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broli
2011-01-03, 10:20 AM
my next master made a few house rules for the next campaign.

its going to be a no magic campaign, using 3.5, with some "action points" similar to the ones in DDO.

i do think the DM made a few mistakes and overpowered the monk, but as you all know, a overpowered monk is equal to a normal fighter :P

the idea of a monk i had is one with A LOT of wis, that uses wis to attak, and be a stunner monk
also having some dex (ca) and con (hp)

we are starting with a 16 point build, that the master is assuring us we will improve trough "training" in game

the more relevant house rules are
* +15hp at level 1
* starting level = 2
* 900 po in equipment (no cash so i have to spend it all)
* 1LA or 2DG races max
* +4 int when calculating skills (and 3 skills can be marked as class)

the action points i was talking about are something like this
* +2 to damage, +1 to natural armor
* +2 to damage, +1 to natural armor +2 stuning fist per day
* +2 to damage, +1 to natural armor +2 stuning fist per day + 2 to DC of stuning fist

i can get that before level 6 :P, plus hp and energy resistance, bonus to attack and damage rolls, ect

now, what starting stats do i use ?
i was thinking 16wis, 12 con, 10 dex
not much that can be done with 16point build

what race? or template?
choosing the right race for this build is gona make alot of difference
but i have yet to find a good index list of player races or templates

thanks for the help!!!

Psyren
2011-01-03, 10:38 AM
* 1LA or 2DG races max

What does "2DG" mean?

If you're getting +1 LA free, then Aasimar (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/planetouched.htm) is a good choice - +2 Wis +2 Cha, Darkvision you're an Outsider, and some other minor buffs. You can then PrC into Tattooed Monk (CWar) for supernatural Alter Self that eventually lasts all day, plus other neat abilities, while still continuing your monk progression.

Ernir
2011-01-03, 10:53 AM
With all due respect, your post is a bit hard to read. You will probably get more feedback if you run it through a spell checker.

Can you explain what you mean by "16 point build" and those action points being "+2 to damage, +1 to natural armor" and so on?


I like the Dark template (from Tome of Magic) for stealth and mobility based characters. The Mineral Warrior (Underdark, and online (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20031003e)), Half-Minotaur (Dragon Magazine 313) and Feral (Savage Species) are very good bruiser templates. Nevermind, didn't see the "core" there...

Telonius
2011-01-03, 10:53 AM
Can you move Cha down to 8? Best stats will probably be:

Str 10
Dex 14
Con 13
Int 10
Wis 16
Cha 8

If the game is Core-only, how are you intending to get Wis to hit? I agree that it's a good idea in this case, but Intuitive Attack is from Exalted Deeds, not Core. (And if we're talking no-magic campaign and BoED is in play, Vow of Poverty would be game-breaking).

broli
2011-01-03, 10:53 AM
oh, sorry, copy pasted from the mail my dm sent in spanish

that line means, i can choose a race that has a maximum of 1LA, or 2 racial hit dice

it does not mean, i can wave off the adjustment

Greenish
2011-01-03, 10:56 AM
its gona be a no magic campaingHow can you be a monk then? :smallamused:

Psyren
2011-01-03, 10:59 AM
that line means, i can choose a race that has a maximum of 1LA, or 2 racial hit dice

it does not mean, i can wave off the adjustment

Oh - in that case, LA is not worth it, and I can't think of any 2HD creatures in core that have no LA either...

