up to you. Cheese is acceptable, but should be kept to a sane level unless you're showcasing a new TO build you've discovered. In the words of one of my predecessors, a little cheddar can be nice, but avoid the mature Gruyere unless you're making a cheese fondue.


Elegance could bear a little elaboration. It basically measures how skillfully you put your build together, and whether you sacrificed flavor for power. We're cooking here - if your dish doesn't taste good, it doesn't matter how well-presented it is. Use of flaws is an automatic loss of one point per flaw in this category. Other things that will cause lost points here are excessive multiclassing, and classes that don't fit the concept - using Cloistered Cleric in a front-line melee fighter, for example, will lose you points.


I am going to have to ask the contestants to PM me about any disagreement with the judges. Under no circumstances is a contestant to defend themselves inside the thread, since it breaks anonymity.

Presentation: Builds will be posted anonymously, in order to avoid the potential of bias towards a particular competitor. For this reason, please don't put your name in the build, as I'm likely to miss it when reviewing the entries!


Due to concerns about standardizing entry format, I'd like everyone to try to use the following table for their entry.NAME OF ENTRY
{table=head]Level|Class|Base Attack<br>Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Skills|Feats|Class Features

1st|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

2nd|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

3rd|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

4th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

5th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

6th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

7th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

8th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

9th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

10th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

11th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

12th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

13th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

14th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

15th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

16th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

17th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

18th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

19th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

20th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities[/table]

CodeNAME OF ENTRY
{table=head]Level|Class|Base Attack<br>Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Skills|Feats|Class Features

1st|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

2nd|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

3rd|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

4th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

5th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

6th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

7th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

8th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

9th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

10th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

11th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

12th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

13th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

14th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

15th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

16th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

17th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

18th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

19th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

20th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities[/table]


For entries with spellcasting, use the following table for Spells per day and Spells Known. (Spells Known only if necessary, i.e. Sorcerer or Bard, but not Wizard or Warmage)
Spells per day/Spells Known
{table=head]Level|0lvl|1st|2nd|3rd|4th|5th|6th|7th|8th|9th

1st|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

2nd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

3rd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

4th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

5th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

6th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

7th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

8th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

9th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

10th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

11th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

12th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

13th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

14th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

15th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

16th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

17th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

18th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

19th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

20th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-[/table]

CodeSpells per day/Spells Known
{table=head]Level|0lvl|1st|2nd|3rd|4th|5th|6th|7th|8th|9th

1st|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

2nd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

3rd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

4th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

5th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

6th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

7th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

8th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

9th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

10th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

11th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

12th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

13th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

14th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

15th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

16th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

17th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

18th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

19th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

20th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-[/table]


For other systems (Psionics, ToB, Incarnum, etc.) keep track of PP/maneuvers/essentia separately, preferably in a nice neat list.

Speculation: Please don't post or speculate on possible builds until the "reveal," in order to avoid spoiling the surprise if a particular competitor is producing a build along those lines.

Leadership is banned; we're producing a meal, not a seven-course banquet for a hundred diners.

So! Who wants to sign up as a contestant, and who wants to sign up as a judge? Looking for about 5 judges and as many contestants as feel like playing!

This week's special ingredient is:
Complete Arcane's Seeker of the Song

Allez optimiser!

Judges
Amphetryon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9688717&postcount=3)
Grynning (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9689574&postcount=7)
WinWin
Vorpal Tribble

Contestants
darbythegambler
Ealstan
TerrickTerran
OMGPonies
Ozymandias9
The Gilded Duke
BobVosh
Heliomance
gbprime

Past Competitions

Iron Chef I: Entropomancer (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=142470)
Iron Chef II: Psibond Agent (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=146583)
Iron Chef III: Cancer Mage (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=148584)
Iron Chef IV: Stonelord (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=150595)
Iron Chef V: War Chanter (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=152543)
Iron Chef VI: Master of Masks (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=156876)
Iron Chef VII: Green Star Adept (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=158633)
Iron Chef VIII: Pyrokineticist (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=160266)
Iron Chef IX: Animal Lord (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=162702)
Iron Chef X: Mythic Exemplar (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=164381)
Iron Chef XI: Blade Bravo (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=166539)
Iron Chef XII: War Mind (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9426386#post9426386)
Iron Chef XIII: Vigilante (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=172233)

darbythegambler
2010-11-03, 05:04 AM
i love this PrC! i'm in

Amphetryon
2010-11-03, 06:47 AM
I'll sign on as a judge for this one.

My criteria:
MY CRITERIA: When more than a single example is given for a score, not all examples need be met to warrant that score.

Originality: Originality looks in part at the established archetypes and builds that the community at large has produced over the years. Characters attempting to perform, yet less adept at performing, as a well-established archetype - for instance, a charger - than typical for that archetype will score lower here than characters attempting to break new ground. Examples of a given score -
5 - A new concept, necessitating the Seeker of the Song PrC.
4 - A new concept, using Seeker of the Song without requiring it to tick.
3 - An unusual concept that has been showcased on gaming forums before, or that is featured in other contest entrants. It’s not new, but it’s not stock standard either.
2 - An old reliable concept, substituting Seeker of the Song for the one typically used in discussions of builds of this type.
1 - A build either cut and pasted or cobbled together entirely from extant handbooks and other known works. No new ideas are presented.

Power: Power is measured assuming a 1st - 20th campaign. Characters that come to power very late in the progression, or that are somehow ineligible to play at low levels, can expect a deduction here as surely as characters whose power peaks at low-to-mid levels and then relatively diminishes. Examples of a given score, relative to other entrants in the contest -
5 - Easily the most powerful, flexible build presented here.
4 - A powerful character that might need help or additional preparation in specific circumstances to continue to do its job well.
3 - A build that is of average power for the contest, neither significantly stronger nor appreciably weaker overall. It may dominate in niche cases or be rendered weak in other niche cases.
2 - While less powerful than the typical entry for this contest, the character manages to contribute reasonably without relying on help from other party members.
1 - The build struggles to perform to the expectations typical for a character in the role assigned. Either the character relies heavily on help from other party members or requires specific equipment not restricted to the given role in order to be useful.

Elegance: Note that I tie the Elegance score closely to the Secret Ingredient. Shifter Druid 18/Moonspeaker 2 may be simple, but it is not an elegant use of Moonspeaker, to my mind. Note also that my default assumption is that characters presented are being inserted into an already-established world. A character that requires the DM to rewrite or ignore large swaths of existing fluff for your concept to work is unlikely to score highly in Elegance. References to Unearthed Arcana include those aspects of Unearthed Arcana that are included in the Variant section of the SRD. If I have to go hunting through books just to figure out where you got a particular feat, item, template, or obscure skill usage, expect no more than a 2 in Elegance. Examples of a given score -
5 - Seeker of the Song is entered appropriately early and taken to completion. All class levels, feats, skills, and disclosed items are smoothly tied together and progress the whole concept seamlessly and in a logical order. Favored Class rules are adhered to, and single-level dips are kept to a bare minimum - no more than one. No Unearthed Arcana, templates, LA or Racial HD, or other obvious power-oriented shenanigans were used. One could reasonably expect a majority of DMs to allow both the concept and progression to happen in a typical game.
4 - Seeker of the Song is entered reasonably early, perhaps delayed a bit or taken piecemeal, but finished. All class levels, feats, skills, and disclosed items are useful, but may not be intuitive choices to augment the presented concept. No Unearthed Arcana, templates, LA or Racial HD, or other obvious shenanigans were used, though Favored Class rules may have been ignored. One might expect to have to explain some bits of the build fairly carefully to a DM and possibly work out some accommodations, but flying books or dice bags are unlikely.
3 - Seeker of the Song is taken to completion, but entered later than expected or typical of this contest. Class levels, feats, skills, and disclosed items are taken in a disjointed fashion, perhaps indicating power is more important than concept. This character may use a race with a level adjustment for thematic reasons, or be forced to take a flaw or two to fit everything in, or use some other method of grabbing more feats or spells or other features than one would typically expect. One would have to work closely with the DM for some features of the presented build to be available, work as described in the build presented, or come online in a timely fashion, and wouldn’t necessarily expect to get this character approved by a DM that doesn’t know the player well.
2 - Seeker of the Song is abandoned before reaching its capstone or entered too late to finish before Epic levels. Class levels, feats, skills, and disclosed items do not share a unifying theme or work toward a more powerful whole. A template and LA are both included, possibly with flaws. Without an established rapport with a DM, one would expect the concept to meet with enough resistance that having a Plan B is advised when pitching the idea.
1 - Vivacious Anthropomorphic Dire Were-Squid Half-Fiend Domain Wizard with Frail and Inattentive and... no. Just no. So many discordant templates and feats and ideas have been slapped together that ‘a Wizard did it’ is the only viable explanation for the character’s existence. Seeker of the Song appears to have been an afterthought to the overall design. You would fully expect the character idea either to be rejected by the DM, or to have come into being entirely through the DM’s meddling with your character, and wouldn’t broach the subject with the DM if dice, books or other potential projectiles were within easy reach.

Use of Secret Ingredient: This is a conglomeration of how well, and how thoroughly, you incorporate the abilities of the Secret Ingredient into the build. Examples of a given score, relative to other entrants -
5 - A fresh, original usage maximizing the particular strengths and minimizing the particular weaknesses of the Seeker of the Song. Every aspect of Seeker of the Song is utilized in the best way of any entry presented.
4 - A solid, complete usage of Seeker of the song. Specific strengths of the Secret Ingredient were emphasized with minimal emphasis taken away from other strengths, or without negating known weaknesses.
3 - Use of Seeker of the Song was typical for the contest. Synergies were not emphasized especially, and some features of the Seeker of the Song were ignored for the sake of maximizing a particular trick or two.
2 - Others used the Seeker of the Song more thoroughly, but this entry’s usage wasn’t bad. The overall concept works but doesn’t especially synergize with the Seeker of the Song’s strengths well.
1 - The Seeker of the Song is actively hindering the concept presented. Clearly the character would have been stronger with a different Prestige Class, and the Seeker of the Song got shoe-horned in there because of the contest.

EDIT: This is strictly a personal preference, but to me, a build that relies on minions, undead hordes, robot armies, and so forth is working against the spirit of the 'no Leadership' clause, and may well see deductions as a result.

true_shinken
2010-11-03, 06:57 AM
I'll sign on as a judge for this one.

My criteria:
MY CRITERIA: When more than a single example is given for a score, not all examples need be met to warrant that score.

Originality: Originality looks in part at the established archetypes and builds that the community at large has produced over the years. Characters attempting to perform, yet less adept at performing, as a well-established archetype - for instance, a charger - than typical for that archetype will score lower here than characters attempting to break new ground. Examples of a given score -
5 - A new concept, necessitating the Seeker of the Song PrC.
4 - A new concept, using Seeker of the Song without requiring it to tick.
3 - An unusual concept that has been showcased on gaming forums before, or that is featured in other contest entrants. It’s not new, but it’s not stock standard either.
2 - An old reliable concept, substituting Seeker of the Song for the one typically used in discussions of builds of this type.
1 - A build either cut and pasted or cobbled together entirely from extant handbooks and other known works. No new ideas are presented.

Power: Power is measured assuming a 1st - 20th campaign. Characters that come to power very late in the progression, or that are somehow ineligible to play at low levels, can expect a deduction here as surely as characters whose power peaks at low-to-mid levels and then relatively diminishes. Examples of a given score, relative to other entrants in the contest -
5 - Easily the most powerful, flexible build presented here.
4 - A powerful character that might need help or additional preparation in specific circumstances to continue to do its job well.
3 - A build that is of average power for the contest, neither significantly stronger nor appreciably weaker overall. It may dominate in niche cases or be rendered weak in other niche cases.
2 - While less powerful than the typical entry for this contest, the character manages to contribute reasonably without relying on help from other party members.
1 - The build struggles to perform to the expectations typical for a character in the role assigned. Either the character relies heavily on help from other party members or requires specific equipment not restricted to the given role in order to be useful.

Elegance: Note that I tie the Elegance score closely to the Secret Ingredient. Shifter Druid 18/Moonspeaker 2 may be simple, but it is not an elegant use of Moonspeaker, to my mind. Note also that my default assumption is that characters presented are being inserted into an already-established world. A character that requires the DM to rewrite or ignore large swaths of existing fluff for your concept to work is unlikely to score highly in Elegance. References to Unearthed Arcana include those aspects of Unearthed Arcana that are included in the Variant section of the SRD. If I have to go hunting through books just to figure out where you got a particular feat, item, template, or obscure skill usage, expect no more than a 2 in Elegance. Examples of a given score -
5 - Seeker of the Song is entered appropriately early and taken to completion. All class levels, feats, skills, and disclosed items are smoothly tied together and progress the whole concept seamlessly and in a logical order. Favored Class rules are adhered to, and single-level dips are kept to a bare minimum - no more than one. No Unearthed Arcana, templates, LA or Racial HD, or other obvious power-oriented shenanigans were used. One could reasonably expect a majority of DMs to allow both the concept and progression to happen in a typical game.
4 - Seeker of the Song is entered reasonably early, perhaps delayed a bit or taken piecemeal, but finished. All class levels, feats, skills, and disclosed items are useful, but may not be intuitive choices to augment the presented concept. No Unearthed Arcana, templates, LA or Racial HD, or other obvious shenanigans were used, though Favored Class rules may have been ignored. One might expect to have to explain some bits of the build fairly carefully to a DM and possibly work out some accommodations, but flying books or dice bags are unlikely.
3 - Seeker of the Song is taken to completion, but entered later than expected or typical of this contest. Class levels, feats, skills, and disclosed items are taken in a disjointed fashion, perhaps indicating power is more important than concept. This character may use a race with a level adjustment for thematic reasons, or be forced to take a flaw or two to fit everything in, or use some other method of grabbing more feats or spells or other features than one would typically expect. One would have to work closely with the DM for some features of the presented build to be available, work as described in the build presented, or come online in a timely fashion, and wouldn’t necessarily expect to get this character approved by a DM that doesn’t know the player well.
2 - Seeker of the Song is abandoned before reaching its capstone or entered too late to finish before Epic levels. Class levels, feats, skills, and disclosed items do not share a unifying theme or work toward a more powerful whole. A template and LA are both included, possibly with flaws. Without an established rapport with a DM, one would expect the concept to meet with enough resistance that having a Plan B is advised when pitching the idea.
1 - Vivacious Anthropomorphic Dire Were-Squid Half-Fiend Domain Wizard with Frail and Inattentive and... no. Just no. So many discordant templates and feats and ideas have been slapped together that ‘a Wizard did it’ is the only viable explanation for the character’s existence. Seeker of the Song appears to have been an afterthought to the overall design. You would fully expect the character idea either to be rejected by the DM, or to have come into being entirely through the DM’s meddling with your character, and wouldn’t broach the subject with the DM if dice, books or other potential projectiles were within easy reach.

Use of Secret Ingredient: This is a conglomeration of how well, and how thoroughly, you incorporate the abilities of the Secret Ingredient into the build. Examples of a given score, relative to other entrants -
5 - A fresh, original usage maximizing the particular strengths and minimizing the particular weaknesses of the Seeker of the Song. Every aspect of Seeker of the Song is utilized in the best way of any entry presented.
4 - A solid, complete usage of Seeker of the song. Specific strengths of the Secret Ingredient were emphasized with minimal emphasis taken away from other strengths, or without negating known weaknesses.
3 - Use of Seeker of the Song was typical for the contest. Synergies were not emphasized especially, and some features of the Seeker of the Song were ignored for the sake of maximizing a particular trick or two.
2 - Others used the Seeker of the Song more thoroughly, but this entry’s usage wasn’t bad. The overall concept works but doesn’t especially synergize with the Seeker of the Song’s strengths well.
1 - The Seeker of the Song is actively hindering the concept presented. Clearly the character would have been stronger with a different Prestige Class, and the Seeker of the Song got shoe-horned in there because of the contest.

Man I really liked your judging criterea. Might set up a new standard for myself when I go back to judging.

Ealstan
2010-11-03, 09:22 AM
Count me in to compete!

TerrickTerran
2010-11-03, 10:13 AM
I'll attempt if I can figure out the right build.

Grynning
2010-11-03, 10:28 AM
I'll judge again.

Criteria in the spoiler.



I'm a bit different in style than most of the recent judging I've seen - I go with an overall "feel" and instinct than a point by point breakdown of scores. I am a bit more forgiving on build legality since as a DM I am not one of those guys who is going to check every single feat to make sure you meet the pre-reqs unless you're obviously abusing the game, and I understand that few games actually function in the "RAW Vacuum." However, do NOT take that as a free pass; I will be checking these to the best of my ability and I will dock points if there's a serious screw up.

Originality:
This is a fairly subjective category for me, and like elegance, it will be based on both concept and execution. If your character has a great, clever back story but is based around blase cookie-cutter mechanics, you will probably score in the 2-3 range. Good story with neat mechanics will earn a 4, especially if it's something mechanical I couldn't have thought of myself. Something reeeeaaalllly out there and unexpected will get you a 5, but be careful as you may take hits in other categories if it's too wacky.

Power:
I set a baseline of 3 for power based on what tier (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=1002.0) I expect most characters to fall into. For this contest, tier 4 will be 3 points, just like the last contest. Tier 3 performance will earn you 4 points. A few neat tricks and boosts to combat power will get you the half-point bump. Earning a 5 here will be based on how well you explain what the character can do, and if you have any real cool combos or tricks that impress me in the build.

Elegance
This one is my favorite category, and most builds make or break themselves here. What I'm looking for is whether A) I'd like to play the character and B) as a DM, would I allow the character. Back story also figures heavily here, because as nice as your mechanics may be, without an explanation they are really bland. I don't need you to justify every class level with story, or to shoehorn silly PrC fluff into your background, but it had better make sense conceptually as to why your character has the levels they have.

Mechanical things I don't like or wouldn't allow as a DM: Flaws, really obscure sources (this means books most people are unlikely to have access to - use common sense here), excessive dipping (some is ok, like the classic Sorcadin build dipping Spellsword, but if there's more than four slashes ["/"] in your class breakdown I'm going to look at it very closely). I won't give a numerical value because this IS still subjective; some builds can get away with a flaw or something if they really work well otherwise, others....can't.

Obviously a build being blatantly illegal or doing something really questionable that would probably earn a "NO" at most tables will make your score drop here, but as I mentioned at the start I will still be forgiving if I can see that you were trying to build around a good concept (probably earning a 1.5 or a 2).

Use of Secret Ingredient:
How well you do here depends heavily on how you did on the other 3 categories, and whether the PrC in question was key to that success. If your build couldn't have hit the power and elegance levels it did without being a Seeker of the Song, expect to do well. If you got a low originality score and plain 2 or 3 in the other two, you will still score low here even if you had all 10 levels of the PrC. My main rule here is yes, please use the PrC a lot, but use it well.

WinWin
2010-11-03, 10:39 AM
I'll judge if required.

My criteria is a mystery, even to me.

I am looking for something that is suitable for play and basing my scoring on that simple criterion. More than that, I can not say.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-11-03, 11:01 AM
Ok, so Combine Songs. Any two songs you know, put them together, get benefits. That makes sense. However, do you have to use to two uses of your bardic music or one?

Subvocalize, as swift action, can start a new song, if only one is being sung. Thus won't work with the above, correct? Thus it is only useful if you want to keep one 'music slot' open for whatever might come your way.

Pechvarry
2010-11-03, 11:11 AM
EDIT: This is strictly a personal preference, but to me, a build that relies on minions, undead hordes, robot armies, and so forth is working against the spirit of the 'no Leadership' clause, and may well see deductions as a result.

This brings up another question: what about material that requires Leadership as a prereq (admittedly very little in 3.5)? Perhaps use Wild Cohort as a stand-in feat or something?

EDIT: more general question: I'd assume the bardic music requirement for entry into the class requires an actual listed class feature labeled "bardic music" and not possession of a single type? For example, the 1d20 different prestige classes that give Inspire Courage only?

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-11-03, 11:15 AM
In regard to that, Amphetryon, that's a big complaint I had with Sally. Artificers are made to make things. They get construct followers as a class ability. Does this mean the entire class has a stigma attached? To not use its strengths just isn't right.

Amphetryon
2010-11-03, 11:24 AM
The key part of the phrase in my edited criteria is 'RELIES ON.' A build whose perceived primary power source and shtick is through some form of minionmancery goes against my understanding of the spirit of the contest rules.

WinWin
2010-11-03, 11:27 AM
oh ok...Spellstiched awakened undead it is.

Even better. Why don't people just take leadership for a Bard competition? Bards have class features that require other characters, it just would not be fair to deny them followers to buff.

Amphetryon
2010-11-03, 11:30 AM
oh ok...Spellstiched awakened undead it is.

Even better. Why don't people just take leadership for a Bard competition? Bards have class features that require other characters, it just would not be fair to deny them followers to buff.

I can't tell which post this is a response to...

OMG PONIES
2010-11-03, 12:01 PM
Welcome, contestants, judges, and guests to Iron Chef XIII.

May want to fix that ole' copy-pasta. As for VT's questions:


Combine Songs: It specifically states that you choose "two music abilities and [activate] both." Though you only use one action, I'm seeing two uses of your music.
Subvocalize: This does not work alongside Combine Songs, as it says, "A seeker can use this ability only if he already has one (and only one) bardic music or seeker music ability already active." The way it interacts with combine songs follows, stating that you can begin a song, add to it via subvocalize, and then sustain both with one standard action per round.


I have my own concerns about the build, namely in terms of variety. Keep in mind the restriction facing Ex-Seekers of the Song :smalleek:. Also, though it is not listed in the Requirements section, the introduction on page 56 contains the following text:


Every seeker of the song must have at least one bard level...

Are we counting that as a requirement?

P.S. In as a contestant, though that may change to judge.

true_shinken
2010-11-03, 12:21 PM
oh ok...Spellstiched awakened undead it is.

Even better. Why don't people just take leadership for a Bard competition? Bards have class features that require other characters, it just would not be fair to deny them followers to buff.

Leadership is banned from Iron Chef.


May want to fix that ole' copy-pasta.
Thanks for pointing that out.


I have my own concerns about the build, namely in terms of variety. Keep in mind the restriction facing Ex-Seekers of the Song :smalleek:.
I hope you'll be surprised with variety, dude.



Are we counting that as a requirement?

No, it's in the flavour text, so it doesn't count. Of course some judge might decide to penalize you in elegance, but I wouldn't.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-11-03, 01:04 PM
Leadership is banned from Iron Chef.
My sarcasm-sense tells me it was a mocking post. Not that it applied. Bards don't make followers. Artificers gain them as a class feature.


Anyways, nothing is jumping out at me to use here, but we'll see what comes to mind.

true_shinken
2010-11-03, 01:10 PM
My sarcasm-sense tells me it was a mocking post. Not that it applied. Bards don't make followers. Artificers gain them as a class feature.
I'll have to disagree here, VT. Remember our note about known cheese up there in the first post? Well, having 20 actions a round is known cheese, isn't it? It does make the game less fun for everyone else when you take 30 minutes a turn for your character alone. That does not sound elegant at all.
Also, Artificers are not forced to create constructs (in the same way not all level one characters with maxed Knowledges are not forced to summon Pazuzu). In fact, they are quite powerful without them.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-11-03, 01:17 PM
That's why I specified in the text he can make constructs for everyone else if they will donate a pint of blood.

Everyone gets two homomnuculus, including the artificer himself. The dragon golem isn't gotten until 18th level. The nimblewrights are out and about the city gathering intel, not in the fight.

Ever if they were ALL there, he had a total of 8 homonuculus, 2 nimbles, and a golem. 11 constructs, not 20. Take out nimbles, that's 9. Take out half the others because they are meant to be scouts, that's down to 5.

