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Jsuelieta
2011-01-10, 02:03 AM
I just got done watching The Gamers: Dorkness Rising for the umpteenth time now and it gave me some awesome ideas. The main problem is I'm not entirely sure if half the stuff they used exists, and if it does, I don't know where to find it. If anyone can help me find out where the feats the fighter girl used and/or the Cantor prestige class come from that'd be great.

The fighter used:
Improved Initiative (duh)
First Strike
Expanded Critical (Maybe Improved Critical with a different name?)
Critical Momentum
Precise Strike

I really hope this particular format of posts isn't going to be a theme with me, I don't wanna be known as 'the lister in the playground' or something.

Dr.Epic
2011-01-10, 02:12 AM
Was that film about D&D? I never saw it, but I thought the majority of stories about gamers (like the Guild) use a fake gaming system (or in the Guild's case, a fake MMO).

Vistella
2011-01-10, 02:16 AM
its about d&d, yes, but those feats are made up, they dont exist (well, improved init is real though)

KillianHawkeye
2011-01-10, 02:19 AM
They explicitly show 3rd Edition D&D Player's Handbooks and other D&D material. The character that the girl makes is completely ridiculous and impossible to construct using only the PHB (which is the only book she is given). I'm not even sure it would be makeable at all without resorting to 3rd party material or maybe Dragon Magazine, since I only own books made by WotC.

*.*.*.*
2011-01-10, 02:19 AM
its about d&d, yes, but those feats are made up, they dont exist (well, improved init is real though)

If they did, being able to crit would be child's play.

Jsuelieta
2011-01-10, 02:26 AM
If they did, being able to crit would be child's play.

That's half the point of her character. According to what she said she crits with a spear on 13-20, applies her dex and int mods to her critical range, gets another attack on a crit and if she drops something when she goes first she gets another attack. She basically soloed an entire group of goblins by chain critting.

So fake feats aside, what about the Cantor class? Does that exist or is that also a Dead Gentlemen fabrication?

Edit: Little fun fact about The Gamers: Dorkness Rising, it was actually funded by WotC, so the fact that they were actually using D&D was product placement.

Dr.Epic
2011-01-10, 02:26 AM
its about d&d, yes, but those feats are made up, they dont exist (well, improved init is real though)

Really?:smallconfused: Usually movies/shows fear copyright issues and they just use an expy, so I guess I'm kind of surprised they actually used D&D. But hey, D&D is sort of like "the" table top RPG and they even openly used it Bender's Game and other shows.

Temotei
2011-01-10, 02:35 AM
I haven't seen Dorkness Rising, so keep in mind that these suggestions are based solely on the names of the feats.


First Strike

This could be a variant on Quick Draw, or it could be an enhanced version of either the hidden blade skill trick or the sudden draw skill trick.


Expanded Critical (Maybe Improved Critical with a different name?)

It could also be another name for Power Critical (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/divine/divineAbilitiesFeats.htm#powerCritical).


Critical Momentum

This could also be another name for Power Critical.


Precise Strike

This could be Deadly Precision (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/psionicFeats.htm#deadlyPrecision) if the fighter was multiclassed as a rogue, or it could be another name for Reckless Offense (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/psionicFeats.htm#recklessOffense). It could also be Weapon Focus, the opposite of Power Attack (trading damage for better attack results), a variant on Combat Expertise (trading AC for better attack results), or this (http://www.realmshelps.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Offensive_Metered_Foot) (or a variant).


I really hope this particular format of posts isn't going to be a theme with me, I don't wanna be known as 'the lister in the playground' or something.

Don't worry. I've got several threads based on making lists, and they're all far larger than yours. :smalltongue:

*.*.*.*
2011-01-10, 03:35 AM
Speaking of this movie, are there any more like it? I personally loved it and the first one

pffh
2011-01-10, 03:49 AM
I think the third one is in production.

JeminiZero
2011-01-10, 03:53 AM
The closest thing to her fighter build would probably be the Blood in the Water /Lightning Mace/Aptitude Kukri/Improved Critical combo.

Although I always wondered about the wisdom of using a critical reliant build in an undead campaign.

