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Angry Bob
2010-11-19, 12:49 PM
In the game I'm in, one of the houserules is that if you're unconscious at the end of an encounter, no XP for it. As the BSF in a party of blasters, I've been there many times. When my characters inevitably die from being a level or two behind, my rerolled characters take yet another level hit. Worse, the encounters just keep getting more and more difficult, so the only choices are to hang back and not get any XP for the fight, for not participating, or rush in and immediately get raped by the CR 12 encounter. Keep in mind I'm hovering around ECL 4 here.

So I built a Half-Minotaur Water Orc Lion Totem Barbarian 1/Totemist X, with buyoff, so that let me scrape by, survive some encounters, even do a little damage, and level to ECL 6, but it should not have been that retarded.

Is being far behind the rest of the party a common occurrence? I mean, not one level or an XP disparity in the same level, but like four or five levels behind. If it is, how did or would you deal with it?

AtwasAwamps
2010-11-19, 12:51 PM
Start slapping your DM till he realizes he's done something wrong.

Jarian
2010-11-19, 12:52 PM
With a trout.

Seriously, after the first time, he should have realized something was wrong.

AtwasAwamps
2010-11-19, 12:55 PM
With a trout.

Seriously, after the first time, he should have realized something was wrong.

Trouts are for sissies.

Use a salmon. Or a tuna.

Or another player after you dump fish sauce on him.

The possibilities are ENDLESS.

sonofzeal
2010-11-19, 12:56 PM
Agreed. That's a horrible thing to do to a player.

Anyway, I think the official rule is that new characters come in at the level of the lowest character still in game. That should prevent you from getting TOO far behind. But no-xp-if-unconscious is just ridiculous.

Vladislav
2010-11-19, 01:04 PM
Worst house rule ever.

Being five levels behind a party is unmanageable, unless you for some reason want to deliberately hobble yourself as a challenge. And that challenge should get old after a few encounters.

As a first step on the path to redeem your DM, direct him to this thread.

Zeofar
2010-11-19, 01:05 PM
I have to wonder: after this happened a few times and it wasn't changed if you expressed concerns, why even bother making a melee character (barring a cheesy druid or cleric, which could probably handle it especially since you would be able to heal yourself)? I get that you probably like melee characters better (as do I), but they can't be feasibly played if taking damage makes them less likely to gain levels. And, no, this is not normal in the least. The rule obviously isn't working, and it seems that the his character creation rules are broken as well. If you make a new character, it should be of the level appropriate to handle the encounters it will be facing, not weaker than the last one. It doesn't even make sense in-game. If your fighter died, why would you recruit a newbie who will just die again? Wouldn't you be trying to team up with someone as powerful or more powerful than you?

Try making a character similar to the other players, and if you really need a tankin' man, tell the DM to make a permanent DMPC that has to be played under the rules he was using for you. Maybe he'll get the picture.

pffh
2010-11-19, 01:05 PM
The no xp if unconscious is just silly. You still learn something from the fight even if you're knocked out.

I'd run a couple of hypothetical situation by the DM to show him how silly it is (and also tell him how silly the rule is).
Example:
The rest of the team is captured by 5 guys but they leave unconscious on the ground you since you're so weak. You then proceed to rescue the party and kill all but on guy while the party watches. But you manage knock that last guy down to less then 10 hp before he knocks you out and then one of the party members manages to break free and kills the last guy.
Who gets xp here?
You?
The rest of the party?
Just the guy that killed the last enemy since the rest were still bound and you were knocked unconscious before managing to kill that last enemy?

Morbis Meh
2010-11-19, 01:07 PM
Talk with your DM out of game, if he doesn't know that you're not enjoying the game then he's doing something wrong. If he doesn't want to try to make a fix then next time you die walk away from this group and find a new one.