So for Sally alone, he has three fighting constructs by 18th level. The rest have their own. It is party friendly.

And no, he doesn't have to make them and is powerful without them. But then, there were the complaints of WBLmancy. Well, items are his thing. Take them away, his golems away, an artificer is beginning to have troubles.

I don't want to sidetrack from the current contest however. Y'all wanna take this to a thread all its own feel free.

true_shinken
2010-11-03, 01:20 PM
I don't want to sidetrack from the current contest however. Y'all wanna take this to a thread all its own feel free.
OK, VT, just a last statement. WBL is part of the rules as well, so if you mess with it, you should expect consequences as well.
Do notice you almost won, regardless of judges penalizing flaws you admit you had.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-11-03, 01:22 PM
Do notice you almost won, regardless of judges penalizing flaws you admit you had.
Losing I don't mind, and there were some awesome entries that could well have surpassed it. It's the reasoning that irked me.

true_shinken
2010-11-03, 01:29 PM
Losing I don't mind, and there were some awesome entries that could well have surpassed it. It's the reasoning that irked me.

Oh, I understand. I guess should just agree to disagree here, like gentlemen, then. ^^

Grynning
2010-11-03, 01:38 PM
Also, though it is not listed in the Requirements section, the introduction on page 56 contains the following text:

Originally Posted by Complete Arcane, page 56
Every seeker of the song must have at least one bard level...

Are we counting that as a requirement?


I personally would not. The intro text to several PrC's says something like "entrants to this class must have a Barbarian level because this requires rage" because the writer/editor forgot there are other ways to get rage. I think the SotS text is like that. If you can get Bardic music from somewhere else (though there aren't many ways), I'd consider that legal entry into the class.

Note: I would NOT consider an ability that replicates a single bard song or that functions similarly to count as bardic music (i.e. you take a class that just gives "inspire courage").

true_shinken
2010-11-03, 01:41 PM
I personally would not. The intro text to several PrC's says something like "entrants to this class must have a Barbarian level because this requires rage" because the writer/editor forgot there are other ways to get rage. I think the SotS text is like that. If you can get Bardic music from somewhere else (though there aren't many ways), I'd consider that legal entry into the class.

I think we can safely rule it's not a requirement. It's not on the requirement field and it's specifically listed as a 'bad' requirement in the DMG. Also, by extension of this rule we couldn't have Duskblade/Dragon Disciple or Lurk/Shadowdancer for example and I've never seen anyone state it can't be done.

Grynning
2010-11-03, 01:48 PM
Man this is a weird class...but one thing is really bugging me - Note of Solitude.

"Will saving throw (DC 10 + the seeker's ranks in the Perform skill). Creatures affected by by this ability get a bonus on this saving throw equal to their Hit Dice."

Am I wrong in thinking that the bold clause above makes this capstone less than freaking useless? It seems like a screw-up of Truenamer level proportions. As far as I can tell, the vast majority of CR-appropriate monsters would only fail this save on a 1.

Edit: Also, just noticed this - the ability "Note of Solitude" isn't on the class table, and instead "Hymn of Revealing" is listed, which isn't in the class text. Has this class been errata'ed?

Amphetryon
2010-11-03, 02:02 PM
Man this is a weird class...but one thing is really bugging me - Note of Solitude.

"Will saving throw (DC 10 + the seeker's ranks in the Perform skill). Creatures affected by by this ability get a bonus on this saving throw equal to their Hit Dice."

Am I wrong in thinking that the bold clause above makes this capstone less than freaking useless? It seems like a screw-up of Truenamer level proportions.

Edit: Also, just noticed this - the ability "Note of Solitude" isn't on the class table, and instead "Hymn of Revealing" is listed, which isn't in the class text. Has this class been errata'ed?
Complete Arcane's Errata (available online from wotc) does not include anything for Seeker of the Song. We're left with 'Text Trumps Table', so the Hymn of Revealing would appear to be a relic of an early version.

Grynning
2010-11-03, 02:06 PM
Complete Arcane's Errata (available online from wotc) does not include anything for Seeker of the Song. We're left with 'Text Trumps Table', so the Hymn of Revealing would appear to be a relic of an early version.

Yeah, I checked the errata myself a few min ago. I guess the rather unfortunate Note of Solitude is the correct capstone. It's basically a 60 foot AoE Dismissal, it just only has a 5% chance of working on pretty much any given creature.

true_shinken
2010-11-03, 02:15 PM
Yeah, I checked the errata myself a few min ago. I guess the rather unfortunate Note of Solitude is the correct capstone. It's basically a 60 foot AoE Dismissal, it just only has a 5% chance of working on pretty much any given creature.

Skill checks are very easy to optimize. Perform's record is about +180, I believe.
Nevermind, it's ranks and not check. Yeah, sounds awful.

Ozymandias9
2010-11-03, 02:31 PM
Yeah, I checked the errata myself a few min ago. I guess the rather unfortunate Note of Solitude is the correct capstone. It's basically a 60 foot AoE Dismissal, it just only has a 5% chance of working on pretty much any given creature.

Yeah, excluding for the moment the need to get rid of a horde of extra-planar mooks, I can think of one and only one use for the capstone. And it's kinda cheesy. I'll pass on using it, but it will be interesting to see what happens if someone else does.

Anyhow, I'll compete for this one.

kestrel404
2010-11-03, 02:43 PM
I'm competing. I've already got half my build done - I thought about it for five minutes and knew exactly where I wanted to go - in exactly the opposite direction as the class designers intended.

Grynning
2010-11-03, 02:53 PM
Nevermind, it's ranks and not check. Yeah, sounds awful.

I think they were looking at how dismissal factors in the creature's HD vs your caster level:



This spell forces an extraplanar creature back to its proper plane if it fails a special Will save (DC = spell’s save DC - creature’s HD + your caster level).


The problem here of course, is that the base DC of dismissal + your caster level is going to be much higher than 10 + Perform ranks at level 20 (which is the earliest that Note of Solitude can be used). To make the ability work, it'd have to be house ruled to be DC 12 + Cha Mod + Perform ranks (making it roughly equivalent to a Dismissal cast by a Wizard with a caster level of 20).


Edit: Just noticed something else - the example character lists a save DC of 33 for their Burning Melody refrain, which is 10 plus their Perform bonus, not their skill ranks. More evidence that the creator of this class didn't know how skill ranks work.

OMG PONIES
2010-11-03, 03:19 PM
Oy, this class is making my head hurt! :smallfrown:

Ozymandias9
2010-11-03, 03:29 PM
I have a request for a ruling:

Hymn of Spelldeath calls for a concentration check to disrupt spell-casting. SLA's function as spells except where specified, but this ability only refers to spells and not spellcasting. For the purposes of this competition, does the hymn forces a similar concentration check on SLAs?

Rancor1
2010-11-03, 03:38 PM
On the same topic, can you autofail the opposed roll to allow someone to cast freely?

Heliomance
2010-11-03, 03:50 PM
I might be interested in this one. Count me as a tentative contestant.

Cieyrin
2010-11-03, 03:52 PM
On the same topic, can you autofail the opposed roll to allow someone to cast freely?

I'd say probably not, as skill checks don't autofail on a 1.

Also, damn, didn't expect my PrC suggestion to make it to the very next contest. Wonders abound. :smallbiggrin:

If I can think of something more insightful than a straight Bard entry, I may actually compete, though I said the same during IC: Animal Lord, so we'll have to see how that goes...

OMG PONIES
2010-11-03, 04:03 PM
Note: I would NOT consider an ability that replicates a single bard song or that functions similarly to count as bardic music (i.e. you take a class that just gives "inspire courage").

Would you be swayed at all if the ability in question refers back to the bardic class feature on page 29 of the PHB?

Amphetryon
2010-11-03, 04:05 PM
Would you be swayed at all if the ability in question refers back to the bardic class feature on page 29 of the PHB?

For me, the answer is 'no' unless the ability is called 'Bardic Music' or explicitly states that it duplicates the 'Bardic Music' ability. If it only references 'Inspire Courage' or 'Bardic Knowledge,' then no.

Ozymandias9
2010-11-03, 04:16 PM
Would you be swayed at all if the ability in question refers back to the bardic class feature on page 29 of the PHB?

I'm not judging this round, but here's my 2 bits.

It's worth noting that there are only a very few cases where such abilities are not explicitly referred to as "bardic music" abilities or an explicit replication of bardic music by a different name.

There are only a couple of instances where specific songs (actually, I think it's just courage) is replicated without noting that the parent ability is replicated: you're probably going to be on firmer ground for most judges if you something other than these.


Additional rules inquiry: is seeker music considered bard music for the purposes of a harmonizing weapon? I'm interested both in whether or not it can carry a seeker song and whether seeker songs count as bardic music for the stipulation that the carried song ends when another bardic music effect begins.

Cieyrin
2010-11-03, 04:26 PM
Additional rules inquiry: is seeker music considered bard music for the purposes of a harmonizing weapon. I'm interested both in whether or not it can carry a seeker song and whether seeker songs count as bardic music for the stipulation that the carried song ends when another bardic music effect begins.

Sounds like a fair assumption, given Seeker Music is powered by Bardic music uses, which to me sounds like Seeker Music are just Bardic Music+ that's otherwise treated as any other Bardic Music ability.

DaragosKitsune
2010-11-03, 06:47 PM
Sounds like a fair assumption, given Seeker Music is powered by Bardic music uses, which to me sounds like Seeker Music are just Bardic Music+ that's otherwise treated as any other Bardic Music ability.

The RAW says as much:


Seeker music follows the same rules as bardic music.

Amphetryon
2010-11-03, 09:11 PM
<snip> Just noticed something else - the example character lists a save DC of 33 for their Burning Melody refrain, which is 10 plus their Perform bonus, not their skill ranks. More evidence that the creator of this class didn't know how skill ranks work.
The version I have in front of me says of the Burning Melody refrain:


A successful Reflex save (DC 10 + the seeker’s ranks in the Perform skill) halves the damage.

That reads to me as going off of ranks directly, not the bonus.

Grynning
2010-11-03, 09:46 PM
I know that. I was referring to the sample character, the bard 10/SotS 2 on the following page. HER burning melody DC is calculated off her perform bonus; in other words, it's wrong. The people writing it didn't know the difference between skill ranks and skill bonus.

The character is ECL 12. Max skill rank is 15. The DC should be 25, but it's listed as 33, which is 10 plus her perform skill bonus of +23.

The class would actually be a lot better and make more sense if the save DC's DID include the total bonus, since other casters all get to add a relevant stat to DC's and the class requiring skill focus in perform would suddenly be good synergy rather than just an arbitrary requirement.

Thurbane
2010-11-03, 10:02 PM
I always thought it was a little odd that Leadership is specifically banned, while animal companions, familiars, hordes of undead, Wild Cohort etc. aren't.

Back in the Mythic Exemplar competition, the build I was considering used Legendary Leader, which has leadership as a prereq.

Anyway, that's my 2 cents...the rules are established, and I don't want to rock the boat.

Grynning
2010-11-03, 10:05 PM
I always thought it was a little odd that Leadership is specifically banned, while animal companions, familiars, hordes of undead, Wild Cohort etc. aren't.

Back in the Mythic Exemplar competition, the build I was considering used Legendary Leader, which has leadership as a prereq.

Anyway, that's my 2 cents...the rules are established, and I don't want to rock the boat.

I think the main issue is that anyone can take leadership and basically have two characters for the price of one, so any leadership build would automatically be "better" than one without. It's just banned to remove that variable and to make judging easier.

Also, I think leadership is probably the #1 auto-banned feat in most actual games. I've never played a 3.5 game where it was allowed.

Thurbane
2010-11-03, 10:28 PM
I understand the reasoning.

Maybe it's because my group doesn't use the Leadership = 2 PCs approach, more Leadership = a loyal NPC.

Anyway, no biggie...only an issue when it's a prereq of something you want to use.

WinWin
2010-11-03, 10:38 PM
Only used it once on a character. Had an NPC theurge offering discount magic items and spellcasting. Only joined combat a couple of times during the campaign. Followers were just in the background.

Summoned & called monsters, created monsters (undead, items) and the like have featured in nearly every game. Always in the background or as plot motivator though.

As for concerns relating to Seeker of the Song, it is a poorly designed class. Just making a coherent character from all of the details is worth bonus points. The big turn off for me is that the refrains ar generally equal or inferior to spells gained 8-10 levels previous by a dedicated caster. Having said that...I have noticed a few enticing options available for a SoS.

BobVosh
2010-11-03, 10:45 PM
I'm up for trying, although I doubt I have time.

Pechvarry
2010-11-03, 11:07 PM
I know that. I was referring to the sample character, the bard 10/SotS 2 on the following page. HER burning melody DC is calculated off her perform bonus; in other words, it's wrong. The people writing it didn't know the difference between skill ranks and skill bonus.

The character is ECL 12. Max skill rank is 15. The DC should be 25, but it's listed as 33, which is 10 plus her perform skill bonus of +23.

The class would actually be a lot better and make more sense if the save DC's DID include the total bonus, since other casters all get to add a relevant stat to DC's and the class requiring skill focus in perform would suddenly be good synergy rather than just an arbitrary requirement.

I'm thinking that ability (and maybe all the rest) were originally intended to be a save DC equal to perform check (like fascinate). I kinda like how they ended up changing it, but they really dropped the ball on note of solitude.

The Gilded Duke
2010-11-04, 12:04 AM
I have a few ideas for an entry with this. Ill give being a contestant a try.

Escheton
2010-11-04, 12:08 AM
It's difficult on this one to not go down the beaten opt-fu paths. For they are quite good.
I might sign on if I come up with something new thats actually a good idea.

Are alignmentshifts during adventuringcareer allowed?
Like a monk going chaotic and taking barb lvls, that sorta thing.

Thurbane
2010-11-04, 12:54 AM
Are alignmentshifts during adventuringcareer allowed?
Like a monk going chaotic and taking barb lvls, that sorta thing.
From what I've seen, I'm pretty sure they are allowed, but I'm guessing they will cost you elegance points.

gbprime
2010-11-04, 09:36 AM
Never tried one of these before. Throw my name into the hat as an Iron Chef newbie, and we'll see what I can concoct. :smallbiggrin:

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-11-04, 12:58 PM
I'll go in as a judge. Nothing is really biting me with this one.

true_shinken
2010-11-04, 07:33 PM
On the same topic, can you autofail the opposed roll to allow someone to cast freely?

No you can't.

Bakkan
2010-11-05, 03:08 PM
I'll sign up as a contestant, got the skeleton of a build done.

EDIT: I assume that in the description of the Song of Life's refrain, we're ignoring the reference to the "Dirge of Frozen Loss" and replacing it with "Song of Life"? Otherwise, things just got a little more interesting:smallamused:

OMG PONIES
2010-11-05, 07:20 PM
This class is riddled with errors! Grr...

Amphetryon
2010-11-06, 06:24 AM
This class is riddled with errors! Grr...

Clearly, that's half the fun. :smallsmile:

Pechvarry
2010-11-06, 01:11 PM
I'll sign up as a contestant, got the skeleton of a build done.

EDIT: I assume that in the description of the Song of Life's refrain, we're ignoring the reference to the "Dirge of Frozen Loss" and replacing it with "Song of Life"? Otherwise, things just got a little more interesting:smallamused:

Don't forget the reference to Spelldeath in the Songdeath refrain description.

true_shinken
2010-11-06, 04:32 PM
Clearly, that's half the fun. :smallsmile:

I love the way you think, Amph.

OMG PONIES
2010-11-06, 10:31 PM
I'll sign up as a contestant, got the skeleton of a build done.

EDIT: I assume that in the description of the Song of Life's refrain, we're ignoring the reference to the "Dirge of Frozen Loss" and replacing it with "Song of Life"? Otherwise, things just got a little more interesting:smallamused:


Don't forget the reference to Spelldeath in the Songdeath refrain description.

So what are we doing about these inconsistencies?

Grynning
2010-11-06, 11:03 PM
So what are we doing about these inconsistencies?

Text trumps table. As far as I can tell, the table is the only thing that's actually wrong. The stuff about DC's is just a design flaw, which won't really be held against anyone since it's just part of the ingredient.

Pechvarry
2010-11-07, 12:14 AM
Text trumps table. As far as I can tell, the table is the only thing that's actually wrong. The stuff about DC's is just a design flaw, which won't really be held against anyone since it's just part of the ingredient.

What Bakkan and I pointed out were wording issues in the text; not the table. Still, they're very obviously errors. For completeness:



Song of Life, Refrain: When she uses the refrain with her dirge of frozen loss, a seeker...

annnnd


Dirge of Songdeath, Refrain: When she uses the refrain with her hymn of spelldeath...

You COULD assume they want you to only be able to refrain these 2 songs when also singing a specific other song via Combine Songs. e.g. You need Song of Life in order to use Song of Life's refrain. If it's an additional benefit appended to your dirge of frozen loss refrain, you'd need to be already singing frozen loss and song of life.

It's more obviously copy/pasta mistakes. Song of Life Refrain happens from using Song of Life Refrain; Dirge of Songdeath Refrain triggers from Songdeath Refrain.

The end.

kestrel404
2010-11-07, 01:34 PM
Build submitted. I really like mine this time. I just hope the judges agree. :smallbiggrin:

true_shinken
2010-11-07, 04:51 PM
Text trumps table. As far as I can tell, the table is the only thing that's actually wrong. The stuff about DC's is just a design flaw, which won't really be held against anyone since it's just part of the ingredient.

Exactly that. Obvious editing mistakes don't need rulings, I believe.
As for the rank/check thing, I believe the judges should rule whichever way they want. I advise contestants to state which ruling they are using and why and to know that not using RAW might get you a hit on Elegance.

OMG PONIES
2010-11-07, 06:17 PM
Build submitted. I really like mine this time. I just hope the judges agree. :smallbiggrin:

Nice and early, eh? I've just today settled on the majority of my build, but I still have some gaps to fill in. I expect that doing so, editing my backstory, and formatting for submission will take until the deadline.

I've found a particularly nasty trick, one that I hope is not readily apparent to and/or duplicated by my fellow competitors.

Amphetryon
2010-11-09, 11:00 AM
One more day...

OMG PONIES
2010-11-09, 11:29 AM
Formatting my submission now! :smallbiggrin:

kestrel404
2010-11-09, 11:42 AM
Wow, this thread's been quiet. I was half expecting to just see it pop up on Thursday with all the builds posted or something.

true_shinken
2010-11-09, 11:51 AM
Waiting on the builds.

Go, go, go! Allez, allez, allez!

Gametime
2010-11-09, 12:16 PM
One more day...

...I couldn't resist.

To the tune of Wicked's "One Short Day."

One more day in the Iron Chef contest,
One more day full of so much to do.
Every book that I read for this contest
Has something cheesy to use for my PC before the day's through.

There are Perform skills high as epic Jump checks,
Bard spell lists and feat prereqs,
Typos in the table, one hundred strong.
There are wondrous items I've got to buy,
That cost a grand to let me fly,
I've finally built a Seeker of the Song.

I wanna get a fancy forum trophy
So I'll be back to post some more
To dispute rulings and raise my score
But for today I'll ponder my XP.

One more day in the Iron Chef contest,
One more day to build 20 levels of fun.
One more day, and we're warning the judges
That this prestige class
will be polished like fine glass
before we are done.

Amphetryon
2010-11-09, 12:25 PM
...I couldn't resist.

To the tune of Wicked's "One Short Day."

One more day in the Iron Chef contest,
One more day full of so much to do.
Every book that I read for this contest
Has something cheesy to use for my PC before the day's through.

There are Perform skills high as epic Jump checks,
Bard spell lists and feat prereqs,
Typos in the table, one hundred strong.
There are wondrous items I've got to buy,
That cost a grand to let me fly,
I've finally built a Seeker of the Song.

I wanna get a fancy forum trophy
So I'll be back to post some more
To dispute rulings and raise my score
But for today I'll ponder my XP.

One more day in the Iron Chef contest,
One more day to build 20 levels of fun.
One more day, and we're warning the judges
That this prestige class
will be polished like fine glass
before we are done.

I was expecting a 'Les Miserables' parody...

Quietus
2010-11-09, 01:47 PM
Wow, I JUST noticed this one. I wish I knew when they went up, but clearly I don't pay enough attention. :smalltongue:

I've got some ideas I'm playing with, and if I can put them together by tomorrow evening, I'll submit. First time chef, ALLEZ! Viva la musique!

cd4
2010-11-09, 04:48 PM
I have managed to create a build so have sent it now because I suspect that if I wait to tomorrow I will go past the deadline.

darbythegambler
2010-11-09, 08:18 PM
I'm sorry to say, I must drop out of this contest, my attempt to finish at the last second isn't going to work again, something's come up tonight so my character will not be finished on time. Best of luck to the current contestants.

Quietus
2010-11-09, 09:59 PM
Yeah, looks like I'm going to have to drop out, too. My idea won't work, due to some wonky wording I wasn't aware of. Kinda sad.. if I'd noticed earlier I might have time to do a backup, but I've got other things that need doing tomorrow. Oh well.

gbprime
2010-11-10, 01:48 AM
Okay, submission is in. Twice. Due to format fail. (Mental note, never copy code into MS Word and expect it to come back out again...) :smallsigh:

OMG PONIES
2010-11-10, 05:18 PM
Build submitted earlier than expected, thanks to a half-day caused by the flu. Sympathy points from the judges are encouraged :smallbiggrin:.

Amphetryon
2010-11-10, 05:27 PM
Build submitted earlier than expected, thanks to a half-day caused by the flu. Sympathy points from the judges are encouraged :smallbiggrin:.

Feel better, OMG. Sympathy points would require us to figure out which one is yours, and, obviously, we wouldn't want to do that now, would we?
:smallbiggrin:

Amphetryon
2010-11-10, 10:55 PM
SUSPENSE! Last call seems nigh.

true_shinken
2010-11-11, 06:27 AM
Now for the big reveal!

Hearts on fire...



Story

Kestrel Hath was born in the city of Aramanth. Aramanth was at that time in the grip of testing and knowledge was the only way to improve your life. Kestrel hated that and eventually ran away on a quest to put an end to the stifling testing. She found an old device that used the power of the song to help improve the city. Hearing the song she tried to learn it but didn’t get far before the city was burned and the people were made into slaves. Once again she started crusading for freedoms this time it took force but she managed to free the people. Heading off with her people towards a new homeland she remembered the song more and more and learnt even more about singing. Her search for the song eventually took her to Sirene there she was taught how to use the song to affect the world and she decided to sing the song until the end.

Stats

Assuming a 32 point buy then these are the inital stats:
Strength 8
Dexterity 14
Constitution 14
Intelligence 12
Wisdom 14
Charisma 16

I have placed all Bonus points into Charisma during this build.

