4E Modern

[Timejockey]

Hello all,
After spending some time with Essentials and the new Gamma World, I had some thoughts on a modern take on 4E that was loosely based on the old d20 edition. I've been working on this over the past few weeks and my group is currently playtesting it in a sci-fi campaign we are running, so I thought I would post it here for some more opinions and critiques. Please let me know what you think, and any major issues or problems that you see with it.
Thank you!

http://www.scribd.com/doc/46261220/4EModern

[Pinnacle]

There should probably be a Melee Training and Expertise feats to go with the ranged ones.
Some of the weapons tell me to "see below" but this doesn't seem to be referring to anything.
The Negotiator novice powers Combat Hesitation and Focus on Me seem like maybe they should target Will? Focus on Me has the Weapon keyword, but it doesn't seem to do anything.

I was going to say that without magic weapons, implements, armor, and such, the robot servitor should only increase by about 1/2 level, but now I see you've accounted for that with inherent bonuses. Cool.

Without magic, I don't think most of the damage types that the Tough Hero's special ability can apply to are likely to come up often enough for it to be useful, are they?

Under the Mechanics skill, there's what looks like a copy/paste error: "Make a Conspiracy check to identify a creature that is a construct." Same thing under Science.

I assume DnD 4E skills other than the differences noted. Would you use 4E monsters with this?


Overall I'd say it seems nifty. I'll try to build a character and see how it comes out and if there's any trouble I have doing so.

[Timejockey]

Thank you for going through it. Editing is not my strong point... :smallsmile:
I fixed the Negotiator powers, which were copy/paste errors, and fixed the things in the skills.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/46261220/4EModern

I thought inherent bonuses might work better for this, since in most campaigns there won't be "+1 9mm Pistols."
Weapons are skill in progress. We just started a homebrew sci-fi campaign in this and I had made up a full equipment list for that, so I haven't had the time to finish the modern weapon lists yet.
As for the Tough's special ability, I don't know how useful it will be in a modern setting. I could see some of those being useful at times, but it might need an alternate power. Maybe something more akin to the old edition where they get a low amount of Resist to everything.
As for Feats and skills, I just added the new ones or ones that needed modifying. I just listed the rest from the Essentials players books. And you could easily use D&D monsters with this. I made up creatures for the thing we are running, but it would be easy enough to modify existing creatures.
We actually made some house revisions after our first session last week, making the Techie's robot a bit better and changing the powers acquisition so you can pick from any Core or Career ones you have available. We also changed the Soldier to Dexterity since most of its powers are ranged based. What are your thoughts on that?

[averagejoe]

The Mod They Call Me: This belongs in homebrew. Moved.

[Pinnacle]

Inherent bonuses instead of Enhancement bonuses also means that powers that don't use weapons or implements won't lag behind.

Stuff I noticed working on a character:
Forceful Charge (Tough Novice) needs a range specified--should be 1, I think.

Shoulder Throw (Martial Artist Novice) lacks the Weapon keyword and doesn't use weapon range or damage, but it does have weapon accuracy and targets AC. Seems like something's off there.

The Martial Artist Expert powers other than Dim Mak should have the Weapon keyword, I think.

Guardian Stance (Bodyguard Novice) needs a range for the second ability; should probably be an adjacent ally, I think?

Needs equipment rules. I know you said you weren't done with the equipment yet, but I don't know starting wealth or how buying works--are you sticking with d20 Modern's Wealth system or using something more defined?

Tough Martial Artist:
Katarina Duchamp

Base Class: Tough Heroine
Career: Martial Artist
Level: 1

HP: 36/36
Bloodied: 18
Surge Value: 9
Healing Surges: 12/12

Abilities:
Str: 16 (+3)
Con: 16 (+3)
Dex: 14 (+2)
Int: 10 (+0)
Wis: 12 (+1)
Cha: 12 (+1)

Defenses:
AC: 12 (10 + 2 Dex)
Fort: 14 (10 + 3 Con + 1 Tough)
Ref: 13 (10 + 2 Dex + 1 MA)
Will: 11 (10 + 1 Wis)

Skills:
Athletics +8 (Trained)
Endurance: +10 (Trained, Tough bonus)
Intimidate +6 (Trained)

Special Abilities:
Durable (Resist 5 Poison)
Ki Strike (+1d10 damage on one melee attack 1/Encounter)

Feats:
Unarmed Training (MA Bonus)
Toughness (level 1)

Basic Attack:
Unarmed Melee (Basic; At-Will; Weapon)
Standard, Melee or Ranged Weapon
One creature
Str (+6) vs AC
1[W] + Str (1d8+3) damage

Novice Powers:
Defensive Strike (Tough; At-Will; Martial, Weapon)
Standard, Melee or Ranged Weapon
One creature
Con (+6) vs AC
1[W] + Con (1d8+3) damage, and Katarina gains a +1 power bonus to the defense of her choice until the start of her next turn.

Shoulder Throw (Martial Artist; At-Will; Martial)
Standard, Melee 1
One Creature
Str (+6) vs AC
1[W] + Str (1d8+3) damage, and target is pushed 1 square and knocked prone

Expert Power:
Dim Mak (Martial Artist; Encounter; Martial)
Standard, Melee 1
One Creature
Str (+3) vs Fort
Str (3) damage and the target takes ongoing damage 10 (save ends)
Aftereffect: Target is slowed and weakened (save ends both)

Same character as a Tough Bodyguard:
Katarina Duchamp

Base Class: Tough Heroine
Career: Bodyguard

HP: 33/33
Bloodied: 16
Surge Value: 8
Healing Surges: 13/13

Abilities:
Str: 12 (+1)
Con: 18 (+4)
Dex: 14 (+2)
Int: 10 (+0)
Wis: 14 (+2)
Cha: 12 (+1)

Defenses:
AC: 12 (10 + 2 Dex)
Fort: 16 (10 + 4 Con + 1 Tough + 1 Bodyguard)
Ref: 12 (10 + 2 Dex)
Will: 12 (10 + 2 Wis)

Skills:
Athletics +6 (Trained)
Endurance: +11 (Trained, Tough bonus)
Perception +7 (Trained)

Proficiencies:
Light armor
Heavy armor
Simple melee
Simple ranged
One-handed military ranged
Sniper rifle
Assault rifle

Special Abilities:
Durable (Resist 5 Poison)

Vigilant Focus (Bodyguard Special; At-Will; Martial)
Minor, Close Blast 2
Enemies in Blast
Effect: Targets are marked until the start of Katarina’s next turn

Feats:
Unarmed Training (1st level)

Basic Attacks:
Unarmed Melee Basic (Basic; At-Will; Weapon)
Standard, Melee Weapon
One creature
Str (+4) vs AC
1[W] + Str (1d8+1) damage.

Pistol Ranged Basic (Basic; At-Will; Weapon)
Standard, Ranged Weapon
One creature
Dex (+5) vs AC
1[W] + Dex (1d8+2)

Novice Powers:
Defensive Strike (Tough; At-Will; Martial, Weapon)
Standard, Melee or Ranged Weapon
One creature
Con (+7) vs AC
1[W] + Con (1d8+4) damage, and Katarina gains a +1 power bonus to the defense of her choice until the start of her next turn.

Guardian Stance (Bodyguard; At-Will; Martial, Stance)
Minor, Personal
One Creature
Effect: Katarina assumes the Guardian Stance. Until the stance ends, she gains the following benefits:
[list] One ally adjacent to her gains a +1 power bonus to defenses.
She can take a free action at the end of each of her turns to shift an ally 1 square.
If an enemy marked by her makes an attack that does not include her as a target, she may make a basic attack against that enemy as a free action.

Expert Power:
Ready For It (Tough; Encounter; Martial, Weapon)
Standard, Melee or Ranged Weapon
One Creature
Con (+7) vs AC
2[W] + Con (2d8+4) damage
Effect: Katarina gains resist 10 to all damage dealt by the target until the start of her next turn.

Equipment:
Light undercover vest (?)
Light Pistol

Skills feel a bit low.
Hmm, are characters supposed to get racial abilities, too? They were kinda built into the 2E Modern rules, since characters were generally assumed to be human, so I didn't add them to the characters I built.

[Timejockey]

Fixed things you mentioned. Originally I had that in the Martial Artist because they get an accuracy bonus thanks to the unarmed fighting feat. But I fixed it. I also tweaked the Tough a bit to give them the option of a higher resist to one type of damage or a lower resist to all damage.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/46261220/4EModern

I worked a bit on the equipment list this morning, and so far I am using standard cash instead of the Wealth system from the old system. Personally I never was fond of the Wealth system, so its more a matter of personal choice.

What do you mean by skills being too low. Do you mean not enough trained skills?
No racial traits. My thoughts on races were that the ability score classes represent humans, and for other races there would be a racial Core class. My thought for that was in traditional stories where there are other races, that race tends to fall into a stereotyped role. Legolas was the elf archer, Spock was the Vulcan science officer, etc. I think if I made up racial templates (no one played an alien in my sci-fi thing so far), I would add in some powers from the core classes that were appropriate to the race. But I am really open to suggestions there.

How did you think the characters looked otherwise? And would you keep the advancement where you get powers from your Core and Career, or would you allow characters to pick from either when they get a power?