Sipex
2010-11-19, 01:07 PM
It sounds like your DM has played too many JRPGs

Urpriest
2010-11-19, 01:19 PM
One thing to keep in mind: if you're really that low level, those encounters that you do manage to stay conscious in will give you lots more XP than they give the rest of the party. Something to be aware of. If you're really that much lower even when taking this into account...yikes.

Psyx
2010-11-19, 01:25 PM
Trout? I'd go for cod. Or maybe tuna.

Something large enough to knock him out. Then when he comes around, ask him what he learned. If he says anything, then tell him he's wrong, because he can't have: He was passed out, and got no XP!

You're already sucking down one for the party by playing the BSF. Loosing XP for it is just grinding your face in the dirt.

It's looking like 'Diehard' is almost an essential feat for you.


Personally, I'd play a skillmonkey who stands at the back and stays alive. Maybe with a bow. If someone whines that you aren't contributing, point out that you MUST be, because you're getting more than your last ten characters who 'contributed' and yet learned nothing.

Vladislav
2010-11-19, 01:34 PM
Guys, if he's going to point his DM to this thread, we need to keep the troutslapping references to a minimum. We want to convince the DM, not make him run in fear.

Greenish
2010-11-19, 01:35 PM
It's looking like 'Diehard' is almost an essential feat for you.
Shape Soulmeld: Bloodtalons or Rageclaws. No prerequisites. :smallcool:

sonofzeal
2010-11-19, 01:40 PM
Guys, if he's going to point his DM to this thread, we need to keep the troutslapping references to a minimum. We want to convince the DM, not make him run in fear.
The DM should also be aware of just how much of a jerk it is to permanently ruin someone's game like that. It's pretty much like kicking someone out of the group entirely, except instead of having the balls to actually do that, you just make their life unbearable instead. Serious jerk move.

I mean, I see the idea. If you're not awake, you didn't learn anything right? And if xp represents learning, then characters who aren't awake and involved shouldn't get any. The problem is {a} if he's charging in and getting smacked down, he probably did learn something, and potentially a lot more than people who hung back and slung the same spells they've slung a dozen times, and {b} the end result is making it impossible for that player to contribute.



As for me, I'd use a Pike. They're spikey. :smallamused:

Ernir
2010-11-19, 01:46 PM
+1 to "no consciousness = no XP" being a bad idea.

Warlawk
2010-11-19, 01:55 PM
The DM should also be aware of just how much of a jerk it is to permanently ruin someone's game like that. It's pretty much like kicking someone out of the group entirely, except instead of having the balls to actually do that, you just make their life unbearable instead. Serious jerk move.

+1. Serious jerk move. Not a game I would be interested in playing. Full stop. The houserule has to go. Additionally, if your fellow players aren't willing to buff/support the BSF, don't play one. Play a greedy build that doesn't help them out and when they bitch, point out that you're helping them just as much as they helped your last characters.

EDIT: For clarification by "greedy build" I mean something strongly focused on keeping yourself alive instead of trying to "tank" for a group that is better equipped to do it than you are.

gallagher
2010-11-19, 02:15 PM
In the game I'm in, one of the houserules is that if you're unconscious at the end of an encounter, no XP for it. As the BSF in a party of blasters, I've been there many times. When my characters inevitably die from being a level or two behind, my rerolled characters take yet another level hit. Worse, the encounters just keep getting more and more difficult, so the only choices are to hang back and not get any XP for the fight, for not participating, or rush in and immediately get raped by the CR 12 encounter. Keep in mind I'm hovering around ECL 4 here.

So I built a Half-Minotaur Water Orc Lion Totem Barbarian 1/Totemist X, with buyoff, so that let me scrape by, survive some encounters, even do a little damage, and level to ECL 6, but it should not have been that retarded.

