View Full Version : Stuck outsiders (3.5)

2011-01-03, 10:09 AM
I am making a D&D world and this is one of the components:

Huge amounts of good (angels), evil (balors, pit fiends) and neutral/evil (powerful undead) outsiders remain in a world after a massive arcane war. Their summoners are dead ...

What do you think happens with all of these creatures on a material plane? How do they react? How do they reshape the world? They are mostly CR 20+ creatures ...

2011-01-03, 10:40 AM
What is keeping them there? Why don't they go home?

Yuki Akuma
2011-01-03, 11:06 AM
Most Outsiders of that power level have a way to plane shift back home. And most calling spells let them go back home once their duties are up.

Summoning spells don't even really call them to the material plane in the first place...

2011-01-03, 11:13 AM
If you can afford the Ptolus setting book (in PDF), one of the premises of that world is similar - that nothing can get out, that all called (as opposed to summoned) outsiders are there for good. That city has some places where powerful outsiders hang out.

2011-01-03, 02:13 PM
They do? I was sure that Gate spell gates-in outsider permanently.

2011-01-03, 02:27 PM
They do? I was sure that Gate spell gates-in outsider permanently.

If they are uncontrolled (the most likely scenario, given that their callers are all dead/gone) then they can leave at any time.

If they are controlled for a short-term task, they leave as soon as it is done. (This is highly unlikely unless every cleric died within a few rounds of your campaign beginning.)

A long-term, more open-ended task that they agreed to complete might leave them there longer... but then you'd have to come up with something a Balor - or a squad of them - would want badly enough to risk being stranded in the material until he finishes fetching/carrying for a cleric. And even then, the task would have to specifically prohibit them from leaving until it was complete. I can't come up with anything plausible that would fit.

2011-01-03, 02:55 PM
I think what the OP is suggesting is some sort of plannar property that prevents them from leaving once called.

In that case, I'd guess plannar entitied loathe being called to this plane even more than they normally would. So, I'd imagine the war would have gone something like this:

Huburistic clerics/wizards get ready for a massive, all-out war. The clerics probably don't have access to plannar ally spells as we know them (few deities would send valuable servants to be trapped in the mortal world) but wizards have access to plannar binding as usual.
Wizards on all sides decide to get the best allies they can, and go all out in binding. Unfortunately for them, none of the outsiders involved like this idea, and many of the powerful ones can tromp the wizards. This happens, ending in the slaughter of the belligrents and ending of the (human) war.
Unfortunately for the outsiders, they still can't get back home. How they respond to this situation will vary among individuals. Some possibilities:

- They continue their old wars amongst themselves, with or without new mortal allies.
- They put aside their differences to find a way home
- They give up on getting home and become rulers of this plane
- They try to settle in, but become weakened/mutated by lack of contact with their home.

Some outsiders might try one response, some another, and other multiple or none of these.

2011-01-03, 03:41 PM
A "you can't get out" is pretty much the premise of the Ravenloft setting - there's no way to leave the plane unless the mists surrounding it let you (yes, the Mists are intelligent and no-one knows what they want... but really, in Ravenloft, "how do I get out" is not as present in your mind as "how do I don't die").

In that setting, in short, demons are dead - really dead, really quick. Angels don't want them around, devils don't want them around, people don't want them around, and demons only strength is that they're effectively infinite... which, in that plane, they're not, but they don't care. They'll go on a rampage, and then get dead, and not in the usual "I'll be abck" way of non-native Outsiders.

Devils and Angels, I imagine, get locked on a stalemate... mainly because the devils' legalese in the contract of the alliance they made with the angels prevents the angels from going on the offensive (also, the huge number of innocent hostages the devils have in their tyrannical empire).

2011-01-03, 05:29 PM
You are the world creator, you don't need to find a mechanical way to force outsiders to stay.

Concerning the effect of having those outsiders on material plane. It depends a lot on the state of the world before they came, the number of powerful non outsider NPCs for example. If there are a lot of powerful wizards/clerics (or even fighter types) they may force a large number of them into servitude or at least make some pacts.

Alternatively, you can say that outsiders become the main bosses that control the world. There would be conflicts (at whatever scale you like) between alignment opposed outsiders. If there is a bunch of lower level outsiders too, they may integrate into society with humanoids (look at planescape setting for inspiration).

You can also base the world on conflict between outsiders and humanoids but I would rather make it lower scale and focus on outsider vs outsider one.

2011-01-04, 06:17 AM
Particularly powerful outsiders (balors and pit fiends included) are capable of instigating, perpetuating and winning wars on their lonesome.

Variability would be dependant on their chosen method of coercion or soul gathering techniques.

Pit fiends would want to dominate the world entire and balors would want to plunge the world into an eternal war; both will be supremely and exceedingly successful at this unless there are enough challengers able to counter their initiative.
Who else would be their peer in power save for the dead summoners?

Those nations brought low by a pit fiend would become increasingly oppressive as laws are enacted to restrict freedoms and individuality and harsh discipline is meted out to those who do not conform.

Countries "controlled" by a balor would descend into anarchy and morally bankrupt free expression, expression of the self irrespective to the law. Excessively violent riots would be a ready occurrence and presence.
Most everything would be set on fire or trampled upon.

2011-01-04, 06:32 AM
I think what the OP is suggesting is some sort of plannar property that prevents them from leaving once called.

Not really. I actually overlooked the fact that strong outsiders can leave the plane soon after summoned(gated in fact), or after they do their bidding.

Yuki Akuma
2011-01-04, 07:08 AM
Using gate to call in outsiders isn't summoning.

It's calling. There's a large difference.

2011-01-04, 07:08 AM
Not really. I actually overlooked the fact that strong outsiders can leave the plane soon after summoned(gated in fact), or after they do their bidding.

Ok, I misunderstood. Sorry.:smallredface:

2011-01-04, 07:41 AM
Yes. If you summon them, they could just kill themselves and pop back to their original planes unharmed. If you call them, that would kill them for real and they would risk demotion.