geomancer and archivest.

[Fouredged Sword]

Ok geomancer. I have been looking at the class and I am wondering if this is doable.

Ok we have an archivest main chacter with druidy themes. You love divine scrolls, but you branch out into something a bit better.

You get leadership. You get a cohort who is a wizard based geomancer. Your cohort can prepare wizard spells as divine spells and make scrolls of them for your main character.

This grants the archivest access to the whole wizard spell list.

does this work? If so is there a way to get a cohort into geomancer without having to bog himself down with levels of a divine caster? The fastest I can think of off hand is a level of favored soul and versitile spellcaster.

[Goonthegoof]

RAW I don't think it works, the part where it says 'may use his wisdom modifier to set the save DC for his arcane spells' implies though they can pick and choose arcane and divine spell requirements, the arcane spells remain arcane and the divine spells remain divine.

[dextercorvia]

He doesn't even have to be a Geomancer.

If you work together, he can provide the spell and you can be the creator. The type of scroll is determined by the creator's class. So since you are a divine caster, the scroll will be a divine scroll of a wizard spell.


Prerequisites

Certain requirements must be met in order for a character to create a magic item. These include feats, spells, and miscellaneous requirements such as level, alignment, and race or kind. The prerequisites for creation of an item are given immediately following the item’s caster level.

A spell prerequisite may be provided by a character who has prepared the spell (or who knows the spell, in the case of a sorcerer or bard), or through the use of a spell completion or spell trigger magic item or a spell-like ability that produces the desired spell effect. For each day that passes in the creation process, the creator must expend one spell completion item or one charge from a spell trigger item if either of those objects is used to supply a prerequisite.

It is possible for more than one character to cooperate in the creation of an item, with each participant providing one or more of the prerequisites. In some cases, cooperation may even be necessary.

If two or more characters cooperate to create an item, they must agree among themselves who will be considered the creator for the purpose of determinations where the creator’s level must be known. The character designated as the creator pays the XP required to make the item.

If you have him be a Warlock12 you can get any spell in the game.

[Stegyre]

If you work together, he can provide the spell and you can be the creator. The type of scroll is determined by the creator's class. So since you are a divine caster, the scroll will be a divine scroll of a wizard spell.
You are trying to exploit very poorly written RAW. Arguably, this tactic does not work at all, because there's no such thing as a "divine scroll of a wizard spell":
The spell must be of the correct type (arcane or divine). Arcane spellcasters (wizards, sorcerers, and bards) can only use scrolls containing arcane spells, and divine spellcasters (clerics, druids, paladins, and rangers) can only use scrolls containing divine spells. (The type of scroll a character creates is also determined by his or her class.)

More importantly, however, Archivists may only learn divine spells (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20051007a&page=3).

Thus, even if you may create such a contradictory creature as a divine scroll of an arcane spell, it would do the Archivist no good. The arcane spell remains an arcane spell, and beyond the class ability of an Archivist.

[dextercorvia]

You are trying to exploit very poorly written RAW. Arguably, this tactic does not work at all, because there's no such thing as a "divine scroll of a wizard spell":


However, if we are talking about an Archivist using leadership to learn more spells -- I rather doubt that this particular exploit would be frowned upon.

That said, your quote is the the rest of the basis for the trick. The creator's class level determines whether the scroll is considered arcane or divine. You may be on to something that this doesn't in fact make the spell divine, which would defeat the purpose in this case.

Normally a wizard is limited in use of scrolls that are on his list, and therefore are automatically arcane.

[dextercorvia]

Sorry for the double post but this is perhaps more pertinent to the OP.

Cohorts that would also work here are:

Cleric with the Spell domain. Anyspell and Greater Anyspell allow them to prepare up to 2nd and 5th level wizard spells in their domain slot. These spells can be scrolled, and are definitely divine spells.

You could also give a cleric 4 levels of Prestige Paladin, and the feat Sword of the Arcane Order. There are deity requirements and it is Realms specific, but that could possibly be refluffed. That puts the cohort down four spellcasting levels from the main character, meaning you can learn any wizard spell up to two levels lower than your highest. At mid levels the first option is better, and looks less broken.

[Fouredged Sword]

That is what the geomancer is for. The goemancer can change the description to from arcane to divine for spells he may cast. Thus he can make a divine version of wizard spells in divine scrolls. The spell itself becomes divine, so the archivest may copy it into his prayer book.

[dextercorvia]

That is what the geomancer is for. The goemancer can change the description to from arcane to divine for spells he may cast. Thus he can make a divine version of wizard spells in divine scrolls. The spell itself becomes divine, so the archivest may copy it into his prayer book.

Geomancer blends aspects though, it doesn't actually change the type of spell.

Southern Magician and Alternative Source Spell each do that, though, and may be a much simpler option. Realms specific and Dragon though, so YMMV.