Build Progression Race = Human
{table=head]Level|Class|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Skills|Feats|Class Features

1st|Paladin of Mystra and Freedom 1|
+1|
+2|
+0|
+2|Bluff +4, Sense Motive +4, Knowledge (Nobility) +4, Knowledge (Religion) +4|Weapon Finesse, Skill Focus (Sing)|Aura of Good, Detect Evil, Smite Evil 1/day

2nd|Paladinof Mystra and Freedom 2|
+2|
+3|
+0|
+0|Bluff +1, Sense Motive +1, Knowledge (Nobility) +1, Knowledge (Religion) +1|None|Divine Grace, Lay on Hands

3rd|Bard 1|
+2|
+3|
+2|
+2|Perform (Sing) +4, Knowledge (Arcana) +4|Devoted Performer|Bardic Music, Bardic Knowledge, Countersong, Healing Hymn, Inspire Courage, Level 0 spells

4th|Bard 2|
+2|
+3|
+3|
+3|Perform (Sing) +3, Knowledge (Arcana) +3, Tumble +2 |None|Level 1 spells

5th|Paladin of Mystra and Freedom 3|
+3|
+3|
+4|
+4|Bluff +1, Sense Motive +1, Knowledge (Nobility) +1, Knowledge (Religion) +1|None|Aura of Resolve, Divine Health

6th|Paladin of Mystra and Freedom 4|
+4|
+4|
+4|
+4|Bluff +1, Sense Motive +1, Knowledge (Nobility) +1, Knowledge (Religion) +1|Battle Blessing|Bonus Spell, Caster Level = Paladin/2+Bard+2, Level 1 spells

7th|Paladin of Mystra and Freedom 5|
+5|
+4|
+4|
+4|Bluff +1, Sense Motive +1, Knowledge (Nobility) +1, Knowledge (Religion) +1|None|Smite Evil 2/day, If successfully smite someone they need to make a concentration check to cast spells, use spell like abilities and use magic devices to cast spells, Spirit of Healing

8th|Paladin of Mystra and Freedom 6|
+6|
+5|
+5|
+5|Bluff +1, Sense Motive +1, Knowledge (Nobility) +1, Knowledge (Religion) +1|None|Greater Dispel Magic 1/day

9th|Bard 3|
+7|
+6|
+5|
+5|Perform (Sing) +4, Knowledge (Arcana) +4|Melodic Casting|Inspire Competence

10th|Bard 4|
+8|
+6|
+6|
+6|Perform (Sing) +2, Knowledge (Arcana) +2, Tumble +4|None|Level 2 Spells

11th|Seeker of the Song 1|
+8|
+6|
+6|
+8|Perform (Sing) +1, Knowledge (Arcana) +1, Sense Motive +4|None|Rapture of the Song(+2AC), Seeker Music, Burning Melody

12th|Seeker of the Song 2|
+9|
+6|
+6|
+9|Perform (Sing) +1, Knowledge (Arcana) +1, Sense Motive +2, Diplomacy +2|Sacred Healing|Combine Songs, Song of Unmaking

13th|Seeker of the Song 3|
+10|
+7|
+7|
+9|Perform (Sing) +1, Knowledge (Arcana) +1, Sense Motive +1, Diplomacy +3|None|Dirge of Frozen Loss

14th|Seeker of the Song 4|
+11|
+7|
+7|
+10|Perform (Sing) +1, Knowledge (Arcana) +1, Sense Motive +1, Diplomacy +3|None|Rapture of the Song (+2 Saves), Song of Life

15th|Seeker of the Song 5|
+11|
+7|
+7|
+10|Perform (Sing) +1, Knowledge (Arcana) +1, Sense Motive +1, Diplomacy +3|Lyric Spell|Subvocalize, Anthem of Thunder and Pain

16th|Seeker of the Song 6|
+12|
+8|
+8|
+11|Perform (Sing) +1, Knowledge (Arcana) +1, Sense Motive +1, Diplomacy +3|None|Hymn of Spelldeath

17th|Seeker of the Song 7|
+13|
+8|
+8|
+11|Perform (Sing) +1, Knowledge (Arcana) +1, Sense Motive +1, Diplomacy +3|None|Rapture of the Song (DR 2/-), Ballard of Agony Reborn

18th|Seeker of the Song 8|
+14|
+8|
+8|
+12|Perform (Sing) +1, Knowledge (Arcana) +1, Sense Motive +1, Diplomacy +3|Divine Might|Aria of Everywhere

19th|Seeker of the Song 9|
+14|
+9|
+9|
+12|Perform (Sing) +1, Knowledge (Arcana) +1, Sense Motive +1, Diplomacy +2, Bluff(CC) +0.5|None|Dirge of Songdeath

20th|Seeker of the Song 10|
+15|
+9|
+9|
+13|Perform (Sing) +1, Knowledge (Arcana) +1, Sense Motive +1, Diplomacy +1, Bluff(CC) +1|None|Rapture of the Song (freedom of movement), Hymn of Revealing[/table]

Paladin Spells
Spells per day
{table=head]Level|1st|2nd|3rd|4th
1st|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

2nd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

3rd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

4th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

5th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

6th|0+2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

7th|0+2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

8th|1+2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

9th|1+2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

10th|1+2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

11th|1+2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

12th|1+2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

13th|1+2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

14th|1+2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

15th|1+2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

16th|1+2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

17th|1+2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

18th|1+2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

19th|1+2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

20th|1+2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-[/table]

Bard Spells

Spells per day
{table=head]Level|0lvl|1st|2nd|3rd|4th|5th|6th

1st|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

2nd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

3rd|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

4th|3|0+1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

5th|3|0+1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

6th|3|0+1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

7th|3|0+1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

8th|3|0+1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

9th|3|1+1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

10th|3|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

11th|3|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

12th|3|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

13th|3|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

14th|3|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

15th|3|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

16th|3|2+2|0+1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

17th|3|2+2|0+1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

18th|3|2+2|0+1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

19th|3|2+2|0+1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

20th|3|2+2|0+1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-[/table]

Spells Known
{table=head]Level|0lvl|1st|2nd|3rd|4th|5th|6th

1st|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

2nd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

3rd|4|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

4th|5|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

5th|5|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

6th|5|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

7th|5|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

8th|5|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

9th|6|3|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

10th|6|3|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

11th|6|3|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

12th|6|3|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

13th|6|3|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

14th|6|3|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

15th|6|3|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

16th|6|3|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

17th|6|3|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

18th|6|3|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

19th|6|3|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

20th|6|3|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-[/table]



Level Discussion

Level 1 and 2

Andante

Standard front line paladin with the non standard weapon finesse and paladin of freedom to help with the alignment issues

Level 3 and 4

Divisi

Now she joins singing buffs with the staying power of a front line finesser. She will need light armour to work best. Her healing hymn will help the party when healing, even before the nightly rest.

Level 5 and 6

Incanto Duet

New paladin spells and a spirit to help healing, plus smiting a spellcaster or UMD user can cause them to lose the spell. Caster level for Paladin spells becomes Paladin/2 + Bard + 2

Level 7 and 8

Fermata Simile

Paladin runs out of new things but this level gives greater dispel magic 1/day, Bard gives new spells.

Level 9 and 10

Crescendo

Improving the bard buffs and preparing for the next stage.

Level 11 and 12

Con Fuoco

Adding a fiery attack and defence to her choices.

Level 13 and 14

Freddo

Adding cold attacks and defence to her choices, the healing song means that losing remove disease earlier is replaced here.

Level 15 and 16

Eccitato

Adding electrical attacks and defence to her choices

Level 17 and 18

Aspramente

Acid damage over time is a useful ability to have.

Level 19 and 20

Forte Coda

Sonic attacks and defence, not many have defences against them. The banishment ability is useful but there are other methods to do that.

Other Possibilities

This combination uses several different alternate class features but it could be done with the standard classes.

Sources

System Resource Document
Unearthed Arcana
Complete Adventurer
Complete Champion
Complete Mage
Complete Arcane
Champions of Valor
Dungeonscape
The Wind on Fire Triology

true_shinken
2010-11-11, 06:28 AM
Strong desire...




“I was lost once. I still am, I suppose… only now I know that’s where I want to be.”

Markus VanDerHomme (of the Lower South Side VanDerHommes) never really fit in well, even amongst his fellow ne’er-do-wells. He was well schooled in the family trades of acquisitions and security, and even showed a knack for the arcane arts, but he just never applied himself to any one thing. He drifted from uncle to uncle, taking the odd job when he had to, but he found that scowling at people and pointing sharp things in their general direction was far less rewarding than literally singing for his supper.

And he did have a marvelous singing voice. He had been approached by one of the region’s bards, but Markus had waived the fellow off, claiming he was nothing more than a talented hack with no real future in it. Still, he continued to sing for some spare coppers now and again… which is what got him drummed out of the family business. He was late for a job, and would have been forgiven had he been drunk in a bar someplace, but having been found SOBER in a bar and having a go at entertaining the patrons… that was the last straw. He would never amount to anything, and was sent packing.

And so his life went for the next few years. City to city, job to job, he was the scallywag, the tomb robber, the sell sword. His life nearly came to an end with that last job, as one of a small handful of caravan guards on a lonely stretch of road, staring down a charging pack of gnolls and outnumbered several times over.

But it didn’t end that day. Instead, it began... with one clear note. A soprano voice so pure it filled his heart with unnatural vigor, split the very fabric of reality, and laid many of the gnolls low with fire. As the remaining gnolls fled into the distance, Markus turned to the woman whose voice had such power and got out only a clumsy “How… ?”

“With practice,” she smiled. “Become a bard, and I could teach you.”

So when the caravan job ended, Markus wasted no time tracking down the bard who had once offered to teach him, and then the simple caravan traveler years after that. Life, it seems, had been telling him what his calling was all along, and Markus had finally learned how to listen.

Male Human Rogue 2 / Duskblade 3 / Prestige Bard 5 / Seeker of the Song 10 Chaotic Neutral or Chaotic Good

Characteristics
s14 d14 c12 i14 w8 ch16

Increases into Charisma

Level Progression
Primal Vagabond
Level
Class
Base Attack<br>Bonus
Fort Save
Ref Save
Will Save
Skills
Feats
Class Features

1st Rogue 1 +0 +0 +2 +0 Bluff 4, Climb 2, Hide 4, Intimidate 2, Listen 2, Knowledge (Local) 4, Move Silently 4, Perform (Sing) 4, Search 4, Sense Motive 4, Sleight of Hand 2, Spot 4, UMD 4 Artist, Craven Trapfinding, Sneak Attack +1d6
2nd Duskblade 1 +1 +2 +2 +2 Climb +1, Knowledge (Local) +1, Knowledge (Arcane) +2, Sense Motive +1 Arcane Attunement, Armored Mage (Light)
3rd Duskblade 2 +2 +3 +2 +3 Knowledge (Local) +1, Knowledge (Arcane) +2, Ride +1, Sense Motive +1 Combat Expertise Combat Casting
4th Duskblade 3 +3 +3 +3 +3 Knowledge (Local) +1, Knowledge (Arcane) +2, Ride +1, Sense Motive +1 Arcane Channeling
5th Rogue 2 +4 +3 +4 +3 Bluff +4, Perform (Sing) +4, UMD +3 Evasion
6th Prestige Bard 1 +4 +3 +6 +5 Knowledge (Local) +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +3, Knowledge (Religion) +2, Perform +1, Speak Language +1 Deadly Defense Bardic Music (Countersong, Fascinate, Inspire Courage +1), Bardic Knowledge
7th Prestige Bard 2 +5 +3 +7 +6 Gather Information +2, Knowledge (Local) +1, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Knowledge (Religion) +3, Perform +1, Speak Language +1
8th Prestige Bard 3 +6 +4 +7 +6 Gather Information +2, Knowledge (Local) +1, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Knowledge (Religion) +3, Perform +1, Speak Language +1 Inspire Competence
9th Prestige Bard 4 +7 +4 +8 +7 Gather Information +2, Knowledge (Local) +1, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Knowledge (Religion) +3, Perform +1, Speak Language +1 Skill Focus (Perform)
10th Prestige Bard 5 +7 +4 +8 +7 Gather Information +3, Knowledge (Local) +1, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Knowledge (Religion) +2, Perform +1, Speak Language +1 Inspire Courage +2
11th Seeker o’ Song 1 +7 +4 +8 +9 Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1 Rapture of the Song (+2 AC), Seeker Music, Burning Melody
12th Seeker o’ Song 2 +8 +4 +8 +10 Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1 Knowledge Devotion Combine Songs, Song of Unmaking
13th Seeker o’ Song 3 +9 +5 +9 +10 Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1 Dirge of Frozen Loss
14th Seeker o’ Song 4 +10 +5 +9 +11 Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1 Rapture of the Song (+2 saves), Song of Life
15th Seeker o’ Song 5 +10 +5 +9 +11 Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1 Extra Music Subvocalize, Anthem of Thunder and Pain
16th Seeker o’ Song 6 +11 +6 +10 +12 Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1 Hymn of Spelldeath
17th Seeker o’ Song 7 +12 +6 +10 +12 Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1 Rapture of the Song (DR 2/-), Ballad of Agony Reborn
18th Seeker o’ Song 8 +13 +6 +10 +13 Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1 Versatile Performer Aria of Everywhere
19th Seeker o’ Song 9 +13 +7 +11 +13 Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1 Dirge of Songdeath
20th Seeker o’ Song 10 +14 +7 +11 +14 Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1 Rapture of the Song (Freedom of Movement), Hymn of Revealing

Spells per day/Spells Known (Duskblade)
Level
0 1st
2nd
Spells Known

1st - - - -
2nd 3 2 - Ray of Frost, Touch of Fatigue, Color Spray, True Strike
3rd 4 3 - Shocking Grasp
4th 5 4 - Rouse
5th 5 4 - -
6th 5 4 - -
7th 6 5 - Inspirational Boost (If DM allows expansion book bard spell, per description in Prestige Bard class)
8th 6 5 -
9th 6 5 2 Spider Climb
10th 6 6 3 See Invisibility


Level Highlights
Level 2 - This is where Markus starts his “career”. With a die of sneak attack and his craven bonus plus the occasional Color Spray, he’s scrappy in a fight, but lacks focus. A rogue with no trap skills, he’s more of a highwayman, and is rather unwilling to lay his life down for anything no mater the cause or the payoff. (The Craven feat at work again.)

Level 6 – After his epiphany, Markus is apprenticed to a bard, and has begun his studies in understanding people (speak language, knowledge religion, etc). But he’s not to be underestimated. With a Shocking Grasp to channel into a melee attack and an extra die out of Deadly Defense, he can add 5d6+6 to any damage roll, and thanks to his Artist Feat, he’s already looking at 4 uses of Bardic Music per day. Not bad for a newbie.

Level 10 – His bardic training caps out with +3 worth of inspire courage (+2 if DM does not allow Inspirational Boost Spell, see spoiler above), and he’s capable of adding 7d6+10 to any melee attack thanks to sneak attack, deadly defense, a channeled shocking grasp, and his trusty (!?) craven feat.

Level 15 – While his melee damage curve has long since capped itselt, Markus can now throw around 10 dice of directed damage and serve as an emergency backup healer. And with 17 uses of Bardic mojo per day, he’s not short on battery power.

Level 20 - At the pinnacle of his career, Markus has taken Versatile Performer to round out his repetoire as a bard, rather than taking another Extra Music feat for even more Bardic music per day. He's also patiently waiting for the universe to sort out his broken Note of Solitude song. =)


Sources
Rogue (PHB)
Duskblade (PHB II)
Prestige Bard (UA)
Seeker of the Song (CArc)

Artist (PGtF)
Craven (CoR)
Combat Expertise (PHB)
Deadly Defense (CScoundrel)
Skill Focus (PHB)
Knowledge Devotion (CChamp)
Extra Music (CAdv)
Versatile Performer (CAdv)

true_shinken
2010-11-11, 06:30 AM
Getting stronger... getting stronger...





The Story of Santana
http://fc07.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2010/084/9/8/988911c62478cc50e53945e5770b7c25.png
Dear Diary,
Hi. My name's Santana. An old Gith taught me a cantrip for keeping a deadjournal on the ethereal plane. I wonder how many ghosts are reading this?
Anyway, I just want everyone to know that my brood parents just can't understand me! They think that just because the Matriarch has taken an interest in me, I should stop with all of the 'silly singing and prancing around' as they call it.
But I can't just forget. Ever since I heard that otherwordly music while hunting in the outer maelstrom, I haven't been able to forget. It's not silly! It's beautiful, and important!
I've managed to find a Gith bar at the edge of the territory, and I've been sneaking off to meet with one of the men working at the bar as an entertainer. I just hope my clanmates don't find out...
Mood: Annoyed
Music: "Sing, sing a song,
Let the world, sing along
Sing of love there could be
Sing for you and for me"

Dear Diary,
The Matriarch has decided that I'm going to be trained as a wizard. Not my first choice, but the Clan would never understand my desire to be a bard, and a wizard is like a bard, right?
And I can sing and dance too - Sir Cedric is teaching me all of the finer points of Song, Dance and Acting. He says that I'm the most naturally talented Neraph he's ever met and he might even be able to find me a troupe I could play with on the Material plane with a bit more training!
Mood: Excited
Music: "All we need is music, sweet music
There'll be music everywhere
There'll be swingin', swayin' and records playin'
And dancin' in the streets"

Dear Diary,
Oh god, this is terrible! My clan, they found out about Sir Cedric! They're saying all these awful things about how he's stolen the Matriarch's prodigy away, as though my learning how to be a singer has somehow stopped me from being a wizard!
I've been forbidden from ever seeing him again, on pain of exile. But I heard my brood parents talking when they thought I went to sleep. The clan is planning to hunt and kill Sir Cedric! I just can't let that happen. Not because of me! I'm going to save him, no matter what it costs. If I don't write to you again, diary, you'll know why...
Mood: Anxious
Music: "Hey jude, don't let me down.
You have found her, now go and get her.
Remember to let her into your heart,
Then you can start to make it better."

Dear Diary,
I'm...I'm...I'm an EXILE! I can't believe this happened to me! My life is just over!
After I went and warned Sir Cedric, the clan cast me out. I managed to meet up with him again before he left Limbo and I've gone with him to his home plane. Now I'm surrounded by all these weird smooth skinned pink things called 'humans' and 'elves' and Sir Cedric says that Dragonborn like himself are pretty rare.
At least Sir Cedric is willing to take me on as his full-time apprentice. He says that if I keep a cloak on I can pass as a Dragonborn like himself.
Mood: Devastated
Music: "All the vampires, walkin' through the valley
Move west down, Ventural Boullevard.
And all the bad boys, are standing in the shadows.
All the good girls, are home with broken hearts.
And I'm Free, I'm free fallin'
Yeah I'm free, free fallin'"

Dear Diary,
It's been a few years since I've started writing in here, but I've made a big decision. I've been helping Sir Cedric with his quest against that nasty chaos-dragon he was in Limbo to fight. I've decided that it's more important than my singing career. I'm going to take up wizardry again - I was pretty good at it. And more importantly, I'm going to pledge myself to Bahamut.
I've heard that the songs dragons sing are almost as nice as the Celestial Chorus. I'm still looking for that perfect music I heard so long ago in Limbo, but there are other things that have to be done first. Eventually, I'll start questing for that again, but until then...Bahamut shall guide my voice.
Mood: Determined
Music: "That's me in the corner
That's me in the spotlight, I'm
Losing my religion
Trying to keep up with you
And I don't know if I can do it
Oh no, I've said too much
I haven't said enough
I thought that I heard you laughing
I thought that I heard you sing
I think I thought I saw you try"

Dear Diary,
I think I may have finally found a lead. It's been a long time since I heard that music out in the maelstrom of limbo, but it still haunts my dreams and memories. But my research into the arcane has lead me to a discipline which may lead me to the music again. It's called Binding.
There are beings who have existed for eons in the spaces between the planes, in the darkness of nothing, waiting for people to let them back into the world. They are ancient, and they've shared the minds and bodies of countless others. One of those beings MUST know something about the music I'm seeking. They simply must!
Mood: Curious
Music: "Through the storm we reach the shore
You give it all but I want more
And I'm waiting for you
With or Without you
With or Without you
I can't live
With or Without you"

Dear Diary,
I've found it! I've finally found it! Oh, I'm so happy! Ever since I started taking on the shape of a Firre, one of those singing angels, I've been having much more vivid dreams about what I actually heard out there in the Maelstrom.
It was primal, and it was perfect, and it was powerful. I remembered all that. But now I can kind of sing along, or at least I can try to sometimes. I've finally found the path - the one I've been looking for my entire life it seems. The song that I've been searching for is finally within my grasp!
Mood: Excited!
Music: "Sing, sing a song,
Keep it simple, To last your whole life long!
Don't worry that it's not good enough
for anyone else to hear
Just sing, sing a song!"

The Build
Name: Santana the Exile
Race: Dragonborn Neraph
Attributes: 8 8 14 16 14 16
NAME OF ENTRY
{table=head]Level|Class|BAB|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Skills|Feats|Class Features
1st|Conjurer 1|
+0|
+0|
+0|
+2|Perform(Sing) 4, Perform(Dance) 4, Perform(Act) 4, Know(Arcana) 4, Diplomacy 4|Apprentice Entertainer|Scribe Scroll, Abrupt Jaunt
2nd|Conjurer 2|
+1|
+0|
+0|
+3|Perform(Sing) 5, Know(Arcana) 5, Know(Planes) 5, Spellcraft 1, Diplomacy 5||
3rd|Binder 1|
+1|
+2|
+0|
+5|Perform(Sing) 6, Know(Arcana) 6, Intimidate 3|Extend Spell|Soul binding (1 vestige)
4th|Binder 2|
+2|
+3|
+0|
+6|Perform(Sing) 7, Know(Arcana) 7, Intimidate 5, Diplomacy 6||Pact Augmentation(1 ability), suppress sign, +2 Int
5th|Conjurer 3|
+2|
+4|
+1|
+6|Perform(Sing) 8, Know(Arcana) 8, Diplomacy 8, Spellcraft 2||
6th|Binder 3|
+3|
+4|
+2|
+6|Perform(Sing) 9, Know(Arcana) 9, Sense Motive 3|Skill Focus(Perform(Sing))|
7th|Binder 4|
+4|
+5|
+2|
+7|Perform(Sing) 10, Know(Arcana) 10, Sense Motive 5, Diplomacy 9|Improved Binding|
8th|Anima Mage 1|
+4|
+5|
+2|
+9|Perform(Sing) 11, Know(Arcana) 11, Spellcraft 6||+1 Int
9th|Anima Mage 2|
+5|
+5|
+2|
+10|Perform(Sing) 12, Know(Arcana) 12, Spellcraft 9, Perform(Dance) 5|Persist Spell|Exploit Vestige
10th|Anima Mage 3|
+5|
+6|
+3|
+10|Perform(Sing) 13, Know(Arcana) 13, Spellcraft 13||Vestigal Awareness
11th|Anima Mage 4|
+6|
+6|
+3|
+11|Perform(Sing) 14, Spellcraft 14, Perform(Dance) 8, Perform(Act) 5||Soul Binding (2 vestiges)
12th|Anima Mage 5|
+6|
+6|
+3|
+11|Perform(Sing) 15, Spellcraft 15, Diplomacy 13|Assume Supernatural Ability (Firre, Song)|Vestige Metamagic, +1 Cha
13th|Seeker of the Song 1|
+6|
+6|
+3|
+13|Perform(Sing) 16, Perform(Dance) 10, Perform(Act) 8, Diplomacy 15||Seeker Music, Rapture(+2 AC), Burning Melody
14th|Seeker of the Song 2|
+7|
+6|
+3|
+14|Perform(Sing) 17, Perform(Dance) 17||Combine Songs, Song of Unmaking
15th|Seeker of the Song 3|
+8|
+7|
+4|
+14|Perform(Sing) 18, Perform(Dance) 18, Spellcraft 18, Perform(Act) 11|Assume Supernatural Ability (Firre, Gaze Attack)|Dirge of Frozen Loss
16th|Seeker of the Song 4|
+9|
+7|
+4|
+15|Perform(Sing) 19, Perform(Dance) 19, Spellcraft 19, Perform(Act) 16 ||Rapture(+2 Saves), Song of Life, +1 Cha
17th|Seeker of the Song 5|
+9|
+7|
+4|
+15|Perform(Sing) 20, Perform(Dance) 20, Spellcraft 20, Perform(Act) 20, Diplomacy 16||Subvocalize, Anthem of Thunder and Pain
18th|Seeker of the Song 6|
+10|
+8|
+5|
+16|Perform(Sing) 21, Perform(Dance) 21, Spellcraft 21, Perform(Act) 21, Diplomacy 20|Snowflake Wardance|Hymn of Spelldeath
19th|Seeker of the Song 7|
+11|
+8|
+5|
+16|Perform(Sing) 22, Perform(Dance) 22, Spellcraft 22, Perform(Act) 22, Diplomacy 22, Sense Motive 7||Rapture(DR 2/-), Ballad of Agony Reborn
20th|Seeker of the Song 8|
+12|
+8|
+5|
+17|Perform(Sing) 23, Perform(Dance) 23, Spellcraft 23, Perform(Act) 23, Diplomacy 23, Sense Motive 10||Aria of Everywhere, +1 Cha[/table]