Is being far behind the rest of the party a common occurrence? I mean, not one level or an XP disparity in the same level, but like four or five levels behind. If it is, how did or would you deal with it?

i had a hald-minotaur water orc barbarian/frenzied berserker that WASNT a charge build. i instead got a slashing varient of the spiked chain (think its called scorpion chain) and put the whirling ability on it.

literally nuked crowds better than a wizard and his fireball

742
2010-11-19, 02:32 PM
it makes the game less fun

i know it doesnt make sense in game but EXP should be awarded evenly to all players (if someone makes enough magic items that theyre behind they have magic items to compensate and it was player choice so its okay for the levels to be uneven)

now rewarding good RPing or a crowning moment of awesome or something with bonus exp is fine, because thats rewarding a player for doing good(i would still spread some of it around for "just watching something that awesome" but whatever), but in a game you shouldnt be punishing the players, especially not for playing their characters. and encouraging cowardice in what i assume is heroic fantasy? yes, the fish slapping needs to start.

honestly in a game with good RPers whose characters really dont want to die you can do away with the level hit from rez completely. you can just say "also, do you know what its like to get digested by a shark? no? then shut up. oh, and my favorite item was sold to pay for the rez. wonderful". the level hit isnt there to make the game unfun, its to give character death weight, maybe instead have it take out their earliest memories first, so theres no mechanical penalty but its still something you really want to avoid. still a solution more for an RP focused game* but in a non RP focused game isnt the material cost and down-time penalty enough?

also dont make a retaliation character. it doesnt make things fun if you make the character in bitterness, and fun is sort of the point, right? now a character that better fits with the party-a full group of CN(bordering on chaotic stupid) spellcasters can get really wacky and fun.

*but it gives the characters more concrete incentive, and its a really cool idea, im going to start using this.

Tyndmyr
2010-11-19, 03:02 PM
Guys, if he's going to point his DM to this thread, we need to keep the troutslapping references to a minimum. We want to convince the DM, not make him run in fear.

Perhaps that's what you want. Me, Im a fan of people running in fear of the trout. :smallamused:

But yeah...he hasn't considered that its a positive feedback loop. It just gets worse and worse. Sure, in theory, being a level or two back results in more xp for the fights you do stay up through(provided he does that right), but in practice, becoming unconcious is increasingly likely as you fall behind, and this chance increases more rapidly than the xp bonus does. So, if you get a couple levels behind, it'll rapidly just become worse.

Coidzor
2010-11-19, 03:04 PM
Is being far behind the rest of the party a common occurrence? I mean, not one level or an XP disparity in the same level, but like four or five levels behind. If it is, how did or would you deal with it?

No, that's not common at all. :smalleek:

If the DM wasn't going to play ball, I'd either make a build that deliberately made it so that the weaknesses of the other characters put THEM in harms way so that they could start dying and reestablish equilibrium, leave the game after throwing what ****s they were into their faces, or just kill the rest of the party and force a restart.

Tyndmyr
2010-11-19, 03:15 PM
If talking fails, the vengeful option is fun. How to win an encounter with nobody conscious? This could be a fun optimization challenge.

Ideally, you want to be someone that never gets targetted, and attacks from range. So...like a little, flying sorc with wings of cover and wings of flurry. Yay!

mucat
2010-11-19, 03:24 PM
Play a greedy build that doesn't help them out and when they bitch, point out that you're helping them just as much as they helped your last characters.

Don't do this. Play the game because you're having fun, leave the game because you're not having fun. To point out their bad behavior by echoing it back at them is a waste of your own time as well as theirs; go do something that is fun instead.

Best option, of course, is to convince the DM to rethink his (undeniably bad) houserules and make the game playable for the melee characters you like to run.

Warlawk
2010-11-19, 03:40 PM
stuff

The issue was dealt with well, kudos Mucat.

In that situation though, I still think playing a build focused on keeping yourself alive instead of supporting level 11 spellcasters with a much lower level character is the best possible option. That DM really needs to adjust some things though.

Lev
2010-11-19, 03:44 PM
So basically he turned into munchkin.

OK, you go up and smack the orc, once you are in splash range I'll fireball it.


This doesn't bode well.