[Timejockey]

Some more work... Added more to the equipment. Will keep updating when I get the time.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/46261220/4EModern

[Surrealistik]

First of all, get rid of the 1/2 level + weapon accuracy portions on the attack line; I consider them needless and redundant. They're fine as they're printed in current 4E DnD sourcebooks with a simple Primary stat vs a Defense; everything else is a given.

Consider multi-attacks for things like the Soldier's burst fire. Many of the Ranger's multi-attack powers would be good inspiration for these.

With respect to burst fire itself as an example:

Burst Fire
At-Will * Martial, Weapon
Standard Action - Ranged weapon
Prerequisite:
You must be wielding a weapon with the Burst property.
Target:
One creature
Attack:
Dexterity vs. AC, up to three attacks, each attack made beyond the first applies a -2 penalty to all attack rolls made with this power.
Hit: 1[W] damage per attack.
Increase damage to 2[W] at 21st level.

[Timejockey]

Noted about the attack roll descriptions, and I will change that in the next draft. I think I got into the habit with that because that is the format they use in Gamma World.

As for the burst fire, I think its a good suggestion but I don't know if burst fire is the best option for change. I viewed strafe as the at-will to use for attacking multiple foes, and burst fire was there to have a higher damage attack against a single foe. I think having a power that could hit multiple targets within a larger area that is not confined to a burst would be very useful, but I think I would do that as an additional at-will instead. Suggestions for another name for it?

[Surrealistik]

Noted about the attack roll descriptions, and I will change that in the next draft. I think I got into the habit with that because that is the format they use in Gamma World.

As for the burst fire, I think its a good suggestion but I don't know if burst fire is the best option for change. I viewed strafe as the at-will to use for attacking multiple foes, and burst fire was there to have a higher damage attack against a single foe. I think having a power that could hit multiple targets within a larger area that is not confined to a burst would be very useful, but I think I would do that as an additional at-will instead. Suggestions for another name for it?

It's still a single target attack; the way the power is worded, it allows you to make up to three attacks against one target only. For every attack made beyond the first, a cumulative -2 penalty applies to all attacks made with the power.

[Timejockey]

True. I think we would need to change the wording a bit though because it didn't read that way to me the way you had it written originally and I was thinking it would be too beefy. Maybe something like this:

Burst Fire
At-Will * Martial, Weapon
Standard Action - Ranged weapon
Prerequisite: You must be wielding a weapon with the Burst property.
Target: One creature
Attack: Dexterity vs. AC, make up to three attacks, but each attack made beyond the first applies a cumulative -2 penalty to all attack rolls made with this power.
Hit: 1[W] damage per attack.

How does that sound? So this would be a true burst attack for the Soldier with the potential of all three bullets hitting, as opposed to the simpler burst property I have which adds a small amount of damage.

How does the rest of system look so far?

[Surrealistik]

Looks good, although try to keep the language as simple as possible, while still communicating what needs to be said; my wording was carefully chosen, and based upon existing 4e examples.

Further, I find it unusual that you are not implementing advanced classes as standard paragon paths with the standard L11 Action Point feature, L11 and L16 PP feature, attack and utility powers (this is not necessarily a bad thing, so much as it's a fairly radical departure).

Finally, try to better define the roles of the various classes in terms of Primary and Secondary roles amongst the Striker, Defender, Controller and Leader archetypes. You might find the following classifications helpful:

Charismatic Hero
Primary: Leader
Secondary: Controller

Dedicated Hero
Primary: Leader
Secondary: Defender

Fast Hero
Primary: Striker
Secondary: Controller

Smart Hero
Primary: Controller
Secondary: Leader

Strong Hero
Primary: Striker
Secondary: Defender

Tough Hero
Primary: Defender
Secondary: Striker

[Timejockey]

I did not go with the traditional advanced classes because it just did not feel right for the system, especially since you have the option to change Core class and Career as you progress. Plus the heroic features aspect is something that I plan to flesh out more, and action point benefits are one of things I am considering.
As for the role classification, I agree but I think that is ends up being more of a function of career over Core class. Soldiers and Bodyguards are defenders, Martial Artists and Gunslingers are strikers, Negotiators are leaders, Con Artists and Academics are controllers, etc. I think some do fall into multiple roles as well. I tried to leave the core classes as vague as possible in terms of role, but I will try to add something to the Careers to define it better.
Any other additions or modifications?

