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tcrudisi
2011-01-15, 03:10 PM
I have a wet-erase battle map that became stained. I let it sit for a few months without cleaning it; now that I have cleaned it, I can still see where the lines were.

What chemicals should I use to remove the stains? I've tried pure alcohol without any success.

Ytaker
2011-01-15, 03:12 PM
What is it stained with? Ink?

Smeggedoff
2011-01-15, 03:14 PM
If it's marker try spraying a bit of deodorant on there and rubbing it with a cloth. It's what I do with mine when it's been sitting for a while

tcrudisi
2011-01-15, 03:24 PM
It is stained with wet erase markers... oh, the irony. It's a wet erase battle mat stained with wet erase markers. It's my fault for leaving it on there for so long, I suppose.

The ink is black and blue (not even one of the normal culprits).

I'll give the deodorant as a "last resort" deal since I don't use the spray kind - but thanks for the tip.

Ozreth
2011-01-15, 03:26 PM
I find that if you just keep using it and washing, washing, washing it will eventually come out.

hereyago
2011-01-15, 03:33 PM
My own saliva always works for me, but that could be a Ph balance thing, or enzyme function or something... Anyway, if I had this problem I'd try lemon juice, as a natural acid that lots of people tend to have in the kitchen. Or vinegar, a stronger natural acid. (A couple of tablespoons in a cup of water.) If that doesn't work how about a sodium bicarbonate paste. Sorry, er, baking soda. Mix some baking soda with water (not sure on the ratio I usually eyeball it. idk, google it I guess, lol) to make a paste, put a layer of it on the board and leave it to set for a few mins. then wipe it off with a damp cloth. Good luck.

tcrudisi
2011-01-15, 03:37 PM
I'm a terrible artist. The main reason I really want the lines off is because it's not all lines. For instance, one area I tried to draw and gave up when the players ask, "What is that?" So I wrote down in the area "Skulls".

So now I have a box with "skulls" wrote in it. Yeah - I want that off. :-P

(I just thought I'd share this so that maybe it will give others a chuckle).

EnnPeeCee
2011-01-15, 04:28 PM
I'm not sure about ink stains, but I do know you can get crusted-on ink off by drawing over it with fresh ink and wiping it off. It would be something easy to try before resorting to something more extreme.

Past that, the first thing I'd try if it happened to me would be some rubbing alcohol.

ericgrau
2011-01-15, 04:33 PM
^ +1 Try more wet erase marker. Often it will dilute the old wet erase and you can then clean it off or sometimes even wet erase it normally.

Basically something needs to wet and/or soften the dried out marker crud before any cleaner will be able to penetrate it, even a strong cleaner it seems. Soaking it in something else might work too.

Curmudgeon
2011-01-15, 04:45 PM
So now I have a box with "skulls" wrote in it. Yeah - I want that off. :-P
I feel your pain. I've got a couple of brown stick figures on mine indicating bodies; they've been there for 3-4 years now. I've also got a reverse image of the L.L. Bean return address from when I brought a package (nicely sealed in heavy plastic) in out of the rain and set it down on the table, which I thought would be protected from the damp by the battle mat left out on it. The table's fine, but rubbing alcohol, ammonia, and various other household cleaners haven't been able to get either of these bits of ink off. Rubbing alcohol and lots of elbow grease have done pretty well with the black, red, blue, and green wet marker inks, but the brown stuff is very stubborn.

TroubleBrewing
2011-01-15, 04:51 PM
Mr. Clean Magic Eraser or the generic equivalent. Walmart brand works just as well. I had the exact same problem, but with an orange wet-erase marker. Got it off in about a minute of scrubbing. You can get them for like two bucks, too.

Supersporkman
2011-01-15, 06:06 PM
A solution of pinesol and water diluting it. A green scrubby pad and lots of elbow grease. If the stain is bad enough do not dilute. Works miracles.

tahu88810
2011-01-15, 06:13 PM
I can't really help you much, because I have the same problem. Due to my laziness, my players fight every battle ever in the ghost ruins of Winterrest Village, burned down seven campaigns ago by the BBEG and his dragon army.

Gnoman
2011-01-15, 08:51 PM
If all else fails, try acetone. Really a last resort though.

Cealocanth
2011-01-15, 11:45 PM
I use Nail Polish Remover.

