Tarquin and Elan's mom

[MarkusWolfe]

How in the blazes did these 2 manage to get together?

Sure, we know they divorced because Taquin was LE and Elan's mom was CG, but that just begs the question: What circumstances had to occur to get them to hook up in the first place?

Right now, all I can guess is that they're in the top left corner of ye olde chart:
(see attachment on next post)

Cripes! There isn't an upload button anywhere! But anyways, back to the topic...

[hamishspence]

My guess is, Tarquin met her in the inn she worked at, took an attraction to her, turned on the charm, and stayed for a while.

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0760.html

Here, it's suggested his contribution to her veggie garden was "fertilizer".

[MarkusWolfe]

My guess is, Tarquin met her in the inn she worked at, took an attraction to her, turned on the charm, and stayed for a while.

You wrote 'charm' without capitalizing it; I'll presume that means you're not talking about the spell.

Ok, I can see this being an explanation for a flirting/one night stand/wench with benefits relationships. But barring a shotgun and arranged weddings, there's no way you can marry someone and have kids without learning a lot about their personalities (and presumably their alignments).

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I never understood how their relationship lasted long enough for marriage and children.

[Wargor]

But barring a shotgun and arranged weddings

Like some of his other weddings you mean? :smallwink:

[Carduus]

It's one of the oldest romantic cliches in the book: opposites attract. They're so different that their relationship felt fresh and new for a long time. If women go for the bad boy, how much badder do you get than a would-be brutal dictator?

[mucat]

So in real life, you've never known married couples of opposite alignments and incompatible personalities? Either you've been very fortunate, or a little bit blind.

It happens all the time. Why? "Love is blind", "I thought he/she could change", "Nobody else understands him/her like I do"...these are all clichés, but they got to be clichés for a reason.

[hamishspence]

You wrote 'charm' without capitalizing it; I'll presume that means you're not talking about the spell.

You are correct.

I suspect his traits showed through over time, with his liquifying of an obnoxious bar customer, being maybe a point when she realized that he wasn't going to change.

[Bulzeeb]

Keep in mind also that while OoTS is written from a modern perspective, the customs it depicts aren't necessarily as modern. I don't know much about antiquated forms of courtship, but I'd imagine that the pre-marriage period is less extensive and in-depth as it is today. Certainly the case where two unmarried people live together and see how the other handles day-to-day activities would never happen in ordinary society(so Haley and Elan are an exception to this). Perhaps the only pre-marriage interactions Tarquin and Elan's Mom really had only offered Elan's Mom brief glimpses of Tarquin's personality, which is charming and friendly, but not his character, which has utter disregard for other lives. Most social interactions will tell you a person's personality, but how often is it that you learn a person's true character?

[mucat]

Keep in mind also that while OoTS is written from a modern perspective, the customs it depicts aren't necessarily as modern.

Actually, it seems to me that they are. The OoTS world is technologically primitive by our standards (compensated to some extent by magic) but it seems socially modern. I don't just mean the author's perspective is modern, but the in-world characters' as well.

Granted, there are an awful lot of monarchies around (which, like the low technology, is just part of the standard fantasy milieu), but on issues from individual dignity to crime and punishment to sexuality, marriage, and family life, people seem to think like citizens of the twenty-first century.

I would imagine that Tarquin and Elan's Mom married for the same reasons that incompatible people marry in real life: they had all the information they needed to see that they were making a mistake, but they (or, at least, she) refused to see it.

[The Pilgrim]

How in the blazes did these 2 manage to get together?

Tarquin does not view women as people, but just as mere objects to satisfy his desires and dispose when there is no more fun.

So, when he meets Elan's Mom, his thought process is basically: "Dumb blonde. Big tits. Convenient."

We don't know much about Elan's Mom. But is thought process could very well have been: "He is fair, handsome, gallant... he has some umpleasant traits, too, but once he marries me, I can change him".

A 2x1 offsprings deal later, Tarquin grows bored and decides that he desires to have another object of pleasure, thus leaves Elan's Mom. Who may or may have not realized that you can't change the nature of a man.

[MarkusWolfe]

I just got back from another site. They suggested that they got together because they believed they were destined to be star crossed lovers and parents of heroes.

What do you make of this?

[hamishspence]

Tarquin does not view women as people, but just as mere objects to satisfy his desires and dispose when there is no more fun.

Now, yes- but then, we don't know for sure precisely what he was thinking.

[MightyTim]

Well, unless I'm wrong, all we know for sure is that Nale told Elan that's what happened. I don't have the strip handy, but I think it's possible that Nale didn't know the true story, and that's just what he assumed.

[hamishspence]

It's done as a flashback strip:

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0050.html

from the way it's phrased, Nale doesn't know why they split up.

[leakingpen]

My guess is, Tarquin met her in the inn she worked at, took an attraction to her, turned on the charm, and stayed for a while.

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0760.html

Here, it's suggested his contribution to her veggie garden was "fertilizer".

IE dead bodies.

[hamishspence]

That was pretty clear from the context.

