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Coidzor
2011-01-11, 07:41 PM
Yeah, it's an NPC class and all, but I got to wondering what one could do with it after responding to a question about PrC Bards, Paladins, and Rangers (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/prestigiousCharacterClasses.htm) and what they did to the tiers of characters.

Well, the idea of PrCing out of adept intrigued me, but my quick skim of PrCs either required spell levels they don't get for awhile due to the delayed spell progression or spells that the adept can't get without some way of expanding its spell list. Or require Turn Undead as a special requirement.

So far I've found Divine Oracle and Impure Prince as options for standard 5th level qualification, 6th level entry. Contemplative after 10, of course, due to only having skill ranks prereqs. So, any other good ones?

Isn't there some divine-only PrC which adds spells known in a similar way to Wyrm Wizard that's also dragon themed, Dracolyte or something?

Simple entries: These first couple of PrCs are easily entered by a straight-class Adept

Divine Oracle(Complete Divine): 10/10 casting class that adds the oracle domain to one's spell list as well as giving a form of evasion at level 2. Adept qualifies at 5th level with one useless feat, Skill Focus: Knowledge Religion. Has the same BAB, HD, and good save (Will) as an adept, so it's basically Adept with class features. [Adept 5 entry]

Human Paragon (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/racialParagonClasses.htm#humanParagon)(Unearthed Arcana): 2/3 casting class but expands the skill list, boosts an ability score, and gives a bonus feat. Also has 3/4 BAB and a better HD in addition to more skill points. [Potential base class, but needs Adept 1 for the spellcasting progression]

Impure Prince(Magic of Eberron): 4/6 Casting, requires 2 feats. Has the bonus of adding some spells to one's spell list as well as playing with Symbionts. Full BAB as well as an upgraded HD. [Adept 5 entry]

Fleshwarper(Lords of Madness): 9/10 Casting, requires a feat, Graft Flesh, which means without getting a bonus feat, it can't be entered until after one's 9th level feat despite qualifying in other respects at 5th level. Adept does have the advantage of having Heal as a class skill (qualifying for the feat at level 7) and having a familiar though. Poor BAB and identical HD, but has Fort as its good save instead. One of the few ways for a non-arcane familiar to have its power boosted. [Adept 9 entry, lower with some way of getting the feat at level 7 or 8.]

Contemplative (Complete Divine): 10/10 casting. Only requirement is to have the ranks of a level 10 character in Knowledge Religion, other than a special requirement of needing to make contact with one's deity or a representative of one's deity or a representative outsider of the ideal of one's alignment, and it gives a domain at first level. Stick it out and you'll get a second domain at 6th. Otherwise, like Divine Oracle, it's Adept + actual class features. [Adept 10 entry]

Knight of the Raven (Expedition to Castle Ravenloft): 9/10 casting, Full BAB, and good Fort and Will saves. Nifty raven harrier, and best of all, it grants Turn Undead at 3rd level, opening up Divine Feats as well as other PrCs. Main downside is the wait until Adept 8 to qualify for entry due to BAB. Also expands the spell list by giving one the Sun Domain (could multiclass to get in earlier though). [Adept 8 entry, lower with multiclassing]

Master of Radiance (Libris Mortis): 4/5 casting, should give Turn Undead at 1st level, but the wording is a bit unclear. Good fort and will, and a better HD than adept too. Has less going on for it but requires less levels in the class to get turn undead than Knight of the Raven, which it kinda competes with for that purpose as they're both qualified for by Adept 8, though Master of Radiance needs the 3rd level spells from Adept 8 casting. [Adept 8 entry]

These entries need multiclassing to get into, pretty much.

Sacred Fist (Complete Divine): requires, more or less, Monk 2 to fulfill the feat requirements along with combat casting, but gives a better HD, full BAB, good fort and reflex saves, and is 8/10 casting by the table, fullcasting by the text. [Adept6/Monk2 or Adept 6/Monk1/FullBAB1 entry at earliest, Adept 16 entry otherwise]

Complicated entry:PrC Paladin (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/prestigiousCharacterClasses.htm): a dip will give +1 BAB, +1 to spellcasting level, and add Paladin spells to one's class list, but requires either a dip into cleric (making using adept superfluous) or getting into a PrC that gives Turn Undead. Requires a potentially useless feat of Mounted Combat. [Adept8/MasterofRadiance1 is the lowest entry I've found, followed by Adept 8/Knight of the Raven 3]

PrC Ranger (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/prestigiousCharacterClasses.htm): Similar to PrC Paladin, but loses a caster level at first and requires 3 feats minimum to enter, 4 if qualifying using rapid shot. Requires Calm Animals as a divine spell, the only way of which I know to acquire as a spell is either dipping druid (again, renders adept kinda superfluous) or getting the Animal Domain via Contemplative, cleric dip(:smallyuk:), or Sovereign Speaker(?) [Eberron: Adept 8, otherwise Adept10/Contemplative1, using the Animal Domain]