Alternate Class Features:
Wizard: Specialist(Conjurer with banned evocation and necromancy), Abrupt Jaunt
Spells per day
{table=head]Level|0lvl|1st|2nd|3rd|4th
1st|3|1|-|-|-
2nd|4|2|-|-|-
3rd|4|2|-|-|-
4th|4|2|-|-|-
5th|4|2|1|-|-
6th|4|2|1|-|-
7th|4|2|1|-|-
8th|4|3|2|-|-
9th|4|3|2|1|-
10th|4|3|3|2|-
11th|4|4|3|2|1
12th|4|4|3|3|2[/table]
Note: Does not include bonus spells or specialist spells

Tactics
Level 5 - "You shoulda been in Showbiz" You've got 2nd level spells and 1st level vestiges, as well as a useful set of skills. A number of useful knowledge skills help in researching new spells and vestiges and a breath weapon for a backup weapon, a handful of social skills to keep you out of trouble, and even the various performance abilities will let you entertain a crowd. You get to use Alter Self for the Outsider type, which is very nice. And being a Dragonborn, not many will be able to tell your species of origin, so getting confused with a Slaad is unlikely to happen.
Level 10 - "The show must go on" You're up to 3rd level spells and 4th level vestiges. Versatility is the name of the game at this stage - relatively speaking you're a bit behind the power curve but you can fill just about any party role short of frontline melee fighter (and then only because you lack the HP for it). Alter Self is probably the only self-buff you need, your breath weapon is still going strong as your primary attack, and everything else is handled by your vestige powers or your spellcasting.
Level 15 - "Triple Threat of the Outer Planes" This is the truly high-point in this build. Thanks to vestige metamagic, you can cast a Persistent polymorph on yourself to become a Firre all day long - giving you 20 strength, 14 dex, 12 con, +12 natural armor, and an excellent fly speed. Thanks to Assume Supernatural Ability, you also get unlimited bardic music uses and the Firre's gaze attack, which does 2d6 fire damage resisted by a DC 14+cha fort save. You've got level 9 binding and can bind 2 5th level vestiges - this means you can bind both Balam and Geryon. Balam gives you a gaze attack that does 2d6 cold damage, resisted by DC 15+Cha will save, gives you the Luck domain's re-roll ability once every five rounds, and grants a +2 insight bonus to various abilities (some of which overlap with the seeker's Rapture bonuses). Geryon gives 360 degree vision, a 2d6 acid damage gaze attack resisted by a DC 15+cha fort save, and the ability to see in all darkness, including magical dark. So, 3 gaze attacks, in 360 degrees (since you literally have eyes in the back of your head)! Next, you can use the Inspire Courage or Greatness song combined with either the fire or ice song, giving you a nice buff while allowing you a swift-action area attack every round. Since the save DC is based on the 'number of ranks you have in the perform skill', the save DC should be is either 44 or 26 (depending on your GM's interpretation). And the penalties from Assume Supernatural Ability are pretty much cancelled out with the bonuses granted by Balam and the Seeker's Rapture ability. Between blasting with your seeker songs, using a breath weapon, casting spells and using your numerous gaze attacks and vestige-granted powers, there's not much that can stand up to you anymore. If a bit more power is needed, several vestiges other than Geryon can provide more options.
Level 20 - "Choir of One" At this point, you're a singing, dancing, superman. You've got either 69 or 23 ranks in perform, but now you've got so many options for what to do with your at-will music that it hardly matters. At-will healing, dispelling, fire, acid, cold or electric damage, and teleportation. And those are just your options for SWIFT ACTIONS (teleportation via Subvocalize)! Snowflake Wardance will give you an all-combat bonus to your attacks. Your non-combat versatility has taken a back seat to your combat effectiveness, but you're certainly not any worse, and between unlimited healing and short range teleportation you have definitely gained.

Secret Ingredient
The Seeker of the Song class is very focused. There is literally only two things that any of the class features care about:
*Uses of the Bardic Music ability and how long you can keep singing (keeping that Rapture ability going)
*Ranks in the Perform skill
This build maximizes both of those things:
*You can't get more uses of bardic music than 1/round, forever - or at least all day, every day.
*At entry into the Seeker class, we've got 34 ranks in the perform skill (or 16, depending on how you're counting).
As for the other class features, Combine Songs and Subvocalize are both extremely useful abilities, and can be used to excellent effect by pretty much any build. Merely meeting the entry requirements for the class and getting seeker music is sufficient to make use of these class features, and the practice of 'braiding songs' will become a staple of any seeker build. This build still beats out most others in using these abilities since unlimited singing means that using twice as many bardic music attempts has far less impact. From my own reading of these abilities and the Song power on Firre, you would probably need to spend a seeker music to activate two songs at once, but using subvocalize to start a second song after the first one you could use the Firre's infinite music on both activations.

Equipment
There's not a lot of specialty equipment that you need.
Perhaps your most important piece of equipment is a Belt of Magnificence. While not dependent on any stats, per se, most of your abilities tend to grant saving throws, which would be nice to raise by having generally higher stats. The fact that the Firre has a relatively low constitution score (though no lower than your own) just reinforces the need for stat boosting items. For the same reason, manuals and wishes to boost your key abilities would also be money well spent.
After that, a ring of counterspelling set to dispel magic or greater dispel (if you can get someone else to charge it for you). Any item you can get to prevent your polymorph spell from being dispelled. A scroll of Polymorph any object will permanently turn you into a Firre, so if your willing to go that route, it's a good idea.
A set of Twilight Mithril Chain when you've got the money will provide sufficient armor without impeding your spellcasting abilities. A harmonic weapon would be nice, but by the time you can use it, you're already able to sing continuously so it's not essential. Otherwise, scrolls, wands and other situation-specific items are a good idea to keep your versatility up to any challenge.

Build Notes
There are a few potentially controversial aspects of this build. The big one is that it gets bardic music via a persistent polymorph/assume supernatural ability. This concept is not going to be an easy sell with most GMs because Polymorph shenanigans is a known source of overpoweredness. However, in this case the polymorph shenanigans are limited to taking the form of a single entity - the Firre - a creature that has very modest physical abilities, no EX attack powers to take, and a slew of supernatural powers that simply aren't being accessed. Having to polymorph into this creature every day is both a weakness that the GM can exploit and a stable set of abilities that the GM can plan on the character always having - which eliminates many of the most broken aspects of polymorph. Plus, this doesn't even come up as an issue until 12th level, by which time most of the other players can be expected to have similarly powerful abilities.
The seeker requirement is Bardic Music Ability, not Bardic Music class feature, and the Firre's Song ability states that it "can use bardic music just as a bard can" for Inspire courage, fascinate, inspire competence and suggestiong, an unlimited number of times per day. So by RAW, there's no doubt that the Firre's Song ability qualifies as the special ability of bardic music. It is because the build gets Bardic Music as an ability and not a class feature that the only bardic music feat taken is Snowflake wardance - which also requires the bardic music ability.
If your GM can't be convinced that this is a workable idea, then taking level 7 as Prestige Bard in place of a level of Binder will give you 4 extra skill points and won't take away anything from the build - as long as you can get a flaw for Improved Binding. This will also prevent you from losing your seeker class features if your polymorph goes away (since you will STILL be polymorphing into the Firre to get unlimited bardic music).
If the GM is allowing LA buyoff, this build works even better with an Aasimar or Dragonborn Aasimar. If flaws are allowed, Both Extend and Skill focus could be taken at first level, and other feats moved around to allow Melodic casting if it is allowed, and otherwise both Silent spell and a metamagic reducer (Easy Metamagic) which would allow casting while singing. Minor shapeshift is also nice, as it would give significant survivability. If the GM does not allow ranks in perform to stack for calculating DCs (which is likely), then Acting and Dance ranks can be traded for other skills - Concentration, various knowledge skills, etc. Acting 5 and dance 10 should be kept just for flavor, though.

true_shinken
2010-11-11, 06:31 AM
I can get no satisfaction...


Mich J. Rana
Neraph Sorcerer 5/Ardent Dilletante 4/Warrior Skald 1/Seeker of the Song 10

The neraphim know but one sound--that of the hunt. One croak if you don't see any prey, two if you do. They see but one sight, the everchanging landscape of Limbo. Never have they journeyed beyond its bounds, nor do they care to. Their only smell is the stale dryness of their dirt huts, they touch naught but thick, though neraphim hide. But their greatest grievance is that they eat only one dish--the chaos beast. Contrary to its name, its flesh is flavorless and ordinary, yet it provides just enough sustenance to continue their senseless life.

And such was my life, until my eyes were greeted by the sight of a confused band of travelers, lost in Limbo as the result of planar travel gone awry. They carried with them the foul aromas of travel and fear, which swelled in my nostrils like sweet perfume. I offered to help their leader, who extended a hand that was so strangely soft I fear my handshake lingered. All of them had silken skin, and wore a variety of hides and other materials whose foreign textures were drugs for my fingertips. As I guided them through the plane, the leader pulled a strange little stringed device from his pack and began to pinch the strings. The sound that emerged--something so unlike croaking as to be its complete opposite--made me feel compelled to move my body in strange and untoward ways, as dancing is not a habit enjoyed by the Neraphim. And the rations they carried with them! Turkey legs, loaves of bread, and jug after jug of ale...it's enough to make a neraph swear off chaos beast entirely!

My house heard that I had not shown for the daily hunt because I was cavorting with these extraplanar misfits, and they were properly steamed. My matriarch croaked for hours on end about how the neraphim are meant to suppress the chaos within us, but I knew what was right for me. My entire life had been spent chasing after bland and flavorless beasts, I told her, but no more. She exiled me on the spot, stripping me of my name among the neraphim. It mattered not, as I had no plans to return.

Once we found a portal out of Limbo, the travelers and I began to adventure together, becoming fast friends. I developed some slight magical prowess, but longed to replicate the music of our group's leader. However, my voice will always be that of a neraphim, and my hands are not dextrous enough to strum a lute or any other instrument. Instead, I began to dance. My awkward movements gave way to elegant lines, but I still felt something missing. This is when my friend the bard informed me that others must be able to hear you to be emboldened by your art. Taking his advice to heart, I began to write poems, hoping to express through speech what his songs had stirred in me. As I studied, he regaled me with various legends and myths, dwelling on the firre eladrin--angels of song. He recounted how he had the rare privilege of meeting one, and he sang me a mere fragment of its melody. The music seemed to vibrate my very bones; I do not exaggerate when I say it was the most beautiful thing I have ever heard.

In my hours of writing and honing my magical arts, I realized that, with enough concentration, I was able to change my form into various creatures. Drawing upon the legends I had heard about the frighteningly beautiful eladrin, I focused myself on taking their form. Wings emerged from my back, and my eyes glowed with the fire of the heavens. Much to my surprise, my poems rang out in the melodious voice of an angel, rather than the muted croak of a frog. I had a taste of their glorious song, and now I take their form as much as I can so that I might enjoy but a few more bars.

Ever since, I have supported my band of friends through my poems, developing them to the point where my words can bring healing, cause pain, or transport us to a different place entirely. I've recently discovered a poem that can banish creatures to their home planes, and I feel that I could use it on myself if I ever wanted to. However, home holds nothing for me beyond the promise of squandered joy, long hours hunting, and more chaos beast. I think I quite prefer things the way they are.

The Build

{table=head]Level|Class|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Skills|Feats|Class Features
1st|Sorcerer 1|+0|+0|+0|+2|Concentration 4, Know (arcana) 4, Perform (dance) 0.5cc, Spellcraft 3|Versatile Spellcaster|Summon Familiar
2nd|Sorcerer 2|+1|+0|+0|+3|Bluff 1, Concentration 4, Know (arcana) 5, Perform (dance) 0.5cc, Perform (poetry) 0.5cc, Spellcraft 3||
3rd|Sorcerer 3|+1|+1|+1|+3|Bluff 1, Concentration 4, Know (arcana) 6, Perform (dance) 1cc, Perform (poetry) 1cc, Spellcraft 3|Power Attack|
4th|Sorcerer 4|+2|+1|+1|+4|Bluff 1, Concentration 4, Know (arcana) 7, Perform (dance) 1.5cc, Perform (poetry) 1cc, Spellcraft 4||
5th|Sorcerer 5|+2|+1|+1|+4|Bluff 1, Concentration 4, Know (arcana) 8, Perform (dance) 2cc, Perform (poetry) 1cc, Spellcraft 4||
6th|Ardent Dilletante 1|+2|+1|+3|+4|Bluff 1, Concentration 6, Know (arcana) 8, Perfom (dance) 4, Perform (poetry) 4, Spellcraft 4|Cleave|Heightened Senses, Lore
7th|Ardent Dilletante 2|+3|+1|+4|+4|Bluff 1, Concentration 6, Know (arcana) 8, Perform (dance) 8, Perform (poetry) 7, Spellcraft 4||Enthrall
8th|Ardent Dilletante 3|+3|+2|+4|+5|Bluff 1, Concentration 6, Intimidate 1, Know (arcana) 10, Perform (dance) 9, Perform (poetry) 10, Spellcraft 4||Joie de vivre
9th|Warrior Skald 1|+4|+4|+6|+5|Bluff 1, Concentration 8, Intimidate 1.5, Know (arcana) 10, Perform (dance) 9, Perform (poetry) 12, Spellcraft 4|Skill Focus (Perform)|Bardic music (countersong, fascinate, inspire competence, inspire courage, inspire greatness, suggestion)
10th|Ardent Dilletante 4|+5|+4|+7|+5|Bluff 1, Concentration 10, Intimidate 2.5, Know (arcana) 13, Perform (dance) 9, Perform (poetry) 13, Spellcraft 4|Assume Supernatural Ability|Bonus feat, sense link
11th|Seeker of the Song 1|+5|+4|+7|+7|Bluff 1, Concentration 11, Intimidate 3, Know (arcana) 14, Perform (dance) 9, Perform (poetry) 14, Spellcraft 4||Rapture of the Song (+2 AC), Seeker Music (Burning Melody)
12th|Seeker of the Song 2|+6/+1|+4|+7|+8|Bluff 1, Concentration 12, Intimidate 4, Know (arcana) 15, Perform (dance) 9, Perform (poetry) 15, Spellcraft 4|Lyric Spell|Combine Songs, Seeker Music (Song of Unmaking)
13th|Seeker of the Song 3|+7/+2|+5|+8|+8|Bluff 1, Concentration 13, Intimidate 5, Know (arcana) 16, Perform (dance) 9, Perform (poetry) 16, Spellcraft 4||Seeker Music (Dirge of Frozen Loss)
14th|Seeker of the Song 4|+8/+3|+5|+8|+9|Bluff 1, Concentration 14, Intimidate 6, Know (arcana) 17, Perform (dance) 9, Perform (poetry) 17, Spellcraft 4||Rapture of the Song (+2 saves), Seeker Music (Song of Life)
15th|Seeker of the Song 5|+8/+3|+5|+8|+9|Bluff 1, Concentration 15, Intimidate 7, Know (arcana) 18, Perform (dance) 9, Perform (poetry) 18, Spellcraft 4|Haunting Melody|Subvocalize, Seeker Music (Anthem of Thunder and Pain)
16th|Seeker of the Song 6|+9/+4|+6|+9|+10|Bluff 1, Concentration 16, Intimidate 8, Know (arcana) 19, Perform (dance) 9, Perform (poetry) 19, Spellcraft 4||Seeker Music (Hymn of Spelldeath)
17th|Seeker of the Song 7|+10/+5|+6|+9|+10|Bluff 1, Concentration 17, Intimidate 9, Know (arcana) 20, Perform (dance) 9, Perform (poetry) 20, Spellcraft 4||Rapture of the Song (DR 2/-), Seeker Music (Ballad of Agony Reborn)
18th|Seeker of the Song 8|+11/+6/+1|+6|+9|+11|Bluff 1, Concentration 18, Intimidate 10, Know (arcana) 21, Perform (dance) 9, Perform (poetry) 21, Spellcraft 4|Doomspeak|Seeker Music (Aria of Everywhere)
19th|Seeker of the Song 9|+11/+6/+1|+7|+10|+11|Bluff 1, Concentration 19, Intimidate 11, Know (arcana) 22, Perform (dance) 9, Perform (poetry) 22, Spellcraft 4||Seeker Music (Dirge of Songdeath)
20th|Seeker of the Song 10|+12/+7/+2|+7|+10|+12|Bluff 1, Concentration 20, Intimidate 12, Know (arcana) 23, Perform (dance) 9, Perform (poetry) 23, Spellcraft 4||Rapture of the Song (freedom of movement), Seeker Music (Note of Solitude)[/table]

{table=head]Ability|Points|Base|Levels|Enhancement|Inherent|To tal|Mod
STR|6|14|0|0|0|14|+2
DEX|2|10|0|0|0|10|+0
CON|2|10|0|0|0|10|+0
INT|4|12|0|0|0|12|+1
WIS|5|13|2|6|5|26|+8
CHA|13|17|3|6|4|30|+10[/table]

Spellcasting

Spells per day
{table=head]Level|0lvl|1st|2nd|3rd|4th|5th|6th|7th|8th|9th

1st|5|3|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

2nd|6|4|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

3rd|6|5|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

4th|6|6|3|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

5th|6|6|4|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

6th|6|6|4|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

7th|6|6|5|3|-|-|-|-|-|-

8th|6|6|6|4|-|-|-|-|-|-

9th|6|6|6|4|-|-|-|-|-|-

10th|6|6|6|5|3|-|-|-|-|-

11th|6|6|6|5|3|-|-|-|-|-

12th|6|6|6|5|3|-|-|-|-|-

13th|6|6|6|5|3|-|-|-|-|-

14th|6|6|6|5|3|-|-|-|-|-

15th|6|6|6|5|3|-|-|-|-|-

16th|6|6|6|5|3|-|-|-|-|-

17th|6|6|6|5|3|-|-|-|-|-

18th|6|6|6|5|3|-|-|-|-|-

19th|6|6|6|5|3|-|-|-|-|-

20th|6|6|6|5|3|-|-|-|-|-
[/table]

Spells Known
{table=head]Level|0lvl|1st|2nd|3rd|4th|5th|6th|7th|8th|9th

1st|4|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

2nd|5|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

3rd|5|3|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

4th|6|3|1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

5th|6|4|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

6th|6|4|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

7th|7|4|2|1|-|-|-|-|-|-

8th|7|5|3|2|-|-|-|-|-|-

9th|7|5|3|2|-|-|-|-|-|-

10th|8|5|3|2|1|-|-|-|-|-

11th|8|5|3|2|1|-|-|-|-|-

12th|8|5|3|2|1|-|-|-|-|-

13th|8|5|3|2|1|-|-|-|-|-

14th|8|5|3|2|1|-|-|-|-|-

15th|8|5|3|2|1|-|-|-|-|-

16th|8|5|3|2|1|-|-|-|-|-

17th|8|5|3|2|1|-|-|-|-|-

18th|8|5|3|2|1|-|-|-|-|-

19th|8|5|3|2|1|-|-|-|-|-

20th|8|5|3|2|1|-|-|-|-|-
[/table]

{table=head]Spell Level|Spells Known
0|Daze, Light, Read Magic, Detect Magic, Ghost Sound, Mage Hand, Message, Prestidigitation
1|Charm Person, Magic Missile, Grease, Mount, Mage Armor
2|Chain of Eyes, Alter Self, Wings of Cover
3|Great Thunderclap, Summon Monster III
4|Polymorph[/table]


The Secret Ingredient

Rapture of the Song: This ability actually gave me the foundational idea for the character. Though the bonuses are relatively minor, together they provide a nice suite of buffs. However, they last only as long as your bardic music uses for the day. Because of that, I was determined to create a build that can use bardic music all day, thus giving the character a persistent set of benefits. For more information on the all-day music, see Tricks/Combos below.
Seeker Music: blasting, healing, dispelling, teleporting, countersong, and energy resistance are all interesting alternative uses for bardic music, but they are usually not the clear-cut choice. For instance, why create a bard who can spend a music use to possibly do 10d6 damage when there are Dragonfire Inspiration builds out there that can add +10d6 damage to ALL of your allies' attacks? However, when resource management is no longer an issue, the question above becomes moot. Instead, infinite music uses means infinite resistance, blasting, healing, teleporting, etc. Even the capstone ability, Note of Solitude, becomes a bit more enticing with infinite uses of bardic music. By itself, it seems a weak way to shift a creature back to its homeplane. However, the "Back from Whence You Came" combo (below), provides the effect with a rather heavy debuff at the cost of 3 bardic music uses. While some might scoff at the cost, it becomes meaningless when you have infinite music uses.
Combine Songs: Originally, this seemed like a trap to burn through music uses at breakneck speed. However, upon further investigation, I realized that it's a rather handy combat buff--you can choose two bardic/seeker musics that you have the Perform ranks for (see my notes on Warrior Skald, below) and activate them together. You can use this offensively (inspire courage+Haunting Melody to give your allies a boost and debuff your foes), defensively (Song of Life+teleporting yourself out of danger), or as an anti-caster utility (teleport into range of a distant enemy caster and activate Hymn of Spelldeath).
Subvocalize: This can be used with the above to great effect. While not explicitly mentioned anywhere, I would argue that bardic music (especially a vocal use such as poetry) can be stopped as a free action. If so, you can use a standard action to begin two bardic/seeker musics, then stop one as a free action. You now have only one bardic/seeker music active, so you are free to use your swift action to subvocalize a third effect within the same round. Furthermore, most of your effects linger for 5 rounds after you cease performing, allowing you some interesting combinations. For instance, the Back From Whence You Came combo (below) uses this trick to counterbalance some of the nerfing that Note of Solitude has built in.


Tricks/Combos

Versatile Spellcaster: While it's not exactly a trick per se, this feat is so stupid good that I try to make sure I can use it on every one of my spontaneous spellcasters. Trade in two spell slots for one of the next level? Yes please! I love using it to trade (usually) worthless 0-level spells for 1-st level ones, though it never sees much use at higher levels. However, this character makes use of it for his primary shtick. Mich tries to polymorph into a firre eladrin as many times per day as possible (for the reason why, see my next note), and Versatile Spellcaster provides us with two extra 4th-level spells at higher levels. Adding that to the 3 base spells per day and the bonus spells for a high CHA ensures that he'll at least be able to take firre form in every encounter. Also, the long duration ensures that he can use his infinite music (see below) to heal his allies after the combat ends.
This is the Song that Doesn't End...: As it is, polymorph is a ridiculous spell. However, when you add in the Assume Supernatural Ability feat from Savage Species, it takes it to a higher level. You get to pick one Su ability of your alternate form to use, and the firre eladrin has one worth noting--Song. It mentions that this creature can use bardic music as many times per day as it would like. Of course, it requires a Will save in stressful situations like combat, but we can ensure that our Will saves are plenty high (cloak of resistance, decent WIS, etc.). Congratulations, you now have an endless bardic music battery to fuel your bardic/seeker music abilities. That's not good enough, though--if we add in Lyric Spell, we can burn some of our (infinite) bardic music uses to cast (infinite) spells. Though the effect will end eventually, and it can be dispelled, being a sorcerer with Versatile Spellcaster ensures that we'll be able to re-polymorph at the drop of a hat. Of course, we still have the bardic music class feature from Warrior Skald, ensuring two things:

We still qualify for Seeker of the Song in natural form.
Even when caught unaware or when out of polymorphs, we have a supply of bardic music to draw from.