Curmudgeon
2011-01-15, 11:51 PM
I use Nail Polish Remover.
Nail polish remover is (primarily) acetone.

jguy
2011-01-16, 12:39 AM
Tooth paste works really well too. Worth a shot

a_humble_lich
2011-01-16, 06:16 AM
Before you try anything (especially harsh chemicals lie acetone) do a small test on the corner to make sure the mat still works afterwards. I had a friend who used some chemicals to clean his whiteboard and was left with a whiteboard that could never be erased.

Also, there are a lot of nail polish removers without acetone these days, but they smell similar so I'd guess they use a similar solvent.

some guy
2011-01-16, 09:29 AM
I've never had a map stained for more than 2-3 weeks. In that case soap and warm water works, I'm not sure if that will work with a time span of a few months but you can always try.

tcrudisi
2011-01-16, 09:53 AM
I've never had a map stained for more than 2-3 weeks. In that case soap and warm water works, I'm not sure if that will work with a time span of a few months but you can always try.

What brand of soap do you use? I figure an anti-bacterial like Dial will have different ingredients than Dove, for instance.

Yesterday I left some rubbing alcohol on it for an hour or more. It accomplished two things: it gave my fiancée a headache and one-half of the mat is now mostly cleaned. Weird, but true. There were two maps that I had drawn onto it and one of them is almost completely off. It's still visible, but only barely. The other... for some reason the alcohol didn't work as much on it. I bet it's straight-laced.

I definitely appreciate all the tips. My internet-fu also revealed yogurt as a possible cleaner. I'll be trying everything suggested (starting with weaker cleaners first) until I come up with something that works. Thanks guys - I will post onto here when I figure out what eventually works so that everyone can at least know my experience with it.

some guy
2011-01-16, 10:21 AM
What brand of soap do you use? I figure an anti-bacterial like Dial will have different ingredients than Dove, for instance.


I'm not sure actually, it's in a different container now, but it was regular handsoap. I'm guessing it was a different brand than you have available.

Good luck!



Also; yogurt? Really?

absolmorph
2011-01-16, 07:32 PM
I'm a terrible artist. The main reason I really want the lines off is because it's not all lines. For instance, one area I tried to draw and gave up when the players ask, "What is that?" So I wrote down in the area "Skulls".

So now I have a box with "skulls" wrote in it. Yeah - I want that off. :-P

(I just thought I'd share this so that maybe it will give others a chuckle).
This thread is relevant to my interests. As humorous as it is, having "Lava 8D" written on my mat for eternity is not appealing.
I feel your pain.

ericgrau
2011-01-16, 07:49 PM
What brand of soap do you use? I figure an anti-bacterial like Dial will have different ingredients than Dove, for instance.
Not really. There's sodium laurel sulfate, saponified oil (always a solid) and glycerin and they all pretty much have the same effect. The rest is just additives, fragrance, etc.

Your different types of cleaners to try:

Desurfacants: Soap, shampoo, detergents (strongest) and other common mild cleaners. Keep dirt from sticking.
Solvents, alcohol: Rubbing alcohol, drinking alcohol, etc. Is also an emulsifier (below).
Solvents, petroleum: Acetone, nail polish remove (also acetone), gasoline, paint thinner. Dissolve oil based things. Obviously doesn't including wet eraser water but might include the dried ink. A warning though, many might dissolve plastic such as battle mats if left to soak instead of being wiped up immediately.
Dilutants: Water, mineral oil. Might be good for soaking, but so is everything else.
Abrasives: Rubbing compound, toothpaste, super fine sandpaper. All of these basically contain super fine sand. Will remove anything with enough rubbing, including a super thin layer of your battle mat and maybe the battle mat grid along with it. Takes minutes of elbow grease though.
Emulsifiers: Lecithin, I think milk falls here too. Allow oil to be dissolved in water.
chemical, acid/alkaline: vinegar or baking soda, typically. Anything sour or bitter. Typically better on organic material.


There now you don't end up trying the same thing twice.

Soylent Dave
2011-01-17, 01:23 AM
There now you don't end up trying the same thing twice.

Soaps and other detergents are derived from alkali salts, and clean by corrosion (as well as encouraging the dissolution of oils) - so you're duplicating things a bit with additional emulsifiers and bases.

It's worth noting that antibacterial soaps do actually contain additional chemicals when compared with normal soap - mostly to do with removing metal ions (which is sort of vaguely related to bacteria in a 'definitely not false advertising honest' kinda way) - but it does mean they're probably slightly better at removing wet erase marker (which contains titanium dioxide).

