PDA

View Full Version : What character to roll? (3.5)



CapnCJ
2011-01-23, 05:31 PM
I've been wracking my brains about this problem and I suddenly rememberd that GitP has a fairly active board for PnP games, so I finally decided to sign up and post. So, hello! And with that, onto my problem..

So i've been playing D&D for some time now, and i'm currently part of a demon hunting campaign. I've been playing a Druid but I fancy a change. The thing is, i'm not 100% sure what to roll. The party is as follows:

Human Favoured Soul - Good healer, uses a Greatsword. Power Attacks a lot.
Half Fiend Warlock - Uses a Bastard Sword, another frontliner. Lots of DR.Channels his Eldrich Blast through his weapon.
Human Paladin - Yet to see him in an adventure as he's just changed (Previous character died) but i'd imagine he'll go Sword & Board knowing the player.

I've played a few arcane spellcasters over time, so I don't really fancy going down that route again. I'm tempted to join the crowd of heavy hitters and roll a Barbarian or something, but the party is lacking a skillmonkey and it's been a very long time since i've played a Rogue. I'm open to suggestions as i'm really not sure what I want to play, only that I don't really want to play the Druid.

Books available are:
PHB
PHB2
All the Completes (At least, I think we have all of them)
All the Races Of... (Again, I think..)
Frostburn
Cityscape & Dungeonscape
The MM1-3 are around, but the DM rarely lets us use them

All suggestions are welcome :)

CJ

mootoall
2011-01-23, 05:35 PM
Factotum! You don't just get to be a skill monkey- you get to be everything!

Tibbaerrohwen
2011-01-23, 05:43 PM
I'm with mooto all, if your DM is allowing Dungeonscape.
The party is pretty balanced, but they are missing a sneaky character, and for that a Rogue, Factotum, Scout or Bard would be superb.

EDIT: All Completes means Lurk would be available.

Waker
2011-01-23, 05:47 PM
Factotum is a good choice for a skillmonkey, which can help fill in for other roles too. With it's superior mobility a Scout is another good choice. Depending on the level you will be starting at, you could also go for something like a Temple Raider of Olidammara.

CapnCJ
2011-01-23, 05:54 PM
Starting level for the character will be 9. We've never even seen a Factotum in the group before, could be a laugh. I'll have a quick look into it. Keep the suggestions coming though :)

gorfnab
2011-01-23, 06:02 PM
How about a Swift Hunter (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?PHPSESSID=f8rbea6k7fmik181j35ieqifc2&topic=103.0)? It has skills and it has great damage potential. You could even go front line and grab a level of Barbarian (Pounce for skirmish obviously) if you wanted to.

CapnCJ
2011-01-23, 06:43 PM
Something about Factotum doesn't really gel with me, not sure I fancy it. Swift Hunter is pretty nice, and certainly a possibility :)

mootoall
2011-01-23, 06:44 PM
Something about Factotum doesn't really gel with me, not sure I fancy it. Swift Hunter is pretty nice, and certainly a possibility :)

What's the matter with it? Whatever it is, I'll be glad to assuage your doubts.

CapnCJ
2011-01-23, 06:57 PM
Every time I flick through the class I think so myself "Huh.. Didn't know WotC were MacGyver fans." The whole jack-of-all-trades idea is fun, and actually it would fit into the party well considering every base is covered already, and... Okay, now i'm starting to convince myself that playing one is a good idea. Dammit.

Duncan_Ruadrik
2011-01-23, 07:07 PM
Rogue with lots of UMD! though the warlock can do it better, UMD never hurt anyone.

mootoall
2011-01-23, 07:22 PM
Every time I flick through the class I think so myself "Huh.. Didn't know WotC were MacGyver fans." The whole jack-of-all-trades idea is fun, and actually it would fit into the party well considering every base is covered already, and... Okay, now i'm starting to convince myself that playing one is a good idea. Dammit.

See? The best fifth wheel around.

I actually find it ironic that the bard, fluffed as the fifth wheel, has to be specialized to be useful.

CapnCJ
2011-01-23, 07:29 PM
The only problem I can see so far with Factotum is that a lot of people seem to consider the Font of Inspiration feat to be essential to the class, and i'm fairly certain my DM wont allow it as it's not in a book the group has, it was printed on the website.

mootoall
2011-01-23, 07:35 PM
It's an official feat, and as much a part of the official rules as the Races of the Dragon or Champions of Valor web enhancements. And it's not incredibly necessary, especially since encounters will be ended quickly with so many heavy hitters.

CapnCJ
2011-01-23, 07:43 PM
Unfortunately, my DM wont let that fly, he's a real nutbuster :(

Something else i'm iffy about with Factotums: They can use inspiration to add to a skill and they get inspiration points every encounter. What exactly counts as an encounter?