Back From Whence You Came: As has already been pointed out, Note of Solitude nerfs itself by having a DC of 10+perform ranks, and shoots itself in the foot by providing your targets a bonus on their save equal to their Hit Dice. As written, it may be great to send away a horde of minor demons, but it won't do squat against bigger baddies unless they roll a one. Two things help to change all of that--Haunting Melody and Doomspeak. Using Combine Songs, we activate both Haunting Melody and Doomspeak (which I argue is a "bardic music ability" since it uses bardic music uses). Creatures within 30 feet have to save vs being shaken (a -2 to saves, among other things), and one creature within 120 feet has to make a higher save vs being "mega-shaken" (-10 to saves, among other things, for one round). Then, you drop one bardic music as a free action, meaning that you have only one active. Because of this, you can subvocalize Note of Solitude as a swift action, forcing creatures within 30 feet to save with (hopefully) a -2 penalty, whereas one creature must save with a -12 penalty. Also worth noting is that, as an extraplanar creature, Mich can choose to use Note of Solitude (a bardic music ability) on himself if he desires/needs to travel to Limbo, effectively making this ability a miniature version of Plane Shift.


Misc. Build Notes

While the original idea was to take all 4 levels of Ardent Dilletante before going into Warrior Skald, the only way to do so was to take both the Battle Sorcerer and Stalwart Sorcerer variants. Not only is it messy to take multiple variants, but the character would be losing out on some of his spellcasting. Only later did I realize that Warrior Skald provided the martial weapon proficiency I needed the whole time!
Speaking of Warrior Skald, I never realized how great this PrC was until recently. Though it requires Power Attack and Cleave, Mich still has some Strength to put them to use. However, the reason why I chose it over another PrC (like Troubador of the Stars) is that it grants all forms of bardic music, as long as you have the ranks for it. Others granted only inspire courage, or stacked with bard to determine which uses were available, but not the Skald. Instead, one level grants you all forms!
If your DM rules that Doomspeak does not work as above, switch the feat with Melodic Casting. That way, you can cast spells (like Wings of Cover) while using bardic music. Haunting Melody would mean that targets of Note of Solitude could still be at a -2.
Another alternative, especially if flaws are allowed, is to find a way to wedge in two metamagic feats and Metamagic Song, giving your infinite music yet another benefit. However, keep in mind that Metamagic Song only lets you boost a spell to the highest level you can cast. Still, tossing around Empowered Scorching Rays all day never gets old.


Gear to Consider

CHA-boosting items (+6 enhancement, +4 tome)
WIS-boosting items (+6 enhancement, +5 tome)
Slippers of Battledancing
Vest of Resistance
Songbow
Harmonizing Echoblade


Sources
Races of the Dragon
PHB
Planar Handbook
Races of Faerun
Savage Species
Complete Arcane
Complete Adventurer
Heroes of Horror
Champions of Ruin
Magic Item Compendium

true_shinken
2010-11-11, 06:32 AM
Dragons are always relevant.



TSORMAL SPELLBANE
"The Wyrm demands reverence, and you shall give it!"

This is the song of the Spellbane, Tsormal
Who was hunted and hated and feared by all
The mages and sorcerers, wizards et al.
Who did not revere the Wyrm of Tsormal.

The Dragon forgotten, great Phylerron he
Did speak unto Tsormal when he was but three
And told him of all of the things he could be
If only he'd slave to great Phylerron be.

When Tsormal was eight, learning hunting and war
He asked his patron what his purpose was for.
With his deep and sad voice, the dragon swore
That he would be so forgotten no more.

"I made this world's magic,
Yet I'm not adored.
Your men have forgot me
And claimed as their hoard
My gift, for which I
Ask only thanks."

Tsormal was fifteen, his voice had improved
Not an eye was dry, not a heart unmoved
When he sang by the fire, as he did every night
With the music resounding in warm firelight

Said he to Phylerron "is this your boon?"
The Wyrm was pleased that Tsormal had so soon
Come to his talents. That night, 'pon the moon
Shone a sign to the student: a musical rune.

Hunting and war, Tsormal left such base things
And turned to the sound of the mountain streams,
The cawing of birds and the flapping of wings
His voice, the tool of Phylerron's calling.

His voice grwew strong, and his power too
And he asked Phylerron what he could do
To further the Wyrm's ultimate quest
Of being acknowledged the best of the best.

Phylerron taught Tsormal of mages' flaws
How to beat them, and keep them from waving their claws
And Tsormal he learned to further the cause
But it drained his power: such are the laws.

At the Wyrm's instruction, he started to train
With the sword and the axe and the spear and the cane
The Way Sublime to Tsormal was plain
And he learned how to take and to recieve pain.

Soon he found out that he could use
The power of song strongly to infuse
His martial attacks with arcane wrath
Surely this, this was his path

In a city one night, hunting more of the same
Who said Phylerron wasn't all that he claimed
He heard a song sung that set him aflame
Primal music, the music that needed no name

Forgetting his quest, he sought out the bard
Who had been singing. Though he had heard
The sound very close, his search was hard
But he finally found him, aged and scarred

"Teach me this music," cried Tsormal, near wild
The old bard smiled and said "You're beguiled
By the music which built the earth and the sea
And predates the gods, the dragons, and me."

Tsormal didn't know if this bard spoke the truth
But he leapt into study with the vigor of youth
The sought out those places where the music was strong
He absorbed it, enjoyed it, and turned it to song.

Phylerron was worried: his earthly slave
Seemed far to involved in this thought depraved
A music 'fore dragons? Surely never be!
And yet Tsormal was not forced to agree.

Despite best efforts, Tsormal trained the more
And learned how to use this earth-making roar
The elements he learned how to use and avoid
Healing and health were later employed

But Tsormal had not yet forgotten the Wyrm
As so many others before him had done
And he turned his thoughts often to how he might do
Phylerron's work by this new avenue

He discovered that, if he played well,
He could disrupt the mages as they cast their spells
The better he played, the harder they fell
At Phylerron's work he now greately excelled

Yet Phylerron was not pleased with his slave
For the Wyrm had studied, and found that save
Bahamut the Platinum, the dragons were made
By this very music. The Wyrm was grave.

By this time Tsormal had mastered them all:
Fire Cold and Lightning were at his call
Acid and Sonic were weapons to him
And he traveled with no need to walk or to swim.

Phylerron appeared as Tsormal was in bed
Tsormal opened his eyes and he lifted his head
He asked "Aren't you proud? All the world knows your name!"
But the Wyrm bared his teeth, incensed by his shame.

Together they fought for a night and a day
Tsormal's strange music held the Wyrm at bay
And though he did not know why they fought,
Tsormal was the victor, and Phylerron was naught.

Fluff:

Tsormal was raised by a human tribe of barbarians. When he was a child, he was contacted by a dragon claiming to be Phylerron, the creator of magic, who aked him to seek out and punish those who used magic without the dragon's blessing.

Tsormal stands tall and this, but carries himself with a strength that is seen by all. His face is tanned and scarred. His hair was once blond but has faded to near white. His eyes glow with a golden light.

Tsormal wears a suit of armor that looks like green snake skales that allows him to move very rapidly, almost faster than the eye can see. Crossed on his back are two identical-looking glaives, whose sharp blades gleam in the light. A shield floats beside him, embossed with Phylerron's crest: a fire-snake and an ice-snake battling over a spellbook. Tsarmal is friendly to all who do not practice magic and to all who revere Phylerron. To all others, he is a deadly enemy, allowing only the briefiest of oppotunities to convert to the order of Phylerron.


Crunch:

Human Barbarian 1/Bard 5/Crusader 2/Jade Phoenix Mage 2/Seeker of the Song 10
{table=head]Level|Class|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Skills|Feats|Class Features

1st|Dragon Totem Barbarian 1|
+1|
+2|
+0|
+0 |Handle Animal 4, Listen 4, Perform(sing) 2, Survival 4|Combat Reflexes, Blind-FightB, Stand StillB|Illiteracy, Favored Enemy(Arcanists)

2nd|Savage Bard 1|
+1|
+3|
+0|
+2 |Perform(sing) +3(5), Spellcraft 2 |-|Bardic Music, Bardic Knowledge, Countersong, Fascinate, Inspire Courage +1

3rd|Savage Bard 2|
+2|
+3|
+1|
+3 |Perform(sing) +1(6), Knowledge(history) 2, Knowledge (religion) 2| Skill Focus (Perform[Sing]) | -

4th|Savage Bard 3|
+3|
+4|
+1|
+3 |Perform(sing) +1(7), Knowledge(arcana) 6| - | Inspire Competence, Constitution +1

5th|Savage Bard 4|
+4|
+4|
+1|
+4 |Perform(sing) +1(8), Concentration 6| - | -

6th|Savage Bard 5|
+4|
+5|
+2|
+4 |Perform(sing) +1(9), Knowledge(arcana) +3(9) Concentration +1(7)|Mage Slayer| -

7th|Crusader 1|
+5|
+5|
+2|
+4 |Perform(sing) +1(10), Knowledge(arcana) +1(10), Concentration +1(8)| - | Furious Counterstrike, Steely Resolve 5

8th|Crusader 2|
+6|
+6|
+2|
+5 |Perform(sing) +1(11), Knowledge(arcana) +1(11), Concentration +1(9)| - | Indomitable Soul, Constitution +1

9th|Jade Phoenix Mage 1|
+7|
+6|
+3|
+5 |Perform(sing) +1(12), Knowledge(arcana) +1(12)| Pierce Magical Protection| Arcane Wrath, Rite of Waking

10th|Jade Phoenix Mage 2|
+8|
+7|
+3|
+5 |Perform(sing) +1(13), Knowledge(arcana) +1(13) | - |Mystic Phoenix Stance

11th|Seeker of the Song 1|
+9|
+7|
+3|
+6 |Perform(sing) +1(14)| - |Rapture of the Song (+2 AC), Seeker Music, Burning Melody

12th|Seeker of the Song 2|
+10|
+7|
+4|
+6 |Perform(sing) +1(15)| Bonus Essentia | Combine Songs, Song of Unmaking, Strength +1

13th|Seeker of the Song 3|
+11|
+8|
+4|
+7 |Perform(sing) +1(16)| - |Dirge of Frozen Loss

14th|Seeker of the Song 4|
+11|
+8|
+4|
+7 |Perform(sing) +1(17)| - |Rapture of the Song (+2 saves), Song of Life

15th|Seeker of the Song 5|
+12|
+8|
+5|
+8 |Perform(sing) +1(18)| Pierce Magical Concealment|Subvocalize, Anthem of Thunder and Pain

16th|Seeker of the Song 6|
+13|
+9|
+5|
+8 |Perform(sing) +1(19)| - |Hymn of Spelldeath, Strength +1

17th|Seeker of the Song 7|
+14|
+9|
+5|
+9 |Perform(sing) +1(20)| - |Rapture of the Song (DR 2/-), Ballad of Agony Reborn

18th|Seeker of the Song 8|
+14|
+9|
+6|
+9 |Perform(sing) +1(21)|Favored Power Attack|Aria of Everywhere

19th|Seeker of the Song 9|
+15|
+10|
+6|
+10 |Perform(sing) +1(22)| - |Dirge of Songdeath

20th|Seeker of the Song 10|
+16|
+10|
+6|
+10 |Perform(sing) +1(23)| - |Rapture of the Song (freedom of movement), Note of Solitude, Strength +1[/table]

Class Variants
Barbarian: As a Dragon Totem (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#dragonTotemClassFeatur es) Barbarian, traded Fast Movement, Uncanny Dodge, and trap sense for the Blind-Fight feat
Barbarian: Traded rage (and improvements) for favored enemy and archery combat style, per UA (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#barbarian). Then traded normal favored enemy for favored enemy (arcanists), using the Arcane Hunter ACF from Complete Mage p 32.
Bard: Used the Savage Bard (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#bardVariantSavageBard) variant

Bard Spells Per Day
{table=head]Level|0th|1st|2nd

1st|-|-|-

2nd|2|-|-

3rd|3|0|-

4th|3|1|-

5th|3|2|0

6th|3|3|1

7th|3|3|1

8th|3|3|1

9th|3|3|1

10th|3|3|2

11th-20th|3|3|2

[/table]

Bard Spells Known
{table=head]Level|0th|1st|2nd|Suggested Spells

1st|-|-|-|-

2nd|4|-|-| Know direction, minor disguiseSpC, open/close, stickSpC

3rd|5|2|-| Dancing lights, endure elements, swift invisibilitySpC

4th|6|3|-| Detect magic, swift expeditious retreatSpC

5th|6|3|2| Dissonant chantSpC, swift flySpC

6th|6|4|3| Identify, know vulnerabilitiesSpC

7th|6|4|3| -

8th|6|4|3|-

9th|6|4|3|-

10th|6|4|3|-

11th-20th|6|4|3|-
[/table]

Crusader Maneuvers and StancesKnown:
{table=head]Level | Maneuvers| Stances
7 | Crusader's Strike (Devoted Spirit), Foehammer (Devoted Spirit), Leading the Attack (White Raven), Stone Vise (Stone Dragon), Tactical Strike (White Raven)| Martial Stance (Devoted Spirit)
8 | - | Thicket of Blades (Devoted Spirit)
9 | Death Mark (Desert Wind) | -
10| - | Mystic Phoenix Stance (Special)
[/table]

Starting Ability Scores: Strength 16, Dexerity 16, Constitution 12, Intelligence 12, Wisdom 10, Charisma 14 (32 pt buy)
Ending Ability Scores (no items): Strength 19, Dexterity 16, Constitution 14, Intelligence 12, Wisdom 10, Charisma 14

true_shinken
2010-11-11, 06:34 AM
Now for the second part...


Tactics

Level 1: To begin with, Tsormal is a mix of Barbarian and Ranger, with Stand Still and Combat Reflexes to carry the day. At this point, Tsormal can force enemy spellcasters to make concnetration checks to cast defensively by moving adjacent to them while wielding a reach weapon, since they cannot move away without provoking an attack of opportunity.

Levels 2-5:Tsormal gains Bard casting and bardic music, allowing him to buff his party as well as himself. The spell choices made for Tsormal depend heavily on whether the campaign will include these levels, as at this point he still has full caster levels.

Level 6: First Sweet Spot At this point Tsormal starts to specialize. He takes a -4 penalty to his caster level, making his level-dependent spells far less valuable. If possible, he should start retraining his spells to ones that do not have a caster level component (the Swift versions of spells like expeditious retreat, invisibility, and fly are excellent choies). However, he gains his first caster lockdown ability, namely the ability to prevent casters from casting defensively. By getting armor spikes and wielding a reach weapon, he can move next to a caster and enure that the caster will either provoke an AoO from casting, provoke an AoO from moving out of Tsormal's threatened area, or be unable to cast that round.
Stat Block

Tsormal Spellbane
Medium Humanoid(human)
Initiative+3; Speed 30 ft.
AC 19 (+5 armor, +3 Dex, +1 Deflection)
HP 35 (5d6+18)
Fortitude +6 Reflex +5 Will +5
Base Attack/Grapple +4/+7
Attack Glaive +8 (1d10+5) and Armor Spikes +8 (1d6+1)
SQ Bardic Music 5/day, Inspire Greatness +1, Inspire Competence, Bardic Knowledge, Countersong, Fascinate
Skills Concentration +8, Perform([sing]) +14
Feats Stand Still, Blind-Fight, Combat Reflexes, Mage Slayer, Skill Focus(Perform[sing])
Abilities Str 16, Dex 16, Con 13, Int 12, Wis 10, Cha 14
Possessions +1 Chain Shirt with masterwork armor spikes, +1 Glaive, Ring of Protection +1


Levels 7-8: Tsormal starts getting a little more serious about his melee capabilities, He gains some maneuvers to help his allies and him. At level 8 he picks up the Thicket of Blades stance, which means taht he can now lock down even more spellcasters. Now, if he's wielding a reach weapon and armor spikes, he can keep casters up to 10 feet away from casting, since they can't 5-foot step out of his threatened area.

Levels 9-10: Second Sweet Spot By entering into Jade Phoenix Mage, Tsormal takes advantage of another channel for his spell slots (especially since he just took another -4 hit to his caster level). Now he can burn any of his spells to gain a +4 on one attack roll and an extra 1d10 points of damage on one attack. Even his cantrips give him a +4 bonus on his attack roll, which he can use to fuel Power Attack if he as located a set of Serpent Armor by this point. This option, combined with his Pierce Magical Protection feat, more than makes up for his medium-high BAB. For added fun, alter self, polymorph, and similar spells, when used to transform into a creature with a natural armor bonus, might be dispelled by the use of this feat, depending on the DM's interpretaion.

Tsarmal can Power Attack essentially every attack versus a mage wince he will be ignoring all magical AC boosts from spells.

Stat Block

Tsormal Spellbane
Medium Humanoid(human)
Initiative+3; Speed 30 ft.
AC 17 (+3 armor, +3 Dex, +1 Deflection)
HP 67 (5d6+2d10+2d6+32)
Fortitude +8 Reflex +6 Will +6
Base Attack/Grapple +8/+11
Attack Glaive +12 (1d10+5) and Armor Spikes +12 (1d6+2)
SQ Bardic Music 5/day, Inspire Greatness +1, Inspire Competence, Bardic Knowledge, Countersong, Fascinate, Furoius Counterstrike, Steely Resolve 5, Indomitable Soul, Arcane Wrath, Rite of Waking, Mystic Phoenix Stance
Skills Concentration +10, Perform([sing]) +18
Feats Stand Still, Blind-Fight, Combat Reflexesitem, Mage Slayer, Skill Focus(Perform[sing]), Pierce Magical Protection
Abilities Str 16, Dex 16, Con 14, Int 12, Wis 10, Cha 14
Possessions Serpent Armor with +1 armor spikes, +1 Binding Glaive, Ring of Protection +1


Levels 11-15: Now Tsormal enters Seeker of the Song and starts using his special abilities. He begins gaining songs that will protect from elemental damage. While the amount resisted is not particularly high, it is useful when facing multiple small creatures of the same type. His Rapture of the Song abilities have the advantage of being completely passive, and since Tsormal will practically always be singing one song or another, they can be thought of as permanent bonuses. His Song of Unmaking, like his resistance songs, work best asgainst large groups of smaller constructs, which are sometimes found as servants of mages. The Song of Life is great when fighting powerful undead or animals with diseases and poisons and essentially negates their abilities. The Song of Life refrain is problematic in that it requires a stadard action to touch the target and a swift action to activate the refrain, leaving no action to maintain the Song of Life. Tsormal avoids this by using Harmonizing Armor Spikes that vibrate with his singing and maintain the Song of Life for him. This, combined with Combine Songs, allows Tsormal to maintain up to three bardic music effects at once, with Subvocalize at level 5 allowing him to switch out some of the effects if he needs to. The Pierce Magical Concealment feat helps to avoid common magical defenses, such as mirror image, blur, and displacement. Finally, his eeker music refains give him plenty of attack options, once again keyed toward dealing with lots of little creatures.

Level 16: Third Sweet Spot It is at this point that Tsormal truly becomes dangerous to spellcasters by using his Hymn of Spelldeath. He can use his Perform check as the DC for casting any spell, even silent, quickened, stilled, or defensively cast spells. Since the Hymn does not require castign defensively, COmbat Casting (a common prereq feat) is of no help. Between Skill Focus, his Harmonizing armor spikes, and likely having a higher Cha than his opponent has Con, Tsormal will have around a +8 advantage in the skill check, corresponding to an 80.5% chance of causing the enemy caster to fail. Furthermore, there is no range limit except that the caster must be able to hear Tsomal perform. This leaves two ways of avoiding Tsormal's Hymn: Deafness or immunity to mind-affecting abilities. Deafness carries its own penalty including a 20% chance of spell failure for verbal-component spells. Tsormal has no way of avoiding general mind-affecting immunity, but his Requiem feat allows him to affect all undead, including the Lichs and Necropolitans that are so common among spellcasters.

In summary, as long as Tsarmal is within melee range of a caster, the mage cannot cast unless it first succeeds on a Concentration check that he ahas a very good chance of failing, then avoiding Tsarmal's Attack of Opportunity, wich none of his magical enhancments to AC or miss chances will apply against, or making a concentration check against Tsarmal's damage. He can't move away without provoking an attack of opportunity, either. In short, Tsarmal makes casting hard.

The Hymn's requiem gives another means of dealing with magical defenses. Between Tsarmal's Greater Dispelling Glaives and this refrain, magical barriers are only a temporary problem.

His other seeker music abilities help him deal with the spellcaster's minions, incluing elementals and constructs. His area of effect attacks can take ouot multiple enemies, and his Anthem of Thunder and Pain refreain is an exremely reliable 10d6 points of damage with the capability of taking out many smaller creatures.

At this point Tsarmal can benefit from a few key team members. A cleric to cast Greater Magic Weapon and Greater Magic Vestments will be extremely helpful, and the stat block below assumes Tsarmal is able to get +4 versions of both. Warlocks, Dragonfire Adepts, and Meldshapers are in Tsarmal's party, as none of their abilities are affected by his Hymn of Spelldeath. If Tsarmal gets Enlarge person on him, things get even better, as not only will his damage increase but his reach will make it even harder for mages to get away from him.

Note that Tsarmal is still a viable combatant when not facing mages. He has multiple Supernatural abilities that protect him and his allies or deal damage to their enemies.

Stat Block

Tsormal Spellbane
Medium Humanoid(human)
Initiative+4; Speed 30 ft.
AC 28 (+6 armor, +4 Dex, +3 Natural +3 Deflection +2 insight)
HP 116 (13d6+2d10+60)
Fortitude +19 Reflex +16 Will +16
Base Attack/Grapple +13/+20
Attack Glaive +23/+18/+13 (1d10+13) or Armor Spikes +24 (1d6+6)
Attack vs. Mages Glaive +25/+20/+15 (1d10+2d6+17) or Armor Spikes +23 (1d6+8)
Attack OptionsBurning Melody Refrain (DC 29), Dirge of Frozen Loss Refrain (DC 29), Anthem of Thunder and Pain Refrain (+17 ranged touch attack), Power Attack, Combat Reflexes, Peirce MAgical Protection, Pierce Magical Concealment
SQ Bardic Music 11/day, Inspire Greatness +1, Inspire Competence, Bardic Knowledge, Countersong, Fascinate, Furoius Counterstrike, Steely Resolve 5, Indomitable Soul, Arcane Wrath, Rite of Waking, Mystic Phoenix Stance, Rapture of the Song (+2 AC, +2 saves), Combine Songs, Subvocalize
[b]Seeker Music[b] Burning Melody, Song of Unmaking, Dirge of Frozen Loss, Song of Life, Anthem of Tunder and Pain, Hymn of Spelldeath
Skills Perform([sing]) +29
Feats Power Attack, Stand Still, Blind-Fight, Combat Reflexesitem, Mage Slayer, Skill Focus(Perform[sing]), Pierce Magical Protection, Pierce Magical Concealment, Requiem
Abilities Str 22, Dex 18, Con 16, Int 12, Wis 10, Cha 20
Possessions Serpent Armor (+4 GMV) with +1 (+4 GMW) Harmonizing Binding Armor Spikes, 2 +1 (+4 GMW) Greater Dispelling Binding Magebane Glaives, Cloak of Charisma +6, Belt of Strength +4 and Health +2, Gloves of Dexterity +2, Amulet of Natural Armor +3, Ring of Protection +3, Vest of Resistance +5, 2 Anklets of Translocation,
Perform([Sing]) Check:
+29 = 19 ranks + 5 Cha + 2 competence + 3 Skill Focus


Levels 17-19: At these levels Tsormal picks up his last two energy defenses as well as his best single-target refrain (Ballad of Agony Reborn) and the ability to teleport. The ability to teleport will be useful in the case that the mage is farther away from Tsarmal than he can get to in one move action. Teleporting will end Tsormal's turn, as per dimension door, but once he is there, the caster will have a tough time casting any spells. At 18th level, Tsarmal takes Favored Power Attack, allowing him to get a 1:3 ratio on hims Power Attack damage.

