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Exthalion
2010-11-08, 12:01 AM
Okay, I admit I have played Saga before so I am not really new. However when I played I learned I had no idea what I was doing when it came to mechanics. Roleplay was fine, I had the lowest charisma and was still the party face because my bitter logic was more interesting to listen too then dice rolling.

Now however I am starting a new game and I would prefer not to be a liability in combat while still being useful outside of it.

The character I was thinking of was something like this:

Arkanian Scientist/Philosopher who really bought into the whole racial superiority complex. While not one of the major players in political circles he was well known and respected in the intellectual community.

He specialized in the Force, both from a physical and metaphysical view and was widely considered one of the best experts on the Force who was not a Force sensitive.

He was part of several very public research projects involving Force based technology such as hypergates like the kind the Rakata used and mimicking the super efficiency in lightsabers.

Secretly he worked with several other important scientists for a secrete group created by Palpatine. They experimented with creating Force sensitives. They succeeded. The results were twisted abominations, but they did have the Force. Taking data from the first live samples they refined their techniques and created ever more functional examples.

During the Clone Wars the work became frantic. Several times the planet was attacked by the CIS. Drive ever faster their work became crueler and ever more focused on results. The subjects themselves, who had previously suffered mostly neglect were tortured ever increasingly, in an attempts to bring out the Dark Side in them. Palpatine had suggested it.

At last they completed their research. My character, Jaro Meng'lei-Oh, tested it on himself. However along with the power came a greater empathy then he had every known, he could feel the pain and horror their work had created. In the first moments of his sensitivity he destroyed the entire remote complex.

When he regained his sanity he made certain all the monsters they had made were destroyed and all data wiped. It wasn't hard, for in his madness the entire area had been leveled by a CIS bombardment. In his rage he had destroyed the local shield generator leaving a vulnerable gap in the planets defense.

After the failed Jedi coup and the death of Anakin Skywalker, Palpatine put together a team of powerful Force users. Their stated goal was to serve as his High Inquisitors, the overseers of Order 66 and his representatives in distant systems. Though each less powerful then Anakin had been together they were a formidable.

Meng'lei-Oh is part of that team. During the war he did horrible things but he still believes in the New Order, and believes Palpatine is the only one who can hold it together. He doesn't approve entire of the Emperor, both his policies and his dark powers could prove dangerous to the galaxy. For now though serving him does the least evil.

My character is not entirely sane. He is afraid to die and so does not face the Emperor directly. He rationalizes this by thinking he couldn't win anyway. He serves Palpatine believing that if he does not someone else will and he at least will try to do the least evil.

When he was a public figure he was known as the "Thaumaturgist", the wonder worker. He has since taken on the persona of the "Grey Reaper". For all his play at atonement though, he refuses to admit, even to himself that he likes it. He likes the power, the absolute mastery over life and death. Separated from the wound in the Force that was the lab he has started to reflect that it might not have been so wrong after all, simply not run correctly...



He is clothed in a long grey hooded cloak which conceals his face and what he is wearing underneath. I am open to weapon ideas and I don't have any attachment to the light scythe. I considered long handled lightsaber. Would it be possible to take an electrostaff and replace one of the ends with a lightsaber by the rules?

Here are the game starting details:

*Level 8
*All characters must be Force Sensitive
*Max Starting Credits + (1500 credits per level of Jedi, 2000 credits per level of Soldier/Scout/Scoundrel, 3000 credits per level of Noble/Prestige class).
*No heroic classes are off limits. All characters must possess the force-sensitive feat. No levels in “Sith Apprentice/Sith Lord” may be taken at this time.
*48 point buy
*All characters must begin with a Dark Side score of at least 1
*Armored Defense, Improved Armor Defense are starting talents for all characters, and Armor Proficiency (light) is a starting feat for all characters
*Era is Dark Times, days after the end of the Clone Wars



So, any help on a build? If you think the background sucks or is too clique please just say so.

Thank you everyone, for all your help.

Jallorn
2010-11-08, 12:49 AM
I'm not much of an optimiser, so I'll just say: stay away from Force Disarm, the disarming system in Saga is so unbalanced to the point of stupidity, you will never make a successful disarm when it really matters.

That said, I like your background, and I think it is quite original.

Exthalion
2010-11-08, 02:45 PM
I have never run into that actually, thank you for letting me know.

Dienekes
2010-11-08, 03:28 PM
Well first off, what do you want to do? Heavy Force powers focus, heavy lightsaber focus? Mix of both (technically not optimal, but it works and it's fun)?

