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DragonsAion
2011-02-12, 07:57 AM
I know the truenamer as a stand alone class sucks badly, but I've been wondering what whould happen if you played one in a gestalt game.

Are there any classes out there that if gestalted with the truenamer would make it more playable? I keep thinking fighter, rogue, or warlock, might help it out.

Reynard
2011-02-12, 09:13 AM
I don't think it'd change anything, since the Truenamers class features are screwed over by themselves.

Prime32
2011-02-12, 09:16 AM
What the truenamer needs is high skill checks. So Item Familiar (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/magic/itemFamiliars.htm). Maybe stick Exemplar [Truespeech] on the other side of the gestalt?

Eldan
2011-02-12, 09:21 AM
I don't remember, is Truespeaking Intelligence? You could stick Factotum/Examplar on the other side. Wouldn't make it a good class, but I guess you could at least beat the checks.

truemane
2011-02-12, 09:23 AM
But you only get your Factotum bonus to any given skill once a day. And the Exemplar means you can take 10, but that's not going to help anyone catch those upper-end DC's. It'll hurt, in fact. It just flattens out the curve.

DragonsAion
2011-02-12, 01:29 PM
one level of Exemplar can give you a +14 bonus on one skill depending on how you look at it. truespeak is based off INT. I got to talking with a friend and we both agree that to play a truenamer is to focus a lot on the Knowledge skills.

CycloneJoker
2011-02-12, 05:19 PM
Also, Mashal, Motivate Intelligence. Yes I do like the idea of getting 5+3+4+4+4+2 at level 2. Just off the top of my head, too. (Ranks, Skill Focus, Intelligence, intelligence from Factotum, Cha from Marshal, Masterwork tool kit.)

Fox Box Socks
2011-02-12, 05:25 PM
Marshal/Factotum might work, but what Truenamers really need (as Zaq so helpfully points out (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=114269)) is access to the Paragnostic Assembly, a Greater Amulet of the Silver Tongue, a greater generic competence item, Knowledge Devotion, and a looooooot of Intelligence.

Also, you know, enough Utterances to make them not awful.

CycloneJoker
2011-02-12, 05:50 PM
Marshal/Factotum might work, but what Truenamers really need (as Zaq so helpfully points out (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=114269)) is access to the Paragnostic Assembly, a Greater Amulet of the Silver Tongue, a greater generic competence item, Knowledge Devotion, and a looooooot of Intelligence.

Also, you know, enough Utterances to make them not awful.

Also, abuse the wording that Meta-Whatevered utterances are different, and ignore resistance.

Jack_Simth
2011-02-12, 05:57 PM
A few levels in Cleric wouldn't be remiss - Divine Insight, a 2nd level Cleric spell, could do them a world of good (if spammed).

Fox Box Socks
2011-02-12, 06:06 PM
As far as I can tell, the real problem with Truenamers is that there is exactly one (1) way to make them not awful. There needs to be this perfect storm of magic items and magical guilds and somewhat broken feats and a DM willing to play ball with it all in order for the class to function as written, and even then it's rather wishywashy with only a few genuinely unique tricks up its sleeve.

JaronK
2011-02-12, 06:40 PM
The problem with comboing in Factotum is then you're a Factotum who occasionally uses Truespeak. It's hard to give yourself decent Truenamer powers this way without just being the other class, which is invariably better.

Marshal requires you to use Charisma, which you otherwise don't need.

JaronK