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Steamsaint
2010-11-11, 11:41 AM
As the title says, this is my first time DMing a serious game (this is 4th edition D&D) and I'm looking for help with plot ideas and, well any other advice you guys can suggest (yes I have seen the stickied thread on DM advice etc.)

The characters:

The few that are actually named I can't remember at the moment, but eh they don't matter at the moment.


Ardent ex-milita captain who is unknowingly turning those around him slowly into his psychic slaves, although it takes several months and the other PCs are assumed to have high enough will defenses compared to commoners to avoid it. He's also promised to not abuse it, and I trust him.
Fallen half-angel (using a reflavoured tiefling) cosmic sorcerer who's grown up alone, slightly crazy with serious father issues (his mother took care of him after he was rejected from heaven for not being perfect, although he was also not old enough to know or understand this). This guy is the only other player who has a deep understanding of the rules other than myself.
"Human" brawling fighter who is in actuality an ancient red dragon bound into one of his slayer's bodies, although he (both player and character) doesn't actually know this; he woke up with amnesia. He originally wanted to be a half-dragon who could shapechange into a human so as not to scare peasants etc. Basically, I'm going to homebrew a paragon path and epic destiny for him so that he gets draconic abilities and eventually the ability to switch between forms temporarily.
An entirely new player, he's played one session in our other campaign filling in for an absent player but was interested in coming back with his own character; he appears to be playing a wizard at this point in time.
Another character still up in the air at this point, his creator hasn't quite decided on what he's going to play so far as I know.


We're starting at level 5 because I feel like it's better - at level 5 you feel a lot more like someone above average, compared to level 1.


And here's my current plot ideas:

We're starting off in some sort of major town (I'm starting to envision it as Ankh-Morpork of Terry Pratchett's Discworld) in a monotheistic setting vaguely resembling Christian religion (although I'm not emphasising it and my players are ok with this kind of thing). I'm hoping to be able to play with each character separately for a session in order to get them together as a group - over MSN or something, with one or two encounters each.

So the plan is to get them all imprisoned somehow by slavers in league with the city guard, then freed by some sort of vigilante group which they will then basically join to avoid capture. Here they learn that the slavers are only after those who are abnormal - at this point the ardent, the half-angel and the dragon guy - and the others were only captured because they got involved in some way (e.g. tried to defend one of the others being captured, found themselves investigating the slavers etc.)

Very quickly they'll return to the vigilante group's base to find everyone slaughtered and these weird undead creatures with creepy white expressionless masks which will basically be reflavoured undead from various monster manuals.

This is where I'm starting to lose ideas: What I want is the slavers to be linked to the BBEG who is a Cleric attempting to summon the god (requiring a specific sacrifice, the specifics of which I have not yet determined) to the material plane, his reason being that by killing the god he can then absorb his divine spark and become god himself. My intention is that the players will interrupt this ritual mid-paragon, causing the god to manifest but stopping the cleric from successfully slaying him.

From there, the god having slain the cleric for his attempted actions, the god becomes the BBEG, slowly altering the material plane into his own divine realm. The players will watch as NPCs that they know and respect slowly become mindless angelic servants and yet by this level they'll be assumed to be resisting this affect far better than the average commoner.

The end will come when somehow the players defeat the god, themselves ascending and becoming gods themselves. That way, I can use this campaign setting later on and they can recognise themselves and feel awesome.

And that's basically it.

So what I'm looking for are suggestions on how I can improve this; I feel like I'm railroading the players a bit especially in the early levels, and while I like the way that the (as-yet-unnamed) god starts altering the material plane, I'm not sure what I can get the players to do while this is happening which gets them from level 15 or so to level 30 without them feeling like they're running away.


So, any help?

Sipex
2010-11-11, 11:50 AM
First of all, I like it, you have lots of options for the players to feel great. That's part of what 4e is all about, being a badass hero.

You railroad at the start but that's fine, your players need some direction at first to get their motives in order. I'd recommend starting with the characters as captives (because otherwise, players are VERY good at escaping capture) and from there asking them how they got to this point.

From there, prepare something in case the players don't join the vigilante group, keep the same essential story (cleric who wants to summon a giant god) but give them a different path to it. Maybe they just work for the vigilantes as mercenaries, maybe they never see them again. Point is, you can turn anyone into undead for your plot hook so you don't NEED the players to join the vigilantes (just make it appealing).

