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Elvenoutrider
2011-01-25, 07:03 PM
Ok, I cant be the only one who has had this problem. In the real world we refer to all humans as humanity which encompases the human race, but what term do you use with more than one kind of sentient race? It came up in my previous camnpaign so much that I kepts saying all sentients but of course sentients includes outsiders and really all intelligent creatures including aberrations and the like.

What should i say to encompass just, for instance, the players handbook races and their non outsider variants.

jseah
2011-01-25, 07:04 PM
Humanoids?

true_shinken
2011-01-25, 07:10 PM
Humanoids?
EDIT: Ninja'd

TheCountAlucard
2011-01-25, 07:13 PM
Well, in Shadowrun, at least, they refer to it as metahumanity. :smallamused:

Czin
2011-01-25, 07:16 PM
The human-like core races (Orcs, Half-orcs, Elves, Half-Elves, Dwarves, and Gnomes, etc) are called Demi-humans in Greyhawk. Just, Demi-Humans. The term for biological forms of life in general (though typically only the sapient variety) is Mortals.

zimmerwald1915
2011-01-25, 07:17 PM
Beings? Mortals?

Innis Cabal
2011-01-25, 07:19 PM
Humanoids?
EDIT: Ninja'd

You know it's not a ninja when you post 6 minutes after the person right?

true_shinken
2011-01-25, 07:23 PM
You know it's not a ninja when you post 6 minutes after the person right?
You know it took me a lot of time to hit 'submit reply' right?

tahu88810
2011-01-25, 07:27 PM
"Sapient races" "Mortals" "Humanoids" "Demi-Humans"

Ragitsu
2011-01-25, 07:28 PM
"That's inhumane!"

"Well duh, i'm drow"

Piedmon_Sama
2011-01-25, 07:35 PM
Mortalkind. The Mortal Races. The Goodly Folk. The Civilized Races or just Civilization. The Free Peoples if you want to go straight from Tolkien.

Ason
2011-01-25, 07:38 PM
Two science fiction series spring to mind where such terms were used.

In C.S. Lewis's Space Trilogy, all the sentient but mortal beings across the solar system are referred to as "Hnau". A few writers and even some philosophers since then have picked up the term.

In Orson Scott Card's Ender's Game series, there is an ongoing debate among the characters in the later books about whether the aliens they encounter are "Ramen" (strangers from another species capable of communication and peaceful coexistence with humans [ex. elves]), "Varelse" (strangers from another species unable to communicate with us [ex. dogs]) or "Djur" (monsters [ex. beholders]). (These definitions all are excerpts from Wikipedia)

mucat
2011-01-25, 07:51 PM
People?...

Eldariel
2011-01-25, 08:05 PM
People is probably the most neutral, all-encompassing term for it. So that's what I'd go with. And for each specific race, the "kind" tends to work; Elf-kind, Dwarf-kind, etc.

Elfin
2011-01-25, 08:36 PM
People is what I usually go with.
Humanoids works too, though it's never been to my taste.

Demihumans I loathe, though: it seems like something only human supremacists would use. Which might make for an interesting idea...

Czin
2011-01-25, 08:45 PM
People is what I usually go with.
Humanoids works too, though it's never been to my taste.

Demihumans I loathe, though: it seems like something only human supremacists would use. Which might make for an interesting idea...

Since the Flanaess is far and away dominated by mankind the usage of the term makes some sense. Plus it's the most convenient term for singling out the most human-like of humanoids (thus excluding creatures like Lizardfolk or Kobolds.)

Sine
2011-01-25, 08:46 PM
Demihumanity? Pseudohumanity? Humanoidity? Differently-Proportioned-Humanity? Other-Ethnicity? Walking XP?


Demihumans I loathe, though: it seems like something only human supremacists would use. Which might make for an interesting idea...
I don't think that's far from the original intent. Gygax and Arneson did like human-centric settings, as I understand it.

Elfin
2011-01-25, 09:25 PM
Well, Gygax was rather brilliant, but there is one thing I'll never forgive him for.

Observe:

Faerun:
http://cdn.obsidianportal.com/map_images/176489/Map_of_Faerun.jpg

Eberron:
http://img15.nnm.ru/2/a/3/9/2/c6f548d0eaaab4b0c509cb552c0.jpg

Greyhawk:
http://www.dancingshaman.net/blood/tsroerth.gif

Is it just me, or is Greyawk's geography horrendously ugly?