Kylarra
2010-11-19, 03:46 PM
I am feeling slightly sheepish, but cannot for the life of me remember what BSF stands for right now. :smallredface:

Coidzor
2010-11-19, 03:48 PM
Yeah, I was the one who suggested just forcibly deleveling the rest of the party.

Possibly by spending gold on a number of scrolls of reincarnate and investing in whatever coup de grace weapon is most appealing for dealing with level 11 characters.


I am feeling slightly sheepish, but cannot for the life of me remember what BSF stands for right now. :smallredface:

Big. Stupid. Fighter.

Amphetryon
2010-11-19, 03:49 PM
I am feeling slightly sheepish, but cannot for the life of me remember what BSF stands for right now. :smallredface:

Big Silly/Stupid Fighter.

mucat
2010-11-19, 03:51 PM
[quote]Way to go on completely reading my intent wrong and throwing out personal attacks about it being "bratty and passive aggressive" though.
You're right; I was rude, and I apologize.

I didn't intend a personal attack, but as I reread it now it does read that way. I stand by the advice -- if even part of a player's motive can be summed up by "that'll show 'em", then it would be better to simply leave the game -- but I should have phrased it better.

I'm editing the post to be more polite; thanks for calling me on it.

tyckspoon
2010-11-19, 03:51 PM
I am feeling slightly sheepish, but cannot for the life of me remember what BSF stands for right now. :smallredface:

In this context, it's probably Big Stupid Fighter- the meatstick who goes up and trades blows with all kinds of things that are nonetheless bigger, stronger, and have better attack bonuses than he does. He requires Intelligence to be his dump stat to justify exactly *why* he does this, in-character, as it's bloody suicidal. Out of character, some groups believe this is a necessary job.. and then refuse to give the necessary support to the BSF to actually let him do the job.

Kylarra
2010-11-19, 03:52 PM
Big. Stupid. Fighter.Aha, thanks. I guess the real question is why are they forcing a role on you that's continuously failed so often.

Coidzor
2010-11-19, 03:53 PM
Aha, thanks. I guess the real question is why are they forcing a role on you that's continuously failed so often.

They probably believe they have to have the party role filled even though they've got plenty of spell slots as level 11 casters to use summoned monsters for most things.

And one of their cohorts would be better suited for the job anyway.

Angry Bob
2010-11-19, 03:55 PM
They aren't actually forcing me to play a tank. I just prefer that role, and they *would* have died a couple of times without me to soak the damage for them.

And they aren't level 11. They're level eight. "They" being the Abrupt Jaunt conjurer, the lawful good cleric, and the half-celestial tiefling warmage/wizard/ultimate magus/DMPC that apparently gains XP based on class levels alone. I say apparently because having a +5 LA or whatever it would be hasn't slowed him down at all. We've been given assurances that he's on his way out, though, so he won't be a problem for much longer.

Tyndmyr
2010-11-19, 04:03 PM
and the half-celestial tiefling warmage/wizard/ultimate magus/DMPC that apparently gains XP based on class levels alone. I say apparently because having a +5 LA or whatever it would be hasn't slowed him down at all. We've been given assurances that he's on his way out, though, so he won't be a problem for much longer.

Run. Run now.

Angry Bob
2010-11-19, 04:05 PM
Eh. He's still a caster, he's got no reason to prepare freedom of movement if he even has it, and I've got +25 or something to grapple. If he starts owning absolutely everything, I can take him. Nothing to stop the Dm from introducing another one, but whatever. Maybe he'll get the picture.

Warlawk
2010-11-19, 04:05 PM
If you want to play a melee tank type for that group, have you looked into the possibility of a Stone Power crusader tank? It isn't a huge offense machine, but it can be very tough to kill and it really sounds like the problem is one of surviving, not dealing damage. Between the crusader class ability to shunt off some damage from round to round, and the stone power ability to mitigate a bunch of that damage you can make a very tough character.

Angry Bob
2010-11-19, 04:06 PM
I tried it. He ran afoul of an osyluth and some suspiciously strong city guards in a lawful evil regime. At 20 hp. He went into negatives before he even got to counterattack.

