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tcrudisi
2011-01-17, 11:56 PM
My fiancée DM'ed for the first time. She was asked to DM for our FLGS on LFR night, so she ran a 4e module. She picked one at random and chose Dale2-1 Forever.

We got our butts kicked. Royally, totally kicked. She held back a few times so that way only one character died and the rest ran away. So yeah - it was effectively a TPK.

I heard a couple of the players complaining that she wasn't holding back and that "experienced DMs know when to start going easy." Well - she did and we still lost that badly. She ignored a couple of the elites abilities. In the room adjacent to us, there was a trap and monster who activate when we leave the room we were fighting in. During the fight, the Thief went into that room (and would have activated the trap and monster). When they were running away, she ignored that trap then too. Once she ignored the damage that the Ranger was supposed to take so the Ranger would stay conscious. Basically, we just got our butts kicked.

I particularly enjoy the irony that it was her first time ever DM'ing and she got an effective TPK. Have any of you ever done something similar?

Ryu_Bonkosi
2011-01-18, 12:42 AM
Ish. Basic out of the box starter kit to teach some new people how to play without adding too much info. 24 point-buy, so not high powered. They all choose rogue. I tried to persuade them against it but they wouldn't listen. So in the third room they had to fight a (I can't remember) and it ended up as a TPK because none of them decided to boost their Con any and all four of them had only 5 hp.

Kaldrin
2011-01-18, 01:07 AM
We got our butts kicked. Royally, totally kicked. She held back a few times so that way only one character died and the rest ran away. So yeah - it was effectively a TPK.

That sucks. I hope it doesn't throw her off running games from now on. I think when we all started out we had situations like that. It's a big reason why I create my own worlds and adventures. A few times I've used the modules from TSR/WotC and wound up changing them so much it was just essentially the story and the map that was the same.

Safety Sword
2011-01-18, 01:10 AM
Terribad players are difficult to DM for :smalleek:

Fitz10019
2011-01-18, 04:40 AM
My fiancée DM'ed for the first time... it was effectively a TPK.

In some cultures, you're not considered old enough to marry until you DM a TPK. Now that's she's qualified... have you?

supermonkeyjoe
2011-01-18, 04:47 AM
I bought the introductory red box set to get some friends hooked on D&D (it worked) they got as far as the room with the stupid chess puzzle and then got utterly destroyed by the animated chess pieces. Amazingly after this they still all wanted to play D&D proper so a TPK isn't always bad news.

Ingus
2011-01-18, 04:48 AM
In some cultures, you're not considered old enough to marry until you DM a TPK. Now that's she's qualified... have you?

Lol!

I had a theorically TPK very late in career. My experienced players started to lose their head at 16th level. So they started to act as a hollywood brat with everyone. When they ended manacing an avatar in disguise and, then, effectively trying to kill him, well...

Runestar
2011-01-18, 04:52 AM
Ooh...so your fiance has a sadistic streak in her...:smallcool::smalleek::smalltongue:

Totally Guy
2011-01-18, 06:06 AM
I heard a couple of the players complaining that she wasn't holding back and that "experienced DMs know when to start going easy."

How horrible! I hope that doesn't put her off... Game store GMing is something I'd not really want to do.

Ernir
2011-01-18, 06:55 AM
I heard a couple of the players complaining that she wasn't holding back and that "experienced DMs know when to start going easy."

Oh, FFS. Experienced players know not to whine when the module kicks their ass. :smallsigh:

potatocubed
2011-01-18, 07:01 AM
That's pretty impressive - when you run an RPGA module without all the ridiculous RPGA restrictions, they tend to be unspeakably easy.

Anyway, congrats to your fiance. Getting comfortable with slaughtering PCs is one of the defining moments of GMship, and 'early and often' is as good a practice as any. :smallsmile:

tcrudisi
2011-01-18, 08:14 AM
In some cultures, you're not considered old enough to marry until you DM a TPK. Now that's she's qualified... have you?

Haha - Ya know... I don't think I have, but I've been DM'ing for ~16 years, so I probably have at some point. I know I have come very close. In one combat, I had 4 players dead and the other two at less than 5 hit points. If the Ranger had not managed to hit the dragon, the dragon aura would have killed both of them without me needing to make an attack roll.


How horrible! I hope that doesn't put her off... Game store GMing is something I'd not really want to do.

Nah - myself and two other players were laughing the whole time. A new DM beating us into a pulp? That's funny. The other two were very much upset. "If this character dies, I'll never play her again. I don't play characters after they die." (said in a very angry voice). Later, they complained to the organizer that she wasn't an experienced DM, because an experienced DM would hold punches. The organizer came up to her afterwards and said, "WAY TO GO!" He's a big fan of TPK's though.


That's pretty impressive - when you run an RPGA module without all the ridiculous RPGA restrictions, they tend to be unspeakably easy.

This was certainly a difficult mod. The organizer came over and said, "Oh god, THIS one? I ran a party of level 7 optimized characters through it and they all finished with no healing surges left." ... We weren't level 7 and we were still playing high. And only two of us were optimized.


Anyway, congrats to your fiance. Getting comfortable with slaughtering PCs is one of the defining moments of GMship, and 'early and often' is as good a practice as any. :smallsmile:

That's a good point. I'll have to let her know that.

