Multiple Weapon Enhancements of the Same Kind

[fireinakasha]

So I was just rolling random magical loot for no good reason (let's call it boredom), and an interesting situation occurred - I got the same weapon enhancement twice. At first, I was just going to mindlessly reroll, but then I got to thinking and something clicked into place for me.

What if you had a weapon with the same type of enhancement, twice. Now, I know some things, like extra damage, attack bonuses, etc., won't stack with themselves, by the rules of stacking, but what about something that doesn't grant numeric bonuses? I've looked all around the SRD, and besides the numeric stacking rules, I don't see anything that says that a magic weapon can't have multiples of the same special ability, or that redundant applications of the same special ability don't function.

For instance, if I made a +1 Spell Storing Spell Storing Spell Storing Longsword (for a total +4 weapon), would I be able to store three spells in it and have them all go off at once? Or if I made a +1 Disrupting Disrupting mace, would any unfortunate undead it struck have to make two saves or be destroyed? Would a +1 Mighty Cleaving Great Sword of Mighty Cleaving allow me to make two additional cleave attempts?

Can someone with more ranks in knowledge (rules) than me illuminate the matter?

[Gralamin]

IIRC there are no rules specifically stating that you cannot do this, but there are implications from the stacking rules that you cannot - That is you cannot store three spells, since the property is coming from the same source, and thus violates the rule that in order to gain the benefits of multiple effects they have to be from a different source.

[fireinakasha]

IIRC there are no rules specifically stating that you cannot do this, but there are implications from the stacking rules that you cannot - That is you cannot store three spells, since the property is coming from the same source, and thus violates the rule that in order to gain the benefits of multiple effects they have to be from a different source.

I get this, and I can see where the argument could be made towards this. But:


Modifiers

A modifier is any bonus or penalty applying to a die roll. A positive modifier is a bonus, and a negative modifier is a penalty.

Stacking

In most cases, modifiers to a given check or roll stack (combine for a cumulative effect) if they come from different sources and have different types (or no type at all), but do not stack if they have the same type or come from the same source (such as the same spell cast twice in succession). If the modifiers to a particular roll do not stack, only the best bonus and worst penalty applies. Dodge bonuses and circumstance bonuses however, do stack with one another unless otherwise specified.

At least in the SRD, the stacking rules appear to only apply to numeric bonuses to dice rolls, not the use of triggered/activated effects.

This is probably going to end up coming down to the age-old argument of "DM gets the final say".

[T.G. Oskar]

So I was just rolling random magical loot for no good reason (let's call it boredom), and an interesting situation occurred - I got the same weapon enhancement twice. At first, I was just going to mindlessly reroll, but then I got to thinking and something clicked into place for me.

What if you had a weapon with the same type of enhancement, twice. Now, I know some things, like extra damage, attack bonuses, etc., won't stack with themselves, by the rules of stacking, but what about something that doesn't grant numeric bonuses? I've looked all around the SRD, and besides the numeric stacking rules, I don't see anything that says that a magic weapon can't have multiples of the same special ability, or that redundant applications of the same special ability don't function.

For instance, if I made a +1 Spell Storing Spell Storing Spell Storing Longsword (for a total +4 weapon), would I be able to store three spells in it and have them all go off at once? Or if I made a +1 Disrupting Disrupting mace, would any unfortunate undead it struck have to make two saves or be destroyed? Would a +1 Mighty Cleaving Great Sword of Mighty Cleaving allow me to make two additional cleave attempts?

Can someone with more ranks in knowledge (rules) than me illuminate the matter?

Synergy enhancements (from Dungeon Master's Guide II, reprinted and enhanced in Magic Item Compendium) works on a related premise. I'd say that if you roll the same effects, and there's a synergy enhancement belonging to that, to focus on it. For example: rolling Flaming twice should turn into a Flaming Surge, rolling Bane twice and ending with the same type of creature should end on a Fiercebane, and so on.

Another good idea is to place a higher-level effect, if it works. For example, Flaming + Flaming = Flaming Burst.

However, thing is that you can't have a duplicate special ability on any weapon. Look at the Weapon Special Abilities tables; it indicates you must reroll if you get a duplicate special ability (meaning, if you roll Spell Storing twice you have to reroll the second one). High level powers and Synergy enhancements work on the idea that you might want to improve your weapon or give it a little extra edge because of this; or at least, that's the intention. So, while by RAW it's not viable, you can decide to instead provide a synergy bonus or an upgrade to the original, counting that the total enhancement bonus remains the same (in most cases, it does: synergy adds +1 to the effective enhancement bonus of the weapon, and the upgrades are +1 higher occasionally).

[Curmudgeon]

At least in the SRD, the stacking rules appear to only apply to numeric bonuses to dice rolls, not the use of triggered/activated effects.
Most weapon enhancements add bonuses to your attack and/or damage rolls. Flaming, for instance, adds 1d6 fire damage, so two instances of flaming would be modifiers to your damage roll from the same source. This falls under the stacking rules.

[endoperez]

Most weapon enhancements add bonuses to your attack and/or damage rolls. Flaming, for instance, adds 1d6 fire damage, so two instances of flaming would be modifiers to your damage roll from the same source. This falls under the stacking rules.

Yes, the first post mentions that this only works (IF it works) with the non-numerical bonuses.

[Person_Man]

I'm too lazy to reread the Rules Compendium right now, but my group has always ruled that benefits of the same type never stack unless they explicitly say otherwise (like Dodge bonuses). For example, Enlarge Person does not stack with Expansion. If you shoot +1 Flaming Arrows out of a +1 Flaming Longbow, then it's only +1 Flaming attacks, not +1 Flaming*2 attacks. (But if you fire +1 Flaming Arrows out of a +1 Frost Longbow, it's +1 Flaming Frost attacks). And so on. So I would personally rule against having duplicate enhancements on the same magic item. But that's just my DM horse sense, not a RAW ruling AFAIK.

[Endarire]

Here's my rule:

Ypu can get a +1 Flaming Flaming Flaming Flaming Flaming weapon. You've just invested a buncha resources to get a +1 weapon with +5d6 fire damage when other means of boosting damage are probably cheaper.

You can't get a +1 Defending Defending Keen Keen weapon since Defending is redundant and Keen doesn't stack with itself.