Also for lightsabers, there's something called a Lightsaber pike [Increases reach but -2 penalty to Block and Deflect], and a long handle lightsaber [can choose to forgo bonus to damage via Str to increase the damage die of the lightsaber], are in Jedi Academy book. You could probably refluff either of these as a Force Scythe.

Exthalion
2010-11-08, 07:39 PM
Long handled sounds like it would serve. Sorry, your right I forgot to specify.

Force heavy would be preferable. He should be able to lay the smackdown with saber if he needs too, but for the most part I want him to seem distant, sort of aloof.

Edit: And if you can think of a way to work in the Aing-Tii force tradition to the backstory I would be very much obliged.

Dienekes
2010-11-08, 08:26 PM
Long handled sounds like it would serve. Sorry, your right I forgot to specify.

Force heavy would be preferable. He should be able to lay the smackdown with saber if he needs too, but for the most part I want him to seem distant, sort of aloof.

Edit: And if you can think of a way to work in the Aing-Tii force tradition to the backstory I would be very much obliged.

I'll probably give some pointers later today, but I don't exactly do whole builds (don't have the attention span)

But I have no idea what an Aing-Tii is [I'll be honest, the only EU I've read is the Thrawn Trilogy]. If you describe what they specialize in I'll give you more focused pointers.

Or if it is somehow a feat or talent I'll find that too.

Mando Knight
2010-11-08, 08:44 PM
If you describe what they specialize in I'll give you more focused pointers.
Time.

Also, while they have a more liberal view of the Force than most, their being aliens would rub the wrong way quite strongly with an Arkanian, and their hatred of slavery would also be a bit antagonistic towards the character...

Exthalion
2010-11-08, 08:54 PM
I recognized how unlikely it was. The only thing that occurred to me as being possible is if after he destroyed the complex he was humbled and sought them out. That is why I asked if anyone could think of a clever reason. It isn't vital by any means.

Dienekes
2010-11-08, 10:57 PM
Alrighty, well Knights of the Old Republic has a lot of vision and prophecy based talents in the Jedi Consular Talent Tree. If that's what you mean by time based you may find some ideas there.

For stats, being more Force focused you'll want to pump Wis and Cha. Personally, I think Wis is more important than Cha as I think getting 1 more Force Power is more important than a +1 to UtF. However, some disagree. You'll probably want to take Force Training when you can (notice, no class can actually take it as a bonus feat).

Since you're taking Long-handle you'll probably dump Str to increase your damage die, so you can dump Str and instead use Dex. So Weapon Finesse is a good choice.

As far as classes go I'd suggest taking Jedi mostly for lightsaber talents (like Block and Deflect).

Since you don't seem to be a part of the Jedi Order technically you can't take the Jedi Knight prestige class, which is more focused on lightsaber stuff anyway. The more difficult to get into but more accurate to your character prestige class is the Force Adept. Unfortunately it requires 3 Force talents, so to get in it right away you won't get any lightsaber talents. Or you can get your GM to ignore the "must be a part of the Jedi tradition" prereq for the Jedi Knight and it works fine.

Force powers you may be interested in:
Farseeing (powers those foresight talents I was talking about)
Battle Strike (just a small boost for your lightsaber)
Move Object (The uses for this ability are near endless)
Mind Trick (same as above, though more out of combat)
Negate Energy (a life saver)
Force Slam (great area effect)
Drain Energy (situational, but funny when you're powerful enough to turn off starships)

You may want to take dips into Soldier for Devastating Attack for your lightsaber, or Scout for Evasion.

Feats: I've already suggested Weapon Finesse, and Force trainings, but Combat Reflexes, Fight Through the Pain (Galaxy at War, if you're taking a lot of hits and are pumping Wis), Rapid Strike, Weapon Focus, and generally anything to help you move around in combat.

Exthalion
2010-11-08, 11:12 PM
You have my great thanks for your advice. In all likelihood I will follow it completely.

The Aing-Tii are more space/time then just time. They can remove the alignment descriptor from Force Powers, use the Force to astrogate instantly, keep companions from being grappled etc. I might seek them out IC which will make much more sense.

For concept, I was thinking of starting with Noble. I agree, mostly Jedi levels, but would you suggest a one level dip in the other two? I might take more then one level of noble.

Any idea on a good vehicle to get? Also, would you suggest tech expert and starship designer? With noble I might be able to fund a very impressive ship.

Gralamin
2010-11-08, 11:18 PM
Make sure if you are using a lot of force powers to grab Skill focus (Use the Force). There really is no reason not to.