Say i'm in a fight, and i'm "given" 2 Inspiration points. I use one during the fight. Later on, we're talking to an NPC and I want to Bluff. Do I only have the one left over from before? Do I get 2 more because every conversation is an encounter? I'm a little dense about all this.

mootoall
2011-01-23, 07:46 PM
Unfortunately, my DM wont let that fly, he's a real nutbuster :(

Something else i'm iffy about with Factotums: They can use inspiration to add to a skill and they get inspiration points every encounter. What exactly counts as an encounter?

Say i'm in a fight, and i'm "given" 2 Inspiration points. I use one during the fight. Later on, we're talking to an NPC and I want to Bluff. Do I only have the one left over from before? Do I get 2 more because every conversation is an encounter? I'm a little dense about all this.

I forget the official definition, but I use it as any situation where you "encounter" an obsticle.

E.g. Searching and then disabling a trap is one encounter. Later, you fight an orc, which is another encounter. Later you're interacting with the princess you're rescuing, which is another encounter. After that, you return her to the king, and when you address him and his court that's another encounter.

Waker
2011-01-23, 07:51 PM
Factotum is a fun class (one of my favorites) even without crazy optimizing. And while the Font is useful, it isn't required unless you plan on using your powers every round, most combat wouldn't require it. Just compensate for any weaknesses with strategy (tripping, flanking, yadda yadda) and UMD.

Bard can be fun, even without specializing, although it obviously pays to do so. Considering the heavy combat orientation that your group has, War Chanter would probably be appreciated.

A scout is another class I rather enjoy. Superior movement and the ability to deal you skirmish damage without needing a flanking partner or for the enemy to be flat-footed is something I appreciate. Swift Hunter can make this very powerful.

Rogue is fun, but many people prefer to use it as a stepping stone into prestige classes like Unseen Seer (though I still appreciate the Arcane Trickster.) Multi-classed with certain classes can make this class quite strong, like doubling up with another class that has evasion so you can get Spell Reflection (Complete Mage.)

CapnCJ
2011-01-23, 07:51 PM
The more closely I read the class stuff, the more confused I get :smallbiggrin:

However, it's starting to look like the perfect last member of the group. My one concern is that i'll be okay at everything, but no good at anything.. Another temptation is just to go full Rogue, grab a couple of tasty magic swords, and slash my way through anything unfortunate enough to get within 5ft of me.

Vemynal
2011-01-23, 08:07 PM
I don't know if your DM would allow it - But with that many melee characters 'White Raven tactics' would be amazing.

Especially if you specialized in the Bard's Inspire Courage along with a Crusader's white raven tactics.

The Bard aspect of the class would also allow you to be a tool/skill monkey and partial party face

mootoall
2011-01-23, 08:08 PM
The more closely I read the class stuff, the more confused I get :smallbiggrin:

However, it's starting to look like the perfect last member of the group. My one concern is that i'll be okay at everything, but no good at anything.. Another temptation is just to go full Rogue, grab a couple of tasty magic swords, and slash my way through anything unfortunate enough to get within 5ft of me.

Well, Waker has it right actually. With a bit of optimization, you'll be great at combat (reach weapon with enlargement and improved trip), see if your DM will let you qualify for Craven, and then darkstalker and stuff for extra funsies.

Waker
2011-01-23, 08:19 PM
Assuming you went straight Factotum and didn't take Font, you would have 5 inspiration points per encounter to use. You aren't a full caster or a dedicated healer, you just happen to have the option to use those abilities. By level 9 you can cast 3 spells per day, up to third level, you can turn undead/lay on hands, you add your Int to all Str and Dex based skills and checks (which include Initiative), you can spontaneously add bonuses to various skills and checks and more. Not to mention that you get one of the most powerful class abilities in the entire game, Cunning Surge, which lets you take an extra standard action in a round. Every skill is a class skill to you, you get a fairly large amount of skill points (remembering that Int is your key stat) so nobody can match you in that regard.
Like I said, I love the class more for the cool abilities and flavor, but it is a very easy class to annoy a DM with, without resorting to high level spells. You can do pretty much anything you want.

CapnCJ
2011-01-23, 08:25 PM
Alright, I think i'm convinced. Now, it becomes about how to build the character.. I might roll some stats with the DM tomorrow and see what I come up with. In the mean time, i'm going to quickly create one and see how it looks, try to work out a couple of things that are still confusing me a little.

This is now a character optimisation thread!

Waker
2011-01-23, 08:41 PM
Well, since you are going to be rolling up your stats later, certain things like the number of skill points you have is still up in the air, thus I will focus on feats and the like.

Combat Expertise/Improved Trip: Trip attempts are str/dex opposed by your str check, but as of Brains Over Brawn, you also add your Int to it, making this a popular choice amongst Factotum players.

Knowledge Devotion (Complete Champion): Make a Knowledge check appropriate to the enemy faced (Religion for Undead, Dungeoneering for Aberration and so on), depending on the check you get a bonus on attack/damage rolls for the rest of the combat.

Iaijutsu: I won't get into, but I'm sure someone else will point out the silliness of this strategy.

Skill Trick: Collector of Stories: Gives you a +5 bonus on Knowledge checks made to determine a monsters weakness. See Knowledge Devotion.