And yes. That permanently turned me off Greyhawk.

Czin
2011-01-25, 09:29 PM
Well, Gygax was rather brilliant, but there is one thing I'll never forgive him for.

Observe:

Faerun:
http://cdn.obsidianportal.com/map_images/176489/Map_of_Faerun.jpg

Eberron:
http://img15.nnm.ru/2/a/3/9/2/c6f548d0eaaab4b0c509cb552c0.jpg

Greyhawk:
http://www.dancingshaman.net/blood/tsroerth.gif

Is it just me, or is Greyawk's geography horrendously ugly?

And yes. That permanently turned me off Greyhawk.
That's not exactly fair when you're using a hideously ancient map of Greyhawk.

Elfin
2011-01-25, 09:32 PM
Oh, I didn't mean the map itself; I was talking about the actual shape of the landmasses.
To me, at least, they're aesthetically just terrible.

Czin
2011-01-25, 09:37 PM
Oh, I didn't mean the map itself; I was talking about the actual shape of the landmasses.
To me, at least, they're aesthetically just terrible.

By that logic I can hate Earth by looking at the continents and saying "YE GODS THESE CONTINENTS ARE TERRIBLE!!! BLLLAAAARRRGH THIS SETTING IS TEH SUXXORZ! I PAY NO ATTENTION TO IT!!!111ONEONEONE"

Boci
2011-01-25, 09:38 PM
By that logic I can hate Earth by looking at the continents and saying "YE GODS THESE CONTINENTS ARE TERRIBLE!!! BLLLAAAARRRGH THIS SETTING IS TEH SUXXORZ! I PAY NO ATTENTION TO IT!!!111ONEONEONE"

Yeah, the fact that a human wasn't responsible for the layout of Earth's dryland shouldn't be taken into consideration.

Czin
2011-01-25, 09:40 PM
Yeah, the fact that a human wasn't responsible for the layout of Earth's dryland shouldn't be taken into consideration.

Hides copy of SimEarth God Edition
Yeah...let's go with that....:smallbiggrin:

Elfin
2011-01-25, 09:43 PM
By that logic I can hate Earth by looking at the continents and saying "YE GODS THESE CONTINENTS ARE TERRIBLE!!! BLLLAAAARRRGH THIS SETTING IS TEH SUXXORZ! I PAY NO ATTENTION TO IT!!!111ONEONEONE"

Welcome to my world.

Boci
2011-01-25, 09:47 PM
Hides copy of SimEarth God Edition
Yeah...let's go with that....:smallbiggrin:

Oh kool. Could you bring Britain within spitting range of France? Also, add a breeze so they can't spit back? :smallbiggrin:

Elfin
2011-01-25, 09:50 PM
Are you kidding? Britain would probably get my vote for most aesthetically pleasing region...no way you're getting within spitting range of it.

Now, Southeast Asia...if the there was a god, I'd slap him for that one.

Czin
2011-01-25, 09:52 PM
Are you kidding? Britain would probably get my vote for most aesthetically pleasing region...no way you're getting within spitting range of it.

Now, Southeast Asia...if the there was a god, I'd slap him for that one.

What about my ancestral homeland (I am a pureblood Norman, none of that nasty mainlander French blood in my veins) Scandinavia? Do you approve of Finland and Sweden's rather...naughty appearance?

Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll
2011-01-25, 09:55 PM
I personally commend you on the fjords.

Elfin
2011-01-25, 09:58 PM
What about my ancestral homeland (I am a pureblood Norman, none of that nasty mainlander French blood in my veins) Scandinavia? Do you approve of Finland and Sweden's rather...naughty appearance?

Scandinavia has always been a dilemma. It's one of my favorite parts of the world...and yet it looks so ugly. I never did notice the naughtiness factor until now, though.

I'm telling you, it's been a hard road.

Czin
2011-01-25, 09:58 PM
I personally commend you on the fjords.

Look carefully on the Euro coins...though the Normans are primarily Danish I have a lot of Swedish descent (family of minor barons stayed there for a century or two to escape the guillotine when Louis the XVIth proved to be an idiot) so my semi-homeland is something of importance, and a good source of jokes.

