Sorcerer into MAO.

[Master Thrower]

So im making a sorcerer and then going into MAO. (mage of the arcane order)
feats im taking-
Arcane Preperation (so I can enter the class)
Coop spell (same :smallfrown:)
Quicken spell
sculpt spell
and two spell focuses (so I can enter archmage)
My build goes something like this

Sorcerer 1-5
MAO 5-14
Archmage 15-20

The character will start at level ten. so up to fifth level spells.
So far i considered taking spell focus, conjuration and transmutation.
with the main ones being- grease, glitter dust, web, (stinking cloud/slow) and telekenisis. Ideas? thoughts?

Usable books- PH,PlH,DMG,CW,CadV,CD,CA,LB, Drc.

[Dusk Eclipse]

I am not sure if Spell focus (Conjuration) is a great investment, since the schools has many no-save just suck/die spells, if you are going to burn a feat on Spell focus, I would at least make it matter.

Maybe necromancy or enchantment, I am sure that with the spells from the spell pool you will be able to get some mileage out of those schools.

[Master Thrower]

I plan on taking many battle field control spells since with the spell pool i can just take a round to get rope trick/ teleport. (i'll still known DD though for a quick escape.) But I liked conjuration as it had spells that targeted many different types of saves. Enchanment felt as though it just targeted will, which transmutation mostly covers.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Does conjuration really targets all saves? hmmm I can't remember of-hand but if you are right, then I see no problems with it.

[Master Thrower]

a few ones that i'd cast pretty often.
Grease- reflex,
glitterdust-will,
stinking cloud-fort

[Safety Sword]

Phew, for a second there I thought you were trying to turn your sorcerer into Mao (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mao_Zedong)

[Black_Zawisza]

Phew, for a second there I thought you were trying to turn your sorcerer into Mao (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mao_Zedong)
Tier -1: Mao
Tier 0: DM
Tier 1: Wizard

[Jack_Simth]

Does conjuration really targets all saves? hmmm I can't remember of-hand but if you are right, then I see no problems with it.
It can target all three saves at 2nd level spells, even:
Glitterdust (Will)
Cloud of Bewilderment (Spell Compendium) (Fort)
Web (Reflex)

[Master Thrower]

It can target all three saves at 2nd level spells, even:
Glitterdust (Will)
Cloud of Bewilderment (Spell Compendium) (Fort)
Web (Reflex)

Im not sure Spell compendium is allowed, but i also use transmutation because at high levels it also targets many saves,
The transmutes- Reflex I believe?
Disintegrate-fort
Telekensisis- Will

[Jack_Simth]

Im not sure Spell compendium is allowed, but i also use transmutation because at high levels it also targets many saves,
The transmutes- Reflex I believe?
Disintegrate-fort
Telekensisis- Will

Ah, Transmute Rock to Mud allows a reflex save... if you cast it on the ceiling above someone, and Transmute Mud to Rock gives a reflex save to someone standing in the targeted mud. Hmm.

[Master Thrower]

Any other suggestitions for second spell focus?

[Jack_Simth]

Any other suggestitions for second spell focus?Pick it after you've picked your spell list, grabbing Spell Focus based on which spells you have the most of?

Transmutation has some gems.

[GoodbyeSoberDay]

See if you can get Races of the Dragon allowed. Wings of Cover is wonderful, even if you aren't dragonblooded. The same goes for Arcane Spellsurge from Dragon Magic.

Flaws are always nice. Note that, unless you're going Metamagic Specialist, it's going to be hard to actually use quicken spell. You might want to swap it out for Heighten Spell.

[alchemyprime]

a few ones that i'd cast pretty often.
Grease- reflex,
glitterdust-will,
stinking cloud-fort

Is it bad that I read that as "stinking cloud-fart"?

Also, what about the teleports? Isn't there one that teleports someone else somewhere?

[Jack_Simth]

See if you can get Races of the Dragon allowed. Wings of Cover is wonderful, even if you aren't dragonblooded. The same goes for Arcane Spellsurge from Dragon Magic.

Flaws are always nice. Note that, unless you're going Metamagic Specialist, it's going to be hard to actually use quicken spell. You might want to swap it out for Heighten Spell.Actually, it'll be fairly simple - he's got Arcane Preparation anyway.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Baleful Transposition/teleport (don't remember which one is the correct name) ... IIRC it targeted will and was in the Spell compendium.

[Master Thrower]

Pick it after you've picked your spell list, grabbing Spell Focus based on which spells you have the most of?