/edit - Also, I'm nit-picking and I apologize, but fiancé is for the male who is to be married and fiancée is for the woman who is to be married. Since my fiancée is a lady, the second e gets added on. :smallsmile:

Grogmir
2011-01-18, 08:27 AM
To the OP. "My fiancée DM'ed " I wonder why you're marrying her? :smallwink:

Anyway - Seems like just one of those things. I don't play in storegames so can't advise on ettiquette.

I would have made clear the DM was a first timer.
I would have also told the two players to suck it up,

There's a huge thread on here about 'holding back' or Fudging and its not something even 'experienced' DMs always do. So the players moans were just that.

Hope you Fiancee DMs again and you have a perfect day.

Grog

tcrudisi
2011-01-18, 09:17 AM
To the OP. "My fiancée DM'ed " I wonder why you're marrying her? :smallwink: Too true!


I would have made clear the DM was a first timer. Everyone was made aware of this fact, actually.


There's a huge thread on here about 'holding back' or Fudging and its not something even 'experienced' DMs always do.

Ya know, I posted on that thread once or twice to give my input. Basically, I don't like holding back. So the fact we TPK'ed? Awesome in my book.


Hope you Fiancee DMs again and you have a perfect day.

Same to you!

Sipex
2011-01-18, 09:27 AM
Sounds fun. What level was the module vs the players? I'm really curious about his.

tcrudisi
2011-01-18, 09:50 AM
Sounds fun. What level was the module vs the players? I'm really curious about his.

It was H2 (so levels 4-7). The players were level 4, 4, 5, 5, and 5. One of the players didn't have her own character, so she borrowed one from the store. After she rolled to hit a couple of times, I asked her if I could see her character. She had no magical items, a shortbow and short sword. She had Throw and Stab and an encounter power that functioned as an improved version of that ability. Ummh... how is she supposed to throw a shortbow? Wow.

The Fighter was another lady (I know, right? 3 women at one table doesn't happen often). She was the other optimized character and she was playing a Fighter. I knew from the get-go that I wasn't going to enjoy her playing style. When she said, "Don't you dare hit me with any of your attacks", I knew it was going to be a bad day. Yes, I play a Wizard. Yes, I know how to control my bursts and blasts, thank you. And I always ask before blasting allies. We lost for a lot of reasons (first of which was the difficulty of the mod), but one reason was certainly her fault. I was using Hypnotism to make the monsters attack themselves, violating her mark, so she could get her combat challenge attack in. We did this through the whole first combat. During the second combat, she suddenly forgot how to tank. She would shift away from the monster or push it away one square. They ran away (and I died) when the monster was at 4hp. If even once, just once, she had stood beside the monster when I successfully hypnotized him, she would have hit him for minimum 6 damage.

Yeah - defenders who don't defend? Pet peeve of mine.

The poor Bard could never hit because he had to roll a 14 on the dice. I kept rolling 11's and needed a 12, so I rarely hit. The Ranger critted a couple of times and the Thief critted a couple of times... other than that, they mostly missed. It was not pretty to watch.

And yeah, we played high. It's Dale2-1 Forever. If you get a chance to play it, do so! Don't cheat yourself by reading through it first though... that module is brutal and should be experienced as such. :) Actually, one of the reasons we lost is because I played it with my fiancée the day before to give her some practice, so I knew what to expect. I didn't want to metagame, so I played it the same way that I did the day before. Even though the day before I was doing things and saying, "I know I should do it the other way first, but this is how most groups will do it, so I'll do it this way." Sure enough, that's how my group decided to do it. :smalltongue:

RaveingRonin
2011-01-18, 10:52 AM
Red hand of Doom, the 3.5 module, has killed me and my party more times then I care to recount. Throw anything else at us, and we will come out on top, with more swag then a Great Wrym and a better reputation then Palor (no matter what alignment we actually are). But make us play Red Hand of Doom, and somehow Hobgoblins and Hellhounds (that's right, the opening combat, the easiest darn encounter in the whole game) will bend us over and make us their butt buddies.

Vladislav
2011-01-18, 10:59 AM
Marry your fiancee. Divorce the two crybaby players.

Grelna the Blue
2011-01-18, 12:47 PM
I particularly enjoy the irony that it was her first time ever DM'ing and she got an effective TPK. Have any of you ever done something similar?

Done it personally? No, not right out of the box. I'm glad, too. I wouldn't have enjoyed it as a first-time GMing experience.

However, I've had it done TO me. The GM for a one-shot allowed the big bad to be RPed by his murderous 9 yr-old son, who didn't know the game but did like to kill things. It was a dragon of about adult age and the kid's tactics kicked our sorry asses. We totally deserved to lose anyway (not nearly enough cooperation), but watching the dragon just reach out and grab PCs (dragon's grapple bonuses make them much better at that than at the tiresome claw/claw/bite routine) and then hurl us against the walls and ceiling (spiked with stalactites) of his lair was a joy to behold. When the PCs tried to hang back (huge mistake), the dragon fried us with his breath. Not one of us got out. The kid was very happy. I have to admit I was too, at seeing a dragon so effortlessly deconstruct a mid level party.