[cho_j]

I just got back from another site. They suggested that they got together because they believed they were destined to be star crossed lovers and parents of heroes.

What do you make of this?

I kind of hope this is true, just so that Nale is the ONLY one in the family who does not find this awesome— he's the only member we've really met so far (I don't count the mom in that) who isn't all into being Genre Savvy. I think it would make family dinners HILARIOUS... if they were to ever have a family dinner (perhaps Empire Strikes Back style?). But maybe the Overcomplicated Plans gene and the Non-Genre Savvy gene are linked, so who knows, their mom might be just as NGS as Nale.

Anyway, I don't think that's really why they would have got together. From Tarquin's bitter description of their fights and subsequent divorce, I think they did what tons of now-divorced couples do: get infatuated with each other, glossing over warning signs of incompatibility as they went (especially the mom), and then find out when they were living and raising children together that some things can't BE glossed over and they were not happy. And granted, we've only heard Tarquin's side, but the way he tells it, one partner (the mom) got sick of the situation a lot faster than the other did. That's really not all that uncommon in break-ups. I don't think there's a Relationship Writing Fumble here, only very humanly flawed characters who had a very humanly flawed romance.

Dang it, now GaGa will be stuck in my head all afternoon. :(

[hamishspence]

The flashback strip implies that Tarquin was the one in court suing for divorce, though Tarquin says it was him who took her for court for visitation rights.

Which were resolved eventually by him getting custody of one child.

[MarkusWolfe]

Dang it, now GaGa will be stuck in my head all afternoon. :(

WHAT HAVE I DONE?!?!?!

[TreesOfDeath]

Chick's dig bad boys, ELan's mom is hot.






What you REALLY can't see that happening in real life? Girl falls for ******* cool guy and guy falls for hot girl with an incomptioable personality?

[Swordpriest]

To top it off, Elan's mom (I wish we knew her name :smallfrown:) is a bard, evidently. "Serve, serve, serve, serve the refreshing adult beverages" fits right in with that. That being the case, how could she resist such a drama-laden, plot-potential-filled relationship? :smallbiggrin:

[Lurk-Sothoth]

Sure, we know they divorced because Taquin was LE and Elan's mom was CG, but that just begs the question: What circumstances had to occur to get them to hook up in the first place?

Tarquin looks exactly like Elan with grey hair: witness Roy's *GASP!* (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0753.html) and Haley's remark that she doesn't mind learning that Elan will still look sexy with grey hair (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0726.html).

Why is it significant that Tarquin looks just like Elan? In the words of Therkla, Elan is "like, REALLY good-looking. Like, Grade-A, lock-the-bathroom-door, 'No, Ma, I'm just taking a long shower,' fantasy material (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0582.html)." :smallamused:

[Orzel]

They are both hot and didn't think about where the relationship would be in after a couple years.

HAPPENS ALL THE TIME!

[Callista]

Probably the way my LG mom married my CE stepdad. He basically made a lot of Bluff checks, after which he generally kicked people around, took most of her money and my college fund, and made a lot of Intimidate checks to keep her thinking that if she ever tried to get out of the relationship, she'd be alone and her kids would end up in foster care. Figuring he had everything under control, he failed to reckon on the LG fourteen-year-old in the house who gave the police evidence when he was arrested for counterfeiting money, and had to plead guilty and got probation instead of getting off scot-free. He didn't kick people around so much after that, knowing he'd end up in prison again if aforementioned fourteen-year-old reported domestic violence... eventually he just up and left.

They're divorced now and we still have no idea where he is. Good riddance, too! My family's tough; we've recovered, pretty much. I still bitch about it sometimes, like now. But trust me, oh, yeah, it can definitely happen; and to the nicest people, too. All it takes is a little naivete, a lot of lies, a lot of blind love, and whammo, you've got a ridiculously-opposed-alignment marriage going on.

[Ron Miel]

Childhood sweethearts. She stayed at home while Tarquin went off adventuring. He came back a few levels later and married her. Then he became more and more corrupt as he advanced in level. Eventually they were too different to continue their marriage.

[squidbreath]

I concur with the "he didn't show all his bad traits at first" theory. Most abusive girlfriend/boyfriend stories I've heard involve the aggressor being super nice for about a year or more before getting increasingly possessive and violent. (All of my mum's siblings married within 1-3 years of dating)

[Callista]

Yes, the sociopathic sort can be extremely charming. It's not just that they are charming at first and show their true nature later on; it's also that they can be charming in public--the family man, the neighborhood's go-to guy, the guy everybody knows and everybody likes--and absolutely evil behind closed doors. It can be very difficult for the people the sociopath victimizes to convince others that they are in such a bad situation, because he carefully maintains his public image. (I say "he" here because more sociopaths are male than female; but it can of course be a female, though her primary targets tend to be children rather than spouses).

[Katana_Geldar]

Girls want bad boys.

[Mando Knight]

Dang it, now GaGa will be stuck in my head all afternoon. :(

And now you can listen to it a cappella (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTFh8LCBZeQ). By a bunch of guys.