There are plenty of other options, but as I said before, I'm not really one for optimizing. Someone else will have to pick up my slack.

gorfnab
2011-01-24, 05:27 AM
Alright, I think i'm convinced. Now, it becomes about how to build the character.. I might roll some stats with the DM tomorrow and see what I come up with. In the mean time, i'm going to quickly create one and see how it looks, try to work out a couple of things that are still confusing me a little.

This is now a character optimisation thread!
Here is the Factotum Handbook (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=2720.0).

Imperious Command feat + Never Outnumbered skill trick is fairly nice.

CapnCJ
2011-01-24, 08:05 AM
Well, the DM has shot down Factotum. He read through the class, decided to ban it. Back to the drawing board, folks.

Edit: I'm now looking at a Fighter/Swashy/Dervish.

Greenish
2011-01-24, 08:21 AM
Be a bard! Good melee, good skills, some casting, awesome party buffing (especially in a melee-heavy group).

[Edit]: Did the DM say why factotum wouldn't fly?

CapnCJ
2011-01-24, 08:29 AM
I have an irrational hatred of Bards that extends far beyond any measure of reason.

Also, he didn't really say, just mumbled about how he doesn't like the style and told me to pick something else :smalltongue:

the clumsy bard
2011-01-24, 08:34 AM
Do you have access to fiendish codex 2? If yes then i have a few suggestions.

CapnCJ
2011-01-24, 08:37 AM
Unfortunately not. In fact, I seem to have listed a couple of books that we don't have in my original post, so a revised booklist:

PHB/PHB2
Complete Warrior/Divine/Aventurer/Arcane
Races of Stone/Dragon/Wild
I don't really like playing LA races, so probably not worth mentioning the MM or anything.

true_shinken
2011-01-24, 08:42 AM
Don't use Hideous Blow. Just don't.
That's all I had to say. Move along.

CapnCJ
2011-01-24, 08:46 AM
Our melee warlock uses that constantly :smallbiggrin:

I'm thinking for my character Rogue1/Swashy3/Fighter2/Dervish4(advancing all the way to 10) and then after that.. Err, i'll decide later.

Malbordeus
2011-01-24, 08:50 AM
with the party you have, a buffmaster type would be loved, long and hard.

but some of the best ones are out of your book list. so i'm going to throw my ideas towards Dragon shaman. Heals/Buffs/Aoe Damage, and then you get feats which improve all three.

various metabreats can be a giggle, you get all auras at a decent + and you have a lay on hands ish ability that can do ability damage/level drain.

CapnCJ
2011-01-24, 09:05 AM
The Favoured Soul uses all his spells for either healing or buffing, so a buffer isn't really needed. I think the one thing the group want is a character that can Haste them, but i'm not rolling a character just for that :smalltongue:

true_shinken
2011-01-24, 09:13 AM
The Favoured Soul uses all his spells for either healing or buffing, so a buffer isn't really needed. I think the one thing the group want is a character that can Haste them, but i'm not rolling a character just for that :smalltongue:
Psst, Bard/Swiftblade :smallwink:

Jayabalard
2011-01-24, 09:30 AM
Two other skillmonkeys: Beguiler and Spellthief.

Now, I wouldn't be surprised if you ruled these out (especially the former), since you said that you kind of want to avoid arcane casters, but they could also fill the skillmonkey niche, along with a bit of arcane casting.

Spellthief writeup on these fora (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44299)

CapnCJ
2011-01-24, 11:47 AM
So I spoke to the DM again today and we figured that whatever I was gonna use, we may as well get some stats rolled. Ever since we started D&D, i've never rolled well for stats, and today was no exception.

15,13,11,10,9,9

The plan remains the same, however. Rogue1/Swashy3/Fighter2/DervishX

Waker
2011-01-24, 12:12 PM
If your goal is to go Dervish, I would suggest going with a Scout instead. Skirmish doesn't require the targets to be flat-footed and the damage is applied to all attacks that are done in a round where you move at least 10ft. Only downside to going with a Scout over a Rogue is that Scouts get Evasion at lvl 5 whereas a Rogue gets it at 2.

Scout 2/Swashbuckler 3/Fighter 1/Dervish 3

But those stats are not very kind. Since you are level 9, you'd get 2 points to put wherever you want, so I'd suggest.
Str-10
Con-11
Dex- 16 (+1)
Int-14 (+1)
Wis-9
Cha-9

You aren't a tank so put most of your focus on your mobility. Pump up your AC and hit with dexterity, Intelligence will be needed for your damage as well as skills. Since you would be a mobile skill monkey I'd suggest a Human for the feat and skill points.

CapnCJ
2011-01-24, 12:22 PM
That's pretty much the stat layout I was planning, maybe grab a +2 stat item or two. I'm just hoping my unlucky rolling doesn't gimp the character too much. I'm gonna have to work hard, it seems.

I'm sticking with Rogue over Scout because I just kinda dislike it.