I guess be a human or half-orc? By core, do you strictly mean "DMG+PHB+MM1" or is everything in the SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/index.htm) allowed? How about the official Wizards of the Coast website?

grarrrg
2011-01-03, 11:03 AM
what race? or template?
choosing the right race for this build is gona make alot of difference
but i have yet to find a good index list of player races or templates


Linky (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19546874/Master_Player_Race_List_Version_2.0) to ALL LA=0 playable races. It mostly only lists stat adjusts, you have to look in the books for things like "+X to *this* skill" and whatnot.
Just giving it a quick scan:
Human: (insert mandatory "Feat is awesome", "skill points rock")
Earth Dwarf: +2 Str +2 Con -2 Dex -2 Cha
Lesser Aasimar +2 Wis +2 Cha
Lesser Duergar: +2 Con -4 Cha, medium, enlarge person 1/day
Mongrelfolk: +4 Con -2 Int -4 Cha
Neanderthal: +2 Str -2 Dex +2 Con -2 Int

Special note for "Buomman: +2 Wis -2 Cha" the ONLY race with Monk as favored class.

I recommend finding a way to get Con-to-AC (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=125732&highlight=stat), so you can dump Dex as well.


If it's allowed, you really can't go wrong with Mineral Warrior (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20031003e) on a Monk.
Armor Class: Natural armor improves by +3.

Darkvision (Ex): A mineral warrior has darkvision with a range of 60 feet or the base creature's darkvision, whichever is better.

Damage Reduction (Ex): A mineral warrior gains damage reduction 8/adamantine. If it already has damage reduction, it retains both versions and uses the best one that applies.

Abilities: Change from the base creature as follows: +2 Strength, +4 Con, -2 Int (minimum 1), -2 Wis, -2 Cha.

And some other stuff.

I admit the -Wis will hurt a little, but Natural Armor, Damage reduction and the rest of the Stats are awesome.
Even better, throw this on Mongrel Folk for +2 Str +8 Con -4 Int -2 Wis -6 Cha


Nevermind, didn't see the "core" there...
I still don't see "core" there...?

broli
2011-01-03, 11:11 AM
With all due respect, your post is a bit hard to read. You will probably get more feedback if you run it through a spell checker.
i am sorry for my bad English,


Can you explain what you mean by "16 point build" and those action points being "+2 to damage, +1 to natural armor" and so on?


a point buy system, as explained in the DMG, with a total of 16 points to spent

The action points its system, added in eberron i think. each level you get a number of action points, that you can spent in buying enhancements for your character. each enhancement has a price, and a progresion.
for example, with 1 AP, i can buy this
* +2 to damage, +1 to natural armor
After i have spent a total of 8 AP, i have this one available (cost is 3AP)
* +2 to damage, +1 to natural armor +2 stuning fist per day

and so on, so when you gain a level, you also gain extra stuff you can buy. There are many others, ie a permanent +2 fire resistance



I like the Dark template (from Tome of Magic) for stealth and mobility based characters. The Mineral Warrior (Underdark, and online (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20031003e)), Half-Minotaur (Dragon Magazine 313) and Feral (Savage Species) are very good bruiser templates.

thanks, i will read those


Can you move Cha down to 8? Best stats will probably be:

Str 10
Dex 14
Con 13
Int 10
Wis 16
Cha 8

that costs alot more than 16 points, and all stats start at 8, so if i choose a race (like half orc), cha can get to 6



If the game is Core-only, how are you intending to get Wis to hit? I agree that it's a good idea in this case, but Intuitive Attack is from Exalted Deeds, not Core. (And if we're talking no-magic campaign and BoED is in play, Vow of Poverty would be game-breaking).

revised that, its not only core, its anything revised for 3.5, and the DM is open to discuss other sources


Linky (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19546874/Master_Player_Race_List_Version_2.0) to ALL LA=0 playable races. It mostly only lists stat adjusts, you have to look in the books for things like "+X to *this* skill" and whatnot.

I will read it, thanks


Just giving it a quick scan:
Human: (insert mandatory "Feat is awesome", "skill points rock")
Earth Dwarf: +2 Str +2 Con -2 Dex -2 Cha
Lesser Aasimar +2 Wis +2 Cha
Lesser Duergar: +2 Con -4 Cha, medium, enlarge person 1/day
Mongrelfolk: +4 Con -2 Int -4 Cha
Neanderthal: +2 Str -2 Dex +2 Con -2 Int
all that with 1LA or less?


