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Keinnicht
2010-11-07, 04:45 PM
Just a little idea I had, here's what it's looking like at the moment

IMPROVISED WEAPONS CLASS
I'm gonna kill you with this teacup
-Riddick, "The Chronicles of Riddick"

Some people like to kill things with swords. Others, with axes. Some legends even tell of people who like to kill things with bows. However, some people prefer to kill people with whatever they happen to be holding.

PREREQUISITES
To become a member of this class, a character must fulfill the following requirements:

Base Attack Bonus: +7
Weapon Proficiency: The character must be proficient with all simple and martial weapons. This reflects the existing knowledge of weapons that allows the use of improvised weapons.

Base Attack Bonus: Good (+1 per level)
Saves: Good reflex
Class Skills: Bluff, Climb (Str), Craft (Int), Handle Animal (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Ride (Dex), and Swim (Str).
Skill Points at each level: 2+INT modifier

CLASS FEATURES

Improvised Weapon Proficiency (Fine, diminutive, and tiny): At 1st level, a member of this class gains proficiency in using any fine, diminutive, or tiny object as a weapon, melee or ranged (They cannot, however, use an item that weighs more than half their "lift over head" capacity.) A improvised ranged weapon has a 10 ft. range. The following table states the damage done by these, and examples:

Fine: 1 (Needles, coins, shot glasses)
Diminutive:1D3 (small rocks, bottles)
Tiny: 1D4 (rocks, child-sized chairs, large saws)
Small: 1D6 (Bar stools, big rocks, chairs)
Medium: 1D8 (average table or desk, big chair, small boulder)
Large: 1D10 (Large table, Throne, 10 ft. pole)
Huge: 2D6 (Banquet table, support beam for an inn-sized building)
Gargantuan: 2D8 (Purple worm corpse, huge boulder, conspicuously consuming king's banquet table)
Colossal: 2D10 (Towers)

Generally, these weapons will not break to the point of nonfunctionality from this use. However, if a particularly fragile item is being used (A shard of glass, for example) the DM may set a percentage chance the object will break each time it is used (Roll D%, may be cumulative.) An item may break without becoming nonfunctional. For example, a bottle being used as a weapon may break and simply deal piercing damage rather than bludgeoning damage.

A "real" weapon cannot be used as an improvised weapon, even if the character is not proficient with it. For example, a character could not "improvise" the use of an exotic weapon. The one exception to this is using a weapon in a manner not intended (Bashing someone over the head with a crossbow, for example.)

The member of this class may choose to deal lethal or subdual damage, except in the case that one is clearly very unlikely to be dealt (Using a broken bottle to deal subdual damage, using a pillow to inflict lethal damage, etc.)

Weapon Focus (Improvised Weapons): At 2nd level, the member of this class gains Weapon Focus (Improvised Weapons) as a bonus feat. Unlike other weapon focus feats, this applies to all improvised weapons, not a specific one.

Improvised Weapon Proficiency (Small): At third level, the class member gains weapon proficiency in small improvised weapons.

Weapon Specialization (Improvised Weapons): At fourth level, the class gains the Weapon Specialization (Improvised Weapons) feat.

Unbreakable: At fourth level, the member of this class' improvised weapons do not break from combat stress, unless he wishes. They can still be sundered.

Improvised Weapon Proficiency (Medium): At fifth level, the class gains weapon proficiency in medium sized weapons.

Heavy Lifter: At sixth level, the class learns how to exert leverage and use their improvised weapons much more easily. As such, they can now use any item they could lift over their head as a weapon as long as they are proficient in it. (Rather than half that weight.)

Improvised Manyshot: At seventh level, the class may use the manyshot feat when using improvised weapons. The combined weight of all weapons used cannot exceed his lift over head carrying capacity.

Improvised Weapon Proficiency (Large): At seventh level, the class becomes proficient in large improvised weapons, as long as they can lift them, of course.

Greater Weapon Focus (Improvised Weapons): At eighth level, the class gains Greater Weapon Focus (Improvised Weapons) as a bonus feat.

Improvised Weapon Proficiency (Huge and larger): At ninth level, a member of this class gains proficiency in Huge and larger improvised weapons, provided he can lift them. He suffers a -2 penalty for each size category greater than large. The Monkey Grip feat gives a +2 bonus to using such a weapon (Mitigating one size category of difference)

Greater Weapon Specialization (Improvised Weapons) At tenth level, members of this class gain Greater Weapon Specialization (Improvised Weapons) as a bonus feat.

REAALLLY Heavy Lifting: At tenth level, a member of this class may use any object he could drag as a weapon. However, his expertise is only in hitting stuff with it - if not engaged in combat, he has to drag it on the ground. This can greatly reduce his speed on the battle field.

Living Weapon: At tenth level, a member of this class may use a living being as a weapon. To do this, he must make a grapple check if the creature is unwilling. He gains a +4 bonus on this check. If he wins, he may use the creature as a weapon for one round. He must make an additional check each round. A creature functions just like a normal improvised weapon, except it does not have the pleasure of the class member's Unbreakable class ability.