Zeofar
2010-11-19, 04:08 PM
half-celestial tiefling warmage/wizard/ultimate magus/DMPC that apparently gains XP based on class levels alone. I say apparently because having a +5 LA or whatever it would be hasn't slowed him down at all. We've been given assurances that he's on his way out, though, so he won't be a problem for much longer.

lolwut. The DM is playing a cheesy blaster at your expense while he and all the other characters (including a cleric) ignore your constant deaths and inability to progress due to dumb houserules? This has got to be a joke. As much as it seems immature to say "don't play with them if nothing changes quickly," that may be a good option. Or, ask the DM to play your character for a couple sessions while you take care of his. It makes more sense that weak, low-level, quick-to-die characters that fill a role that the party can't cover otherwise are controlled by the DM anyhow.


I tried it. He ran afoul of an osyluth and some suspiciously strong city guards in a lawful evil regime. At 20 hp. He went into negatives before he even got to counterattack.

Have you ever done anything to grievously piss off the DM? Like, if you had him do a tattoo for you, would he put embarrassing and/or inappropriate images and slurs instead of what you asked for?

Tyndmyr
2010-11-19, 04:11 PM
I tried it. He ran afoul of an osyluth and some suspiciously strong city guards in a lawful evil regime. At 20 hp. He went into negatives before he even got to counterattack.

Run faster.

grimbold
2010-11-19, 04:15 PM
but doesnt being unconscious at the end of a fight suggest that in fact you did the most work in the fight?

Angry Bob
2010-11-19, 04:16 PM
but doesnt being unconscious at the end of a fight suggest that in fact you did the most work in the fight?

It should. But in this case it apparently doesn't.

Amphetryon
2010-11-19, 04:18 PM
but doesnt being unconscious at the end of a fight suggest that in fact you did the most work in the fight?

Depends on the fight. I've seen characters drop to negatives in the Surprise Round, before their Initiative, several times.

Sipex
2010-11-19, 04:18 PM
Again, too many JRPGs.

Coidzor
2010-11-19, 04:22 PM
They aren't actually forcing me to play a tank. I just prefer that role, and they *would* have died a couple of times without me to soak the damage for them.
So, the obvious answer was that you should've let 'em die. They'll be hard pressed to make the game less enjoyable for you after you fell 4 levels behind them.


And they aren't level 11. They're level eight. "They" being the Abrupt Jaunt conjurer, the lawful good cleric, and the half-celestial tiefling warmage/wizard/ultimate magus/DMPC that apparently gains XP based on class levels alone. I say apparently because having a +5 LA or whatever it would be hasn't slowed him down at all. We've been given assurances that he's on his way out, though, so he won't be a problem for much longer.
That he created the monstrosity in the first place. :smallyuk:


I tried it. He ran afoul of an osyluth and some suspiciously strong city guards in a lawful evil regime. At 20 hp. He went into negatives before he even got to counterattack.

Yeah, your DM's an ass. You've merely served to confirm this with every utterance about him.

His lack of perspective on how a table top roleplaying game with other people playing should be could have been forgiven in the one case. The multiple cases though just show a deficiency of character.

Otodetu
2010-11-19, 04:36 PM
Every time i hear about depressing games like this i really hope that it is a lie, that people are just trolling, please tell me this is a troll...


If it is a real game and it bothers you, then run away or confront the dm.

Otherworld Odd
2010-11-19, 04:40 PM
Uhhh, yeah. Your DM takes my first place prize in most idiotic house rule creation.

Angry Bob
2010-11-19, 04:40 PM
Nah, it's real. He seems like he could be reasoned with, but I don't play until after next week. I definitely will bring this up, because the other players are my friends, and I'm sure you all know how that is. At the very least, I might be score some extra levels to bring me on par with the rest of the party. Maybe if I'm really lucky, the warmage can disappear in a puff of pink smoke. He seems attached to his houserule, though.

nedz
2010-11-19, 05:24 PM
-1 to the houserule.

