View Full Version : [4E] Monster Manual 3 Hit Points

Duos Greanleef
2010-11-22, 10:59 PM
Is it just me, or do the monsters in MM3 have lower hit points?
Was there an adjustment to the math, or is my perception jacked up?
Thanks in advance, playground!

2010-11-22, 11:06 PM
I seem to recall reading somewhere that hit points are down and damage is up.

I think it was to make them easier to hit, but at the same challenge level.

I will try and find the link.

2010-11-23, 03:14 AM
Pretty sure this is the link you were looking for: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/UpdateJuly2010.pdf

2010-11-23, 03:38 AM
I don't see any changes in hit points in this errata. Just damage and accuracy.

2010-11-23, 03:54 AM
MM3 monsters use roughly these calculations for their basic stats: http://blogofholding.com/?p=512

I've found that when I'm grabbing a monster from an older source I run it against these calculations to make sure it's roughly in line. It's also incredibly easy to make your own monsters and be reasonably sure they won't be over or underpowered using that source.

e: Dang, I just noticed that the July errata has a similar table.

2010-11-23, 08:05 AM
Yes, they started using a different formula because the monsters from the first 2 books didn't do enough damage and had way too many hit points, resulting in long and boring fights.

2010-11-23, 08:16 AM
Agreed - I always glasscannon my monsters anyway - more so once their bloodied. Glad they regonised this.

2010-11-23, 10:42 AM
I think the hitpoints were adjusted for MM2 (especially for solos & elites), and damage was adjusted for MM3. Other non-numeric changes have happened in regards to monster design between MM1-MM3, which is why minions tend to be more interesting and solos more pimptastic in MM3.

If you want more of the classic MM1 monsters updated with the new math, I strongly recommend picking up the new Monster Vault that just came out. Look at the solos like dragons or the purple worm for a good example of how monster design (especially solos) have changed.

2010-11-23, 10:50 AM
What are the new HP calculations in MM3? Because the July errata uses exactly the same HP formulas as DMG when it came out, at least for non-solos. These monsters aren't squishier in the slightest, they just deal more damage.

Duos Greanleef
2010-11-23, 12:27 PM
Upon closer inspection, it would appear that things really aren't as all-around different as I'd originally thought. Also, the biggest difference I found was accounted for in the MM2 switch to HPx4 instead of HPx5 for solos. All of the following numbers are directly from the respective books.
At Level 01:
MM1: CON 10 / HP 22
MM2: CON 13 / HP 18 (side not: only discrepancy I found)
MM3: CON 10 / HP 22
At Level 15:
MM1: CON 22 / HP 182
MM2: CON 20 / HP 180
MM3: CON 24 / HP 184
At Level 27:
MM1: CON 30 / HP 254
MM2: CON 24 / HP 248
MM3: CON 18 / HP 242
At Level 30: (aka, the biggest change I've found)
Solo Soldier
MM1: CON 30 / HP 1390
MM3: CON 27 / HP 1100

I think what got me the most was the shell-shock from Llolth's apparent lack of hit points, but has been relieved with closer inspection. You'll have to excuse my earlier post. It was, well, early. :smalltongue: