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View Full Version : [3.5 Monster] Taskmaster Thrall & Hounds [Please Evaluate]



Land Outcast
2011-02-14, 05:48 PM
Taskmaster Thrall (Ogre) Sorcerer 6
Large Aberration
HD 4d8+8 plus 6d4+12 (53 hp)
Speed 40 ft. (8 squares)
Init: +1
AC 18; touch 13; flat-footed 17 (-1 size, +1 Dex, +5 Natural, +3 Insight*)
BAB +6; Grp +13
Attack Mind Scourge* +9 melee (1d4+3 plus 1 Wis and 1 Cha) or Unarmed Strike +8 melee (1d4+3)
Full-Attack Mind Scourge* +9/+4 melee (1d4+3 plus 1 Wis and 1 Cha) or Unarmed Strike +8/+3 melee (1d4+3)
Space 10 ft.; Reach 10 ft. (20 with scourge)
Special Attacks: Death Blast, spells
Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft., low-light vision, summon familiar, telepathy 100 ft.
Saves Fort +8 Ref +4 Will +4 (Will +9 controlled) (Will +1 vs. master)
Abilities Str 16, Dex 12, Con 15, Int 8, Wis 6, Cha 17
Skills: (Concentration +11 controlled), Intimidate +16
Feats: Alertness, Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Scourge), Improved Unarmed Strike, Weapon Focus (Scourge)
Environment: Underdark
Organization Work squad (one taskmaster thrall and 20-40 humanoids of CR 1/2) or Company (2-4 taskmaster thralls, each in charge of 20-40 humanoids of CR 1/2) or Entourage (2-4 taskmaster thralls, each in charge of 20-40 humanoids of CR 1/2, and one mind flayer).
Challenge Rating 7
Treasure Thrall Robes & Mind Scourge
Alignment Always True Neutral

Proficiencies: The taskmaster thrall is proficient with all simple weapons and with the greatclub. Furthermore, it is proficient with hide armor

Combat:
Surrogate(Su): A Taskmaster Thrall might be controlled at any time by its master; whenever the master takes direct control, Will saves, Intelligence checks, and some skill checks (Bluff, Concentration, Diplomacy, Knowledge, Sense Motive, Spellcraft) are made using the master's bonuses.
If any Will save is failed, the master has the option to release control. Should he decide mantain control (or to take direct control) while any spell, effect or condition is affecting the Taskmaster, it afects him instead.
A master is at all times aware of all spells, effects and conditions afecting a Taskmaster Thrall's mind.
The standard master for a taskmaster thrall is a mind flayer with no class levels, whose stats relevant to the taskmaster thrall are Will +9, Concentration +11, and Cha 17).

Death Blast (Su): Upon death, the Taskmaster Thrall releases a 40 ft. radius burst of psionic energy, anyone caught in the area must succeed on a Will saving throw of DC 18 or be stunned for 1d4 rounds. On a succesful save they are just dazed for one round.

Spells: CL 6th; DC 13 + lvl; spells per day 6/6+1/5+1/3+1
Level 0: Acid Splash, Daze, Detect Magic, Disrupt Undead, Ray of Frost, Resistance, Touch of Fatigue
Level 1: Chill Touch, Hold Portal, Hypnotism, Obscuring Mist
Level 2: Scorching Ray, Touch of idiocy
Level3: Ray of Exhaustion

*See "The Template" below
**Note that this creature is not meant as a mere example of the Taskmaster Thrall template. Therefore it isn't based off the standard ogre but one with an elite array: Str 8, Dex 14, Con 13, Int 12, Wis 10, Cha 15


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Well, my players have just come out from a Maze (great excuse for a mini-dungeon) guarding an underground cavern being reconditioned by a slave workforce under the surveying view of taskmasters.

Chances are they will confront some normal, cannon fodder thralls (some will beg to be killed, some will just curl into a ball, some will fight while vacantly staring into the nothing). Then one or two of these guys will appear (the area is huge, so they might end up confronting 4 of them, but not simultaneusly), probably accompanied by pseudonatural hounds of some sort.

