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View Full Version : I need help with my sinister plan



Aemoh87
2011-02-01, 11:31 PM
So one of my party members takes orders from another character. I am playing a cleric and I want to sever that bond or complicate it. It would also be sweet if I could give the specific characters orders that help me/are detrimental to their bond.

I need low level ideas that don't require alot of cash. Go!

Also I would like something with strong mechanics behind it so that it won't cause a big argument, since they are going to want to know how I did it.

Mikeavelli
2011-02-01, 11:41 PM
It might be a little too high level for you, but the Book of Vile Darkness has a 5th level spell called 'False Sending' that allows you to send a Sending (as the normal spell) with you pretending to be someone else, and leave them utterly convinced of this.

They get a will save to negate though.

Aemoh87
2011-02-01, 11:44 PM
That is a good start, it's a fighter that has an awful will save.

CapnVan
2011-02-02, 04:05 PM
Can you give a little more info on why this character takes orders from another?

I assume it's not a magical effect.

In which case it comes down to sneakiness, and the appropriate use of your divine spells.

Who's the non-fighter character?

Chilingsworth
2011-02-02, 04:08 PM
Also, are you the DM, or another player? If you're another player, have you mentioned this to the DM? Maybe he/she has ideas?

EDIT: You could always get a hat of Disguise/alter self item. Then diguise yourself as one or the other of your targets.

Amnestic
2011-02-02, 04:09 PM
Also, how are these orders given? If it's not in person, you could try using the Forgery skill, though you've probably not got m/any skill ranks in it.

Aemoh87
2011-02-02, 04:09 PM
alright the servant is some sort of fighter variant who has taken an oath to a lord. Much like a samurai. It's not magical but he will lose his abilities if he breaks the oath. He also cannot harm unarmed humanoids, nor can he let it happen.

The master is a sorcerer who really isn't much of a threat to me later in the game but he is annoying now.

I want to get the fighter to be my personal whipping boy and do my dirty work... or at least get out of my way. I don't want to kill anyone if I don't have to just because my party is immature and they would build a character who's sole purpose is to try and kill mine, but if I have to I would.

Also the directions are given verbally as both master and servant are in the party. Making it a very delicate issue.

....Also Also, I have thought of pitting his two oaths against each other, but I don't know how I would get a lowbie sorc to give him such an oath knowing it's against both of their best interests. I may need to magically force it but I don't know how at the moment.

Sillycomic
2011-02-02, 04:14 PM
Your party is immature?

Yeah, I would suggest not doing this at all.

Even if you don't kill anyone, once they find out what happened they're going to be after your character anyway. Explaining the logical way why your sinister plan went off isn't going to change that fact.

I suggest telling the GM you are hiring an assasin. Just wait until the fighter goes off on his own for some reason, and then let the assasin do his dirty work.

The GM plays the assasin and none of the characters of the players should figure out what happened. You're in the clear.

Aemoh87
2011-02-02, 04:16 PM
Wise words. That might work perfectly. Now I need a ton of gold and 2 assassins (Safety First).

Chilingsworth
2011-02-02, 04:20 PM
You still might want to disguise yourself before hiring the assassins. That way, when (I'm guessing not if,) the party investigates who sent the assassins, it'll be harder for them to learn you sent them.

Amnestic
2011-02-02, 04:25 PM
You still might want to disguise yourself before hiring the assassins. That way, when (I'm guessing not if,) the party investigates who sent the assassins, it'll be harder for them to learn you sent them.

Disguise yourself as another party member, watch the fireworks :smallamused:

Aemoh87
2011-02-02, 05:38 PM
Why can't I play with you guys... Especially when I DM. You've got my sinister sense tingling half past Manshoon en-route to a full Asmodeous. (Sp)

Chilingsworth
2011-02-02, 05:40 PM
Why can't I play with you guys... Especially when I DM. You've got my sinister sense tingling half past Manshoon en-route to a full Asmodeous. (Sp)

If you wanted to learn how to use the Play-by-Post system here, you could. :smallbiggrin:

Sillycomic
2011-02-02, 05:49 PM
Oh... perhaps a Xanatos gambit?

1. Get a hat of diguise.

2. Disguise yourself as the sorcerer.

3. Hire an assasin (or big dumb fighter a level or two above yours) to kill the fighter. You will give him a time and a place when he'll be free at a later date.
Do this in a public place, a bar or something so there are witnesses who see the sorcerer talking with the assassin.

4. Once the fighter goes out on his own to do whatever, tell the assassin (fighter) where to find the victim.

5. ???

6. Profit!


You win either way.

If the assassin kills the fighter, you win.

If the fighter beats the assassin, they'll try to find out who hired him and all clues will lead to the annoying sorcerer. This will put the fighter in a moral quandry which either has him breaking oaths or perhaps killing the sorcerer.

You still win!

So long as you have a decent GM who can keep a secret, I think this is a decent plan.

Aemoh87
2011-02-02, 06:49 PM
well a plan is defiantly coming together. All I need to do is work up the cash now. Part of his oath is he needs to find who killed his master if his master dies. So maybe I will kill the master via assassin, then kill the assassin right after he murders the sorcerer (rushing in just seconds too late to prevent the assassination). Then I will be able to "plant" clues for the dumb (the player isn't dumb but the player does lack the in game skills to play detective) fighter to do my bidding. The best part is he has to try to find who killed his master and I will be there to lead him along! BRILLIANT!