[pendell]

Probably the way my LG mom married my CE stepdad. He basically made a lot of Bluff checks, after which he generally kicked people around, took most of her money and my college fund, and made a lot of Intimidate checks to keep her thinking that if she ever tried to get out of the relationship, she'd be alone and her kids would end up in foster care. Figuring he had everything under control, he failed to reckon on the LG fourteen-year-old in the house who gave the police evidence when he was arrested for counterfeiting money, and had to plead guilty and got probation instead of getting off scot-free. He didn't kick people around so much after that, knowing he'd end up in prison again if aforementioned fourteen-year-old reported domestic violence... eventually he just up and left.

They're divorced now and we still have no idea where he is. Good riddance, too! My family's tough; we've recovered, pretty much. I still bitch about it sometimes, like now. But trust me, oh, yeah, it can definitely happen; and to the nicest people, too. All it takes is a little naivete, a lot of lies, a lot of blind love, and whammo, you've got a ridiculously-opposed-alignment marriage going on.

:Thumbs up to Callista:

Well done , that woman.

It occurs to me that any sort of human typically shows their charming side first. What, you think the first thing I show to people in job interviews or internet fora is my complete social maladjustment or ferociously bad temper? Nope.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

[NerfTW]

You wrote 'charm' without capitalizing it; I'll presume that means you're not talking about the spell.

Ok, I can see this being an explanation for a flirting/one night stand/wench with benefits relationships. But barring a shotgun and arranged weddings, there's no way you can marry someone and have kids without learning a lot about their personalities (and presumably their alignments).

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I never understood how their relationship lasted long enough for marriage and children.


And I thought I was naive. :P
People do stupid things for love.

[nac]

How in the blazes did these 2 manage to get together?
Meh, whirlwind romance? Those two were perfect for each other.

[cho_j]

And now you can listen to it a cappella (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTFh8LCBZeQ). By a bunch of guys.

My friend actually goes to that school and sent me that link the SECOND she got accepted! XD

[snikrept]

What I'm not understanding is how she survived the breakup. Apparently she still qualifies as "somebody" in Tarquin's book.

... possibly he still loves her. Though http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0050.html suggests he's the one who initiated the divorce.

[Capt Spanner]

:Thumbs up to Callista:

Well done , that woman.

It occurs to me that any sort of human typically shows their charming side first. What, you think the first thing I show to people in job interviews or internet fora is my complete social maladjustment or ferociously bad temper? Nope.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Hmm. You're habit of signing everything off with "Respectfully, Brian P." means that in my head you're basically played by Stephen Fry as he appears on QI.

I think Tarquin is easily capable of bluffing a LG image for several years. He's been bluffing an entire continent so far!

[Hawkfrost000]

I think Tarquin is easily capable of bluffing a LG image for several years. He's been bluffing an entire continent so far!

true, very true

DM

[Grendus]

To top it off, Elan's mom (I wish we knew her name :smallfrown:) is a bard, evidently. "Serve, serve, serve, serve the refreshing adult beverages" fits right in with that. That being the case, how could she resist such a drama-laden, plot-potential-filled relationship? :smallbiggrin:

This. Which ironically makes Elan smarter than his mom, since he actually decided that a stable relationship was more important than bardic drama (see his confession to Haley about Theralka).

[Lynn]

I don't think Tarquin really needed to bluff to hide his evilness. He sounds like Elan's mom's reaction when she realised he was evil surprised him. He doesn't see himself as evil, and he was obviously evil mostly because he now has the power to legalise slavery, gruesome punishment, order an evil feast, etc.
When Elan's mother met him she did not have a clue. All she saw was that he was (very) handsome, smart, charmfull and fun.
Elan obviously took his charisma from him and 18 charisma must be enough to make you overlook a lot of flaws, if only for a while.

[Cybertoy00]

Maybe Elan's mom (WHAT IS HER NAME?!) is such a nice woman that she honestly fell in love with Tarquin, evil tendencies aside. When it became apparent that his sociopathy had no limit or was getting out of control, she had to put on the brakes.
That's assuming that it was her idea to get divorced, as Tarquin says.

[Burner28]

Chick's dig bad boys, ELan's mom is hot.






What you REALLY can't see that happening in real life? Girl falls for ******* cool guy and guy falls for hot girl with an incomptioable personality?

That might be the casse though it is kinda hard to see from the art style.

[Aruius]

In my opinion, Elan's Mom and Tarquin decided to get the get together in order to make a hero. As Tarquin states in one of the newer strips, he wants Elan to defeat him and become a hero. As Tarquin is very well versed in the "laws" of literary drama (And we can assume Elan's mother is as well, seeing that evidence points to her being a bard), What wouldn't make a better story? "Son born from evil father and good mother overcomes evil father, overthrowing his empire and saving the world" (Very much like Star Wars)

It is possible that they only got together out of the desire to create a wonderful story, the only thing the two seem to have in common.