Also, here is a version updated with the simpler format for the attack sections of the powers and the adjusted Burst Fire power. I need to work on the language for the power more, but I do think the word "cumulative" is important when describing the penalty.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/46261220/4EModern

[Timejockey]

Another version, this time with a completed first draft of the full weapons and armor list, and some minor revisions to powers.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/46261220/4EModern

[Timejockey]

More revisions and some changes, equipment section is mostly complete, and I've started on the vehicle rules.
Opinions and suggestions always appreciated.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/46261220/4EModern

[Surrealistik]

Some Fast Hero at-wills:

You should aim for 8-10 At-Wills apiece. Some contributions:

Fast Hero At-Wills:

Finessing Strike
At-Will * Martial, Weapon
Standard Action - Melee or Ranged weapon
Target:
One creature
Attack:
Dexterity vs. Reflex
Hit: 1[W] + Dexterity damage.

Fading Strike
At-Will * Martial, Weapon
Standard Action - Melee or Ranged weapon
Prerequisite: You must be trained in Stealth.
Target:
One creature
Attack:
Dexterity vs. AC
Hit: 1[W] damage.
Effect: You shift a number of squares equal to half your Dexterity modifier, and you can make a Stealth check to become hidden.

Trick Strike
At-Will * Martial, Weapon
Standard Action - Melee or Ranged weapon
Prerequisite: You must be trained in Bluff or Thievery.
Target:
One creature
Attack:
Dexterity vs. AC
Hit: 1[W] damage + Dexterity damage and the target grants combat advantage to you until the end of your next turn.

Mugging Strike
At-Will * Martial, Weapon
Standard Action - Melee weapon
Prerequisite: You must be trained in Thievery.
Target:
One creature
Attack:
Dexterity vs. AC
Hit: 1[W] damage + Dexterity damage and you can make a Thievery check to Pickpocket the target with a +5 power bonus.


Sliding Strike
At-Will * Martial, Weapon
Standard Action - Melee or Ranged weapon
Target:
One creature
Attack:
Dexterity vs. AC
Hit: 1[W] damage + Dexterity damage, and you slide the target a number of squares equal to your Intelligence modifier (minimum 1).

Fleet Strike
At-Will * Martial, Weapon
Standard Action - Melee or Ranged weapon
Target:
One creature
Attack:
Dexterity vs. AC
Hit: 1[W] + Dexterity damage.
Special: When using a melee weapon and charging, you can use this power in place of a melee basic attack. If you do, you gain a bonus to all defenses versus Opportunity Attacks equal to half your Dexterity modifier during that charge. This attack ignores all penalties to its attack roll from running.

Opportunist's Assault
At-Will * Martial, Weapon
Standard Action - Melee or Ranged weapon
Target:
One creature
Attack:
Dexterity vs. AC
Hit: 1[W] + Dexterity damage. If the target is granting combat advantage, this attack deals 1[W] extra damage.

Sweeping Assault
At-Will * Martial, Weapon
Standard Action - Close burst 1
Requirement: You must be wielding a melee weapon.
Target:
Each enemy in burst
Attack:
Dexterity vs. Reflex
Hit: 1[W] + Dexterity damage.

Acrobatic Assault
At-Will * Martial, Weapon
Standard Action - Melee or Ranged weapon
Prerequisite: You must be trained in Acrobatics.
Target:
One creature
Attack:
Dexterity vs. AC
Effect: You can make an Acrobatics skill check with a +5 power bonus as part of a move action before or after the attack. If the Acrobatics skill check succeeds, you gain combat advantage against the target until the beginning of your next turn. If the Acrobatics skill check fails, you grant combat advantage until the beginning of your next turn.
Hit: 1[W] + Dexterity damage.


Countering Strike
At-Will * Martial, Weapon
Standard Action - Melee weapon
Target:
One creature
Attack:
Dexterity vs. AC
Effect: 1[W] + Dexterity damage. If the target attacks you before the start of your next turn, you make the following attack against the target as an immediate interrupt with combat advantage: a Dexterity vs. AC attack that deals 1[W] + half Dexterity damage.

Combo Strike
At-Will * Martial, Weapon
Standard Action - Melee weapon
Target:
One, two or three creatures
Attack:
Dexterity vs. AC, up to 3 attacks. Each attack beyond the first applies a cumulative -2 penalty to each attack made with this power.
Hit: 1[W] damage. If you hit a target with all 3 attacks, you can knock that target prone, and push it 1 square.

[Timejockey]

Nice, thank you. Powers look good. I think the combo strike might work better as a Strong power though, reflecting something like a boxer's combination. Keep em coming and I'll get them in there as I work on it.

[Timejockey]

Didn't get to add the new powers yet, working on some other things. But here is an updated file with some reformatting, some corrections for ranges on Smart Hero expert powers, a new Constitution career (the Juggernaut), and vehicle rules. The vehicle rules were modified and adjusted from the ones originally presented in the Adventurer's Vault, so I am curious to see what people think.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/46261220/4EModern