Transmutation has some gems.

I was thinking something along the lines of these for my 5th level and higher spells. most of my lower ones are certain which ones i'll do. This is up to level 14.

5- telekensis, cone of cold? dominate person.
6 disintigrate, antimagic field,
7. finger of death.

[GoodbyeSoberDay]

Actually, it'll be fairly simple - he's got Arcane Preparation anyway.Right. That does negate the advantage of spontaneous metamagic use, though, and 'getting it wrong' on which spells to quicken hurts quite a bit due to the high level spell slots being used.

[Master Thrower]

Right. That does negate the advantage of spontaneous metamagic use, though, and 'getting it wrong' on which spells to quicken hurts quite a bit due to the high level spell slots being used.

well a quickened grease/magic missle ( as im starting at tenth level) never hurts when I only known when 5th level spell but have 3 5th level slots.

[Dusk Eclipse]

This (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=2180.0) is a good place to get sorcerer advice. And I am not sure should be getting Finger of Death, I am sure there are better spells out there.

[GoodbyeSoberDay]

well a quickened grease/magic missle ( as im starting at tenth level) never hurts when I only known when 5th level spell but have 3 5th level slots.You might want to cast one of your fifth level spells more than once. For instance, if you had Arcane Fusion as one of your 5th level spells known, it would effectively be a quickened first level whatever-you-want, plus a spell of fourth level or lower. Fourth level like Polymorph. AF is a spell I'd cast more than once. Speaking of Polymorph, though, what's the optimization level of your party?

[Master Thrower]

You might want to cast one of your fifth level spells more than once. For instance, if you had Arcane Fusion as one of your 5th level spells known, it would effectively be a quickened first level whatever-you-want, plus a spell of fourth level or lower. Fourth level like Polymorph. AF is a spell I'd cast more than once. Speaking of Polymorph, though, what's the optimization level of your party?

Its a campain with moderate optimization. we have our member with the least experience being the frontline fighter so im looking for the battle field control element. No over the top, gate loops, polymorph breaking, etc. polymorph is allowed but we generally dont use it to break the world. I'd rather not take it as we just had a wizard who liked to use it every encounter.

[Jack_Simth]

Right. That does negate the advantage of spontaneous metamagic use, though, and 'getting it wrong' on which spells to quicken hurts quite a bit due to the high level spell slots being used.
Yes... but there's a few mitigating factors:
1) You don't have to prepare all your slots - just a handful of them. Oh yes, and nothing stops you from taking fifteen minutes to prepare one later in the day, if you've got slots available (just as a Wizard can).
2) As a Sorcerer, you're going to be picking spells that are fairly generically useful, regardless. The OP is starting at tenth. Hard to go wrong with a Quickened Shield; a Quickened Grease is wonderful if there's a melee character about (almost nothing has ranks in Balance... and that Fighter in Full Plate, that not only has no ranks in Balance, but has a six-point penalty to the skill due to armor & shield, is going to spend a bit more time than normal stuck in the Greased area, as he generally needs a 15 or so to move at all, and an eleven or so to avoid falling over). A Quickened Obscuring Mist is wonderful if you face something ranged. If you make use of ranged Touch Attacks, a Quickened True Strike can be gold, and a Quickened Ray of Enfeeblement is worth the swift action on any Brute. If you really don't know what you want, a Quickened Magic Missile is pretty much guaranteed to be at least a little useful if you're not fighting something with Shield (or similar).

[Master Thrower]

Still stuck on what my second spell focus should be...
tranmutation- looks good,
enchantment- all will saves
illusion- same problem as above
necromancy?

[sreservoir]

why are you taking ten levels of MAO? drop it after 7, because you get no benefit from New Spell, bonus feats aren't that hard to get elsewhere, and the capstone is just lame.

[Master Thrower]

why are you taking ten levels of MAO? drop it after 7, because you get no benefit from New Spell, bonus feats aren't that hard to get elsewhere, and the capstone is just lame.

well cause I can take it up till 9. and Im not sure what else i'd take till I could hit archmage

[GoodbyeSoberDay]

well cause I can take it up till 9. and Im not sure what else i'd take till I could hit archmageFatespinner is decent filler. Very light requirements, interesting abilities that don't break anything, no fuss, no muss.

[Master Thrower]

ok. but still need a second spell focus. ideas?

[GoodbyeSoberDay]

I would go for Transmutation. Slow and Glass Strike come to mind.