MeeposFire
2011-01-10, 03:53 AM
Really?:smallconfused: Usually movies/shows fear copyright issues and they just use an expy, so I guess I'm kind of surprised they actually used D&D. But hey, D&D is sort of like "the" table top RPG and they even openly used it Bender's Game and other shows.

The first movie was not so obvious but was really popular in the gaming community. WotC and others probably thought that the free publicity was worth allowing their material to be shown in the second movie and since the movie was not expected to be a large run then they knew that trying to get money out of the movie makers would just make the movie not have the stuff at all and they would lose the free advertising and good will. It was a good idea on their part.

MeeposFire
2011-01-10, 03:56 AM
Speaking of this movie, are there any more like it? I personally loved it and the first one

Sorry just noticed this and I do not know how to quote multiple times...

You could always look up FARADOR!

It is in French but there are subtitles and it is very funny.

Link:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nhmUj9QJ9RM

Chaos rising
2011-01-10, 05:29 AM
When in doubt... HOMEBREW!

Ravens_cry
2011-01-10, 06:00 AM
It's definitely 3.0 some of what she does, that kind of criticals could only come from when crit threat stacking worked.
One thing that kind of irked was, well, she is obviously meant to represent flavour over power, but her build is pretty effective, thanks to feats that don't exist, at least in the Core book. If this was the case, wouldn't said powergamers have found them? Seriously, free attacks and free movement on a crit, in a system where you could potentially get 9-20 threat range? What power gamer would pass that up?
The spell that removes a clerics connection to their god does exist though, it even gets a full page picture in the Spell Compendium. Still, a jerk kind of move on the DM's part, I would also be pissed at that.

pffh
2011-01-10, 06:41 AM
If this was the case, wouldn't said powergamers have found them?.

I think a part of the joke is that the powergamer wasn't really that good at powergaming. We have the "I move to assist Daphnee, twice", "Hide behind the mountain of dead bards" and a blaster sorcerer that apparently only knows or uses two or three spells.

Tengu_temp
2011-01-10, 06:45 AM
One thing that kind of irked was, well, she is obviously meant to represent flavour over power, but her build is pretty effective, thanks to feats that don't exist, at least in the Core book. If this was the case, wouldn't said powergamers have found them? Seriously, free attacks and free movement on a crit, in a system where you could potentially get 9-20 threat range? What power gamer would pass that up?

They obviously wanted to make a DND equivalent of the "an enthusiastic newcomer arrives at some kind of field and despite lacking in skills beats all the old guard by using non-standard strategies that confuse them because they're not used to such spontaneity" cliche. Which is a cliche I hate with a passion, because it's total bullcrap, but it doesn't stop some people from thinking they can beat a pro by "confusing them" with button-mashing in a fighting game or taking ridiculous moves in chess. But that's a rant for another day.

Vistella
2011-01-10, 06:49 AM
... and a blaster sorcerer that apparently only knows or uses two or three spells.

wild mage, not sorcerer :smallcool:

DementedFellow
2011-01-10, 06:57 AM
It's definitely 3.0 some of what she does, that kind of criticals could only come from when crit threat stacking worked.
One thing that kind of irked was, well, she is obviously meant to represent flavour over power, but her build is pretty effective, thanks to feats that don't exist, at least in the Core book. If this was the case, wouldn't said powergamers have found them? Seriously, free attacks and free movement on a crit, in a system where you could potentially get 9-20 threat range? What power gamer would pass that up?
The spell that removes a clerics connection to their god does exist though, it even gets a full page picture in the Spell Compendium. Still, a jerk kind of move on the DM's part, I would also be pissed at that.

To me, this is no different than saying the cleric must worship a deity. And also, wasn't the cleric played by an DMPC? I think it's alright to say, "Okay, this game has so much stringent restrictions that no sane player would enjoy playing it, but you all need a healbot, so I'll play it. Roll up something consistent with this world."

Starbuck_II
2011-01-10, 07:19 AM
To me, this is no different than saying the cleric must worship a deity. And also, wasn't the cleric played by an DMPC? I think it's alright to say, "Okay, this game has so much stringent restrictions that no sane player would enjoy playing it, but you all need a healbot, so I'll play it. Roll up something consistent with this world."

No the second party had a Paladin.
The first party had a player played Cleric.

DementedFellow
2011-01-10, 07:27 AM
No the second party had a Paladin.
The first party had a player played Cleric.