Level 20: Finally, Tsarmal reaches the final level of Seeker of the Song and gains the Note of Solitude. This ability is difficult to use, hence the significant boost to the enemy's save. However, it is still useful to Tsormal because many of the mage's summoned creatures will be extraplanar, as well as all of his called creatures. The Note is not useful when fighting one lage creature, but when facing many smaller creatures, such as the 5 Babaus or Invisible stalkers summoned by a Maximized Summon Monster IX, each of whom has only a 5% chance of making the DC 33 Will save necessary to avoid being sent back home.

Stat Block

Tsormal Spellbane
Medium Humanoid(human)
Initiative+6; Speed 30 ft.
AC 42 (+7 armor, +7 shield, +6 Dex, +5 Natural +5 Deflection +2 insight)
HP 222 (17d6+2d10+152); DR 2/-
Fortitude +24 Reflex +19 Will +20
Base Attack/Grapple +16/+26
Attack Glaive +31/+26/+21 (1d10+20) or Armor Spikes +31 (1d6+10)
Attack vs. Mages Glaive +33/+28/+23 (1d10+2d6+24) or Armor Spikes +23 (3d6+14)
Full Power Attack vs. Mages Glaive +17/+12/+7 (1d10+2d6+72)
Attack OptionsBurning Melody Refrain (DC 33), Dirge of Frozen Loss Refrain (DC 33), Anthem of Thunder and Pain Refrain (+22 ranged touch attack), Bllad of Agony Reborn Refrain (+22 ranged touch attack), Dirge of Songdeath Refrain (+22 ranged touch attack), Note of Solitude (DC 33) Power Attack, Combat Reflexes, Peirce Magical Protection, Pierce Magical Concealment
SQ Bardic Music 15/day, Inspire Greatness +1, Inspire Competence, Bardic Knowledge, Countersong, Fascinate, Furoius Counterstrike, Steely Resolve 5, Indomitable Soul, Arcane Wrath, Rite of Waking, Mystic Phoenix Stance, Rapture of the Song (+2 AC, +2 saves, DR 2/-, freedom of movement), Combine Songs, Subvocalize
[b]Seeker Music[b] Burning Melody, Song of Unmaking, Dirge of Frozen Loss, Song of Life, Anthem of Tunder and Pain, Hymn of Spelldeath, Ballad of Agony Reborn, Aria of Everywhere, Dirge of Songdeath, Note of Solitude
Skills Perform([sing]) +33
Feats Power Attack, Stand Still, Blind-Fight, Combat Reflexesitem, Mage Slayer, Skill Focus(Perform[sing]), Pierce Magical Protection, Pierce Magical Concealment, Requiem, Favored Power Attack
Abilities Str 30, Dex 22, Con 24, Int 28, Wis 16, Cha 20
Possessions Serpent Armor (+5 GMV) with +1 (+5 GMW) Harmonizing Binding Armor Spikes, +1 (+5 GMV) Animaed Heavy Steel Shield, 2 +1 (+5 GMW) Greater Dispelling Binding Magebane Glaives, Belt of Magnificnce, Amulet of Natural Armor +5, Ring of Protection +5, Vest of Resistance +5, 2 Anklets of Translocation, Manual of Gainful Exercise +5 (read), Manual of Bodily Health +4 (read)

Perform([Sing]) Check:
+33 = 23 ranks + 5 Cha + 2 competence + 3 Skill Focus




Variations

For an Exalted version, the Nemesis feat (BoED p44) makes for an excellent choice as early as 1st level if the DM interprets it to mean that you can detect any arcane caster or invoker within 60 feet.

You can avoid using armor spikes by picking up a spiked chain, though this requires another feat

An alternate build with a slightly more grapple-focused skill set, but requiring a mid-campagin alignment change, would be Monk 2/Bard 4/Crusader 2/Jade Phoenix Mage 2/Seeker of the Song 10.

A build without the barbaric influence, but unable to take Pierce Magical Concealment as effectively, is given by Bard 6/Crusader 2/Jade Phoenix Mage 2/Seeker of the Song 10. This build has the advantage of having third-level slots to get an extra 1d10 damage a few times a day.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-11-11, 08:37 AM
Wow, only five entrants?

*starts to look over*

Kesnit
2010-11-11, 09:11 AM
I'm rather sad Santana and Mich used such similar builds since they were both such great ideas. :smallfrown:

Quietus
2010-11-11, 09:55 AM
Since the builds are up now, I'd love to hear people's thoughts on what I was *going* to enter - the plan was bard8/dread pirate3/seeker9, with as much Inspire Courage boosting as I could get in there - With Song of the White Raven, a Badge of Valor, and Words of Creation, I'd be looking at +9 inspire courage, turned into 9d6 fire via dragonfire inspiration (silverbrow human base). With TWF from Dread Pirate, and 15 BAB at level 20, I'd be quite decent in melee, and I was hoping to channel the dragonfire down the Seeker's rays, particularly the Anthem of Thunder and Pain's refrain - 10d6 lightning+9d6 fire to initial, then 5d6 lightning+9d6 fire against up to three secondary targets is scary. The Acid one would be 10d6+9d6, followed by another 10d6 next round, and sonic 15d6+9d6 - and all of these rays would be as touch attacks.

On top of these, I'd also be carrying third level Bard spells, mostly buff or utility types. As far as flavor, I was going to use Princess Bride's "Dread Pirate Roberts", with a healthy heaping of Disney, to make a singing, dancing Disney pirate that had the ability to shoot people with rays of electricity, acid, and sound that were also on fire.

The problem I found with my build was that the closest ruling I could find for whether or not these rays would carry Dragonfire was as "Weaponlike Spells", which are specifically called out as not being viable for bonus damage from Inspire Courage. As a DM, if a player brought the build I was working on to me, I'd have laughed, told them it was a great idea, but the rules didn't support it.. so I couldn't feel right about bringing it to this competition. I'd love to hear thoughts on that build, though.

Amphetryon
2010-11-11, 10:07 AM
Wow, only five entrants?

*starts to look over*

We had at least two late scratches, according to the posts. There's also an outside chance that TS had some connection issue and has another build or three waiting to be posted.

WinWin
2010-11-11, 11:15 AM
noone used my idea...pity. I'll get to work scoring over the weekend.

OMG PONIES
2010-11-11, 11:22 AM
What was your idea, pray tell?

WinWin
2010-11-11, 11:29 AM
Nothing extraordinary. A sorcerer/exalted arcanist/troubador of stars/SoS. Perhaps 4 or 5 levels of the SI.

Background was going to be based around some 'celestial choir' and the 'music of creation'. Too saccharine for my tastes though.

kestrel404
2010-11-11, 11:58 AM
The big problem with Troubadour of the Stars is that both it and Seeker require you to be 10th level to enter - so every level of Troubadour is a level you're not taking in Seeker. With the judges grading so heavily against entries that don't have all of the levels in a secret ingredient, using more than one or two levels of Troubadour would be a really tough sell - and then the class is a 'dip', which incurrs its own issues.

Quietus
2010-11-11, 01:04 PM
The big problem with Troubadour of the Stars is that both it and Seeker require you to be 10th level to enter - so every level of Troubadour is a level you're not taking in Seeker. With the judges grading so heavily against entries that don't have all of the levels in a secret ingredient, using more than one or two levels of Troubadour would be a really tough sell - and then the class is a 'dip', which incurrs its own issues.

That was another part of the problem with my Pirate build - to get what I wanted, I had to go Seeker9. I don't feel losing the capstone would have mattered much, though looking back at it, I'd have two Perform skills maxed, and by the interpretation some have used, that would mean a DC of 56-HD on the dismissal effect, which is really solid.

OMG PONIES
2010-11-11, 01:36 PM
The big problem with Troubadour of the Stars is that both it and Seeker require you to be 10th level to enter.

You can fit it in nicely at 9th, but then you're stuck with a 1-level dip if you want to finish the SI. It's funny that none of this round's contestants snagged it. Last round, I heavily considered making Dymphna a Paladin 5/Vigilante 7/Troubador of Stars 6/Heir of Siberys 2 for access to celestial and sanctified spells. When I saw that this round involved bardic music, my mind jumped to Troubador of the Stars, but I steered away from it because I thought it would be a common entry and that it would be too close to Dymphna in flavor.

Amphetryon
2010-11-11, 02:01 PM
I was wondering if we'd see a Spellsinger, from RoF, myself.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-11-11, 02:37 PM
Rule query: Doesn't Dragonborn require the base creature to be humanoid?

kestrel404
2010-11-11, 03:14 PM
Rule query: Doesn't Dragonborn require the base creature to be humanoid?


Prerequisites: In order to be accepted as a suitable candidate, the supplicant must be non-evil and have an Intelligence score of at least 3.

The template version of the race also states that you keep your original type and subtypes - so I'd say that's a definitive no.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-11-11, 03:28 PM
The template version of the race also states that you keep your original type and subtypes - so I'd say that's a definitive no.
It says humanoid stock, even describes what humanoid stock in the dragonborn text. When you gain the template you become a Humanoid (dragonblood).

Where does it say you keep your original type and subtypes?

P.5
- The Platinum Dragon foreswore breeding creatures to oppose Tiamat's spawn, instead accept humanoid volunteers.

Such humanoids give up all their former racial identity are born anew. They become Dragonborn.

P.8 (right above the template)
The dragonborn children of Bahamut are unique race in that they are not born; they are reborn. Each one enters the world as a halfling, an elf, a human, or a member of some other humanoid race...

Keld Denar
2010-11-11, 03:33 PM
The only really wonky thing here is that Warrior Skald (and the above mentioned Spellsinger) is from a 3.0 book (Races of Faerun). Bardic Music was different in 3.0. MUCH different. It was one ability that scaled with ranks. 3.5 broke BM into several different features, each with its own entry. 3.0 and 3.5 bardic music shouldn't be allowed to mix together, given that major difference.

I know the rule that 3.0 material is legal in 3.5 if its not reprinted in another source, but there is a major disconnect in the mechanics between how the abilities from the two different editions work.

This isn't a slight against the maker, but it is something that judges should be aware of, for whatever its worth.

Pechvarry
2010-11-11, 04:16 PM
Tsormal's feats listed on the table don't seem to match up to his text. I don't know where Power Attack is coming from, Combat Reflexes is either picked up at level 1 or achieved via item (apparently both), and I'm not sure what he's doing with Bonus Essentia.

I'm a bit concerned about the Firre entries using bardic music to fuel bardic music feats. These are things that take bardic music uses, as opposed to being class features. If their interpretation is the correct one (and I'm not equipped to say one way or the other, honestly), then these builds could also simply pick up Lyric Spell (CAdv) and obtain unlimited spellcasting.

Amphetryon
2010-11-11, 04:22 PM
P.5
- The Platinum Dragon foreswore breeding creatures to oppose Tiamat's spawn, instead accept humanoid volunteers.

Such humanoids give up all their former racial identity are born anew. They become Dragonborn.

P.8 (right above the template)
The dragonborn children of Bahamut are unique race in that they are not born; they are reborn. Each one enters the world as a halfling, an elf, a human, or a member of some other humanoid race...

Speaking only for myself, I find both above quotes to fall into the realm of flavor text.

EDIT: My scores should be up before I go to bed. I just need to go back over them and make sure I'm satisfied I was consistent.

Thurbane
2010-11-11, 05:24 PM
FWIW, this is what the FAQ has to say about non-humanoids becoming Dragonborn:

Can a warforged become a dragonborn of Bahamut, and if so what are the racial traits it keeps from the warforged list?
Despite the misleading entry in the dragonborn racial traits that suggests that all dragonborn are humanoids, the only prerequisites for being reborn in this manner are a non-evil alignment and an Intelligence of 3 or better. Thus, there’s nothing stopping a warforged from undergoing this ritual and dedicating himself to the service of Bahamut.
Leads to some interesting ideas, about all sorts of weird and wonderful creatures becoming dragonborn...:smalltongue:

OMG PONIES
2010-11-11, 05:39 PM
Can a half-dragon or a dragon become a dragonborn? :smalltongue:

Thurbane
2010-11-11, 05:42 PM
My question is - say a 1/2 Ogre Becomes Dragonborn. Is his type now giant, humanoid or both (with the dragonblood subtype)? If dragonborn adds the humanoid type, could be a (cheesey) way to allow non-humanoids to benefit from Elnarge Person and similar spells.

true_shinken
2010-11-11, 05:52 PM
OK, I received a few PMs I thought I should share:

Tsormal noticed a typo in his build.

Namely, (I have Bonus Essentia listed as my feat for 12th level, but in the tactics section I make reference to Requiem. Could you possibly either replace Bonus Essentia with Requiem in the build or mention that that is a typo, that Bonus Essentia shouldn't be there and requiem should?

I wanted to get to you to answer a judge's (Pechvarry) query on my build.

First, as I think I mentioned in an earlier PM, Bonus Essentia on the table is an error, and should be Requiem.

Second, the Combat Reflexes feat is retrained to Power Attack after getting the Serpent Armor (which grants Combat Reflexes as a bonus feat)

Also, a word from Santana

The "+2 int" at level 4 of my build is a typo. It should be +1 int (the level 4 stat raise). I just don't want anyone to think I'm cheating or anything.

Also, to help the judges, here are the sources for various bits of my build:
Races of the Dragon - Dragonborn
Planar Handbook - Neraph
PHBII - Apprentice Feat
Tome of Magic - Binder, Improved Binding, Anima Mage
Book of Exalted Deeds - The Firre
Savage Species - Assume Supernatural Ability
Frostburn - Snowflake Wardance


We had at least two late scratches, according to the posts. There's also an outside chance that TS had some connection issue and has another build or three waiting to be posted.
Unfortunately, that's not it. Just got few entries.

Hm, I guess that's about it. Go judges! :smallbiggrin:
Also, I got no word from Strategos but I'm trying to get the person who made my avatar to make our trophies.

Pechvarry
2010-11-11, 06:23 PM
I'm not a judge, but I thank you for the clarification none-the-less, Tsormal-builder!

Grynning
2010-11-11, 08:55 PM
I'm getting to work on these now, but I may be distracted later, so it'll probably be Saturday night before the scores are up. Good job everyone...this is gonna be some interesting judging, I can tell already.

Edit: Shinken, could you see if Mich J Rana could provide a similar source breakdown to the one Santana gave? It'd help me out a little. I've got the others all figured out.

Also, about Santana - I can't locate the "Apprentice Entertainer" feat anywhere in the PHBII, nor can I find it in any reference websites. Can I get a page number or something?

Amphetryon
2010-11-11, 09:34 PM
I'm getting to work on these now, but I may be distracted later, so it'll probably be Saturday night before the scores are up. Good job everyone...this is gonna be some interesting judging, I can tell already.

Edit: Shinken, could you see if Mich J Rana could provide a similar source breakdown to the one Santana gave? It'd help me out a little. I've got the others all figured out.

Also, about Santana - I can't locate the "Apprentice Entertainer" feat anywhere in the PHBII, nor can I find it in any reference websites. Can I get a page number or something?

The Apprentice feats are in DMG2.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-11-11, 09:36 PM
Probably gave more high scores in the competition than have in any other. Bards always seems to bring out the awesome.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Kestrel Hath - 11.75 (2.75 average)
Originality - 2.5
Background is overly short and rather confusing. Could use some drastic elaboration. Paladin of Freedom/Bards are something seen often as they both are Charisma-based classes. Also no special tricks are really noted by the two classes combining.

Power - 3.25
While the synergy is useful from both being Cha based I see nothing especially powerful that isn't inherent in choosing the classes. The chosen feats help, but its a minor boost.

Elegance - 4
Give credit where its due, if the class has nothing else it has a sort of synergy.

Use of Secret Ingredient - 2
You use the secret ability to 10 levels, but not exactly sure why. Nothing in the build specifically calls for it or aids it especially. It's just there, useful and used, but no more than any other. For the most part nothing in this build catches my eye at all. In the dish that is the entry its a potato, whose place could be equally filled by any other starch.


Primal Vagabond - 15.5 (3.875 average)
Originality - 4
I have a soft spot for this character for some reason. May be the interesting selection of feats and beginning class choices. Also never seen anyone actually take Prestige Bard. It's not horribly original all told, but comfortably so.

Power - 3.75
He starts out strong and versatile, and continues on his way through much of the build. Nothing that screams Optimized, but sturdy.

Elegance - 4.25
All the bits go together very well, from class to spell selection.

Use of Secret Ingredient - 3.5
Don't see any outstanding use of it, but it melds well with the others and adds to the build like another PrC wouldn't.

Santana - 16 (4 average)
Originality - 5
I'm not sure I've ever award a 5 for Originality, but you got it. I'm loving me some monsters, but never come across a Neraph before. Dragonborn neraph is just out there. You're not the only neraph, but you are the only dragonborn one, so at least a bonus to the latter. I also finally thought to myself, 'Here is something we'll not see binders in.' Bzzz! Wrong! And yet... it works. Wasn't aware of a couple of those feats either. Then there is the very imaginative background. I enjoyed you coming to know of the song of existence through such a maelstrom. Makes perfect sense. May also be the only one who went into how they came to be connected with this music.

Yes, you may have used the same build idea as another, but the rest is enough to still keep you at a 5 in my book.

Power - 4
This is an extremely powerful build. It and another have the same idea, but I think you managed to take it a step farther than he and have the more truly optimized build.

Edit: Due to further study on polymorph am reducing strength slightly.

Elegance - 3
Hate to not give you anything here, but persistent spelling for a near permanent firre is jussst a little cheesy. Chin up, it got you a high power score.

Use of Secret Ingredient - 4
I think you about nailed its use and in fluff and crunch made good use of it. You didn't make it to 10 levels though, and I don't feel the last 2 are completely worthless, so will bump it down a .5


Mich J. Rana - 14.25 (3.625 average)
Originality - 3.75
Whoa, another Neraph? What are the odds? Well, not gonna dock you for being the second, but not going to grant a bonus like I might have. Use a few 3.0 sources I wasn't familiar with, but on the whole nothing particularly new that wasn't also done in this competition (didn't give the other points for it either). Not a bad background however.

Power - 4
The tricks, while not as extensive or powerful as your sister build are still nice and hefty and give him a distinct edge.

Elegance - 3
Everything works together, though the strange 3.0 mixes wouldn't likely make its way into my games. In the end it balances out to a neutral score.

Use of Secret Ingredient - 3.5
Everything meshes together satisfactorily.


TSORMAL SPELLBANE - 15 (3.75 average)
Originality - 3.75
Nice poem, and singing dragons is an intriguing idea I'd not thought of. Maneuver using bard is also somewhat interesting.

Power - 4.25
He's certainly got a lot of different bits going, and Jade Phoenix is a powerful PrC. Also has some massive AC and some pretty high HP.

Elegance - 3.5
I can see 1st level dip to get him into dragons, savage bard for singing dragon warrior, ok, crusader then melds into the fighting background and together you have phoenix mage. Little shaky when heading into the secret ingredient, but nothing too bad. The background and theme hold it together well for what would otherwise seem a whole lot of random dips.

Use of Secret Ingredient - 3.5
Thematically I can somewhat see its use in the build, though could see it equally well with more jade phoenix to a degree. Wouldn't have some of the tricks though, and it comes together in its own unlikely fashion. Bit of a misfit build, but I can appreciate what its going for.

Amphetryon
2010-11-11, 10:14 PM
As always, the judgments are about the builds, not the people who worked hard to put them together. As a long time participant in the Iron Chef, I have great respect for the amount of effort involved. Everyone who submitted a build should be proud.

KESTREL
Originality: Paladin is becoming very common in the Iron Chef’s meta, and is not unique within this contest, either. Bard/Paladin is a fairly common mix, given CHA focus is at least initially obvious, if not actually needed, for Seeker of the Song. Score: 2

Power: Paladin with below average STR is going to be tough sledding for a front-line type; even when Kestrel’s Bardic Music comes online, she’ll lag behind the damage curve for most of her career, arguably waiting until Divine Power at 18th level. Casters start to have reliable ways to create and stack miss chances by the time her Concentration-inducing Smite is available, so it’s not a highly reliable option even if the caster is an obvious and viable target. Battle Blessing is of limited utility with the small amount of Paladin Spells, and Sacred Healing is a weak choice, especially given the limited number of Turn Undead attempts available to Kestrel and that both her base classes can heal. With only 2nd level spells, Kestrel ends up lagging behind where a Paladin or a Bard would be, and in exchange picks up some blasting damage that is, at best, the ranged equivalent of her sub-par melee ability. Even the Sonic attacks are of limited use, and can be worked around with a 2nd level spell. Score: 1.5

Elegance: While some of the Feat choices are sub-optimal, and she might have more logically proceeded with Bard as the first class for Skills and Bardic Music, the progression is fairly straightforward. There are two issues here, based on my listed Elegance rubric. First, Paladin of Freedom is an Unearthed Arcana variant. Second, while you gave a list of source material, there is no citation for which Feat or ACF is linked to which book. That meant I had to go hunting through the sources to figure out where you got particular Feats. I won’t give the full listed deduction for this, because you at least provided a baseline. Nice use of the Italian musical terms, by the way. Score: 2.5

Use of Secret Ingredient: All 10 levels are taken, entered as quickly as possible without shenanigans. Kestrel needs Seeker of the Song to shore up ranged attacks and have some method of dealing with multiple foes. That said, Kestrel’s use of Seeker of the Song is neither especially thorough nor especially emphasizing the overall strengths of the build otherwise. Score: 3

OVERALL: 9/2.25


PRIMAL/MARKUS
(QUICK NOTE: What happened to your table? Was there a problem when you copy/pasted the code, or when you sent it in, or what?)

