Strength Build

[Jallorn]

I know there's a couple classes out there that make for a ridiculously powerful Str based character, but I can only find the one, Hulking Hurler. What else is involved?

[Urpriest]

Cancer Mage for infinite strength.

Illumian for Str to bonus spells.

Warhulk for lots and lots of strength if you're not abusing Cancer Mage.

[Jallorn]

Cancer Mage for infinite strength.

Illumian for Str to bonus spells.

Warhulk for lots and lots of strength if you're not abusing Cancer Mage.

Warhulk, that's what I was looking for. What book is that in?

[Urpriest]

Warhulk, that's what I was looking for. What book is that in?

Miniatures Handbook.

[Derjuin]

The Warhulk's in Miniatures Handbook, page 22. Ninja'd :smalltongue:

[Godskook]

Frenzied Berserker is also worth a look. Gets full BAB, +10 Str in frenzy, and improved PA.

[Jallorn]

Actually, now I'm looking for the most efficient race and templates for boosting Str, that is, the ones that give the most Str for the least LA.

[ericgrau]

Half minotaur mineral warrior and goliath are among the most borderline broken / high optimization templates and race.

[Jallorn]

Half minotaur mineral warrior and goliath are among the most borderline broken / high optimization templates and race.

What books are those from? Unfortunately, Crystal Keep had to take down all their DnD stuff.

[Goonthegoof]

Goliath is Races of Stone, but an orc gets the same amount of strength for no LA, take dragonborn water orc over goliath unless you have another reason to take goliath.

Half minotaur is from dragon 313, lol-touched (+6 str +6 con 1 LA) is from MM4, feral is from savage species and mineral warrior is from underdark. Mineral warrior is more of a tank template though.

[Douglas]

Actually, now I'm looking for the most efficient race and templates for boosting Str, that is, the ones that give the most Str for the least LA.
Browse through this thread (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19873078/Hulking_Hurler_build), where a large number of forum posters scoured rulebooks over many months to get as much carrying capacity (mostly from strength) as possible at ECL 20 while still fitting in Hulking Hurler. Pick any random page and you'll probably find something insane for strength boosting being discussed on that page. The other thing you'll see being discussed a lot is how many trillions (or quadrillions, or quintillions, or however many digits they got to) of dice of damage the latest Hurler's boulder does.

[Goonthegoof]

With a level adjustment of +2 you could get a lolth-touched half minotaur water orc, that'd give you
Large size
Str +22
Dex -2
Con +14
Int -4
Cha -2
NA +4
Speed 40'
1d8 Gore Attack
Track
Scent
+2 Search, Spot, Listen
+4 Hide, Move Silently
Darkvision 60'
Natural Swimmer
Immune to fear

[yilduz]

With a level adjustment of +2 you could get a lolth-touched half minotaur water orc, that'd give you
Large size
Str +22
Dex -2
Con +14
Int -4
Cha -2
NA +4
Speed 40'
1d8 Gore Attack
Track
Scent
+2 Search, Spot, Listen
+4 Hide, Move Silently
Darkvision 60'
Natural Swimmer
Immune to fear

All of that for LA +2?
:smallconfused:

[Goonthegoof]

If he replaces the water orc with incarnate construct warforged he'll lose 4 str, gain 2 int and get all of it for LA +0.

[MammonAzrael]

All of that for LA +2?
:smallconfused:

Half-Minotaur is responsible for most of the craziness...it's a stupid broken template.

And Lolth-Touched will force you to be Chaotic Evil...and you can't be Good or Lawful in the first place to acquire it.

[Goonthegoof]

If you're looking for a way of making that strength useful in melee then you can ignore hulking hurler, take 6 levels of dungeoncrasher fighter and 5 levels of warforged charger (which you technically qualify for if you take adamantine body at first level despite no longer being a construct). Take a level of spirit lion totem barbarian for free pounce and maybe frenzied berserker for bonus strength if you want.

Pick up the Feathered Wings graft (10k) for fly speed of twice your normal land speed, the Goring Horn graft (8k) for a useful natural weapon and free improved bull rush, then take feats like knockback, leap attack and shock trooper.

Fly into the air above someone and smack them into the ground with a spiked chain or something take one exotic weapon master level and get the uncanny blow feature, dealing twice your strength when wielding a one handed exotic weapon in two hands.

You should be hitting 4 to 5 times a round, dealing 12d6+6 times your strength modifier per hit. Plus free power attack charging cheese.

You also have great armour, massive health and immunity to nonlethal damage, critical hits, mind affecting spells and abilities, death effects, necromacy effects and ability damage/drain.


Half-Minotaur is responsible for most of the craziness...it's a stupid broken template.

And Lolth-Touched will force you to be Chaotic Evil...and you can't be Good or Lawful in the first place to acquire it.

Half minotaur's pretty dumb, but there are similar templates which achieve stuff like that that are nearly as bad. Ultimately it doesn't really matter, this is all direct melee damage and there are always ways around that.

Besides, you need to be evil to make use of all those nifty fiend grafts.

[Eldariel]

Half-Minotaur is responsible for most of the craziness...it's a stupid broken template.

It's most likely a thought error the entire thing; either that or crack. 'cause by WoTC's own guidelines it's fairly obvious that getting +12 Str (and some +8 or some such Con and other stuff) for +1 LA isn't ok. While +4 is pretty much in-line with what you should be getting.

So...whoever wrote the "all changes of size increase"-line really just didn't think his cunning plan through...or was on crack. In fact, he was probably on crack either way; either to not realize what that line actually means, or to think it's ok.


Of course, it still doesn't beat what a spellcaster can do (lolcleric) but it does give you a shortterm advantage.

[Goonthegoof]

Except that at +4 it would be incredibly overpriced.

[candycorn]

Also, consider Tauric. The template makes you a quadruped with arms (think centaur), gives you some racial hit dice, and a LA of +3. In exchange, it lets you stack a LOT of templates for free.

[Dr.Epic]

Warhulk for lots and lots of strength if you're not abusing Cancer Mage.

Yeah, Warhulk (based on what I've seen) is pretty cool. Warshaper gives you +4 str (and some other cool stuff). It's a decent warrior PrC.

[Godskook]

What're you optimizing? Cause Marshal 1 can give you +Cha on all Str checks and Str-based skill checks.

[Eldariel]

Except that at +4 it would be incredibly overpriced.

No, it would be fair at +4; Large Size alone is about +1 LA. And Half-Minotaur has other advantageous stats and abilities. Compare Half-Minotaur Human to a Goliath and you get:

{table=head]|Half-Minotaur|Goliath
Size|Large|Medium+Powerful Build
Speed|40'|30'+Mountain Movement
Strength|+4 Str|+4 Str
Dexterity|+0 Dex|-2 Dex
Constitution|+2 Con|+2 Con
Intelligence|-2 Int|+0 Int
Wisdom|+2 Wis|+0 Wis
Charisma|+0 Cha|+0 Cha
Natural Armor|+2|+0[/table]

In addition, Half-Minotaur has Scent, Darkvision 60', Track, +2 Spot, Search & Listen, Know North & +4 vs. Maze, and a natural Gore-attack (which, being a head-based attack, can be used with basically any weapons). Goliath has Acclimated, +2 to Sense Motive and that's about it. Oh yeah, and Half-Minotaur gets the base race abilities too; in this case feat and skills.

Half-Minotaur is quite fine with only +4 Str and +2 Con at +1 LA, especially with buyoff.

EDIT: Oh, you thought I meant +4 Level Adjustment? No, no, no, I meant "only" +4 Strength as opposed to the +12 you get when you apply size increases.