Divine PrCs that require Turning: Need some way of entering a class that grants turn undead. [Adept 8/Master of Radiance1 is the lowest qualification with 3rd level divine spells and turn undead, provided a high enough wisdom score]

Sacred Exorcist (Complete Divine): Would be wonderful and right up your alley for getting Turn Undead, but you don't get dismissal or dispel evil on your spell list without expanding it first. Only way I currently know of is to get A. the Good Domain for Dispel Evil (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/dispelEvil.htm) (which requires 16th level Adept casting as it's a fifth level spell in the domain) B. the Paladin spell list where it's a 4th level spell, but that PrC requires Turn Undead in order to get into it.
Dismissal (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/dismissal.htm)'s a level 4 cleric spell but unless it appears as a lower level spell on another domain's spell list it's either out of reach or in the same place as Dispel Evil. [Eberron: Adept 16, otherwise Adept 15/Contemplative 1 with Good Domain. :smallyuk:]

Deadgrim (Magic of Eberron): Could grant Turn Undead if one qualifies for the class using FE: Undead (possible to be gained by PrC Ranger 1 as well as dipping into Ranger 1)? Expands the spell list somewhat with necromancy spells. Full bab, 4/5 casting. A number of special requirements such as membership in an organization and defeating an undead creature of CR equal or greater to one's character level, and either Turn Undead or FE: Undead. [Eberron: Adept8/PrC Ranger 1, otherwise Adept 10/Contemplative 1/PrC Ranger 1 or Adept 8/Ranger 1]

Thurbane
2011-01-11, 08:25 PM
Basically what you're looking for is something with relatively easy entry reqs, preferrably not dependant on spell level or spells that the Adept doesn't get...

I'm interested in this too, so I'll have a hunt around when I'm back at my books. The thing to keep an eye out for is classes with full (or close to) casting advancement, and with only modertae skill rank or other easy entry reqs.

Human Paragon is something to consider...at the loss of one casting level, it significantly expands the Adept's available skills.

You might also find some applicable ideas in the thread I started for adding spells known for a Favored Soul: http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=175398

Angry Bob
2011-01-11, 08:49 PM
An near as I can tell, adept is the only class that can get into fleshwarper(Lords of Madness) early without multiclassing.

Coidzor
2011-01-11, 09:04 PM
An near as I can tell, adept is the only class that can get into fleshwarper(Lords of Madness) early without multiclassing.

How is that?

Come to think of it, isn't there an Urban Adept variant class spell list or some kind of variant of adept specific to Eberron, say from Dragon magazine material?

Urpriest
2011-01-11, 09:08 PM
How is that?


Heal as a class skill and a familiar.

Coidzor
2011-01-11, 09:50 PM
Heal as a class skill and a familiar.

Ahh, I forgot about that, graft flesh requiring such a high number of skill ranks in heal compared to when the class is otherwise enterable. x.x

Edited the first post with some of my earlier findings from looking around for PrCs to get turn undead on a Adept after looking at the lists of stuff (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19871954/Lists_of_Stuff).


Church Inquisitor, one of the earliest enterable Cleric PrCs would be very nice but it has the unfortunate requirement of requiring Zone of Truth which I don't see a way of getting onto the spell list at this time...

Akal Saris
2011-01-11, 10:02 PM
Fleshwarper even says in its 'Classes' section that adepts can enter at 6th - forgetting, of course, that the crafting feat requires too many ranks in heal, so an adept can't enter until 9th.

The 3.0 'Masters of the Wild' had a storm-themed caster that a witch or adept could enter quite easily.

Some more:

Simple:
Paragnostic Initiate (CC): Quite decent for the adept, which has all knowledge skills.
Legacy Champion (WoL): Decent for the adept, as it turns the class into a druid chassis with 8/10 casting and even some class features.
Exorcist of the Silver Flame (EBCS): Easy to enter, not sure how well it fits adepts though.

Slightly complicated:
Stormcaster (Stormwrack): Requires Gust of Wind, such as through the Least Mark of Storm feat. Quite a good blaster PrC, since it adds stunning effects and bonus dmg as well as sonic-type dmg.

Zaq
2011-01-11, 10:24 PM
I don't recognize the Deadgrim. Where's it from?

Never mind, I found it. Magic of Eberron, in case anyone else was wondering.

Akal Saris
2011-01-11, 10:31 PM
Magic of Eberron

Edit: curses, foiled again!

Coidzor
2011-01-11, 10:31 PM
I don't recognize the Deadgrim. Where's it from?