IMHO If you are 4 levels behind you are just there to carry the bags.

Its possible they don't realise how lame this is;
You might therefore need to educate the group.
One idea to do this is to create a character who can render the entire party unconcious at the end of the combat, you should then take all of the XP :smallbiggrin:
Rinse and Repeat
They will soon get the point.

Vladislav
2010-11-19, 05:40 PM
To be honest, doesn't seem like the DM is a jerk or out to riun the game or get the OP. Just seems like a case of Does Not Get It (TM). Which is also rather bad, but at least manageable.

Si-on
2010-11-19, 05:56 PM
Just got home from my weekly game. If my dm was like yours I would not be going back.

power4me
2010-11-19, 06:04 PM
On the original topic of if this has ever happened to anyone, i once played in an AD&D campaign where if you died, you rerolled a new character at level one. That being said, the party was pretty diverse with lots of lvl ones and three or four level sevens.

Unfortunately, we still did dungeon crawls for level 7 characters. it was aweful

Si-on
2010-11-19, 06:21 PM
I once played an AD&D game where if you died you started with a first level character. I played 4 characters in 4 sessions. The rest of the group were between 7th and 10th. Never again.

Zhalath
2010-11-19, 11:54 PM
Eh. He's still a caster, he's got no reason to prepare freedom of movement if he even has it, and I've got +25 or something to grapple. If he starts owning absolutely everything, I can take him. Nothing to stop the Dm from introducing another one, but whatever. Maybe he'll get the picture.

Grapple? Man, the DM will just give up on his character if you grapple him.

Going unconscious means not getting XP leads to not leveling up leads to getting knocked unconscious means not getting XP means not leveling up means-AH!

+1 to having a rational discussion with your GM about why this is a bad idea and that you're not having fun. D&D is about having fun. It's a game. Games are for having fun.
Alternatively, you could ask your GM for your pay. I mean, if it's difficult and unreasonable and seems to exist to punish you, it's either a LE government or work.

Toric
2010-11-20, 01:14 AM
Agreed on the Not Getting It part. The one true way to "win" at D&D is to have fun while enhancing everyone else's fun. So far this DM's not quite winning. Hopefully he'll remove the houserule when you explain the vicious cycle it's caught you in as a melee fighter and everyone can start winning again.

If not, explain to the other players to get them on your side with the power of logic.

If that fails, then yes, run. :smallsmile:

FelixG
2010-11-20, 01:39 AM
Really, what you should do is grab his DMG, beat him senseless with it and tell him that he can have it back when he learns to be a good DM, then point him to this thread or forum to get advise on how to not be an idiot.

TurtleKing
2010-11-20, 02:10 AM
There is one race that negates death literally. Play the immortal Prinny. I have seen it a few times on the playground, but find one that can survive almost anything. The prinny I played was blasted multiple times by the God of Death, and can get right back up and say " What is that all you have?". At -1 you become unconscious and don't go below. Only a Greater Deity or higher can drop you below -1. The fun part is telling the DM to bring it on I can take whatever you dish out.

Edit: One thing I should mention is that the Prinny is incredibly broken by being immortal. I cracked my DM's cosmology wide open when I finally got serious and roleplayed my character. Because of me my band defeated a Purple Wurm and a heavily optimised Elf Rogue2 Psion16. This was done at levels 3 through 5. If you have heard the tail(sp) about negotiating with deities the way into deityhood for the party was because of my Prinny.

Coidzor
2010-11-20, 02:24 AM
:smalleek: Once you start down that dark path, forever will it rule your destiny.

sonofzeal
2010-11-20, 02:30 AM
There is one race that negates death literally. Play the immortal Prinny. I have seen it a few times on the playground, but find one that can survive almost anything. The prinny I played was blasted multiple times by the God of Death, and can get right back up and say " What is that all you have?". At -1 you become unconscious and don't go below. Only a Greater Deity can drop you below -1. The fun part is telling the DM to bring it on I can take whatever you dish out.

Edit: One thing I should mention is that the Prinny is incredibly broken by being immortal. I cracked my DM's cosmology wide open when I finally got serious and roleplayed my character. Because of me my band defeated a Purple Wurm and a heavily optimised Elf Rogue2 Psion16. This was done at levels 3 through 5. If you have heard the tail(sp) about negotiating with deities the way into deityhood for the party was because of my Prinny.
Make it Vecna-blooded, and you have yourselves a winner!

Rogue 7
2010-11-20, 02:54 AM
Again, too many JRPGs.

What in the nine hells do JRPGs have to do with this?

Coidzor
2010-11-20, 02:57 AM
What in the nine hells do JRPGs have to do with this?

Well, in games like final fantasy, if a character is knocked down they don't get an XP for the battle they were in, even if they fought for the entirety and just got kilt by the enemy exploding upon death.

So it was a conjecture that this houserule came from a desire to make the table top experience more like such a console RPG.

I think.

FelixG
2010-11-20, 05:41 AM
What in the nine hells do JRPGs have to do with this?

Nothing in the nine hells has anything to do with JRPGs, its the tenth hell that has all you need to know on the subject.

Frenchy147
2010-11-20, 07:54 AM
:smallsigh:I kind of understand the unconcious=no XP but it might be more reasonable if you got XP for the enemies defeated while you were awake or something.

Also, If you're that far behind talk to your DM. Ask him if you could make a character at least within a level or two of the other PC's. If he doesn't let you, walk.

P.S. lol FelixG

Rasman
2010-11-20, 09:32 AM
no xp for being out cold might be one of the dumbest house rules I've ever heard...and believe me...my DM's have some...well...doozies...

I'd argue this and bring up the fact that this is a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation.

If your DM won't ease up on this, then I wouldn't play with this group.

Although to be more devious, you COULD just sit back and watch the rest of your group get killed off until they get down to your level, but that could take a while. Regular poison in their morning coffee could help that along...

Fitz10019
2010-11-20, 04:13 PM
Maybe it's your turn to DM. This houserule could just be a desperate cry for help.

Runeclaw
2010-11-20, 05:25 PM
All the obvious stuff about the stupidity of the house rule (and, apparently, the DM) has been discussed at length. I agree with all that. Having to make new characters at a lower level after dying is also stupid.

But if for whatever reason these rules stay in place and you none the less want to continue playing, some ideas:

1) Dont' tank. You may prefer them, but they are clearly unworkable in this system, which has greatly increased the importance of not taking damage. If you don't want to be a caster, consider an archer. As was previously suggested, small and flying are good ideas. Max AC, miss chance, and other defenses as much as possible. Skill monkey is a good idea, too, as they typically aren't "expected" to contribute as much to combat.

2) Contingent healing?

3) Depending on how literally interpreted the house rule is, a character type that isn't subject to unconsciousness might useful. Vampire (although they're terrible) or lich can't be knocked unconscious and are difficult to kill.

TurtleKing
2010-11-20, 11:49 PM
If going small and hard to hit and archery then see about the pixie rogue. They could attack while still invisible, and this also brings out the sneak attack whenever you want.

Vizzerdrix
2010-11-21, 12:20 AM
Have you considered getting a lycanthropy infection? Is isn't a great solution, but it's better than nothing. +1 against the dumb house rule

WarKitty
2010-11-21, 01:07 AM
Or just take the diehard feat for starters, and get yourself a bunch of healing items.

RipperOfShirts
2010-11-21, 01:46 AM
How well do you get along with the other players? I mean, if the DM isn't going to change anything, maybe ask them for some help on this. Let them know that this is becoming nigh-on-impossible and the fun is getting sucked out and maybe they can help you out.

At the very least, convince them that the rule sucks, and you have a majority vote on removing the house rule.