Exthalion
2010-11-08, 11:44 PM
I planned on it, but thank you for reminding me. Sometimes there are a lot of things to remember when you are not familiar with the system.

Dienekes
2010-11-08, 11:51 PM
You have my great thanks for your advice. In all likelihood I will follow it completely.

The Aing-Tii are more space/time then just time. They can remove the alignment descriptor from Force Powers, use the Force to astrogate instantly, keep companions from being grappled etc. I might seek them out IC which will make much more sense.

For concept, I was thinking of starting with Noble. I agree, mostly Jedi levels, but would you suggest a one level dip in the other two? I might take more then one level of noble.

Any idea on a good vehicle to get? Also, would you suggest tech expert and starship designer? With noble I might be able to fund a very impressive ship.

If you're starting with Noble you'll probably spend your 1st level feat on Force Sensitivity so you can spend one of the Nobles many skills on UtF. You can then take a level of Jedi to gain lightsaber proficiency. Ultimately it costs you one Force Training but if you're starting at 8th level this can be ok.

I'll admit my limitations as a player here and say I know just above nothing about starships. None of my players took an interest in starship design or being a pilot so I invented "Jyce" they're pilot, and describe space battles around them based on what seems interesting at the time. So I have no advice in that part.

Nobles really shine at buffing allies and gaining a lot of money. Since it seemed like your character wasn't much of a team player I more or less ignored them. Sure dipping in for the wealth can be worth it, especially in tech heavy builds. Jedi normally are the opposite of tech heavy so I kind of ignored the noble. But if you're looking to spend it on a ship and you're going to use the skills then go for it. Really, if you're going Force heavy, and you're willing to take a delay going prestige class for a few levels go for it.


Make sure if you are using a lot of force powers to grab Skill focus (Use the Force). There really is no reason not to.

I can't believe I forgot this. It's so obvious and so correct. Take this feat.

Mando Knight
2010-11-09, 12:16 AM
With noble I might be able to fund a very impressive ship.
I do hope you mean "retrofit a used ship," since new starships start at 100,000 credits, and you can easily spend thousands of credits on just a single component, even if it's on a snubfighter or light freighter. Even a noble isn't going to just take that in stride.

(Also, developing the blueprints for a completely empty battlecruiser takes 230 days and a DC 225 Mechanics check. Even a genius starship designer needs roughly 100 Mechanics-savvy assistants to have a shot at developing a new cruiser model... which is actually a pretty low number for the number of engineers required)

Chambers
2010-11-09, 01:16 AM
Pre-Errata Move Object is fun for picking up a trooper and bashing him into another trooper, then wielding the dead body of the first trooper against other troopers.

...

What? It was our first game of Saga. :smallsmile:

Exthalion
2010-11-09, 02:46 AM
Hello Chambers, I seem to see you often. Do you check through my posts, or are you just on this forum often?

Chambers
2010-11-09, 10:26 AM
Hello Chambers, I seem to see you often. Do you check through my posts, or are you just on this forum often?

I pretty much hang out in the Roleplaying Games, Homebrew, and PbP forums. :smallsmile:

Mando Knight
2010-11-09, 11:33 AM
Pre-Errata Move Object is fun for picking up a trooper and bashing him into another trooper, then wielding the dead body of the first trooper against other troopers.

...Couldn't you do that post-errata, as well?
(It also lets you fly...)

EDIT: Oh, I see. The errata makes it a one-shot effect for each use of the power. Makes sense, given that Vader doesn't repeatedly sledge Luke with the same bit of junk in their duel in Cloud City. (He also never uses Grip in the manner it's shown in the Dark Forces series. The only time a use like that occurs in the films is when Dooku uses it on Obi-Wan in RotS)

Exthalion
2010-11-09, 04:02 PM
Question, due to not starting as a Jedi do I need to take Force Training to even have any powers?

Mando Knight
2010-11-09, 04:12 PM
Question, due to not starting as a Jedi do I need to take Force Training to even have any powers?

You always need Force Training to have any powers. Jedi don't get it as a bonus feat, either at start or as one of their even-level feats. Being able to Use the Force but lacking any Force Powers means you can take other feats and talents that have trained UtF and/or Force Sensitivity as a prerequisite, as well as access to the same suite of "minor" Force abilities (applications of the UtF skill, as on page 77) as everyone else.

Exthalion
2010-11-09, 04:20 PM
Thank you, this makes my feats in need of some adjustment.