[Stegyre]

Cleric with the Spell domain. Anyspell and Greater Anyspell allow them to prepare up to 2nd and 5th level wizard spells in their domain slot. These spells can be scrolled, and are definitely divine spells.
To the contrary: they are quite explicitly still arcane spells. Reread the description (SpC). Nothing says that they become divine spells; instead, it repeatedly emphasizes the arcane nature. For example, "Once you choose and prepare an arcane spell, you retain it in your mind."; "When you cast the arcane spell, it works just as though cast by a wizard of your cleric level . . . ."

By RAW, Alternative Source Spell probably would work. This is the problem with a lot of Dragon material: if WotC text is often poorly worded and written in apparent ignorance of obvious implications, Dragon text tends to raise such problems to the next order of magnitude. The GM who would permit this gets what he (or she) deserves.

Southern Magician is more problematic. The feat provides only that you may "cast" a spell as the alternative type (divine cast as arcane; arcane cast as divine). "The actual source of the spell's power doesn't change, nor does its means of preparation. You are merely weaving the strands of magic together in an unconventional way that makes the spell behave somewhat differently."
Note also that mixing participants in item creation leads to other problems. Suppose that a cleric 20 and wizard 1 combine to create a Magic Missile scroll. Can they agree that the cleric will be the "creator," so it has CL 20?? By RAW, they conceivably can, but this is a case of very badly written RAW.

[dextercorvia]

To the contrary: they are quite explicitly still arcane spells. Reread the description (SpC). Nothing says that they become divine spells; instead, it repeatedly emphasizes the arcane nature. For example, "Once you choose and prepare an arcane spell, you retain it in your mind."; "When you cast the arcane spell, it works just as though cast by a wizard of your cleric level . . . ."

I hadn't noticed that. I was working off of the Divine Casters cast divine spells assumption. That opens up an entirely different set of exploits.

[Stegyre]

I hadn't noticed that. I was working off of the Divine Casters cast divine spells assumption. That opens up an entirely different set of exploits.
Potentially yes, in that it would nominally allow a single-class cleric to qualify for a PrC that requires arcane spells, but read carefully: most such class will grant progression in an "arcane spell casting class."

Cleric is not such a class, and having the Spell Domain does not make it one, so you'd have a character in a PrC that isn't gaining any of the arcane spell casting advancement that is a principal perq.

[Tyndmyr]

You are trying to exploit very poorly written RAW. Arguably, this tactic does not work at all, because there's no such thing as a "divine scroll of a wizard spell":

More importantly, however, Archivists may only learn divine spells (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20051007a&page=3).

Thus, even if you may create such a contradictory creature as a divine scroll of an arcane spell, it would do the Archivist no good. The arcane spell remains an arcane spell, and beyond the class ability of an Archivist.

Er, Alternative source spell? It then becomes a divine spell, and thus, a divine scroll. No biggie.

Divine bard is probably more practical, though.

[Stegyre]

Er, Alternative source spell? It then becomes a divine spell, and thus, a divine scroll. No biggie.
And if you read a little further up, you'd see:

By RAW, Alternative Source Spell probably would work. This is the problem with a lot of Dragon material: if WotC text is often poorly worded and written in apparent ignorance of obvious implications, Dragon text tends to raise such problems to the next order of magnitude. The GM who would permit this gets what he (or she) deserves.


Divine bard is probably more practical, though.
Yes, and that does work. A player just needs to have the DM approve that variant and then the character needs to find one, so s/he can be recruited as a cohort/follower/hireling/whatever.

(Things like this are yet another example of WotC not thinking through the consequences.)

[dextercorvia]

Potentially yes, in that it would nominally allow a single-class cleric to qualify for a PrC that requires arcane spells, but read carefully: most such class will grant progression in an "arcane spell casting class."

Cleric is not such a class, and having the Spell Domain does not make it one, so you'd have a character in a PrC that isn't gaining any of the arcane spell casting advancement that is a principal perq.

Most, but not all. Fatespinner, IIRC. Dweomerkeeper is another example. I'm sure there are more.

ETA: Is there any definition of Arcane Spellcasting Class other than a class that grants the ability to cast arcane spells through its class features? If not, then I think the Spell domain (and Anyspell, Greater Anyspell), being a class feature would qualify, by RAW.

[Stegyre]

ETA: Is there any definition of Arcane Spellcasting Class other than a class that grants the ability to cast arcane spells through its class features? If not, then I think the Spell domain (and Anyspell, Greater Anyspell), being a class feature would qualify, by RAW.
Not in the Glossary (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/glossary&term=&alpha=A). However, the Glossary does explicitly define "bards, sorcerers and wizards" as those who cast arcane spells, and includes similar language w.r.t. clerics for divine spells.

That's not to say you can't make your argument to your DM, but wear a helmet.

(And yes, many PrCs do not limit their progression to arcane casting, but then you're just advancing your divine casting, which you'd already be able to do. You could also potentially use this argument to get early entry into a class like Mystic Theurge with only Wizard 1, but there are better ways to do that, so this isn't exactly all that useful.)

[dextercorvia]

It is a help for Dweomerkeeper and Geomancer (relating back to the OP) since they require both, but only advance one.