Sorry about that. It's from Magic of Eberron. It's unclear whether it gives turning if one doesn't have it to begin with, and even the lists of stuff noted this. Just updated the main post to add that in.


The 3.0 'Masters of the Wild' had a storm-themed caster that a witch or adept could enter quite easily.

And you think it's unupdated?

I don't have the book so if anyone who does could check that out please, it'd be appreciated.


Some more:

Simple:
Paragnostic Initiate (CC): Quite decent for the adept, which has all knowledge skills.
Legacy Champion (WoL): Decent for the adept, as it turns the class into a druid chassis with 8/10 casting and even some class features.
Exorcist of the Silver Flame (EBCS): Easy to enter, not sure how well it fits adepts though.

Slightly complicated:
Stormcaster (Stormwrack): Requires Gust of Wind, such as through the Least Mark of Storm feat. Quite a good blaster PrC, since it adds stunning effects and bonus dmg as well as sonic-type dmg.

Are these all fullcasting then other than the Legacy Champion?

Zaq
2011-01-11, 10:51 PM
I just flipped through MotW and I didn't see any storm-themed casters. Are you sure that you're thinking of the right source?

avr
2011-01-11, 10:57 PM
In Eberron, Adepts get one domain. It's explicitly noted in the Sovereign Speaker PrC in Faiths of Eberron that this qualifies them for that PrC.

Coidzor
2011-01-12, 12:29 AM
In Eberron, Adepts get one domain. It's explicitly noted in the Sovereign Speaker PrC in Faiths of Eberron that this qualifies them for that PrC.

Ahh, I knew there was something different about them. Definitely have an easier time PrCing out with that domain. Thanks! :smallbiggrin: Looks like both the domain adept and the Urban Adept alternate spell list are from Eberron too.

Urban Adept looks to be from Sharn: City of Towers, page 167, though the spell list doesn't seem to open up any especial options there.

So, I was just kicking around the idea, and here's a build skeleton I came up with that uses a bit of dragon magazine to see what I could do with an adept.
Eberron:
Eberron Adept 5/Sovereign Speaker 3/Knight of the Raven 3/PRC Paladin 2/Contemplative 1/Sovereign Speaker+6

Holy Mount(Dragon 325) and Dragon Mount(Draconomicon) at the first opportunity, which seems to be the 15th and 18th level feat slots. Ends up with respectable armor aboard a gold dragon, with only two feats devoted to prerequisites.

Original build skeleton to see what I could get an adept to do while riding a dragon:Strongheart Halfling- TWF (if retraining possible, have this as wild cohort and then retrain it)
1 - Track
3 - Endurance
6 - Mounted Combat
9 - Oversized TWF (optional)
12 - Holy Mount
15 - Dragon Mount
18 - X

(Non-Eberron) Adept 6/ Divine Oracle 2/Knight of the Raven 3/PrC Paladin 2/Contemplative 1/ PrC Ranger 1/Knight of the Raven +5

End up with the Animal and Sun domains as well as getting it all with 17th level Adept casting, getting Flamestrike and Commune with Nature as 5th level spells over a normal adept, but with the entire ranger and paladin spell lists for 1st through 4th.

And riding a dragon while wielding two valorous lances. If one were a hellbred instead, I believe one could even do all this while being served by undead minions.

There's no feats free with such a build, but going ranged would allow one to use those tasty ranger arrow spells from champions of ruin.

Demidos
2011-02-21, 07:18 PM
Ahh, I knew there was something different about them. Definitely have an easier time PrCing out with that domain. Thanks! :smallbiggrin: Looks like both the domain adept and the Urban Adept alternate spell list are from Eberron too.
[/SPOILER]

What does domain adept do?:smallconfused:

Coidzor
2011-02-21, 07:32 PM
I know it gives them one cleric domain (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spellLists/clericDomains.htm) for spell list purposes. Can't remember offhand whether they get the domain power or not. I believe so though.

Khatoblepas
2011-02-21, 07:41 PM
The 3.0 'Masters of the Wild' had a storm-themed caster that a witch or adept could enter quite easily.


I don't remember one of those, but from the same book (I believe), was the Hexer, a PrC that, until Archivist came out, could only unquestionably be entered by an Adept.

Full BAB, 5 sorc/wiz spells, and evil eye abilities. Quite nice. It required Lightning Bolt as a divine spell.

true_shinken
2011-02-21, 07:55 PM
I don't remember one of those, but from the same book (I believe), was the Hexer, a PrC that, until Archivist came out, could only unquestionably be entered by an Adept.

Full BAB, 5 sorc/wiz spells, and evil eye abilities. Quite nice. It required Lightning Bolt as a divine spell.

Damn, I opened this thread to suggest Hexer.
This class is very good.

Coidzor
2011-02-21, 08:27 PM
Man, I need to finally look that one up. can't believe I forgot about it.