-

Wet Erase marker is, as I said, metal and water based - so soap and water should do a better job than alcohol or organic solvents (acetone & friends) - they're better at removing Dry Erase marker, which is alcohol-based.

The more alkaline the solution you use, the better it should clean wet erase marker. But it needs to be liquid (e.g soapy water).

And, as a few people suggested, writing over the board with an existing marker first will help - with a dry erase marker you'd try to wipe it off straight away. With a wet erase you need to let it dry a little, then try to wipe it off with a damp cloth as usual (and soapy water should help as well).

If you've got permanent marker on there, write some dry erase over the top and then wipe it off, that usually works (as do strong solvents).

Any solvent will eventually clean the surface though (I'd avoid abrasive cleaning if you can, as it's more likely to knacker the surface, but toothpaste is brilliant at actually removing the marker). Alcoholic and organic solvents on a wet erase board will probably need to be left to soak into the board for a little while (as I think the OP has discovered!).

Oh and Turtle Wax and the like is a good way to resurface a whiteboard which doesn't seem to work very well after you've cleaned it. Baby oil works too, but it isn't quite as good.

-

Edit : Oh yeah, and while I'm not going to do a COSHH assessment for all of this, any solvents you apply to marker pen will release toxic fumes, so do it somewhere well-ventilated or you'll get a headache (and/or breathing difficulties). But you can all probably figure that bit out.

Saintheart
2011-01-17, 07:23 AM
And remember, if all else fails, there isn't a problem you can't solve with fire! :smallbiggrin:

Callista
2011-01-17, 08:37 AM
I had that problem--didn't use mine for four years. Covering the stains with more marker and then erasing normally worked. I did have to "scrub" with the fresh marker, so use an old one that you don't mind ruining the tip of.

Demonweave
2011-01-17, 08:51 PM
I'm glad this thread is here, I have the same problem.

I have pink numbers written on half the squares of my battle mat :smallfurious:
(Got annoyed by drawing the same runes over and over so we just numbered them)

Why we chose pink I will never know

Shpadoinkle
2011-01-17, 08:55 PM
I know this has already been said, but I'm throwing my chip in with the people who have suggested trying rubbing alcohol, toothpaste, and nail polish remover.

If none of those work, you could try making a new mat. I made one myself out of a piece of regular paper and some clear packing tape.

tcrudisi
2011-01-19, 07:50 AM
Just to give everyone a head's up on my success (or more appropriately, failure).

I've not managed to completely clean it yet. In fact, one-half of it seems very resistant to the idea.

I've had alcohol sit on it for a couple of hours. (this contributed to the one-half that did come off).

I tried toothpaste on a 4x4 square, and that did not work.
I then tried taking a bad wet-erase marker and marking heavily in that same 4x4 square. That 4x4 square is now much, much worse than the others. I do not know if if was the toothpaste or the marking heavily with the wet-erase marker that caused this.

I've tried Windex with no luck.

I've also tried regular water.

I have also tried yogurt (several people in other threads said it worked). It didn't work. However, looking back, I realize that I tried this in the toothpaste/hard marking square, so I wonder if one of the previous attempts removed the material that makes it wet-erase, thereby nullifying the yogurt? I should have tried the yogurt in another spot too. Curses.

I can't think of anything else that I've tried off-hand (and I need to walk out the door in 1 minute and I don't have my shoes on).

Shinigaze
2011-01-19, 09:55 AM
We just had this problem a few days ago and we used lysol/clorox wipes to clean it up. It worked great on the stuck on lines, but less so on the smudgy type stains.

Grogmir
2011-01-19, 10:15 AM
[QUOTE=ericgrau;10168058]^ +1 Try more wet erase marker. Often it will dilute the old wet erase and you can then clean it off or sometimes even wet erase it normally.[QUOTE]

This!

Ah seems you've tried that - thats some harsh liquids you've put on there - looks like its permenently stained tbh. :smalleek:

Person_Man
2011-01-19, 11:30 AM
As a side note, you may wish to look into Heroscape terrain, and/or dungeon tiles from Castle Raveloft, or any of the other similar variants from other games. You can generally buy them cheap online, as long as you get them used and are patient enough to wait for a good deal. I've also heard that Dwarf Forge terrain is quite amazing, but is equally expensive and hard to find used. I own and use a battle map similar to yours, but not that I own alternatives I rarely use it.