Prestige Classes

[Curious]

Hi there, I am going to ask a question that most of you will probably think is rather obvious. For my entire role playing career, I have played using AD&D, first edition rules, since they were the rules my DM introduced me to. I have only been playing for about three years, and I am just now deciding to play a game of Pathfinders, and I just want to clarify: what the heck is a prestige class? The online rules state that you cannot become a Red Mantis assassin or some such without a certain level in several skills, which cannot be gained without going up several levels. Yet the prestige class skills list starts at level one and works its way up, so I am a bit confused.
Could someone perhaps just give me a general rundown on what a prestige class is? Thanks for your time.

[Mongoose87]

You need to read up on how multi-classing works in 3.5 and pathfinder. Then, this will make a lot more sense to you.

[Defiant]

Dungeon Master's Guide - page 176

[tuesdayscoming]

Basically, you level up in a given base class (fighter, rogue, wizard, etc.) until you meet the BAB/skill/spellcasting requirements of the prestige class you want to enter. So if you are a level 5 paladin, level 1 blackguard, you get all the abilities of a level 5 paladin PLUS the abilities of level 1 blackguard.

Note that in this particular example I am ignoring the alignment requirements of both classes. Most likely if you were to take this particular build you would actually end up as a level 5 EX-paladin, level 1 blackguard.

[Curious]

Oh! It becomes clear now; I can understand the system. Thanks for the help everyone, this should make things go much smoother!:smallsmile:

[HunterOfJello]

Prestige Classes can be really cool for character builds. Some of them make a character more diverse in their overall abilities, occasionally at the cost of power. Others make a character better at doing one specific role or type of action at the cost of diversity. Also, there are a few that make a character stronger with no cost or weaker with a great cost. It all depends on the prestige class.

With a very long list of base classes and a massive list of prestige classes, 3.5e allows characters to follow almost any path while still adhering to the stricter rules of the edition.

[Curious]

Okay, in a related question; what would be a good weapon set up for a rogue? Two-weapon fighting, single weapon, or other?

[Dusk Eclipse]

Obligatory Handbook link (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8711233) Warining, you might not want to post in that thread, I am not sure if it already on the thread necromancy threshold but its better to be safe than sorry

I prefer two-weapon fighting myself, but some people prefer archery.

[Keld Denar]

TWF is decent if you can get your attack bonus up. You can do pretty decent with a single weapon as well. The actual weapon doesn't make much difference as most of your damage comes from SA dice.

[Curious]

I managed to nail a twenty for my dexterity- we use a very generous dice rolling method -so I think I may use TW fighting. So, if I had two weapons and SA'd, would I get extra damage for both weapons?

[Dusk Eclipse]

Sneak attack is kinda binary

It checks for conditions that activate SA (IE Flanking)
first attack: check flanking? yes-> sneak attack
second attack: check flanking? yes-> sneak attack.

Kinda like this.

[Kalaska'Agathas]

Yes, so long as your enemy is flat footed, flanked, or otherwise denied his Dex bonus to AC for both attacks.

If you have the feats to spare (TWFing takes a lot of feats to work well) I'd spend one feat on Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Kusari-Gama (It's on page 145 in the Dungeon Master's Guide) which will give you reach so you can full attack more often (you have to move less, as you threaten a larger area). They're pretty perfect for Rogues, one handed (so you can TWF), finesseable (as they're light weapons), and have reach while threatening adjacent.

[Curious]

Hm, looks like two-weapon fighting should be good for me then, as I'm trying to create a rogue that can kill enemies as quickly and quietly as possible. What do you think about a few levels in assassin?

[Dusk Eclipse]

Have you checked that link I posted before? it has some incredible advice.

And yeah, assassin is a good class, the pre-reqs(other than the alignment one) will be met by almost all rogues automatically so in a sense you won't be trading anything to gain a nice boost (spells are awesome, poison use is situational but good when you actually can use it, Death attack is incredibly difficult to use effectively unless you are on a solo game)

And I suggest you pay attention to the Iron Chef competition hosted on the forum, the secret ingredient is Assassin, so you might get a few ideas from it.

[Curious]

I did check out that link, and found it very informative, so thank you. I may check out this other 'Iron Chef' thread, and see whats up.

[Keld Denar]

Another idea for you is to take levels in the Swashbuckler base class from Complete Warrior. Another book, Complete Scoundrel, has a feat called Daring Outlaw in it that allows you to stack your levels of Rogue and Swashbuckler together to determine how many SA dice you get. Thus, if you have 4 levels of Rogue and 16 levels of Swashbuckler, you have the same number of SA dice as a level 20 Rogue.

This allows you to stack lots of SA dice on a nearly full BAB chassis with a few extra HP. You lose out on skill points and those neat rogue special abilities. Its a trade off, but a pretty decent one if you want to focus mostly on melee combat.

[Curious]

I think what I am going to do is go up to about level five as a rogue, and then take a few levels in Assassin. Finally, I'll an undetermined number of Shadow-dancer levels, as their hide in plain sight and shadow step powers would be amazingly useful to an Assassin. What do you think?

[Keld Denar]

Shadowdancer is ok. Its very feat intensive to get in, which makes it rough to fit with TWFing. Also, the Spring Attack line doesn't work out well with TWFing since you don't get the benefit of of TWFing while you are attacking. Plus, it doesn't advance SA damage, which is your bread and butter.

[Endarire]

Tier System for Classes (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=1002.0)

Get to know which classes get which options.

[Psyren]

Tier System for Classes (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=1002.0)

Get to know which classes get which options.

There's a newer version actually. (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=5293.0)

And for proof that the tier system is good, The Giant himself (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0764.html) gave it a shoutout. How cool is that? :smallsmile:

[Dusk Eclipse]

I think what I am going to do is go up to about level five as a rogue, and then take a few levels in Assassin. Finally, I'll an undetermined number of Shadow-dancer levels, as their hide in plain sight and shadow step powers would be amazingly useful to an Assassin. What do you think?

I think shadow dancer is not worth it, if you only want HiPS and shadow step, Assassins get HiPS at level 8 (ECl 13 at the earliest) and get dimension door on their spell list, they still advance sneak attack, and won't burn your precious feats on pre-requisites.

[Greenish]

I did check out that link, and found it very informative, so thank you. I may check out this other 'Iron Chef' thread, and see whats up.Notice though that Iron Chef uses 3.5 assassin, which isn't quite the same as PF's assassin.

[Duke of URL]

Finally, I'll an undetermined number of Shadow-dancer levels

Wait... Shadowdancer actually has more than one level?