Originality: Rogue/Duskblade/Prestige Bard/Seeker of the Song is definitely different, although I thought we might see a Prestige Bard in this one. Score: 4

Power: Duskblade and Craven mesh for some reasonable damage at low levels; at mid levels and beyond, he starts to function a bit more like a Dragon Shaman than anything else, albeit a Dragon Shaman with an unusual recharge mechanic. Knowledge Devotion obviously helps in some instances. Score: 3

Elegance: Your backstory, while entertaining, isn’t a good mesh for your progression overall. Your progression is very reasonable, but it disconnects with the story presented. My listed rubric indicates a penalty for Unearthed Arcana, and I have to ding you a bit for presentation here, as there’s a standard format to which you did not adhere. Versatile Performer is taken very late, and feels tacked on. Lastly, in every campaign I’ve seen, you have to actually pick an alignment, not just list an either/or set of options. Score: 2.5

Use of Secret Ingredient: All 10 levels, taken on schedule for the apparent purpose of being able to blast things multiple times a day, given the number of Bardic Music uses highlighted. That makes for a fairly typical usage. Score: 3

OVERALL: 12.5/3.125


SANTANA
Originality: Entry via Anima Mage was not expected. Score: 4

Power: Santana is quite likely the most powerful character presented, although that is in spite of, rather than because of, the Seeker of the Song. Score: 4

Elegance: Whoo, boy. The Secret Ingredient is delayed too long, and cannot be finished pre-epic. You use Neraph for Assume Supernatural Ability abuse into Firre, just in order to qualify for the Secret Ingredient. It’s such a controversial method that you were compelled to include alternate means for Santana to enter Seeker of the Song, in fact. I’ve never allowed, nor seen allowed in a campaign (as opposed to a one-shot) that particular trick, outside of TO. At the very least, you’d have to work with the DM on this one well in advance, and your best bet is to hope the Assume Supernatural Ability shenanigans come about as a direct result of the DM’s story arc. Score: 1.5

Use of Secret Ingredient: You only took 8 levels, and would really have been a stronger, better character without it. Prematurely leaving Anima Mage in order to take Seeker of the Song is either a deliberate self-nerf, or the result of an extremely convoluted story arc. Otherwise, it’s only done to satisfy the Secret Ingredient for the contest. Score: 1

OVERALL: 10.5/2.625


MICH
Originality: I expected a Warrior Skald, but not on a Sorcerer chassis. Score: 4

Power: A Sorcerer with a Power Attack focus and a 10 CON could well have some problems at low levels. Much of Mich’s power comes from the Polymorph spell used on the Neraph (Outsider) race, but it is undeniable power, limited only by those things that would shut down the spell. The situationally useful ability to Doomspeak for a late-game boost is potentially handy, but very DM dependent. Score: 3.5

Elegance: Neraph abuse again, but at least this time it’s not required for entry into Seeker of the Song. Ardent Dilletante is a nifty little addition, with a fairly natural progression. The Polymorph shenanigans and use of the Firre’s song ability are hurdles to a good score, requiring a good working relationship with the DM and, probably, some specific in-game events. All in all, Mich fits about where I listed a middling point of Elegance. Score: 3

Use of Secret Ingredient: All the levels of Seeker of the Song were taken in (not surprisingly) consecutive order. They boost the primary shtick for Mich, but that primary shtick is either sub-par blasting, or largely contingent on Polymorph abuse, or both. Combined, these factors make for no more than a typical use of Seeker of the Song. That said, it would almost certainly have been better for Mich to focus on a different tactic, as a Sorcerer. Score: 3

OVERALL: 13.5/3.375


TSORMAL
Originality: A Bardarian Crusader is a fairly frequent feature of various D&D forums. So is a Mage-Slayer build. Score: 2

Power: The lockdown, anti-caster tactics that Tsormal uses becomes less effective as his spellcaster opponents become more powerful. Because all of his Perform checks are based off of Perform (Sing), a single 2nd level spell shuts them down, assuming superior mobility options haven’t already rendered the tactics moot. Finally, the writeup you provide indicates that your build only really functions well if there are no other spellcasters in the party who will be hurt by the Spelldeath hymn. Score: 3

Elegance: Two different forays into Unearthed Arcana here, but that’s not the most troubling part. When you swapped the Favored Enemy variant Barbarian to be Favored Enemy (arcanist) “using the Arcane Hunter ACF from Complete Mage page 32,” you ignored the text on that variant that requires Ranger. That means that Favored Enemy (arcanist) is an illegal element of your build without DM fiat. Feat retraining - as the note posted by true_shinken indicates was your intent - is not readily available in many campaigns, and relying on it for a build feels inelegant to me. Score: 2

Use of Secret Ingredient: It seems the focus of your build is around being a Mage-Slayer, which you do adequately. However, only one aspect of Seeker of the Song influences that trick, and it’s obtained at 6th level. More levels of Jade Phoenix Mage would have made for a considerably stronger character overall, leaving the rest of the Seeker of the Song levels feeling tacked on. Score: 3

OVERALL: 10/2.5

WinWin
2010-11-11, 10:36 PM
Thanks for the spoilers. I have to finish an assignment, then I'll get right on the judging.

I should be done Saturday afternoon or sunday morning AEST

Pechvarry
2010-11-12, 02:28 AM
TSORMAL
...

Bonus Essentia is listed as the 12th level Feat, with no method that I can perceive of using that Essentia, which makes it read as a wasted Feat.
...

See Shinken's note above -- Bonus Essentia is an artifact; it's supposed to be the Requiem feat.

Amphetryon
2010-11-12, 06:47 AM
See Shinken's note above -- Bonus Essentia is an artifact; it's supposed to be the Requiem feat.

That sentence was also an artifact. Hooray for irony.

true_shinken
2010-11-12, 07:14 AM
About Primal/Markus, the creator sent me two versions. I used the most recent, but both had scrambled formatting, unfortunatelly. :/
Excellent build, btw. I really liked all of the entries and it's shaping up to be quite a race for the 1st place!

Jumilk
2010-11-12, 06:03 PM
Hello people!
I've made several trophies for this round of Iron Chef.
Now there is a bronze trophy for the 3rd place and a crystal trophy for honorable mentions. I am also working on a badge for the judges and I hope you all enjoy it!
Good luck to all chefs and judges! :wink:

WinWin
2010-11-13, 01:02 AM
Kestrel Hath
Originality 3 Not exactly what I was expecting, especially including an ACF I had to dumpster diving for, but not remarkable when compared to the competition. Nicely put together.
Power 3 OK, but not remarkable.
Elegance 4.5 Short and sweet. Does seem a little vanilla though.
Secret Ingredient 2.5 Why SotS? Perhaps you have a good reason for taking the PrC other than it being the focus of the competition. I simply can't see how it adds to the character though (not a judgement, just an explaination). Perhaps a little more detail here would have helped me see what it adds to the character.
Primal Vagabond
Originality 5 Not what I was expecting. At All.
Power 3.75 Starts off Strong, then seems to taper off as the build progresses. Great for a campaign that will finish early.
Elegance 3.5 Prestige Bard is an optional rule for campaigns that do not normally include the bard class. Taking it is making an assumption about the campaign that may or may not sit well with the DM. This cost you a point on an otherwise tight build.
Secret Ingredient 3 A very front loaded character. Again I am inclined to ask why was SotS included. You reference a few class features, but don't explain how the PrC is essential.
Santana
Originality 4.5 Not what I expected. At all. I have to make a half point deduction here, simply because someone else used a few elements the same idea.
Power 4.5 Versatile with quite a few options. Unfortunately the character requires a bit of time to pick up momentum and a large chunk of it's power in later levels is contingent upon one spell.
Elegance 1 I imagine most DM's would allow you to play a Firre Eladrin racial class before they allowed polymorph abuse.
Secret Ingredient 3 I am torn here. Part of me wants to give you a 1. Another wants to give you a 5. I decided to split the difference rather than go into it too deeply.
Mich J. Rana
Originality 4 Unexpected, but contains a few choices that I thought would be common. I made a half point deduction here because your idea contains a few elements that are obviously not original.
Power 4.5 Not as versatile as some builds, but outsider polymorph adds a lot of potential here. While Firre is mentioned for the bardic music, other forms are obviously available. I like the use of Bardic music feats with combine songs and subvocalise, probably the strongest features of the seeker.
Elegance 3 Takes a while to build momentum. Some Dm's may balk at some of the sources used. Otherwise nicely put together.
Secret Ingredient 4.5 You take the class and make it your own. On the other hand...More levels of Sorcerer would probably be better in a campaign.
Tsormal Spellbane
Originality 4 I was expecting to see some ToB...Not with a mage slayer combo though.
Power 4 Focused, but can put the hurt down with decent resource conservation.
Elegance 3 Seems a little scattered in places, but progression is solid. Trading out the Favoured Enemy for a ranger ACF hurts you here.
Secret Ingredient 4 I don't know why you used all 10 levels here. Hymn of Spelldeath seems to be the capstone of the build. I would not have penalised moving away from Seeker after this was obtained.

Akal Saris
2010-11-13, 01:44 AM
Thank you for making the trophies, Jumilk!!

I'm sorry to see this contest went by so quickly - I had a rough build together, but then real life took over =/

I have to say, Tsarmal is my personal favorite, both for creating his own ballad and for turning SotS into a mage-hunter. The build looks like it would make for a strong NPC adversary as well.

My build-in-progress:
Sona Silverhair, Silverbrow Human Bard 3/Marshal 3/Crusader 4/Seeker of the Song 10
BAB +15, 25 songs/day

The concept: Every round just wanders around singing and off-tanking, with multiple auras to help the team win. Can subsume songs each round for a little energy dmg and start new ones, and also gets some dmg in from reach + AOO's.

Draconic Aura +4 (Lightning dmg DCs)
Draconic Aura +4 (Initiative & Spot)
Marshal Minor Aura +ChaMod (Cha-based skills)
Marshal Major Aura +2/+4 with item (Dmg)
Crusader Auras x2 (+dmg on charges and thicket of blades)
2 songs active (depends on situation, probably energy resistance quite often so one can be subsumed)
+2 att/skills/saves aura to everyone from admiral's bicorne

true_shinken
2010-11-13, 05:55 AM
Your build looks awesome as usual, Akal!

Amphetryon
2010-11-13, 08:59 AM
I wonder if we'd have gotten more contestants this go-round if folks knew ahead of time there would be four, rather than the customary two, trophies.

true_shinken
2010-11-13, 10:05 AM
Well, the last few ICs didn't even get any trophies :/
I believe everyone will enjoy Jumilk's trophies, though. They feature a familiar face, after all.

Also, I've decided the next secret ingredient will be a martial class. \o/
And... no current tally yet? C'mon, OMGPonies. By now people already know about your spreadsheet ^^

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-11-13, 10:20 AM
*mumble grumble*

Current Scores
{table=head]Entry|
VT (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9746878&postcount=111)|Amphetryon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9747131&postcount=112)|WinWin (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9753944&postcount=118)|Final Score
Mich|
14.25|
13.5|
16|
43.75|
P. Vagabond|
15.5|
12.5|
15.25|
43.25|
Tsormal|
15|
10|
15|
40|
Santana |
16|
10.5|
13|
39.5|
Kestrel|
11.75|
9|
13|
33.75|
[/table]

true_shinken
2010-11-13, 10:35 AM
Thanks for the tally, VT!

Well I believe it was alreayd pointed out, but since I got a few PMs about this, I'll make a note so that the last judge will know about it and maybe so people might discuss it:

Santana cannot actually bind 2 vestiges at once. His EBL is 9 only for determining which vestiges he can bind. For everything else, including how many vestiges he can bind at once, his EBL is 7. This is because Improved Binding only adds to your EBL for determining which vestiges you can bind.
As a spell with a range of touch, Polymorph is not a legal target for Persist Spell. Because of this, Santana only has access to the Secret Ingredient's class features for 8 minutes per casting. Including his base spells per day, bonus spell for high INT, and Exploit Vestige, Santana can still only use the Secret Ingredient for 32 minutes per day!

WinWin
2010-11-13, 11:48 AM
I think polymorphing is clever, but impractical for most games. For a 5 minute (or half hour) workday it is a cool trick, but otherwise a hinderance in a campaign. I did like the concept, though I think it would have been better served by qualifying normally as opposed to qualifying via a spell.

Most of the utility of outsider polymorph is wasted on one form in my opinion, hence my comment that Firre would have been a better racial choice.

I may have more to say when I sober up. Only to happy to modify my scoring if I have overlooked or misinterpreted something. It looks as though it is going to be a tight finish.

Grynning
2010-11-13, 12:50 PM
At work at the moment, but I will do my scoring as soon as I get home in 6 more hours.

Akal Saris
2010-11-13, 01:14 PM
Amp made an interesting point in his judging - for a T4 class that supposedly lacks versatility, paladin is an extremely popular class in our Iron Chef competitions. Without counting, I would guess that a paladin build has been in nearly every competition so far (in part because I've used it a few times myself!).

What does that say about paladin? Is it better than JaronK gives it credit for in his tier system? Is it simply preference among a small set of optimizers? Is it because paladin is front-loaded, so it gives a lot of goodies from 1-6, before we start in on the special ingredient? Or maybe the sheer versatility of so many ACFs and so many variant paladins?

Quietus
2010-11-13, 01:33 PM
I have a question - I'm likely to consider competing in the next Iron Chef round, if the secret ingredient catches my eye. When do they get posted? If I'd known ahead of time, I might have built up my Dread Pirate Roberts ... I'm actually regretting that I didn't submit it, because I think the combination of Dragonfire-inspired TWF with ranged touch ray and spell support would make for a versatile, if not super powerful, character.

true_shinken
2010-11-13, 01:42 PM
Amp made an interesting point in his judging - for a T4 class that supposedly lacks versatility, paladin is an extremely popular class in our Iron Chef competitions. Without counting, I would guess that a paladin build has been in nearly every competition so far (in part because I've used it a few times myself!).
I believe even the Cancer Mage competition had a Paladin!


What does that say about paladin? Is it better than JaronK gives it credit for in his tier system? Is it simply preference among a small set of optimizers? Is it because paladin is front-loaded, so it gives a lot of goodies from 1-6, before we start in on the special ingredient? Or maybe the sheer versatility of so many ACFs and so many variant paladins?
It's the front-loading and the ACFs, I believe. We get a lot of Paladins, but usually as dips.


I have a question - I'm likely to consider competing in the next Iron Chef round, if the secret ingredient catches my eye. When do they get posted? If I'd known ahead of time, I might have built up my Dread Pirate Roberts ... I'm actually regretting that I didn't submit it, because I think the combination of Dragonfire-inspired TWF with ranged touch ray and spell support would make for a versatile, if not super powerful, character.
We'll have the next secret ingredient up when this contest wraps up - which I believe will be very soon, since the judges were very fast this time around.

I'm taking suggestions for the next secret ingredient, btw. I want a melee class, but you could always persuade me otherwise. :smallcool:

On the subject of Santana's rules disputes, I got feedback from the creator:


Your math is wrong. Anima mage is a full progression class for both binding and casting. Binder 4 + Anima Mage 5 means that I've got effective binder level of 9, not 7, with the ability to bind 5th level vestiges (as an 11th level binder).


Argh. When I first started the build, I was assuming I'd use Alter Self - but the Firre is 8 HD so I switched to a polymorph base. Oh well, maybe next time.

Grynning
2010-11-13, 09:30 PM
Ok, judging done. I'm not going to spoiler mine since I'm the last to finish. I just skimmed some of the other judges stuff but I purposely didn't remember the scores to try to keep mine fresh. I liked the flavor of most of the entries, but damn, lots of rules wackiness in this contest. Good job to everyone once again, though, it was a pleasure.

This judging is dedicated to Amanda Palmer, my favorite IRL bard at the moment, who I got a +2 competence bonus from while typing this up.

Kestrel Hath:

Originality: 2.5

Paladin/Bard Devoted Performer is a fairly predictable build for this one, and nothing really jumped out at me. It's a very basic support/melee character, and the story was a little too short and generic to spice it up much.

Power: 3

Good synergy of abilities for the most part. The character basically covers the heal and melee support aspect of the bard quite well, though it suffers a lot in skill utility due to the large number of pally levels.

No spells known list for bard! Aaarrggghhh...please tell me what your bard is packing in that spell list, it could've given you a boost here.

Elegance: 3.5

Shenanigan-free, simple progression. I can't see anyone having a problem with the character per se, except that it needs more flavor.

Use of SotS: 2.5

You use it, sure, but you don't do a whole lot with it. No real combos pointed out, no real logical reason for the SotS levels over more bard or pally. I like it ok, but this character didn't make me want to try out the PrC. You need more effort to make something like Seeker of the Song really appealing.

SCORE:
Overall - 11.5
Average - 2.875


Primal Vagabond:

Originality: 3.5

Duskblade is an unusual entry to prestige bard, but it works well here, though using prestige bard was no surprise to help the weakened casting of the SI. The story is well done and helped me get into the idea of the character.

Power: 4

This character is fairly strong in melee and very playable at the low levels, and has enough to fall back on if the Seeker Songs aren't cutting it. Duskblade is a favorite of mine as a balance point for tier 3, and that's where I think this character falls for the most part, so you got the bump up to 4.

Elegance: 4

I like the way the build is put together, for the most part. I'm not really a huge fan of the Craven feat's flavor, but that's mutable (it's called "craven," and I for one wouldn't like a character who that word accurately described). I would have scored this even higher if you'd used the tables, they are much easier to read.

Use of SotS: 4

This character feels like it would be logical for them to go into this weird little "blaster bard" PrC, and you did work it into his origin story too (though it could've been developed a bit more). SotS fits in well here and contributes to the characters existing capabilities, so good job.

SCORE:
Overall - 15.5
Average - 3.875


Santana:

Originality: 4

I know we have two entries with the same trick to get into the class and the same LA +0 outsider race, but both threw me for a loop, and I won't dock either one for both having the same interesting idea. Also, AWESOME backstory, I liked reading that. Dragonborn is a very overused template, though, I deducted a bit for that.

Power: 3.5

I wanted to make this higher, but there are some illegal elements to the build, so the character wouldn't work quite as well as it should as presented. Still, it's a caster/binder for the first half of its career and when the SotS stuff is working, it works pretty well. You did point out some pretty cool ideas for using subvocalize too.

Elegance: 1.5

Unfortunately, I have to dock pretty heavily here. First, I'm not a fan of using temporary effects to qualify for things in the first place, and this one is pretty questionable, and of course, as addressed above, you can't persist polymorph, so for a lot of the day, you're not getting a lot of your class features. Additionally, while we discussed multiple interpretations of the Seeker of the Song's spell DC's, stacking ranks from different perform skills wasn't one of them, and I don't think any DM would let that fly. I gave this a 1.5 instead of a 1 because your story was so cool, though I didn't really get how binder fit in there.

Use of SotS: 2

While I could have marked down here again for the illegal elements of the build, I left it at 2, because you did put forth a very solid effort, and this character is very neat and fits the flavor of the class quite well. However, most of its abilities come from its entry classes and Anima Mage. Next time, get it as crunchy as it is fluffy and we'll eat it up, I'm sure.

SCORE:
Overall - 11
Average - 2.75



Mich J. Rana:

Originality: 4.5

Just like the entry above, yet so different. I like this guy a lot based on his backstory, he's like me in that he just wants to rock out and eat good food. Also, sent me googling for some of the stuff in this build....I mean, Ardent Dilletante, what the hell ass...

Power: 4

He's got spells, he can sorta melee, he's an outsider with polymorph. Seems like he could contribute quite well to a tier 3 party. Like some other entries, skills besides perform are neglected.

Elegance: 2

As I mentioned before, using polymorph to qualify is cheesy, and I'm not a fan. Also, lots of sources, and some damned obscure class levels. This would be hard to convince me to allow without some modification at my gaming table.

Use of SotS: 3

I like the idea of using the banishment song on yourself, I'd never thought of that, and definitely gives you a Seeker of the Song worth playing. Like the previous build though, the entry classes are really more the keystone than the SI here.

SCORE:
Overall - 13.5
Average - 3.375


Tsormal:

Originality: 4.5

A dragon worshipping, mage killing barbarian dude. Wasn't thinking I'd see that in this competition. That story was amazing, and bonus points for sticking to the rhyme pattern.

Power: 4

Pretty solid tier 3 entry into the class, he can fight, and actually has a decent shot at doing what he's supposed to do (killing casters).

Elegance: 2.5

I know you corrected the feat choice thing in the posts above, but still, double-check your build before submitting. I'm not opposed to taking favored enemy arcanists with the barbarian ACF, but some people might be. Jade Phoenix mage doesn't really fit here, I'd have liked to have seen something else, though I see why you did it.

Use of SotS: 4

Using the Seeker songs to go beat up wimpy mages is a pretty cool idea, I must admit. Nothing really takes away from using the primal music here, I liked this guy quite a bit.

SCORE:
Overall - 15
Average - 3.75

Private-Prinny
2010-11-13, 09:38 PM
As a spell with a range of touch, Polymorph is not a legal target for Persist Spell.

Seriously? :smallconfused:

I always thought Touch was a fixed range, since the range is independent of your CL. You learn something new every day, I guess. :smallsigh:

Amphetryon
2010-11-13, 10:18 PM
Amp made an interesting point in his judging - for a T4 class that supposedly lacks versatility, paladin is an extremely popular class in our Iron Chef competitions. Without counting, I would guess that a paladin build has been in nearly every competition so far (in part because I've used it a few times myself!).

What does that say about paladin? Is it better than JaronK gives it credit for in his tier system? Is it simply preference among a small set of optimizers? Is it because paladin is front-loaded, so it gives a lot of goodies from 1-6, before we start in on the special ingredient? Or maybe the sheer versatility of so many ACFs and so many variant paladins?

If I had to make a guess, I'd say it's a combination of the good saves you get from a small investment, coupled with a desire to do something 'unexpected' in an effort to snag some Originality. Note that some judges in past competitions have come out with criteria that indicated 'obscure' base classes like Totemist or Binder would not be sufficient on their own to count as original. It's possible, even probable, that at least a couple contestants figured that in with the fact that Paladin is generally under-appreciated outside of IC, and chose it for a sort of surprise factor.

The obvious issue with this strategy, to me, is that the surprise gets lessened considerably when it's repeated.

EDIT: The other reason I'd point to as likely to influence Paladin's popularity, is the need to make these (generally sub-par) Prestige Classes improve the overall build concept. If you've started your build off with a Specialist Wizard, it's usually hard to justify most of the PrCs featured in IC as anything other than taken for the sake of the contest. Paladins and Monks, which have limited benefits to them after 2nd level, get stronger with intelligent PrC usage in a way that many higher tier Base Classes to not.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-11-13, 10:30 PM
Final Scores
{table=head]Entry|
VT (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9746878&postcount=111)|Amphetryon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9747131&postcount=112)|WinWin (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9753944&postcount=118)|Grynning|Final Score
Primal Vagabond|
15.5|
12.5|
15.25|
15.5|
58.75|
Mich|
14.25|
13.5|
16|
13.5|
57.25|
Tsormal|
15|
10|
15|
15|
55|
Santana |
16|
10.5|
13|
11|
50.5|
Kestrel|
11.75|
9|
13|
11.5|
45.25|
[/table]

Gentleman, we have finished voting in less than 3 days. I believe that brings us dangerously close to being awesome.

*shakes each of your hands*

OMG PONIES
2010-11-13, 11:12 PM
Thanks to all the judges for posting scores so quick! Granted, we still have to leave time for any disputes, but this round was a well-oiled machine.

Grynning
2010-11-13, 11:22 PM
*returns handshake*
Thanks for compiling the scores VT.

By the way, I did want to say that though I gave Santana the lowest score in my judging, I feel like I should clarify that I did really like the concept and by no means thought the character was bad, it's just by my standards for this contest I couldn't give it higher elegance or use of the ingredient scores. The creator deserves an honorable mention for sure.

I really respect the chefs in this competition especially, because in this case, the SI was a really rough class to work with, even more so than Vigilante from the last one. Lots of bad editing, and just poor design overall really kind of sinks Seeker of the Song into nigh-uselessness, and I would homebrew my own version if someone ever really wanted to use it in a game of mine. This is like going on the real Iron Chef and getting lutefisk (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lutefisk) as your ingredient.

Pechvarry
2010-11-14, 02:24 AM
I considered entering so I could make a character simply named One Man Band, who could play 3 songs at the same time + dance. He'd play his own 3-part melody, tap-dancing rhythm.

Regrettably, he was pretty much the opposite of optimization.

Akal Saris
2010-11-14, 04:11 AM
Congrats to Primal and Mich! I thought all of the builds were excellent though :)

WinWin
2010-11-14, 07:48 AM
congratulations everyone. I look forward to the reveal.

true_shinken
2010-11-14, 09:35 AM
I was just about to make the reveal, but then a contestant asked to wait until Monday because he will have a few disputes.
Since we can't afford to put the wrong names in the trophies, let's just wait until this dispute issue clears up.