For the 15-30 bit? Gods aren't easily slayable, maybe have the players search out a MacGuffin which will weaken the god or some secret way of increasing their power to help them slay the god. They will need to run at first though, it's just a given, this is ok. Maybe have them leave the city which is safer (the god is too busy contorting it and taking control) so they aren't running all the time and have the contorted city as the final dungeon.

kyoryu
2010-11-11, 02:35 PM
Have you played much 4e? 1st level in 4e feels a *lot* more powerful than 1st in previous editions. Also, starting at a lower level means less stuff to worry about and learn upfront.

Don't do too much homebrew. As a newbie DM, you don't really have a strong enough grasp on how things are going to balance against each other to make well-designed, semi-balanced homebrew.

It sounds like you're on the Railroad Express. That's cool, it's a valid playstyle. However, make sure that your players are willing to buy tickets.

Also, I'd honestly recommend that newbie DMs back off on the railroading a lot. The game is, in many ways, about the players' stories, not yours. Many DMs start with some vision of a grand story they're going to tell - and that puts the players in the role of audience, which is generally not why people play RPGs. With a little experience it becomes easier to guide the story - but you'll always be a cat herder, not a director.

Your overall setting sounds pretty good - a bit of railroading at the beginning ain't a bad thing to get people into the world. Heck, it's pretty much the structure of every BioWare game, ever. However, instead of thinking about *events* (which your players will do everything to throw a wrench into), think about *situations* or the *setting*. So you've got a BBEG cleric? Who are his lieutenants? Where is he active? Who is aiding him? Who is obstructing him? Good stories often include more than just the "BBEG" - they include someone actively opposing what the main character(s) is doing, while being closer in power level to the protagonist. Think Gollum, or the Linear Guild in OotS. A persistent antagonist like this (lesser in power than the BBEG) can give a recurring foil to the PCs' plans, and add a little dimension to the conflict. As Jim Butcher puts it, the basic story outline is "<protagonist> must <solve problem>. But will he succeed when <antagonist> <performs interfering action>?"

Steamsaint
2010-11-11, 04:08 PM
I've played in two other campaigns of 4e, one starting at 1st level the other starting at 5th and found I enjoyed the one starting at 5th a lot more because the characters could simply do more.

Ok, so it seems like railroading up until the point they get broken out of jail (which is going to be the start of the first session all together) seems acceptable and from there on it's all about presenting the players with a problem and it's their decision. I can do that, which is good.

Anyone got any more specific ideas for the MacGuffin? Some sort of other way of raising themselves to godhood, perhaps, although it would have to have some reason why the cleric did not use that method instead.

As far as homebrew is concerned, I'm only using one thing new that we haven't already been using previously in earlier campaigns and that is the limit breaks idea from the At-Will website (http://at-will.omnivangelist.net/2009/09/limit-breaks-part-2-drive/) i.e. something I haven't come up with on my own (although since they haven't done psionic I'm going to have to work something out for our Ardent, which is probably copied from one of the other power sources)
For the homebrew stuff for the dragon guy it will likely be based very much on the various dragon-related paragon paths etc. already out there. For example, the at-will flight of Scion of Arkhosia (in which you have to land at the end of each round) would probably be stolen - in fact I might just give him the path itself except change the encounter to be more like the racial breath power.

kyoryu
2010-11-11, 04:40 PM
I've played in two other campaigns of 4e, one starting at 1st level the other starting at 5th and found I enjoyed the one starting at 5th a lot more because the characters could simply do more.


No arguments. You've just got to weigh that against you, as a DM, having to properly balance and play against a larger number of abilities. Starting at 1st level lets you ease into it a bit more.

While starting at 5th level may (arguably) increase the potential fun of the game, it also increases the chance that something will get botched up... so while starting at 1st level may allow the Awesome Factor to be in a range from, say, 5 to 7, starting at 5th may allow a max Awesome Factor of 10... but may drop the lowest possible Awesome Factor to 1 or 2.

The question is not really "is it best to start a campaign at 1st level or 5th," but "for my first campaign, can I make a game that will be more fun starting at 1st or 5th?"

I'm not really pushing here for the 1st level campaign, FWIW, especially since you've at least played enough 4e to actually know the power differential. I'm just saying you should, as a new DM, consider the potential downsides.

Katana_Geldar
2010-11-11, 05:07 PM
Particularly when you're still gaining confidence as a DM and having to deal with the five or so things that demand your attention at once.

And on railroading, once you start it can be difficult to get players to follow their own choices.

As for Macguffins, could be some sort of artifact or details of a ritual.

And I agree with the advice against homebrew, don't put it in until you know what you're doing. Deva is a playable race anyway.