But the paladin was a DMPC, correct? But as it stands I was wrong and admit it. My bad.

Jsuelieta
2011-01-10, 08:12 AM
I love how my relatively innocent questioning about feats and a prestige class (that has yet to be addressed, by the way :smalltongue:) has developed into a conversation into one of my favorite movies. Always feels good to have a forum topic actually go somewhere.

I appreciate the proxies to the fighter, though, be great for the -next- campaign I'm in.

Douglas
2011-01-10, 08:13 AM
But the paladin was a DMPC, correct? But as it stands I was wrong and admit it. My bad.
Yes, the paladin was a DMPC. Yes, the players complained about it instantly - especially because he was a paladin and would thus put a serious crimp in their normal play style.

And yeah, most of those feats and the PrC were all made up for the movie.

Starbuck_II
2011-01-10, 08:35 AM
Has anyone made them up in Homebrew?
They make Wizard or Archivist Gishes better: add Int to Crit/Initiative.

Expanded Critical: Add Dex to Crit?
Critical Momentum: gets another attack on a crit. Weak feat (unless stacks with each crit) as Snap Kick is better.
Precise Strike: was that Int to Crit?
First Strike: if she drops something when she goes first she gets another attack.

All we know of these home brew feats: require Improved Init, good Dex/Int. Possibly good BAB.
Pretty good homebrew though.
Also the Demon smiting spell (4th level?) seems to do 1d6/lv vs living, (1d8+1 )/lv vs demons (or 1d10, it said double).

Yuki Akuma
2011-01-10, 08:50 AM
Yes, it's based on D&D. Because they got permission from WotC to base it on D&D.

Also, that module that gets published in the end? That's real. It was a limited run, though, and the cover is a fake.


Also the Demon smiting spell (4th level?) seems to do 1d6/lv vs living, (1d8+1 )/lv vs demons (or 1d10, it said double).

Alternatively, it works... exactly like other similar spells, and deals 2d6 per level versus demons. Or deals 1d6 per level, doubled.


Also: the ending of that campaign (in the movie) was awful. One player gains a free level in a PrC? Another gets told 'no, you can't play the class you want to play, be a Cleric instead'? For a movie it was okay but in a real game I'd be pissed.

Gametime
2011-01-10, 12:36 PM
Really?:smallconfused: Usually movies/shows fear copyright issues and they just use an expy, so I guess I'm kind of surprised they actually used D&D. But hey, D&D is sort of like "the" table top RPG and they even openly used it Bender's Game and other shows.

Wizards cooperated with them in the making of the movie. The scene of the Ninja Pizza Delivery game was filmed in WotC offices, and Monte Cook actually has a brief cameo (as the priest they bribe to get into the church near the end).

dspeyer
2011-01-10, 10:58 PM
They obviously wanted to make a DND equivalent of the "an enthusiastic newcomer arrives at some kind of field and despite lacking in skills beats all the old guard by using non-standard strategies that confuse them because they're not used to such spontaneity" cliche. Which is a cliche I hate with a passion, because it's total bullcrap, but it doesn't stop some people from thinking they can beat a pro by "confusing them" with button-mashing in a fighting game or taking ridiculous moves in chess. But that's a rant for another day.

I thought it was the "woman enters traditionally male domain, encounters skepticism of her abilities and does better than any of the men". A cliche with rather unfortunate implications, at least when used like this.

felinoel
2011-01-10, 11:18 PM
Was that film about D&D? I never saw it, but I thought the majority of stories about gamers (like the Guild) use a fake gaming system (or in the Guild's case, a fake MMO).

I'm pretty sure the Guild is about a real MMO... World of Warcraft?

But as for Gamers, they used a lot of renames for some odd reason... perhaps copyright issues?

DementedFellow
2011-01-11, 05:52 AM
I'm pretty sure the Guild is about a real MMO... World of Warcraft?

But as for Gamers, they used a lot of renames for some odd reason... perhaps copyright issues?

Not really, the wikipedia article says that the creator kept it vague so they would garner a larger audience. WoW may be the most popular MMO, but some people will hate it for that very reason.

Eldan
2011-01-11, 06:02 AM
Gamers 1 was a small, low-budget fan movie, and as such, couldn't call the game explicitly "D&D", so they renamed everything while still being obvious about what was being portrayed, really.
Gamers 2 was allowed to use D&D, and I'm pretty sure they even named it in the movie. I should rewatch it some time.