Congratulations on the judges for their lightspeed judging this time! It was the fastes I've ever seen. You guys are awesome.

About our honorable mention award, let's decide it by voting. PM me which contestand should get the prize and whoever gets more votes will get the crystal trophy (I've seen it and it's awesome).
I also saw Jumilk's judge badges and they are even more cool than I thought they would be.

Amphetryon
2010-11-14, 10:00 AM
I was just about to make the reveal, but then a contestant asked to wait until Monday because he will have a few disputes.
Since we can't afford to put the wrong names in the trophies, let's just wait until this dispute issue clears up.

Congratulations on the judges for their lightspeed judging this time! It was the fastes I've ever seen. You guys are awesome.
Thanks.

Sadly, I think the size of the contestant pool had much to do with our blazing speed. The day after the builds were posted was also a holiday in the USA, which probably helped judges in America.

Grynning
2010-11-14, 11:13 AM
Sadly, I think the size of the contestant pool had much to do with our blazing speed. The day after the builds were posted was also a holiday in the USA, which probably helped judges in America.

Holidays don't equate to days off for a lot of us, unfortunately. I was actually worried about getting mine done on time because I've still had work every day this week.

If there are any disputes about my scores, I'll be happy to field them, though I don't know how much it'll affect the final outcome.

true_shinken
2010-11-14, 04:58 PM
Okay, a few rules disputes.
Vorpal Tribble:
- Mich's background discusses his exposure to Seeker Music, though another entry was noted (and scored) as the only one to mention it.
- The explanation of Mich's Use of the Secret Ingredient score is a bit brief. Can you please elaborate on the reason he scored lower than a character that did not conplete the SI, especially when Mich had noted uses and combinations of every class feature (including the frustrating capstone).

Grynning
- Mich doesn't use firre polymorph to qualify for the SI--he does that just fine on his own.
- You mentioned that Mich uses too many sources. However, the build itself only uses 9 sources (the same number as Markus/Primal)--MIC was included only for potential gear, which was not an essential part of the build. For consistency's sake, I would ask you to adjust your score.
The entry classes used provide only two things: bardic music/perform skills, and limited spellcasting to support the SI, which was the focus of the build.

I think that is all.



Seriously? :smallconfused:

I always thought Touch was a fixed range, since the range is independent of your CL. You learn something new every day, I guess. :smallsigh:
I thought that as well, but it is specifically adressed in the errata, I believe.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-11-14, 08:19 PM
Mich's background discusses his exposure to Seeker Music, though another entry was noted (and scored) as the only one to mention it.
Mentioning it was not a part of the score. My comment was a nod of appreciation.

However, still not entirely certain where Mich learned the music even after several reads unless it's this:
"He recounted how he had the rare privilege of meeting one, and he sang me a mere fragment of its melody. The music seemed to vibrate my very bones; I do not exaggerate when I say it was the most beautiful thing I have ever heard."

I mean, that's fine if it's the case, but if I had been judging based on where it was learned, listening to a twirling riptide in the fabric of existence for the music of creation trumps the relative equivalent of someone humming a few bars of this music. The former also makes more sense thematically, hearing the song from a potential source itself.
Having learned it from another singing it is well and good, just not as noteworthy.


- The explanation of Mich's Use of the Secret Ingredient score is a bit brief. Can you please elaborate on the reason he scored lower than a character that did not conplete the SI, especially when Mich had noted uses and combinations of every class feature (including the frustrating capstone).
Well, would have bumped Santana's down a full point if they were good, solid capstones. As such, they weren't but as I said, not completely useless, so a .5 instead.

I really liked the story of both, though Mich's in my own mind's eye reading it felt like he'd taken it to go along with the Ardent. Someone obsessed with sensations, he just focused on music in the end because someone sang to him, and it was the most sensational of the senses so far. Wasn't a life calling though.

Just my own personal feeling while reading it. Enough for a .5 difference.

Grynning
2010-11-15, 12:44 AM
Mich doesn't use firre polymorph to qualify for the SI--he does that just fine on his own.
- You mentioned that Mich uses too many sources. However, the build itself only uses 9 sources (the same number as Markus/Primal)--MIC was included only for potential gear, which was not an essential part of the build. For consistency's sake, I would ask you to adjust your score.
The entry classes used provide only two things: bardic music/perform skills, and limited spellcasting to support the SI, which was the focus of the build.

You are correct, he does still qualify for the SI without polymorph. It is using a dip in a 3.0 class, one which you point out yourself is very heavily front loaded with power (indicating it wasn't very well thought out), but I will adjust up by .5 on elegance.

I will not adjust higher based on sources, as you do draw from two setting specific books that non-FR players (myself included) are unlikely to own or have even looked at before, the Planar Handbook (another one that's pretty uncommon), and 2 different 3.0 sources. There's just too much stuff going into this one from disparate, unconnected material. All PV used from most of his sources were feats, and feats that are commonly known to most optimizers. You'll note that his originality score was lower than yours, however. As I said in my criteria, originality is good, but if it forces me to accept that I'm not going to be able to see the source in time to judge the contest, I have to penalize a bit.

Yes, Primal uses a couple of FR sources too, however, they aren't 100% necessary to his build. Craven and Artist could both easily be swapped out for other feats without a lot of impact on the character. All his class levels are from Core and completes, as are the majority of his other feats.

Final Elegance Score: 2.5, for a total score of 14

OMG PONIES
2010-11-15, 10:40 AM
Adjusted Final Scores

{table=head]Name|Place|Total|Average
Markus VanDerHomme|GOLD|58.75|3.67
Mich J Rana|SILVER|57.75|3.61
Tsormal Spellbane|BRONZE|55|3.44
Santana|Fourth|51.5|3.22
Kestrel Hath|Fifth|45.25|2.83[/table]

With that, I think we're ready for the reveal of our Chefs, the trophies, and ICO XV!

true_shinken
2010-11-15, 10:54 AM
I'll contact Jumilk about the trophies.
I'm still not set on the next secret ingredient, so give me suggestions. :smallbiggrin:

OMG PONIES
2010-11-15, 11:28 AM
Scion of Tet-Em-Nu or whatever...the rhinoceros-focused prestige class. Or heck, a Dwarven Defender! In the meantime, can we get a reveal of the chefs?

Amphetryon
2010-11-15, 11:38 AM
Scion of Tet-Em-Nu or whatever...the rhinoceroshippopotamus-focused prestige class. Or heck, a Dwarven Defender! In the meantime, can we get a reveal of the chefs?Fixed That For You. :D

Akal Saris
2010-11-15, 12:56 PM
I'll suggest Kensai from C. Warrior, pg. 49. There are several interesting abilities thrown in there, and the customizable weapon means that each optimizer will have 10 levels of different abilities to focus on.

Pechvarry
2010-11-15, 01:07 PM
Pretty much ANYTHING out of the Planar Handbook if it's not too obscure -- Defiant, Doomlord, and especially Fatemaker. I would say Ardent Dilettante, but since that's actually been in the ICO Challenge once or twice, it may not be as swell. Visionary Seeker could be good, too. Kinda barren on class features but the ones it has are pretty cool and unique.

I also like Tactical Soldier but Miniature's Handbook is really tumbling down obscurity's own personal rabbit hole.

cd4
2010-11-15, 01:08 PM
I'll suggest Kensai from C. Warrior, pg. 49. There are several interesting abilities thrown in there, and the customizable weapon means that each optimizer will have 10 levels of different abilities to focus on.

And with the restriction of being lawful it allows someone to easily use a paladin to enter. :smallbiggrin: You only need to have int 10 and 5 levels of paladin to get the requirements.

The fun and games will be the oath you swear for the code.

Tvtyrant
2010-11-15, 01:36 PM
Have we done Truenamer? Or Survivor?

true_shinken
2010-11-15, 01:53 PM
Have we done Truenamer? Or Survivor?

Truenames is a base class and Survivor has, what, 3 levels? I believe both wouldn't be good secret ingredients.

Also, guys - expect the reveal and the trophies in a few hours. The secret ingredient is coming right behind and I think most of you will enjoy it...
EDIT: It's a fan favourite and it's from Complete Warrior.

Dusk Eclipse
2010-11-15, 02:02 PM
Truenames is a base class and Survivor has, what, 3 levels? I believe both wouldn't be good secret ingredients.

Also, guys - expect the reveal and the trophies in a few hours. The secret ingredient is coming right behind and I think most of you will enjoy it...
EDIT: It's a fan favourite and it's from Complete Warrior.

Bear warrior.... frenzied berserker (we all love to hate it/find amusing ways to stop the frenzy)... or warshaper.

Amphetryon
2010-11-15, 02:25 PM
Knight Protector. :smallconfused:

Tvtyrant
2010-11-15, 02:26 PM
Truenames is a base class and Survivor has, what, 3 levels?

5, but the point is it gets no spells and no BaB progression. Just:Evasion, uncanny dodge, improved evasion, improved uncanny dodge and one other such thing.

Amphetryon
2010-11-15, 02:34 PM
5, but the point is it gets no spells and no BaB progression. Just:Evasion, uncanny dodge, improved evasion, improved uncanny dodge and one other such thing.

Thing is, here at GitP, the contests have been restricted to 10 level PrCs.

Tvtyrant
2010-11-15, 02:36 PM
Ah nevermind then. Shame, I wanted to see people trying to make that into something useful.

Thurbane
2010-11-15, 04:15 PM
Ah nevermind then. Shame, I wanted to see people trying to make that into something useful.
Yeah, I was in the same boat with Elemental Warrior - I'd really like to see it in the comp, but it's only 5 levels.

I'll throw out a vote for Ardent Dilettante - I've suggested it a couple of times, even though it has cropped up in the most recent comp.

I'll also second Tactical Soldier...maybe it's just because I've got nearly all of the non-setting specific 3.5 books, but I really don't consider MH that obscure...

true_shinken
2010-11-15, 08:26 PM
OK, now for the big reveal!

1st place goes to gbprime's Primal Vagabond!
2nd place goes to OMG Ponies' Mich J. Ranna!
3rd place goes to Bakkan's Tsormal Spellbane!
4th place and honorable mention goes to kestrel404's Santana!
Last but not least, 5th place goes to cd4's Kestrel Hath!

Thank you for competing and stay tuned on for the IC XIV trophies and IC XV very soon!

Jumilk
2010-11-15, 08:42 PM
Congratulations to all contestants! I really enjoyed the results even though my favorite build, Tsormal, didn't get the gold trophy.
I hope you all like the trophies because I had a lot of fun doing them and I want to do them again in the next Iron Chef. I also expect more contestants next time because when Shinken is happy he usually makes me happy as well. :smallwink: (I got a new dress! Yay!)

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1269/5179928663_6da5793970.jpg http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1440/5180529340_4102a65ba4.jpg http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4144/5179928861_492df78d5f.jpg http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1359/5180529622_3dddb57a0b.jpg

Here are the judge badges I promised.
http://img340.imageshack.us/img340/9908/medalhawinwin.jpg http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/8590/medalhavorpaltribble.jpg
http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/7370/medalhagrynning.jpg http://img543.imageshack.us/img543/7449/medalhaamphetryon.jpg

I tried to contact WinWin via PM for him to choose an avatar if he wanted but he didn't answer, so it stays like this.
You are all free to give me new dresses as well.
Kisses! (^3^)

OMG PONIES
2010-11-15, 08:42 PM
Congrats to all competitors! Kestrel, great minds or somesuch. And congrats to gbprime on a close victory.

EDIT: WOW! Those are some fantastic trophies/badges!

gbprime
2010-11-15, 09:19 PM
Wow, my first Iron Chef too. I'm humbled, thank you.

I usually aim for Tier 3 in any build, since it's widely acceptable under nearly any DM. Many DM's shy away from T2, and most outright flee from T1, so while I'm capable of going there, I don't. :smallamused:

And for anyone who is still interested at this point, here's the build using the right table. (I used the table, MS Word ate it, I resubmitted, it was still goofed up... and at that point it was 2 AM and I gave up and went to bed. Lesson learned.) Thanks for deducting only lightly for it.


Primal Vagabond ----- Male Human Rogue 2 / Duskblade 3 / Prestige Bard 5 / Seeker of the Song 10


Backstory

“I was lost once. I still am, I suppose… only now I know that’s where I want to be.”

Markus VanDerHomme (of the Lower South Side VanDerHommes) never really fit in well, even amongst his fellow ne’er-do-wells. He was well schooled in the family trades of acquisitions and security, and even showed a knack for the arcane arts, but he just never applied himself to any one thing. He drifted from uncle to uncle, taking the odd job when he had to, but he found that scowling at people and pointing sharp things in their general direction was far less rewarding than literally singing for his supper.

And he did have a marvelous singing voice. He had been approached by one of the region’s bards, but Markus had waived the fellow off, claiming he was nothing more than a talented hack with no real future in it. Still, he continued to sing for some spare coppers now and again… which is what got him drummed out of the family business. He was late for a job, and would have been forgiven had he been drunk in a bar someplace, but having been found SOBER in a bar and having a go at entertaining the patrons… that was the last straw. He would never amount to anything, and was sent packing.

And so his life went for the next few years. City to city, job to job, he was the scallywag, the tomb robber, the sell sword. His life nearly came to an end with that last job, as one of a small handful of caravan guards on a lonely stretch of road, staring down a charging pack of gnolls and outnumbered several times over.

But it didn’t end that day. Instead, it began... with one clear note. A soprano voice so pure it filled his heart with unnatural vigor, split the very fabric of reality, and laid many of the gnolls low with fire. As the remaining gnolls fled into the distance, Markus turned to the woman whose voice had such power and got out only a clumsy “How… ?”

“With practice,” she smiled. “Become a bard, and I could teach you.”

So when the caravan job ended, Markus wasted no time tracking down the bard who had once offered to teach him, and then the simple caravan traveler years after that. Life, it seems, had been telling him what his calling was all along, and Markus had finally learned how to listen.
Characteristics
s14 d14 c12 i14 w8 ch16

Increases into Charisma
Level Progression
Primal Vagabond
{table=head]Level|Class|Base Attack|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Skills|Feats|Class Features

1st|Rogue 1|
+0|
+0|
+2|
+0|Bluff 4, Climb 2, Hide 4, Intimidate 2, Listen 2, Knowledge (Local) 4, Move Silently 4, Perform (Sing) 4, Search 4, Sense Motive 4, Sleight of Hand 2, Spot 4, UMD 4|Artist, Craven|Trapfinding, Sneak Attack +1d6

2nd|Duskblade 1|
+1|
+2|
+2|
+2|Climb +1, Knowledge (Local) +1, Knowledge (Arcane) +2, Sense Motive +1| |Arcane Attunement, Armored Mage (Light)

3rd|Duskblade 2|
+2|
+3|
+2|
+3|Knowledge (Local) +1, Knowledge (Arcane) +2, Ride +1, Sense Motive +1|Combat Expertise|Combat Casting

4th|Duskblade 3|
+3|
+3|
+3|
+3|Knowledge (Local) +1, Knowledge (Arcane) +2, Ride +1, Sense Motive +1| |Arcane Channeling

5th|Rogue 2|
+4|
+3|
+4|
+3|Bluff +4, Perform (Sing) +4, UMD +3| |Evasion

6th|Prestige Bard 1|
+4|
+3|
+6|
+5|Knowledge (Local) +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +3, Knowledge (Religion) +2, Perform +1, Speak Language +1|Deadly Defense|Bardic Music (Countersong, Fascinate, Inspire Courage +1), Bardic Knowledge

7th|Prestige Bard 2|
+5|
+3|
+7|
+6|Gather Information +2, Knowledge (Local) +1, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Knowledge (Religion) +3, Perform +1, Speak Language +1| |

8th|Prestige Bard 3|
+6|
+4|
+7|
+6|Gather Information +2, Knowledge (Local) +1, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Knowledge (Religion) +3, Perform +1, Speak Language +1| |Inspire Competence

9th|Prestige Bard 4|
+7|
+4|
+8|
+7|Gather Information +2, Knowledge (Local) +1, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Knowledge (Religion) +3, Perform +1, Speak Language +1|Skill Focus (Perform)|

10th|Prestige Bard 5|
+7|
+4|
+8|
+7|Gather Information +3, Knowledge (Local) +1, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Knowledge (Religion) +2, Perform +1, Speak Language +1| |Inspire Courage +2

11th|Seeker 1|
+7|
+4|
+8|
+9|Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1|New Feats|Rapture of the Song (+2 AC), Seeker Music, Burning Melody

12th|Seeker 2|
+8|
+4|
+8|
+10|Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1|Knowledge Devotion|Combine Songs, Song of Unmaking

13th|Seeker 3|
+9|
+5|
+9|
+10|Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1| |Dirge of Frozen Loss

14th|Seeker 4|
+10|
+5|
+9|
+11|Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1| |Rapture of the Song (+2 saves), Song of Life

15th|Seeker 5|
+10|
+5|
+9|
+11|Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1|Extra Music|Subvocalize, Anthem of Thunder and Pain

16th|Seeker 6|
+11|
+6|
+10|
+12|Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1| |Hymn of Spelldeath

17th|Seeker 7|
+12|
+6|
+10|
+12|Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1| |Rapture of the Song (DR 2/-), Ballad of Agony Reborn

18th|Seeker 8|
+13|
+6|
+10|
+13|Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1|Versatile Performer|Aria of Everywhere

19th|Seeker 9|
+13|
+7|
+11|
+13|Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1| |Dirge of Songdeath

20th|Seeker 10|
+14|
+7|
+11|
+14|Diplomacy +2, Knowledge (Arcane) +1, Listen +1, Perform +1, Sense Motive +1, Spot +1| |Rapture of the Song (Freedom of Movement), Hymn of Revealing[/table]

Spells per day/Spells Known
{table=head]Level|0lvl|1st|2nd|Spells Known

1st|-|-|-|

2nd|3|2|-|Ray of Frost, Touch of Fatigue, Color Spray, True Strike

3rd|4|3|-|Shocking Grasp

4th|5|4|-|Rouse

5th|5|4|-|

6th|5|4|-|

7th|6|5|-|Inspirational Boost (If DM allows Expansion book Bard Spell, per description in Prestige Bard)

8th|6|5|-|

9th|6|5|2|Spider Climb

10th|6|6|3|See Invisibility[/table]
Level Highlights
Level 2 - This is where Markus starts his “career”. With a die of sneak attack and his craven bonus plus the occasional Color Spray, he’s scrappy in a fight, but lacks focus. A rogue with no trap skills, he’s more of a highwayman, and is rather unwilling to lay his life down for anything no mater the cause or the payoff. (The Craven feat at work again.)

Level 6 – After his epiphany, Markus is apprenticed to a bard, and has begun his studies in understanding people (speak language, knowledge religion, etc). But he’s not to be underestimated. With a Shocking Grasp to channel into a melee attack and an extra die out of Deadly Defense, he can add 5d6+6 to any damage roll, and thanks to his Artist Feat, he’s already looking at 4 uses of Bardic Music per day. Not bad for a newbie.

Level 10 – His bardic training caps out with +3 worth of inspire courage (+2 if DM does not allow Inspirational Boost Spell, see spoiler above), and he’s capable of adding 7d6+10 to any melee attack thanks to sneak attack, deadly defense, a channeled shocking grasp, and his trusty (!?) craven feat.

Level 15 – While his melee damage curve has long since capped itselt, Markus can now throw around 10 dice of directed damage and serve as an emergency backup healer. And with 17 uses of Bardic mojo per day, he’s not short on battery power.

Level 20 - At the pinnacle of his career, Markus has taken Versatile Performer to round out his repetoire as a bard, rather than taking another Extra Music feat for even more Bardic music per day. He's also patiently waiting for the universe to sort out his broken Note of Solitude song. =)

Sources
Rogue (PHB)
Duskblade (PHB II)
Prestige Bard (UA)
Seeker of the Song (CArc)

Artist (PGtF)
Craven (CoR)
Combat Expertise (PHB)
Deadly Defense (CScoundrel)
Skill Focus (PHB)
Knowledge Devotion (CChamp)
Extra Music (CAdv)
Versatile Performer (CAdv)


And yes, amazing trophies! Thanks!

Pechvarry
2010-11-15, 10:01 PM
Those badges are sooo awesome. I lol'd. Brilliant.

Grynning
2010-11-15, 10:16 PM
Thanks for the excellent work Jumilk! Badge is already sig'ed.

Congrats, gbprime! Your first competition and your first win! Hopefully we'll see you in the next one too!

Also, accolades and applause for OMG_Ponies, Bakkan, & Kestrel 404, and a big pat on the back for cd4 too! Even if you didn't get a trophy, just doing a good, competitive build like you did shows you have the potential to be the next Iron Chef!

Bakkan
2010-11-16, 03:04 AM
Amazing trophies, thank you very much!

Congratulations to all my fellow competitors, especially gbprime! I know that I learned a lot from this competition and look forward to competing again.

EDIT: Thanks for the complement on my build, Jumilk!

kestrel404
2010-11-16, 07:31 AM
Ooh! I get a trophy! Thanks, Jumilk!

I guess now I'll have to finally go and make myself a sig.

OMG: Yeah, the Firre/Assume Supernatural Ability trick is easily the best upgrade to the Seeker PRC that there is out there - if only the Firre was a few less HD (like, say 5) it would have worked a lot better.

BobVosh
2010-11-16, 08:34 AM
Thing is, here at GitP, the contests have been restricted to 10 level PrCs.

Is this a rule, or a tradition? I think it could be interesting to see what happens with a 5 level PrC as people will have a lot more freedom on supporting classes.

WinWin
2010-11-16, 09:54 AM
I am in awe of the trophies. Thank you very much Jumilk.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-11-16, 10:00 AM
Beautiful trophies, all around, befitting the entries.

Kesnit
2010-11-16, 10:40 AM
Is this a rule, or a tradition? I think it could be interesting to see what happens with a 5 level PrC as people will have a lot more freedom on supporting classes.

IMO, a 5 level SI would be "too easy." As you said, it would give more flexibility, which kind of goes against the point of the contest. The build is supposed to be about the SI, with the rest of the build there to support. With only 5 levels of SI, the build focuses less on the SI because the SI is (at most) 25% of the build, rather than 50%.

Amphetryon
2010-11-16, 12:55 PM
Is this a rule, or a tradition? I think it could be interesting to see what happens with a 5 level PrC as people will have a lot more freedom on supporting classes.

The thinking here - to this point - is that they want the Secret Ingredient to be the focal point of the build; this is evidenced by how harshly builds that don't finish the Secret Ingredient get scored. With a 5 level PrC, it's all but impossible to make that little bit the central focus of the build. At least, it's all but impossible without lots of dips into other classes, and multiple dips are also often harshly scored in this iteration of the contest.

Akal Saris
2010-11-16, 01:16 PM
Indeed, awesome prizes this go-around. Congrats everybody!!

Jumilk
2010-11-16, 02:21 PM
You guys deserve more than this. I'm playing RPG since last year, so I'm a newbie. I have to learn a lot with you. *Admiration 100%*
I really feel praised because you liked the trophies. :redface:

To the next mission I'm going to get drunk! (^O^)/
(All for the inspiration, of course...)


_________________________________________

Edited size

Trophies:
http://img822.imageshack.us/img822/3900/gmini.png http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/8497/smini.png http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/336/bmini.png http://img641.imageshack.us/img641/9004/cmini.png

Badges:
http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/3226/jwinwin.png http://img830.imageshack.us/img830/1828/jvorpaltribble.png
http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/3313/jgrynning.png http://img35.imageshack.us/img35/414/jamphetryon.png