Basically I wanted imput in their power level, design flaws, etc...
(For the combat record: a debuffer who might be able to hold his own in battle... sort of what I envisioned a magical slavedriver to be).

The Template:

Taskmaster Thrall[/SIZE]
http://www.earthsmightiest.com/images/news/comics/Thrall%20by%20Liam%20Sharp.jpg

Sometimes slave labour has to be directed finely, sometimes a thrall finds a lost memory in the recesses of its mind and must be calmed, sometimes physical operations have to be undertaken under the hated sun or near to some risk deemed too high to allow the regal presence of an Illithid.

That's what taskmasters are for.

“Taskmaster Thrall” is an acquired template that can be added to any large humanoid or giant.
Most of the time Taskmasters are not being directly controlled, but have been under enough conditioning to obey eficiently to the mandates of its master (but not other illithids).
Under the Illithid influence, having whatever spark of power in their blood stirred, most Taskmaster Thralls progress into the Sorcerer class.

Creating a Taskmaster Thrall
Size and Type: Type changes to Aberration.
Special Attacks: A Taskmaster Thrall retains all special attacks of the base creature and also gains the following special attack.
Death Blast(Su): Upon death, the Taskmaster Thrall releases a 40 ft. radius burst of psionic energy, anyone caught in the area must succeed on a Will saving throw of DC (10 + 1/2 HD + Cha) or be stunned for 1d4 rounds. On a succesful save they are just dazed for one round.
Special Qualities: A Taskmaster Thrall retains all special qualities of the base creature and also gains the following special qualities
Telepathy(Su) 100 ft.
Surrogate(Su): A Taskmaster Thrall is more of a shell to which its Illithid master issues commands and of which ocasionally takes direct control; whenever the master takes direct control, Will saves, Intelligence checks, and some skill checks (Bluff, Concentration, Diplomacy, Knowledge, Sense Motive, Spellcraft) are made using the master's bonuses. If any Will save is failed, the master has the option to release control. Should he decide mantain control (or to take direct control over an already affected Taskmaster Thrall), any spell, effect or condition affecting it afects him, (a master is at all times aware of all spells, effects and conditions afecting a Taskmaster Thrall's mind).
Restructuration(Ex): A Taskmaster Thrall's mind has been conveniently reestructurated to suit the master's needs: two feats are changed for Alertness and Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Scourge), and skill points are redistributed as to maximize Intimidate, Listen and Spot skills.
"Maximize" in this context implies assigning the maximum possible skill points to each of those skills, with priority order of Intimidate, Listen, Spot (which can result in no ranks acquired in any of these if skill points available are less than three per HD).
Skills: See Restructuration
Feats: See Restructuration
Abilities: -2 Str, -2 con, -4 wis, +6 cha
Challenge Rating: As base creature +0
Level Adjustment: -

Equipment:

Thrall Robes: These insconpicuous robes offer a great boon in exchange for "loyalty". After creation they must be attuned to a creature designed as the "master" of the threall robes in a four-hour ritual involving the temporary loss of 1 hit point (which is restored when the robes are destroyed).
Thereafter the robes grant to any creature donning them -save for the one designed as master- an insight bonus to AC equal to master's Charisma bonus to a maximum of +5 (usually +3, given the standard mind flayer) and an equal penalty to Will saves against said master.
Faint Abjuration; CL 3rd; Craft Wondrous Item; Price 22,500 gp.
(price based on a +3 bonus... accounting for the wisdom penalty and the variable, possibly lower Charisma scores)

Mind Scourge: Scourge which deals, additionally to 1d4+Str hp damage, 1 Wis and 1 Cha damage; same rules as Whip but deals lethal damage.