DementedFellow
2011-01-11, 09:41 AM
I thought it was the "woman enters traditionally male domain, encounters skepticism of her abilities and does better than any of the men". A cliche with rather unfortunate implications, at least when used like this.

Yeah, I always thought it was a dig at how men are not bright enough to approach a situation aside from, "THOG SMASH!" I consider the guy's response to her puny HP pretty apt. If she is expecting her character to wade into battle, then she needs to be able to take a hit, regardless of how many chain hits she can perform, eventually it will be the monster's turn to hit.

Yuki Akuma
2011-01-11, 12:07 PM
She was a level 10 character with d10 hit dice. She had, on average, 55 HP.

Anything capable of beating her down in one hit was also capable of forcing a save against massive damage anyway.

Starbuck_II
2011-01-11, 12:30 PM
She was a level 10 character with d10 hit dice. She had, on average, 55 HP.

Anything capable of beating her down in one hit was also capable of forcing a save against massive damage anyway.

They roll hp I believe not take average. So she could have low hp if she rolled low.

Anonomuss
2011-01-11, 12:32 PM
Speaking of this movie, are there any more like it? I personally loved it and the first one

There's the web series: JourneyQuest (http://www.journey-quest.com/)
Its not really the same thing, but it's still more comedic fantasy from the Dead Gentlemen. I quite enjoyed it.

Douglas
2011-01-11, 01:50 PM
Gamers 2 was allowed to use D&D, and I'm pretty sure they even named it in the movie. I should rewatch it some time.
I'm not sure if they ever actually spoke the name out loud, but they did show what was quite clearly the D&D 3.5 Player's Handbook pretty close up, with the DM giving it to the new player so she could make her character.


Yeah, I always thought it was a dig at how men are not bright enough to approach a situation aside from, "THOG SMASH!" I consider the guy's response to her puny HP pretty apt. If she is expecting her character to wade into battle, then she needs to be able to take a hit, regardless of how many chain hits she can perform, eventually it will be the monster's turn to hit.
That did come back to bite her late in the movie as I recall, with a powerful enemy knocking her down to 6 hp in one hit. She was rather dismayed at the event.

Yuki Akuma
2011-01-11, 02:22 PM
They roll hp I believe not take average. So she could have low hp if she rolled low.

...

I said on average, she had 55 HP. I said nothing about them not rolling HP. I meant, if you roll ten ten-sided dice, the vast majority of the time, you will end up with a figure between 50 and 60.

Which is what an "average" means, you know.

Pink
2011-01-11, 02:24 PM
...

I said on average, she had 55 HP. I said nothing about them not rolling HP. I meant, if you roll ten ten-sided dice, the vast majority of the time, you will end up with a figure between 50 and 60.

Which is what an "average" means, you know.

In fairness, even with average you generally assume full Hit points with your level 1 HD, so it shoulda been 59.5 HP.

Starbuck_II
2011-01-11, 02:25 PM
But I was just saying while on average she shouldn't worry, if they roll she might have need. :smalltongue:

Yuki Akuma
2011-01-11, 02:57 PM
In fairness, even with average you generally assume full Hit points with your level 1 HD, so it shoulda been 59.5 HP.

...That's true!

Damnit, when will I stop just working out the average rather than taking into account max HP at first level?

grimbold
2011-01-11, 03:02 PM
Was that film about D&D? I never saw it, but I thought the majority of stories about gamers (like the Guild) use a fake gaming system (or in the Guild's case, a fake MMO).
i thought that as well

MeeposFire
2011-01-11, 04:50 PM
It is less "about" D&D and more about gaming and D&D is the game they use as the basis for the story and considering how prevalent D&D is in gaming it makes sense to use it like that.

karlfalkenstein
2013-04-01, 02:18 PM
I have an answer to the cantor prestige class for you. The thing is its not a prestige class, but cantor does exist. It is a character concept from the Quintessential Bard. The Quintessential collection involves a series of books with the being things geared toward a specific class. This includes concepts, feats, prestige classes, and items. But the Cantor character concept what it does is it turns them from an arcane to a divine caster, allowing them to gain their powers through a divine deity using their song as a powerful form of worship.
Like any divine caster, they have to pray for their spells, and the dm decides how long it takes them to do so everyday. If you are interested in reading more of these, the quintessential collection is one i would recommend.

