Girard is a Famous Rebel

[Silverlocke980]

So we know Tarquin knows- or knows of, an important distinction when dealing with someone who enjoys lying by omission so much- Girard.

My theory? Girard's behind all the chaos. Why are so many empires fighting all the time? Because Girard started it all. He caused all this chaos.

He's a famous historical character on this continent. He's the guy who toppled whatever established order was already here, creating this chaotic realm of tyrannies in its place. I'm certain Girard didn't mean for that to happen, but he didn't mean to blow up the Order either; he had a different intention that time.

And Girard's entire character seems to be about the dangers of Chaotic thinking. His mindless hatred of Lawful characters and authority has been proven to be incorrect- Soon Kim never, ever broke his word- and has been directly harmful to the world's safety- not only did he try to kill the Order, albeit inadvertently, but he's kept them from knowing where his Gate is, while Xykon can make a beeline for it when he needs to.

For added fun, I assume that there were peaceful regimes that were already here that Girard toppled, probably in a V-like disguise, hoping to create beautiful, perfect chaos... and leading way to this hellhole of infighting.

In essence? Girard, who is nothing if not ur-Chaos in the extreme, more Chaotic than anything else, made this place what it is- mindless Chaos, for all that the empires try to instill order.

So that's how Tarquin knows of him- the way we would George Washington. Famous, historical figure, known by anyone with any learning.

But not someone he knows personally.

[Dr.Epic]

So because Girard hates authoritarians, he hates all government and order?:smallconfused:

[Silverlocke980]

Yeah, didn't you read his rant? Kings... power... yeah, he's pretty much ur-Chaos. He hates authority. He believes that all government eventually becomes authoritarian.

It's not so much "hates all authoritarians, therefore hates government" as "believes all government is authoritarian, and hates authoritarians, therefore hates governments".

[Zevox]

Yeah, didn't you read his rant? Kings... power... yeah, he's pretty much ur-Chaos. He hates authority. He believes that all government eventually becomes authoritarian.
No, he said he believes that if you "give a man enough power, he's bound to abuse it, no matter how noble he thinks he is." That's a far cry from saying that all government inevitably becomes authoritarian - it's little more than the old adage of "power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely." He says he distrusts authority, but he doesn't give any indication that he hates all government. Distrust and hate are two extremely different things.

The hate he seems to hold for Soon appears to be personal, probably motivated by the events leading to Kraagor's demise at the hands of the Snarl given his closing remarks in that message. Do not mistake that for a hate he has for all authority figures - we have no evidence of that at this point.

Zevox

[Porthos]

This is an interesting theory, and on first blush I like it. Only problem is humans and lizard races have been fighting over the livable scraps that are left for 500 years. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0680.html)

Now it is possible that there was a somewhat more established order back in the day. And when you take into consideration the line, "I've never trusted authority figures, be they kings, presidents or party leaders (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0694.html)," it might be possible that Girard is helping keep things chaotic.

Then again, he might be a Famous Rebel because he thinks all of the authority figures out here deserve to be toppled. So in this case he isn't the cause of the instability. But he might be trying to keep Empires like the one that Tarquin and crew are working on from forming.

So it wouldn't surprise me at all to find out that Girard (or his descendants/followers) is (are) a player in all of this. But I don't think they're the ones who caused all of it to begin with.

[Silverlocke980]

Hmm... I don't know. His hatred of Soon, admittedly, could just be personal, but it seems to speak of broader issues. Between the whole "fascist paladin" thing, and the fact that he's accusing Soon Kim- who never broke his word- of being an obvious word-breaker for a "greater good"...

I doubt Girard is friendly with the idea of government in general.

[Porthos]

I doubt Girard is friendly with the idea of government in general.

No, he probably isn't. Doesn't mean he wants to topple all of them, though.

====

The thing I am somewhat placing my Epileptic Tree bet on is the line, "Give a man enough power and he's bound to abuse it. No matter how noble he thinks he is."

Why do I single out that line?

Well, last time I checked, Epic Level Spellcasters are bit on the powerful side. Just a tad. :smallwink: And if Girard was corrupted by his own power... Well, I would find the irony delicous indeed. :smallamused:

[Zevox]

Hmm... I don't know. His hatred of Soon, admittedly, could just be personal, but it seems to speak of broader issues. Between the whole "fascist paladin" thing, and the fact that he's accusing Soon Kim- who never broke his word- of being an obvious word-breaker for a "greater good"...

I doubt Girard is friendly with the idea of government in general.
He doesn't have to be friendly with it in order to not hate it so much that he finds the idea of toppling all governments and leaving the region in perpetual violent chaos attractive. Again, there is a big difference between "distrust" and "hate."

Girard does not appear, given what little we have to go on, to be some mad anarchist, just a chaotic good or neutral individual with a particular hatred for a certain Paladin. His final remark about Kraagor heavily implies that the latter is personal. If I were to guess, I'd say he likely never got along well with Soon simply because he was both a Paladin (lawful, often considered authority figures, religious) and the group's leader (authority figure), and that blossomed into the hate we see over time, with the last straw being Kraagor's death, which he appears to blame for Soon for. That's just a guess, mind you, but it seems to follow from what few facts we have about Girard.

Of course, what happened to him or what he did after he went off to guard his own Gate is open to question - for all we know he may have been changed in some ways by his hatred for Soon, and become the sort of person who would do the things you suggest. But any attempts to answer that question at this point fall under the category of "total speculation," as we have no evidence at all to go on for it.

Zevox

[Dr.Epic]

Hmm... I don't know. His hatred of Soon, admittedly, could just be personal, but it seems to speak of broader issues. Between the whole "fascist paladin" thing, and the fact that he's accusing Soon Kim- who never broke his word- of being an obvious word-breaker for a "greater good"...

I doubt Girard is friendly with the idea of government in general.

Even Codename V was welcoming of government. I doubt Girard is worse.