Special note for "Buomman: +2 Wis -2 Cha" the ONLY race with Monk as favored class.
the planar handbook is not revised for 3.5, besides buomman cant talk, or they loose wisdom XD, not a good idea


I recommend finding a way to get Con-to-AC (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=125732&highlight=stat), so you can dump Dex as well.

im gona ask, that is really cool


If it's allowed, you really can't go wrong with Mineral Warrior (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20031003e) on a Monk.
Armor Class: Natural armor improves by +3.

Darkvision (Ex): A mineral warrior has darkvision with a range of 60 feet or the base creature's darkvision, whichever is better.

Damage Reduction (Ex): A mineral warrior gains damage reduction 8/adamantine. If it already has damage reduction, it retains both versions and uses the best one that applies.

Abilities: Change from the base creature as follows: +2 Strength, +4 Con, -2 Int (minimum 1), -2 Wis, -2 Cha.

And some other stuff.

I admit the -Wis will hurt a little, but Natural Armor, Damage reduction and the rest of the Stats are awesome.
Even better, throw this on Mongrel Folk for +2 Str +8 Con -4 Int -2 Wis -6 Cha

if i can get that with 1La or less, then its the best option so far


I still don't see "core" there...?
i removed it, was my mistake

JBento
2011-01-03, 11:17 AM
With +1 LA, you can also get Lolth-touched (from MM...V?). +6 Str, +6 Con, and immunity to fear.

grarrrg
2011-01-03, 11:21 AM
all that with 1LA or less? All of those are la=0, from the link I provided, note that 2 of them are "lesser" versions of things with LA.


if i can get that with 1La or less, then its the best option so far
Mineral Warrior template adds +1 LA. But on a Pure-Melee build, it is worth every penny.

Greenish
2011-01-03, 11:29 AM
The action points its system, added in eberron i think. each level you get a number of action points, that you can spent in buying enhancements for your character. each enhancement has a price, and a progresion.
for example, with 1 AP, i can buy this
* +2 to damage, +1 to natural armor
After i have spent a total of 8 AP, i have this one available (cost is 3AP)
* +2 to damage, +1 to natural armor +2 stuning fist per day

and so on, so when you gain a level, you also gain extra stuff you can buy. There are many others, ie a permanent +2 fire resistanceThat's not how Eberron action points work. In Eberron, you get new action points (and lose the old if you didn't use them) every time you level, and during the play can use them to add 1-3 d6 to any d20 roll you make, or to use a class feature with limited daily uses more times each day, or to power some feats and class features.

What you describe doesn't sound very "action-y" at all.

JBento
2011-01-03, 11:34 AM
He seems to be referring to the action points/enhancements usage in DDO, where stuff actually works like that, but you have to go up 5 levels to level - the first four merely give you an action point to spend on enhancements.

broli
2011-01-03, 11:35 AM
That's not how Eberron action points work. In Eberron, you get new action points (and lose the old if you didn't use them) every time you level, and during the play can use them to add 1-3 d6 to any d20 roll you make, or to use a class feature with limited daily uses more times each day, or to power some feats and class features.

What you describe doesn't sound very "action-y" at all.

thats why i said "like in DDO"
http://ddowiki.com/page/Enhancements

ddo is a mmorpg based on D&D

Telonius
2011-01-03, 11:41 AM
Blah, didn't see the "pathfinder" label on that calculator... (Thought it looked a bit high-ish for 16...)

Anyway, in that case:
Str 10
Dex 12
Con 12
Int 8
Wis 14
Cha 8

Alternately, you might consider a Carmendine Monk build, if you can finagle a way to get Int to attack.

Greenish
2011-01-03, 11:45 AM
thats why i said "like in DDO"
http://ddowiki.com/page/EnhancementsI was just pointing out that that has nothing to do with Eberron action points.