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Echoes
2010-12-06, 08:28 AM
Okay,

In the real-time game I play, the DM has a homebrew world that is his brainchild. He has spent years refining it and writing the cosmology. Every single NPC in every single town is fully statted out and has two pages of backstory and personality. There is an intricate system of divine with sub-groupings and their own history, probably with enough mythology to write a book.

This is all well and good, except that it has gotten to the point where it impedes mechanics. I'll go to use a spell a certain way that is very much within a reasonable, if even underwhelming, reading of its description, and I'll get the response "Sorry, magic doesn't work like that in this universe, so you can't". We are forced to spend thousands of gold in order to move from the adventure site to town (or choose to only spend a thousand and fight a CR 20+ encounter at level 6...), and yet this is not accounted for in the treasure obtained, so we end up pushed into a low-wealth campaign against higher-than-reasonable CR monsters.

And it has an even bigger effect on roleplay. I bring up that a certain event relevant to the campaign should have been covered by a god's portfolio sense, and he replies "Sorry, gods don't have that here." I try to write a background for an inspired character, but he says "Oh, if you would want to do that, then you would need to come from town X and be race Y, which is too far away for this campaign." This isn't even for terribly exotic things, some are just the standard "wizard goes to academy" type of backstory.

I would be willing to work with these little snags, except that they are consistently not told to us until after we've acted. I prepare a spell with a specific use in mind, then when I go to cast it I find out it doesn't do what I thought. He has me roll up a whole character and then only afterward write the background, and it's then I find out I'm not allowed to use the entire concept I just wrote for. So, here I am asking the playground: When your DM grows attached to his homebrew world to the point that story trumps playability, what do you do?

Yora
2010-12-06, 08:35 AM
The problem doesn't seem to be the setting, but that the Dm doesn't tell you the things your characters would know. Tell him that you need all such information that are relevant to your character concept.
I like heavily homebrewed settings, but if the dm sets that the campaign does not take place in a standard D&D setting, he has to tell you what kind of game you are playing instead.

Sir Swindle89
2010-12-06, 08:35 AM
Read what he has prepared for the world. Agree that if he forgets to tell you about a ruling then it's moot for the session.

I run homebrew worlds and only homebrew worlds (i don't like the players to know more about the world than i do :smallwink:) and i never have problems as long as i say thing like "long range teleports only work along ley lines" or "Only noble characters can be psionic" right at the beginning of the game, durring CC.

Psyx
2010-12-06, 08:52 AM
Tell the GM that his constant corrections are annoying. And pointless: How were you to know that the last king died of cholera aged 14?!

The GM needs to provide information IN ADVANCE if he expects players to live in such a world.

So basically, ask your GM to spend a session or two simply talking about the game world, or ask him to provide a 200 page cyclopedia on it for you. Hopefully, they'll get the hint: Overly complex backgrounds that the players don't know about, but are constantly corrected on are DULL.


cf: Every 'Dune' book after the first one.

GoatBoy
2010-12-06, 09:08 AM
Sounds like he has a story in mind and is not about to mess it up in the name of "fun."

Try and communicate to him that he either has to be clearer with his particular concept (campaign bible, with clear specifics on mechanics), or be more flexible according to the needs of his players. There's four(-ish) of you and only one of him, remember.

If that doesn't work, find a new DM.

Morithias
2010-12-06, 09:09 AM
Like the other two said, if a DM is going to do a homebrew world of that detail, he's either got to be a MASTER at improv and changing stuff on the fly, or better have a bloody pdf file for you weeks in advance.

Most of the time when we use "homebrew" settings, it pretty much boils down to "plot and a Schrodinger Armory"

Echoes
2010-12-06, 09:21 AM
Thank you for your quick responses. I came to him with that suggestion, and he said he would compile a few of the documents he has written about the world. However, he then said, "but I'm going to keep most of it secret". His justification is that he doesn't want us metagaming and reading entries in his own private monster manual so our characters happen to know exactly what tactics to use against monsters we've never encountered before. I countered that he should at least include everything a character who spent their entire lives in that world could reasonably know, and it turned into an argument about the medieval period, early modern Europe, and the Protestant Reformation.

Morithias
2010-12-06, 09:24 AM
Thank you for your quick responses. I came to him with that suggestion, and he said he would compile a few of the documents he has written about the world. However, he then said, "but I'm going to keep most of it secret". His justification is that he doesn't want us metagaming and reading entries in his own private monster manual so our characters happen to know exactly what tactics to use against monsters we've never encountered before. I countered that he should at least include everything a character who spent their entire lives in that world could reasonably know, and it turned into an argument about the medieval period, early modern Europe, and the Protestant Reformation.

Wow he's such a bad Dm even the arguments go off the rails. I kid I kid! XD

Just keep working at it, eventually you'll come to an agreement, after all The Empire of Blood wasn't build in a day.

Psyx
2010-12-06, 09:39 AM
Well, you obviously don't want monster stats!

It's fine all being secret if it's supposed to be. Basically you need to be given enough information that you're NEVER interrupted IC in order to be corrected on a point about the game world.

Sir Swindle89
2010-12-06, 09:39 AM
Thank you for your quick responses. I came to him with that suggestion, and he said he would compile a few of the documents he has written about the world. However, he then said, "but I'm going to keep most of it secret". His justification is that he doesn't want us metagaming and reading entries in his own private monster manual so our characters happen to know exactly what tactics to use against monsters we've never encountered before. I countered that he should at least include everything a character who spent their entire lives in that world could reasonably know, and it turned into an argument about the medieval period, early modern Europe, and the Protestant Reformation.

You don't need his monster manual (maby a listing and estimated CR) but you do need to know every thing about all your spells and any thing in the background your character could know. Just don't be a **** and metagame

KillianHawkeye
2010-12-06, 09:44 AM
Protip: check to make sure your character concept is valid before filling in all the details. :smallwink:

Serpentine
2010-12-06, 09:57 AM
You NEED to know all mechanics houserules in advance. He needs to realise that, because that is important for the very character you're playing - and why wouldn't your character know what your character can do?! Similarly, you need to know before you make your character what restrictions there are on race, class and background choices. Simple as that.

The rest, everyone else already said. You need to know the things about the campaign world that your character would know, and that your DM expects you to know - if he fails to tell you something you ought to know, then he has to deal with it, not punish you.

Just show 'im this thread :smallwink:

valadil
2010-12-06, 10:38 AM
Thank you for your quick responses. I came to him with that suggestion, and he said he would compile a few of the documents he has written about the world. However, he then said, "but I'm going to keep most of it secret".

Fine. World discovery is entertaining. Keeping monster stats secret is perfectly valid too.

But you need to be able to create characters without being corrected. If there's only one town and race that fits the wizard academy background, that information needs to be published.