Plus, the Fjords are from Norway, and the Norweigians weird because they're not primarily blond. They're...shiver...ginger...

Fishy
2011-01-25, 10:51 PM
I'm in a game where the PCs are all fae of various stripes. The accepted term for humans and orcs and the like is 'mortals', but my PC has always referred to them as the Real People, who live in the Real World.

Anyone who is confused when a tree starts talking to them is happily told it's because she's not Real.

starwoof
2011-01-25, 11:00 PM
In my setting the PHB races and a few others are referred to as Civilized Peoples or Civilized Races. Except for gnomes, who live in the woods and are considered to be Fey.

I've never liked the term 'demi-humans'. It makes humans seem like they are better than dwarves, which they clearly are not.

Ravens_cry
2011-01-25, 11:22 PM
People.
If it talks to me, if it shows the ability to set and follow through goals, and it isn't obviously disabled or juvenile member a member of a type creature I consider to be people, it is people.

Ozymandias
2011-01-25, 11:59 PM
"Demi" is a Latin prefix meaning "half." Hercules was a demigod because he had a mortal mother and a divine father. Achilles was not because his mother was a nymph, not a god.

Similarly, a half-elf is a demihuman (assuming it's half-elf half-human) but a dwarf, an elf, or an orc is not. So while the term demi-human does not imply that they are lesser than humans (cf. demigods who were generally greater [and also generally demihumans, as it happens]) it simply isn't applicable. D&D has used it historically to mean "humanoid" but this is a nonsensical abuse of linguistics that makes J.R.R. Tolkien cry.

Humanoid is good for the humanoid core races, i.e. all of them. "Beings" or "thinking beings" is okay for sentient manta rays or whatever.

Kurald Galain
2011-01-26, 05:00 AM
Humanoids?

In several campaign worlds, the proper word is "elfoid" since they were there first :smalltongue:

kamikasei
2011-01-26, 05:12 AM
Several posters have suggested "people", but how does tha deal with:

It came up in my previous camnpaign so much that I kepts saying all sentients but of course sentients includes outsiders and really all intelligent creatures including aberrations and the like.
Outsiders and aberrations are (sometimes) people too!

Ravens_cry
2011-01-26, 05:19 AM
Several posters have suggested "people", but how does tha deal with:

Outsiders and aberrations are (sometimes) people too!
Oh,. they're people too.
Just not very nice people. Don't bring house-warming gift or come to younglings recital. Very bad neighbours.

gkathellar
2011-01-26, 06:19 AM
Mortals in a setting with plenty of immortals. Folk in a setting without so many.

Star Wars uses Sentients, which is great for a Sci-Fi setting.

mucat
2011-01-26, 10:00 AM
Several posters have suggested "people", but how does tha deal with:

Outsiders and aberrations are (sometimes) people too!

Actually, that's what I like about the term "people"...your players can pick up a lot about the society their characters live in, just by paying attention to how NPCs use this word. If it's a rabidly human-centric nation, then "people" are humans (or maybe even only certain humans). "We may be at peace with the Hammerfist Clan right now, but they're not people; they're dwarves."

To a more inclusive, "classic D&D" society, "people" would mean the Core PC races...but goblins, kobolds, ogres and whatnot are monsters. There's no real thought of getting along with them, just of mitigating their threat.

When NPCs start calling the local goblin tribe "people" -- even if it's "people we don't like and fight constant border skirmishes with" -- then the players are more likely to start thinking about how to solve the conflict, rather than considering it an immutable fact of the game world.

And a truly cosmopolitan society, where Slaads and banshees stop by to play poker on Friday nights, Raven's definition takes over: if I can have a conversation with him/her/it/them, then they're people. In some cases they may be a dangerous person, a bad person, or an unlikeable person, but I still have a wider range of options on how to deal with them than if I thought of them as walking packets of danger and XP.


When it's important to make it clear that you're talking about only a subset of all the sapient creatures out there, just use a more specific term. "Mortals" if the point is to exclude Outsiders. "Humanoids" if you're not talking about aberrations or dragons right now. "Fred, Amy, that Beholder over there, any gnome whose age is a two-digit prime, and all the Miller sisters except Beth" if that's who you're talking about.