Amnestic
2011-02-02, 06:58 PM
well a plan is defiantly coming together. All I need to do is work up the cash now. Part of his oath is he needs to find who killed his master if his master dies. So maybe I will kill the master via assassin, then kill the assassin right after he murders the sorcerer (rushing in just seconds too late to prevent the assassination). Then I will be able to "plant" clues for the dumb (the player isn't dumb but the player does lack the in game skills to play detective) fighter to do my bidding. The best part is he has to try to find who killed his master and I will be there to lead him along! BRILLIANT!

Perfect if it all goes off without a hitch of course. What's your backup plan if the Sorcerer should survive the encounter? At that point both he and the Fighter are still alive, will be more guarded and know that someone is gunning for them making your job all the more difficult. Every evil genius needs a back up plan or five.

Aemoh87
2011-02-02, 07:00 PM
well then I put my DM skill to the test, as well as cozy up to the current DM. I lead them on a wild goose chase for said assassin leaving a wake of destruction with plenty of rewards to reap. Then when they finally do catch me I hopefully will have the levels and items to be a dominant melee cleric.

These players know what a Tier one cleric looks like but not when I play it. They will think one dispel magic and I am dead. But I will have spellblade on my gauntlet, shield spikes, and armor spikes that counters dispel magic, greater dispel magic, and dispelling touch.

I can't really think of any other dispels to guard against other than Mordiken's which they won't have since you can't get 9th level scrolls in this camp and they defiantly won't be high level anytime soon.

Amnestic
2011-02-02, 07:12 PM
well then I put my DM skill to the test, as well as cozy up to the current DM. I lead them on a wild goose chase for said assassin leaving a wake of destruction with plenty of rewards to reap. Then when they finally do catch me I hopefully will have the levels and items to be a dominant melee cleric.

These players know what a Tier one cleric looks like but not when I play it. They will think one dispel magic and I am dead. But I will have spellblade on my gauntlet, shield spikes, and armor spikes that counters dispel magic, greater dispel magic, and dispelling touch.

I can't really think of any other dispels to guard against other than Mordiken's which they won't have since you can't get 9th level scrolls in this camp and they defiantly won't be high level anytime soon.

As a long term goal, that works out great. Preferable, even, but I was under the impression you wanted this dealt with in short order? :smallconfused:

Is the Fighter loyal/especially friendly to anyone else outside of your adventuring party? Manipulating the Sorcerer into targeting that person could easily drive a wedge between the two.

Aemoh87
2011-02-02, 07:18 PM
I wanna deal with it now. But if I can't... as long as I have some level of control.

But the fighter is not close to anyone else, nor does he have a reason why he is close to the sorc. He is a dwarf and the sorc is a drow... It makes no sense, which is part of the reason I wanna ruin it as a player. Because it's stupid. I hate it when people make mechanical decisions and then forget about the role playing implications of them. That is how many mechanical things are limited, with serious role play implications.

Amnestic
2011-02-02, 07:43 PM
Wait, I'm confused, what reason was there behind this Oath that the Dwarf Fighter made in the first place then? Was there a crunch/metagame reason behind it or something?

What about backstories? Any living family members that they're still on good terms with for either member? If we're going Evil with a capital E, "innocents" are fair game. Set up a murder of a family member of the Fighter's, have it look like the Sorcerer planned it? He's a Drow. It's not a great step to expect one of those people* to do something evil to maintain loyalty/make sure the Fighter's loyalties aren't split between the Sorcerer and his family.


*And before you cry "racist!", I'm quite sure that's a justified belief to be held in the world in question. It's not my fault that Drow are predominantly evil.

Aemoh87
2011-02-02, 07:47 PM
Idk. It's all upsetting. I am this half-minotaur who has connections to the cult of Baphomet but isn't completely evil (CN), but is really just a destructive merc. But really I don't understand anyone elses character nor did they write backgrounds. But I of course have an intricate on that includes why I have certain feats and all of my characters significant history.

but I am the rare type that believes feats mean more than just mechanics to a character.

Amnestic
2011-02-02, 08:06 PM
Aggravating indeed. A lack of any sort of backstory/character intentions does make it somewhat hard to deal with. :smallannoyed:

If your DM is/was okay with the idea of sending assassins, I trust he'd be okay with you screwing with their stuff. Just moving a bunch of gold from one pack to another would be enough. Take something from the Fighter, put it in the Sorcerer's pack while they're not awake, but could easily blame the other and not you.

Make it something small at first, and that they tried to take it rather than just play a practical joke. If you go too high, it makes it seem like they're being set up. Little things, things which characters would "miss" if they weren't on the character sheet, are great. Just to drive an enmity between the two. If one character/player thinks the other is stealing from them, and the other feels they're being falsely accused, it's a fast track to arguments. You could play up the Fighter's concerns. Tell him you saw the Sorcerer skulking around the camp while you were on watch.

Aemoh87
2011-02-02, 08:08 PM
My only concern there is it needs to be decisive which is why I am leaning more towards killing one now. The fighter would just say whatever your my master it's fine, I need it to be something that can't be worked out.

So either pitting the fighters vow to his master and vow not to hurt unarmed folk against each other causing him to lose class abilities... or kill some one.

Amnestic
2011-02-02, 08:22 PM
Pretty much. If all else fails, buy some ability damage poison, drop it in their food liberally, wait for them to die/become so weakened from ability damage that they can barely fight back and bash their heads in with whatever weapon you have on hand.

Not particularly elegant, but it'd get the job done.