Vknight
2013-04-01, 03:09 PM
It's definitely 3.0 some of what she does, that kind of criticals could only come from when crit threat stacking worked.
One thing that kind of irked was, well, she is obviously meant to represent flavour over power, but her build is pretty effective, thanks to feats that don't exist, at least in the Core book. If this was the case, wouldn't said powergamers have found them? Seriously, free attacks and free movement on a crit, in a system where you could potentially get 9-20 threat range? What power gamer would pass that up?
The spell that removes a clerics connection to their god does exist though, it even gets a full page picture in the Spell Compendium. Still, a jerk kind of move on the DM's part, I would also be pissed at that.

I think the implication is one of more of those feats need Improved Initiative and high INT + DEX etc.
Along with that they are show to be power gamers that fail at power gaming, only knowing the system and being bad at exploiting it and instead having to rely on super-gear. The monk for example was only good for what interrogating and stunning until they got that gear.

Lets look at them
One has only played a fighter to be able to tank
The other plays a wild mage(Chaotic Evil) or clerics
and finally a Rogue
The fact they all lost initiative shows none of them had all that great of initiative. Who wants to bet that rather then using Weapon Finesse he was running Power Attack on his rogue with 16 Strength?

All I'm saying is that
2 played the game for fun
1 played to win

and girl enters who plays for story so she made her character concept and then looked at what could make that which is the key difference I doubt those guys looked at anything beyond +'s to damage

The man played a Monk
Not a Unarmed Swordsage... a monk

Dienekes
2013-04-01, 03:25 PM
It also can be seen that though her build was very good at cleaning up the goblin mooks, whenever she faced a more powerful opponent she doesn't seem to actually do anything.

Sinsear
2013-04-03, 06:13 PM
I actually went looking for the wild mage class being used in this movie and was unable to really find anything. Does anyone have details on where a similiar class might be found. I was primarily interested in what benefit was gained by having spells with a variable (multiple rounds for a Lightining Bolt?) casting time.

tommhans
2013-04-04, 01:46 AM
those gamers movies are awesome ^^

It's a movie and ofc they exaggerate the "rules", there is always someone in a group that exploits and uses the rules to the maximum, coming up with rules they have not read yet, but in truth she has problems in other encounters througout the game as it really only counted when she first critted she got extra powers and bonuses which made those moves possible.

The bard scene is just brilliant, laughed well at that part, but yeah that wild mage was pretty bad with just having 2-3 spells which took forever to prepare, but then again was mighty powerful!

If you havent seen their web series, JourneyQuest, i advice you to look it up on youtube, its all there :)

Krazzman
2013-04-04, 02:53 AM
I think the third one is in production.

Astropia (? or similar)
Standart Action
Journey Quest
Farador

thats the ones I know of from the top of my head...

Hopeless
2013-04-04, 06:26 AM
I just got done watching The Gamers: Dorkness Rising for the umpteenth time now and it gave me some awesome ideas. The main problem is I'm not entirely sure if half the stuff they used exists, and if it does, I don't know where to find it. If anyone can help me find out where the feats the fighter girl used and/or the Cantor prestige class come from that'd be great.

The fighter used:
Improved Initiative (duh)
First Strike
Expanded Critical (Maybe Improved Critical with a different name?)
Critical Momentum
Precise Strike

I really hope this particular format of posts isn't going to be a theme with me, I don't wanna be known as 'the lister in the playground' or something.

Yes to the Improved Critical's alternate name I figured it was run using 3.0 rules where her spear could have the Keen enhancement where it stacked so had a critical chance of 17-20...

I recall she had 45 hp, the d20 subtitles called that spell a Feeblemind targetting charisma when wisdom would have been a better choice but thats just me!

I believe the mage player actually had no problem with cleric's just with the dm stripping his character of ability access without warning...

That scene with the goblins' made me think she should have Power Attack, Cleave and Great Cleave to explain why she got the extra attacks but I do recall the dm saying she had First Strike which allowed her an extra attack if she went first.

All this from memory... I better keep quiet now...:smallredface: