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View Full Version : A good third feat for a first level archivest.



druid91
2011-01-26, 07:12 PM
Well I have the scribe scroll bonus feat, I took tomb tainted soul (So my heals can double as attacks), I was thinking about brew potion so I can make a few healing potions for my team mates.

How does this sound?

Elfin
2011-01-26, 08:18 PM
Knowledge Devotion. Period.

tyckspoon
2011-01-26, 08:24 PM
Knowledge Devotion is a natural fit for an Archivist, and is excellent if you ever intend to 'zilla out a bit and hit stuff. If you don't, it's a wasted feat. Brew Potion is a hideously inefficient way to deliver healing; get Craft Wand or use your free Scribe Scroll to make Cure X Wound scrolls if you want to extend your healing resources. If you're concerned about what happens when you get knocked out/your party needs more healing than you can provide in good time, just buy a few healing potions.. but don't rely on them, they're too expensive for regular use, and that specific use isn't really worth spending a feat.

On the other hand, potions can be a pretty handy way of passing around buffs and saving on actions, since you can store a spell in it and then somebody else can use their own action to cast it. Plus make potions of some of those nice clerical Personal buffs. Potions are still pretty inefficient, but it's better than just pigeonholing yourself into making healing juice.

Psyren
2011-01-26, 08:25 PM
If you're allowed Dragonlance, Academic Priest is godly for Archivists.

You also need to decide on a PrC breakpoint. Most Archivists don't go further than 11 (Dread Secret) though you can PrC earlier if there's a 10-level class you've got your eyes set on, and start getting the feats you'll need for that.

dextercorvia
2011-01-26, 08:58 PM
Knowledge Devotion requires 5 ranks in a knowledge skill, so that is out for 1st level.

I wish I had something more to contribute, but I'm blanking now.

JeminiZero
2011-01-26, 09:30 PM
Since you're getting 2 feats, are you human? Able Learner has uses even if you're not multiclassing around. Such as the ability to buy Tumble, Balance, Autohypnosis (although this is more useful for a high wis Cleric) and various other useful non-class skills at 1 rank/skillpoint.

chaos_redefined
2011-01-26, 09:47 PM
Improved Initiative?

Grendus
2011-01-26, 09:55 PM
The Spontaneous Summoner/ Healer/Harmer feats are nice, as they give you a lot more flexibility to your prepared spells. You should have a halfway decent wisdom for bonus spells, and three or four cures/harms/summons a day (by RAW you don't even need them in your prayerbook) is enough unless your build focuses on them. You can get the requisite 4 skill ranks at level 1. Very useful feats.

If your DM will let you use Knowledge Devotion bonus for Dark Knowledge though that should be a priority. That +2 damage should apply to everything, and you'll have your knowledge skills through the roof what with an int focus and 4 skills per level.

Urpriest
2011-01-26, 10:24 PM
You can't even get Brew Potion at first level without shenanigans anyway.

druid91
2011-01-26, 10:31 PM
You can't even get Brew Potion at first level without shenanigans anyway.

What?:smallconfused:

I thought that was the other low level crafting feat?

dextercorvia
2011-01-26, 10:36 PM
The Spontaneous Summoner/ Healer/Harmer feats are nice, as they give you a lot more flexibility to your prepared spells. You should have a halfway decent wisdom for bonus spells, and three or four cures/harms/summons a day (by RAW you don't even need them in your prayerbook) is enough unless your build focuses on them. You can get the requisite 4 skill ranks at level 1. Very useful feats.

I believe they require you to be able to cast at least one of those spells as a prereq.


What?:smallconfused:

I thought that was the other low level crafting feat?

IIRC, CL 3 is required.


What is your focus? Do you want to be Batman, or mix it up in Melee, or shoot lazers?

Grendus
2011-01-26, 11:04 PM
I believe they require you to be able to cast at least one of those spells as a prereq.

It says "Able to cast", which is arguable. It's 125gp to get Summon Nature's Ally (you get Cure and Inflict Light Wounds by default, they're level 0 cleric orisons). After that, it specifies "from your class spell list", which for archivists is any divine spell.

Check with your DM first, of course, he may (quite fairly) say you can spontaneously swap for any cure/summon spell that you know (though that may not be RAI, seeing as the Favored Soul was reprinted in Complete Divine and doesn't get all divine spells by default). Personally, I'd let you do it - FFS you're playing an archivist. There are plenty of other ways to break the game, trading a feat for what other T1 classes can do won't make you any more overpowered than you already are.

dextercorvia
2011-01-26, 11:09 PM
What I was getting at is that SNA is probably the most useful one, but it is the hardest to pull off at level 1 since, you have to get druid spells from scrolls. And, I'm not remembering for sure, but I think 125gp is either at the top end of starting wealth or past it.

Optimator
2011-01-26, 11:11 PM
I always take Draconic Archivist and Archivist of Nature. Potions aren't particularly good, especially compared to wands.

Grendus
2011-01-26, 11:14 PM
Eh, you're right. Probably a good third level spell. Go with spontaneous harm or cure (I'd take cure, personally, doubly so if your DM allows retraining), at early levels you don't want to tie up your spells for healing unless you have to. Once you can afford wands of lesser vigor, retrain it.

dextercorvia
2011-01-26, 11:24 PM
If you go the Spontaneous Healing route, that opens you up to take Versatile Spellcaster (RotD). If you don't try to cast spells beyond your usual level, and only use empty slots (like a Sorcerer would), your DM will probably let it fly. Even thought it is a two for one trade, with the power increase, it actually helps your stamina.

druid91
2011-01-26, 11:53 PM
Eh, you're right. Probably a good third level spell. Go with spontaneous harm or cure (I'd take cure, personally, doubly so if your DM allows retraining), at early levels you don't want to tie up your spells for healing unless you have to. Once you can afford wands of lesser vigor, retrain it.

MY healing is casting inflict spells.

I took tomb tainted soul so I could do that.

dextercorvia
2011-01-26, 11:55 PM
Why would you take a feat so that you can use one spell in place of an almost identical one?

druid91
2011-01-26, 11:58 PM
Efficiency.

Now instead of trying to find the right balance of inflicts to cures, I can just prepare mostly if not entirely inflicts.

Well that, and since I'm making this guy with the premise of d&d adventurers at hogwarts. Imagine their horror when I take a killing curse and it makes me stronger.

dextercorvia
2011-01-27, 12:03 AM
Inflicts are a crappy way to deal damage. You have to be in melee range, hit with a touch attack (not too hard, but still) and they get a save for half. The damage is 1d8+CL, max 1d8+5.

If you want to blast, there are much better ways. An Archivist can be a serious melee threat with the right feats and spells, but Inflict doesn't fit either theme.

Edit: Tomb Tainted Soul won't protect you from Death spells. Slay Living will still kill you.

druid91
2011-01-27, 12:09 AM
Yes, but which would you rather have? Healing spells that just heal? or healing spells that double as hurting spells?

EDIT: Yes, but I was under the impression that one of the follow ups did.

dextercorvia
2011-01-27, 12:20 AM
If I'm going to spend the feat? Good spells that I can swap out for healing in a pinch. The archivist gets like 3/4 of the spells published. Don't waste that prepping Inflict Wounds spells.

Edit: I'm not sure about the TTS line, I had to look that up for the last post.

druid91
2011-01-27, 12:23 AM
What spells would you suggest then?

Hawk7915
2011-01-27, 12:24 AM
People have recommended Improved Initiative and the Archivist of Nature/Draconic Archivist feats; these are good generic choices. Some other good options...

Extend Spell: You're a divine caster, I'm sure you'll find SOMETHING to extend as you level up. This is an investment though: Extended Light is a pretty poor ability at level 1 :smalltongue:.

Insightful Reflexes: You use Intelligence, rather than Dexterity, for your Reflex saves. Handy!

Then of course we have the standard generic stuff of genericness: Iron Will, Improved Toughness, Spell Focus and Spell Penetration. Skill Focus: Concentration is an option too; you can do worse. You can do better too, but you can do worse for low level play.

dextercorvia
2011-01-27, 10:34 AM
What spells would you suggest then?

It depends on what you want to do. Do you want to blast, buff or bash?

druid91
2011-01-27, 06:13 PM
It depends on what you want to do. Do you want to blast, buff or bash?

I want to hurt things with dark magic.

So blast.

JaronK
2011-01-27, 06:27 PM
Since you're already Tomb Tainted, Black Sand is the best spell ever. Note how when it kills you get permanent black sand.

JaronK

druid91
2011-01-27, 07:03 PM
Since you're already Tomb Tainted, Black Sand is the best spell ever. Note how when it kills you get permanent black sand.

JaronK

JaronK... You are a genius. I have that book and it didn't even come to mind.

JaronK
2011-01-27, 07:57 PM
JaronK... You are a genius. I have that book and it didn't even come to mind.

You know about Necrosis Carnexes right? You'll need to be CL 11 to make them but they require Animate Dead and they run around healing with negative energy all day long.

Don't bother casting healing spells. Cast stuff that endlessly heals your people. It just works better. And with negative energy, it's REALLY easy.

JaronK

dextercorvia
2011-01-27, 11:52 PM
I don't have as much experience with the dark stuff, but there is a 2nd level cleric spell in the PHBII that sounds perfect for your character Called Black Karma Curse. It's a will save or they hit themselves in the face with their highest damaging attack.

That just reminded me of the Cru... Puppet curse from Harry Potter.