Whenever a creature-weapon hits, the creature takes half the attack's damage. In addition, if the struck opponent has any spikes or similar natural weapons, the creature takes damage from these as well.

Additionally, any touch-based abilities of the creature may be activated by the member of this class when the attack hits. This excludes at will abilities or touch spell-like abilities, only automatic special attacks like the energy drain of a wight or a poison.


Right now it seems a bit overpowered. But I'm looking forward to the day somebody will invest in a +3 Vorpal Broken Bottle

The Antigamer
2010-11-08, 04:55 AM
I like the concept, but on first glance at the abilities I think you should bump the size descriptors each up one. I'm not sure I want to be hitting people with a table just to deal d8 damage :-/
Also, you might want to consider somehow making the improvised weapons bypass DR, or gain enhancement bonuses like a soul knife.

Oh, and this is definitely not overpowered...if anything it's underpowered.

"But I'm looking forward to the day somebody will invest in a +3 Vorpal Broken Bottle"
But no one will do that. The point of improvised weaponry is that you don't carry it around with you carrying around an improvised weapon that you enchanted eliminates any point to specializing in improvised weapons.

Keinnicht
2010-11-08, 05:26 PM
I like the concept, but on first glance at the abilities I think you should bump the size descriptors each up one. I'm not sure I want to be hitting people with a table just to deal d8 damage :-/
Also, you might want to consider somehow making the improvised weapons bypass DR, or gain enhancement bonuses like a soul knife.


I'll think about this for awhile. I see your point, I tried to make the damage on par with a similar weapon of it's size, but I suppose that since a member of this class is unlikely to carry any other weapon, it's reasonable.

The Antigamer
2010-11-08, 08:39 PM
Also "Unbreakable: At fourth level, the member of this class' improvised weapons do not break from combat stress, unless he wishes. They can still be sundered." is an almost entirely useless ability, since you already said only fragile things break.

SurlySeraph
2010-11-08, 10:05 PM
I'll think about this for awhile. I see your point, I tried to make the damage on par with a similar weapon of it's size, but I suppose that since a member of this class is unlikely to carry any other weapon, it's reasonable.

Going by the SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/weapons.htm#weaponSize), the damage needs to be a lot higher. The Colossal weapons it lists (2-handed weapons for Colossal wielders are themselves Colossal) deal 8d6 damage, not 2d10. Spending 9 levels to be able to use a weapon that does 2d10+4 damage at a -4 attack penalty if you can manage to carry it around isn't remotely worthwhile. The 10th-level ability isn't much to write home about, either; monsters with useful touch attacks are rarely very large, the division between "at will" and "automatic" abilities will require DM adjudication as I don't see it anywhere in the rules, and nothing stops the creature he's grappling to use as a weapon from attacking him on its turn as normal.

Additionally, gaining proficiency in larger improvised weapons so slowly really doesn't make the class appealing. At it first level, you can make attacks with weapons that deal up to 1d4 damage; any 7th-level fighter can easily afford a +1 flaming greatsword that does four times as much average damage.

As written, there just isn't much reason for a character to want to take this class. Personally, I'd recommend making it a five-level PrC, giving access to all improvised weapons up to Medium at 1st level and increasing the maximum size by one each level, having the improvised weapons deal damage closer to that of standard weapons of the same size, expanding the list of class skills, and lowering the BAB requirement so it's more accessible.

The Antigamer
2010-11-09, 05:14 AM
Going by the SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/weapons.htm#weaponSize), the damage needs to be a lot higher. The Colossal weapons it lists (2-handed weapons for Colossal wielders are themselves Colossal) deal 8d6 damage, not 2d10. Spending 9 levels to be able to use a weapon that does 2d10+4 damage at a -4 attack penalty if you can manage to carry it around isn't remotely worthwhile. The 10th-level ability isn't much to write home about, either; monsters with useful touch attacks are rarely very large, the division between "at will" and "automatic" abilities will require DM adjudication as I don't see it anywhere in the rules, and nothing stops the creature he's grappling to use as a weapon from attacking him on its turn as normal.

Additionally, gaining proficiency in larger improvised weapons so slowly really doesn't make the class appealing. At it first level, you can make attacks with weapons that deal up to 1d4 damage; any 7th-level fighter can easily afford a +1 flaming greatsword that does four times as much average damage.

As written, there just isn't much reason for a character to want to take this class. Personally, I'd recommend making it a five-level PrC, giving access to all improvised weapons up to Medium at 1st level and increasing the maximum size by one each level, having the improvised weapons deal damage closer to that of standard weapons of the same size, expanding the list of class skills, and lowering the BAB requirement so it's more accessible.

This man speaks sense.
I still like the idea of the class providing a Vow of Poverty type bonus to improvised weapons, so that they can bypass magic resistance and such.