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TechnOkami
2010-11-05, 10:22 PM
Say a evil aligned creature gained the ability to actually use smite evil (not even sure if its mechanically possible), would the positive energy flowing through him damage him in the process?

Marnath
2010-11-05, 10:23 PM
Naw. Good clerics can technically use negative energy spells, and that doesn't hurt them, so I'd say this wouldn't either.

TechnOkami
2010-11-05, 10:28 PM
Naw. Good clerics can technically use negative energy spells, and that doesn't hurt them, so I'd say this wouldn't either.

Not to be annoying, but can you extrapolate on the "technically" bit?

Amphetryon
2010-11-05, 10:51 PM
Not to be annoying, but can you extrapolate on the "technically" bit?

There are Clerical spells that use negative energy that are not of the [evil] descriptor.

TechnOkami
2010-11-05, 11:00 PM
There are Clerical spells that use negative energy that are not of the [evil] descriptor.

And this could work vise versa, correct?

Aidan305
2010-11-06, 08:03 AM
Technically, negative energy damages all living creatures, just as positive energy damages all undead.

In this case, the smite evil ability is being granted by, presumably, a deity of some sort. And (depending on the deity) it's unlikely that they'd want their followers to be injured by the ability. After all, they'd want them to use it.

TechnOkami
2010-11-06, 08:38 AM
Cool, then my crazy Idea might just work.

Runestar
2010-11-06, 08:44 AM
Hey, if an undead cleric can cast cure spells without incident...

KillianHawkeye
2010-11-06, 08:46 AM
Say a evil aligned creature gained the ability to actually use smite evil (not even sure if its mechanically possible), would the positive energy flowing through him damage him in the process?

A) Positive energy is not inherently damaging to living creatures, regardless of alignment.

B) Smite Evil is not based on positive energy.

hamishspence
2010-11-06, 08:49 AM
Not to be annoying, but can you extrapolate on the "technically" bit?

It's worth remembering that "using negative energy" by casting negative energy spells, is not an evil act.

According to the PHB, "channelling negative energy" by using Rebuke/Command Undead, is an evil act.

However, it's probably not all that evil. LN Clerics of Wee Jas cannot turn undead, only rebuke them, and they don't automatically change to Evil for doing so.

And the Bone Knight prestige class from the Eberron book Five Nations, can be of any alignment, and if a paladin, retains some (not all) of its paladin abilities.

And gains a Rebuke Undead ability, and loses any Turn Undead ability.
So you could have a LG guy, who commits Evil acts (little ones), and doesn't cease to be LG.

TechnOkami
2010-11-06, 08:58 AM
Well, my idea was a Chaotic Evil Demon/Devil Paladin, justified in the sens that he's so sadistically evil that he loves nothing more than the pure and utter pain, torture, and destruction of his own kind, just because he can. So he opts to learn the powers of a paladin to do so more easily. He's effectively doing good acts by acting like a paladin and murdering every demon/devil in sight, but in reality he's pleasuring his own sadistic nature.

Now, just by rules alone this is impossible to do, which is why I'll be asking for the GM to let me and writing a dam good background to convince him otherwise.

Amphetryon
2010-11-06, 09:01 AM
Well, my idea was a Chaotic Evil Demon/Devil Paladin, justified in the sens that he's so sadistically evil that he loves nothing more than the pure and utter pain, torture, and destruction of his own kind, just because he can. So he opts to learn the powers of a paladin to do so more easily. He's effectively doing good acts by acting like a paladin and murdering every demon/devil in sight, but in reality he's pleasuring his own sadistic nature.

Now, just by rules alone this is impossible to do, which is why I'll be asking for the GM to let me and writing a dam good background to convince him otherwise.

Paladin of Slaughter (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#paladinofSlaughterClas sFeatures) might be an easier sell.

hamishspence
2010-11-06, 09:01 AM
Well, my idea was a Chaotic Evil Demon/Devil Paladin, justified in the sens that he's so sadistically evil that he loves nothing more than the pure and utter pain, torture, and destruction of his own kind, just because he can. So he opts to learn the powers of a paladin to do so more easily. He's effectively doing good acts by acting like a paladin and murdering every demon/devil in sight, but in reality he's pleasuring his own sadistic nature.

Now, just by rules alone this is impossible to do, which is why I'll be asking for the GM to let me and writing a dam good background to convince him otherwise.

While starting out with "Smite Everybody" is difficult, a character who is LG, takes the LG-only prestige class Shadowbane Inquisitor from Complete Adventurer- and then falls to Evil, will retain all their shadowbane inquisitor powers.

One of which is a Smite power that works on "anybody you designate as corrupt"

They don't actually have to be corrupt- but you can certainly use it on only villains if you want.

The PRC synergizes well with Blackguard- since leves in count as paladin levels and stack with paladin levels, for determining blackguard powers.

TechnOkami
2010-11-06, 09:03 AM
Paladin of Slaughter (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#paladinofSlaughterClas sFeatures) might be an easier sell.

Yeah I saw that, but that's not the point.

Amphetryon
2010-11-06, 09:04 AM
While starting out with "Smite Everybody" is difficult, a character who is LG, takes the LG-only prestige class Shadowbane Inquisitor from Complete Adventurer- and then falls to Evil, will retain all their shadowbane inquisitor powers.

One of which is a Smite power that works on "anybody you designate as corrupt"

They don't actually have to be corrupt- but you can certainly use it on only villains if you want.
There's also Strength of Conviction, from Exemplars of Evil, that lets you smite anyone you perceive as working against your cause. It's slightly off the OP's stated flavor, but...

hamishspence
2010-11-06, 09:06 AM
It's easier to start out Good- take Shadowbane Inquisitor, then fall to evil through over-sadistic tendencies when fighting Evil.

The Order of Illumination, which has Shadowbane Inquisitors- is a really really extremist organization when it comes to prosecuting the fight against evil. And they are willing to sacrifice innocents, if they think it's necessary to destroy a bigger Evil threat.

"Evil character who preys on the Evil" is pretty famous.
"Evil character who preys on the Evil but not the Innocent" is rarer.
"Evil character who preys on the Evil and protects the Innocent" is rarer still, but arguably justifiable.

Person_Man
2010-11-08, 11:41 AM
Not sure exactly what you're going for, but a Binder 5 (with the Improved Binder feat) can bind the Andras vestige, which grants:

Weapon Proficiencies: lance, rapier, greatsword, longsword.
Improved Critical: With all weapons you weild.
Summon Mount: Regular war horse, 1 hour per level.
Bonus to Ride: +8 unnamed.
Sow Discord: Will Save or 1 enemy attacks his ally for 1 round, once every 5 rounds.
Smite Good AND Evil: Once every 5 rounds. Not limited by your alignment, and you don't have to specify Good or Evil when you Smite - it works on all LG, NG, CG, LE, NE, and CE enemies.


Smite is actually not that difficult to optimize. But it comes with the big limiting factor that LOTS of enemies are not Good or Evil.