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View Full Version : Getting Sleight of Hand on a Wizard [D&D3.5]



FMArthur
2011-02-14, 02:09 PM
I'm in the process of building a Wizard who is a generalist without necessarily being a Generalist, if you know what I mean. He's a Focused Conjurer with the Rapid Summoning feature but I'm prepping him with universally useful abilities like Collegiate Wizard, Uncanny Forethought, Cloudy Conjuration, Sculpt Spell and Invisible Spell so that he's ready for pretty much anything, despite his class feature set screaming "SUMMONER!!!". He'll summon where appropriate and the ACF lets him do so in a flexible manner, that's all.

Anyway, I'm having a bit of trouble getting his Sleight of Hand up for the Conceal Spellcasting skill trick (which has actually been granted for free and unlimited use to everyone with SoH ranks as of Races of Stone's release, two and a half years before Complete Scoundrel) in order to cast all of his invisible spells unnoticed. It's opposed by everyone else's Spot checks, so it would be nice to get Sleight of Hand boosted or at least get it in-class.

I really want to do this in a cost-efficient manner so that he doesn't lose any of his potential or power for being able to be sneaky at times; I could spend a feat on Skill Knowledge, but I'd rather not if anyone here knows of ways to get it easier. I've already checked the Cityscape skill substitutions (you should always keep those in mind when building a character) and there's no Sleight of Hand entry. I'm quite opposed to losing caster levels. All I've found that gets it in-class more or less 'for free' is Fatespinner, which requires 5 ranks in Profession (gambling), but I am interested in getting this Wizard fully-operational prior to ECL 8. Is there any other 'free' way to get Sleight of Hand in-class or to boost it?

Also, check out the art they have for the Fatespinner:
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/ca_gallery/85436.jpg
This is a picture of a Wizard being awesome.

Reynard
2011-02-14, 02:18 PM
I'm in the process of building a Wizard who is a generalist without necessarily being a Generalist, if you know what I mean. He's a Focused Conjurer with the Rapid Summoning feature but I'm prepping him with universally useful abilities like Collegiate Wizard, Uncanny Forethought, Cloudy Conjuration, Sculpt Spell and Invisible Spell so that he's ready for pretty much anything, despite his class feature set screaming "SUMMONER!!!". He'll summon where appropriate and the ACF lets him do so in a flexible manner, that's all.

Anyway, I'm having a bit of trouble getting his Sleight of Hand up for the Conceal Spellcasting skill trick (which has actually been granted for free and unlimited use to everyone with SoH ranks as of Races of Stone's release, two and a half years before Complete Scoundrel) in order to cast all of his invisible spells unnoticed. It's opposed by everyone else's Spot checks, so it would be nice to get Sleight of Hand boosted or at least get it in-class.

I really want to do this in a cost-efficient manner so that he doesn't lose any of his potential or power for being able to be sneaky at times; I could spend a feat on Skill Knowledge, but I'd rather not if anyone here knows of ways to get it easier. I've already checked the Cityscape skill substitutions (you should always keep those in mind when building a character) and there's no Sleight of Hand entry. I'm quite opposed to losing caster levels. All I've found that gets it in-class more or less 'for free' is Fatespinner, which requires 5 ranks in Profession (gambling), but I am interested in getting this Wizard fully-operational prior to ECL 8. Is there any other 'free' way to get Sleight of Hand in-class or to boost it?
The best way I can think of is (and you still delay spell levels by one) is a dip in Human Paragon, for any 10 skills as permanently in-class


Also, check out the art they have for the Fatespinner:
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/ca_gallery/85436.jpg
This is a picture of a Wizard being awesome.

I hope that outfit has some ridiculous enchantments on it. Nothing else justifies it.

Chilingsworth
2011-02-14, 02:34 PM
As Reynard said, Human Paragon will do the job. It's a three-level class, with two levels of casting progression. You can make one of your class skills be a class skill for ALL classes you tke. You also gain full simple weapon profficency, a martial weapon profficency, and 4+int skill points/level. If you take the other two levels, you get a bonus feat (2nd level) and a +2 bonus to any ability score of your choice (3rd level.) Yeah, you lose the caster level, but for all that, ti's not bad. Even better, Paragon classes have no prereq's: You can take them from level 1, if you want.

Your only other option would be to take the skill knowledge some kind of feat.

Darrin
2011-02-14, 02:43 PM
City of Stormreach has a feat called "Criminal Background" that adds Bluff, Open Locks, and Sleight of Hand as class skills.

FMArthur
2011-02-14, 03:08 PM
City of Stormreach has a feat called "Criminal Background" that adds Bluff, Open Locks, and Sleight of Hand as class skills.

Oh! That's better than Skill Knowledge, and Bluff is probably something I'd want to have when invisible spells start going off from an unknown source. :smallbiggrin:

But yeah I don't think Human Paragon cuts it. Giving up a spellcaster level is losing 1 spell slot from your 2 highest levels when going into an even-numbered level, and a whole new level of spells when going into an odd-numbered level (3 or 4 spell slots because of Focused Specialist and Int bonus). I'd pay a feat to avoid that.

Since PHII's retraining rules are in play I can always retrain the feat to something else when I take a Fatespinner dip later.

Andion Isurand
2011-02-14, 04:41 PM
IMO... I never liked Uncanny Forethought as written, it always felt...unfinished, especially for spells with casting times longer than a standard action or a full round action.

FMArthur
2011-02-14, 05:00 PM
IMO... I never liked Uncanny Forethought as written, it always felt...unfinished, especially for spells with casting times longer than a standard action or a full round action.

I won't be using it like that. I'm just taking it for the spontaneity. I'm also being an Illumian with the Krau sigil to negate the caster level loss, and I plan to get at least three sigils so that I can get the Vaulnaen combination for a couple more spells cast spontaneously. Maybe slots left open for Uncanny Forethought can count for Naenkrau bonuses, though...

Anyway, this wizard build will be all about versatility. And making Sorcerors feel like they're being beaten at their own game. :smallcool:


EDIT: Oh man, I'm just reading up on the Illumian race's actual characteristics after realizing that everything I know about their behaviour turned out to just be assumptions I made about their connection to runes and text (ie they were walking libraries and computer terminals). So I picked up RoD and started reading the Illumian chapter past their statblock. Their actual behaviour can be paraphrased as follows: Illumians are blatant, unrepentent powergamers. Made my day. :smallamused:

Curmudgeon
2011-02-14, 05:41 PM
City of Stormreach has a feat called "Criminal Background" that adds Bluff, Open Locks, and Sleight of Hand as class skills.
You can't qualify as a Wizard, though. You've got to join the Bilge Rats organization at level 1, and that requires 3 ranks in Intimidate and either sneak attack or sudden strike. The feat is designed so Rogues and Ninjas can multiclass later and still keep all their criminal skills maximized.

FMArthur
2011-02-14, 05:55 PM
You can't qualify as a Wizard, though. You've got to join the Bilge Rats organization at level 1, and that requires 3 ranks in Intimidate and either sneak attack or sudden strike. The feat is designed so Rogues and Ninjas can multiclass later and still keep all their criminal skills maximized.

Thanks for the info. This is probably for the best, since there would be some confusion about what happens to my suddenly-cross-class Bluff ranks when I retrain the feat without acquiring it as a class skill like I will with Sleight of Hand. Skill Knowledge won't have that problem.