[Previous stage]Taskmaster Thrall (Ogre) Sorcerer 6
Large Aberration
HD 4d8+8 plus 6d4+12 (53 hp)
Speed 40 ft. (8 squares)
Init: +1
AC 18; touch 13; flat-footed 17 (-1 size, +1 Dex, +5 Natural, +3 Insight*)
BAB +6; Grp +13
Attack Mind Scourge* +9 melee (1d4+3 plus 1 Wis and 1 Cha) or Fist +8 melee (1d4+3)
Full-Attack Mind Scourge* +9/+4 melee (1d4+3 plus 1 Wis and 1 Cha) or Fist +8/+3 melee (1d4+3)
Space 10 ft.; Reach 10 ft. (20 with scourge)
Special Attacks: Death Blast, spells
Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft., low-light vision, telepathy 100 ft.
Saves Fort +8 Ref +4 Will +4 (Will +9 controlled) (Will +1 vs. master)
Abilities Str 16, Dex 12, Con 15, Int 8, Wis 6, Cha 17
Skills: (Concentration +11 controlled), Intimidate +16, (Spellcraft +15 controlled)
Feats: Alertness, Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Scourge), Improved Unarmed Strike, Weapon Focus (Scourge)
Environment: Underdark
Organization 2-4 (with Illithid and 2-4 Slave squads of 20-30 humanoids each)
Challenge Rating 7
Treasure Thrall Robes & Mind Scourge
Alignment Always True Neutral


Combat:
Surrogate(Su): A Taskmaster Thrall might be controlled at any time by its master; whenever the master takes direct control, Will saves, Intelligence checks, and some skill checks (Bluff, Concentration, Diplomacy, Knowledge, Sense Motive, Spellcraft) are made using the master's bonuses.
If any Will save is failed, the master has the option to release control. Should he decide mantain control (or to take direct control) while any spell, effect or condition is affecting the Taskmaster, it afects him instead.
A master is at all times aware of all spells, effects and conditions afecting a Taskmaster Thrall's mind.

Death Blast (Su): Upon death, the Taskmaster Thrall releases a 40 ft. radius burst of psionic energy, anyone caught in the area must succeed on a Will saving throw of DC 18 or be stunned for 1d4 rounds. On a succesful save they are just dazed for one round.

Spells: CL 6th; DC 13 + lvl; spells per day 6/6+1/5+1/3+1
Level 0: Acid Splash, Daze, Detect Magic, Disrupt Undead, Ray of Frost, Resistance, Touch of Fatigue
Level 1: Chill Touch, Hold Portal, Hypnotism, Obscuring Mist
Level 2: Scorching Ray, Touch of idiocy
Level3: Ray of Exhaustion


The Template:
[SIZE="5"]
Creating a Taskmaster Thrall

Size and Type: Type changes to Aberration.
Special Attacks: A Taskmaster Thrall retains all special attacks of the base creature and also gains the following special attack.
Death Blast(Su): Upon death, the Taskmaster Thrall releases a 40 ft. radius burst of psionic energy, anyone caught in the area must succeed on a Will saving throw of DC (10 + 1/2 HD + Cha) or be stunned for 1d4 rounds. On a succesful save they are just dazed for one round.
Special Qualities: A Taskmaster Thrall retains all special qualities of the base creature and also gains the following special qualities
Telepathy(Su) 100 ft.
Surrogate(Su): A Taskmaster Thrall is more of a shell to which its Illithid master issues commands and of which ocasionally takes direct control; whenever the master takes direct control, Will saves, Intelligence checks, and some skill checks (Bluff, Concentration, Diplomacy, Knowledge, Sense Motive, Spellcraft) are made using the master's bonuses. If any Will save is failed, the master has the option to release control. Should he decide mantain control (or to take direct control over an already affected Taskmaster Thrall), any spell, effect or condition affecting it afects him, (a master is at all times aware of all spells, effects and conditions afecting a Taskmaster Thrall's mind).
Restructuration(Ex): A Taskmaster Thrall's mind has been conveniently reestructurated to suit the master's needs: two feats are changed for Alertness and Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Scourge), and skill points are redistributed as to maximize Intimidate, Listen and Spot skills.
Skills: See Restructuration
Feats: See Restructuration
Abilities: -2 Str, -2 con, -4 wis, +6 cha
Challenge Rating: As base creature +0
Level Adjustment: -

Equipment:
Thrall Robes: grant an insight bonus to AC equal to master's Charisma bonus (usually +3) and an equal penalty to Will saves against said master.
Mind Scourge: Scourge which deals, additionally to 1d4+Str hp damage, 1 Wis and 1 Cha damage; same rules as Whip but deals lethal damage. Note: I might make the Mind Scourge into a Symbiont.

Comments and imput more than welcome.

Land Outcast
2011-02-15, 09:27 PM
And these would be his lil' helpers


Hound of Diailetnathilxos
http://wearemoviegeeks.com/wp-content/predator-hound-concept.jpg
Hound of Diailetnathilxos [Pseudonatural Worg]
Size/Type: Outsider
Hit Dice: 4d10+8 (30 hp)
Initiative: +2
Speed: 50 ft. (10 squares)
Armor Class: 14 (+2 Dex, +2 natural), touch 12, flat-footed 12
Base Attack/Grapple: +4/+7
Attack: Bite +7 melee (1d6+4)
Full Attack: Bite +7 melee (1d6+4)
Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Trip, true strike
Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft., low-light vision, scent, DR 5/magic, acid & electricity resistance 5, true form
Saves: Fort +6, Ref +6, Will +3
Abilities: Str 17, Dex 15, Con 15, Int 6, Wis 14, Cha 10
Skills: Hide +4, Listen +12, Move Silently +3, Spot +5, Survival +2*
Feats: Alertness, Track
Environment: With Diailetnathilxos
Organization: Solitary, pair, or pack (6-11)
Challenge Rating: 3
Treasure: None
Alignment: Always neutral evil
Advancement: 5-6 HD (Medium); 7-12 HD (Large)
Level Adjustment: +1 (cohort)


True Form (Su)
As a standard action, a Hound of Diail can take the form of a charred canine with its legs ending in a single claw, fangs protuding from under its jawline, and only one eye which moves freely over its body. Despite the alien appearance, its abilities remain unchanged. Other creatures receive a -1 morale penalty on their attack rolls against a Hound of Diail when it is in this true form.

True Strike (Su): Once per day, a Hound of Diail can gain a +20 insight bonus on a single attack roll. In addition, the Hound of Diail suffers no miss chance against a target that has concealment or total concealment when making this attack.

Trip (Ex)
A Hound of Diail that hits with a bite attack can attempt to trip the opponent (+3 check modifier) as a free action without making a touch attack or provoking an attack of opportunity. If the attempt fails, the opponent cannot react to trip the Hound of Diail.

Resistance (Ex)
A Hound of Diail has resistance to acid and electricity 5 (increases to 10 at 8 HD and to 15 at 12 HD).

Damage Reduction (Ex)
A Hound of Diail has DR 5/magic (increases to 10/magic at 12 HD).

Spell Resistance (Ex)
A Hound of Diail has spell resistance 14 (10 + HD).

Skills
A Hound of Diail has a +1 racial bonus on Listen, Move Silently, and Spot checks, and a +2 racial bonus on Hide checks.
*A Hound of Diail has a +4 racial bonus on Survival checks when tracking by scent.

Debihuman
2011-02-16, 09:12 AM
Taskmaster Thrall (Ogre) Sorcerer 6
Large Aberration
Hit Dice: 4d8+8 plus 6d4+12 (53 hp)
Speed: 40 ft. (8 squares)
Initiative: +1
Armor Class 18 (-1 size, +1 Dex, +5 Natural, +3 Insight); touch 13; flat-footed 17
BAB/Grapple: +6/+13
Attack Mind Scourge +9 melee (1d4+3 plus 1 Wis and 1 Cha)
Full Attack: Mind Scourge +9/+4 melee (1d4+3 plus 1 Wis and 1 Cha)
Space/Reach: 10 ft./10 ft. (20 with scourge)
Special Attacks: Death Blast (DC 18), spells
Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft., low-light vision, telepathy 100 ft.
Saves: Fort +8 Ref +4 Will +4
Abilities Str 16, Dex 12, Con 15, Int 8, Wis 6, Cha 17
Skills: Climb, Intimidate Listen and Spot
Feats: Alertness, Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Scourge), Improved Unarmed Strike, Weapon Focus (Scourge)
Environment: Underdark
Organization Solitary or Band (2-4)
Challenge Rating: 7
Treasure: Only Thrall Robe and Mind Scourge
Alignment: Always True Neutral

Fixed it more or less. There are still a significant number of errors.

There is no such thing as a "Fist" attack; it's a Slam or Slap (see Natural Weapons under Special Abilities). However, Ogres do not have a natural attack listed. It should be noted that they also proficient with greatclub and javelin as in their monster entry.

This ogre is also proficient with all simple weapons (as gained from sorcerer class) and could even have a familiar which should be noted.

Creatures do not get iterative attacks based on BAB for their natural attacks, they get it based on how many appendages they have.

Ogres have a Cha of 7, how does yours get a Cha of 17? The template only adds +6 for 13. Where did the extra 4 points come from? This is a good place to show your math. For example if you start with the elite array and then applied the Ogre modifiers ((+10 Strength, -2 Dexterity, +4 Constitution, -4 Intelligence, -4 Charisma) and then applied the template modifiers, it is a lot easier to see if you applied the template correctly. I cannot tell from just the stat line.

Organization seems like it should be: Solitary or Band (2-4) or Band (2-4 with Illithid Master). Additional troops would be listed under the Illithid master's stat block as part of its troops.

If they are never encountered alone, then the CR needs to reflect that. It seems odd they are never encountered alone. The Ogre isn't controlling the the slave squads so those probably should be listed under the Illithid Master rather than under this creature. Yes, it's a vessel for control but you'd still need to stat out the master for this to make sense.

Since you didn't stat up the Master, I cannot tell what bonuses should be added. You should remove any and all references to bonuses that come from the master since you didn't identify the master's stats that indicate which bonuses should apply.

Skills should be fixed to just show the basic creature with its template. You were supposed to Maximize Intimidate, Listen and Spot as per the template and Ogres have a Climb skill.

Attack lines are wrong. Mind Scourge is missing the -1 size penalty to attack.

Touch AC doesn't include Natural armor either.

You probably need a full write up of the Thrall robe as a true magic item, including cost and creation.

Debby

Land Outcast
2011-02-16, 11:50 AM
First: thanks for the reply :smallsmile:

Second: on Skills and Abilities, remember what I'm saying under the creature's stat block and abilities, it is intended as a creature to be used in a particular situation, ergo it might have skills, feats or abilities different form the standard monster. Yet, that's not the end of the explanation. (Might add a disclaimer "Not intended as a mere example of the template".

On the stat block:

Why did you up its Initiative from +1 to +2? Dex being 12

Are insight bonuses to AC are not included in touch AC?

Why did you reduce the attack bonus with the mind scourge to +8?
6 (Bab) + 3 (Str) + 1 (Weapon Focus) - 1 large size = 9



There is no such thing as a "Fist" attack; it's a Slam or Slap (see Natural Weapons under Special Abilities). However, Ogres do not have a natural attack listed. It should be noted that they also proficient with greatclub and javelin as in their monster entry.

This ogre is also proficient with all simple weapons (as gained from sorcerer class) and could even have a familiar which should be noted.

Creatures do not get iterative attacks based on BAB for their natural attacks, they get it based on how many appendages they have.
True enough, it souldn't be "Fist" but rather "Unarmed Strike".

Will add:
Proficient with all simple weapons and greatclub.
Proficient with hide armor


Ogres have a Cha of 7, how does yours get a Cha of 17? The template only adds +6 for 13. Where did the extra 4 points come from? This is a good place to show your math. For example if you start with the elite array and then applied the Ogre modifiers ((+10 Strength, -2 Dexterity, +4 Constitution, -4 Intelligence, -4 Charisma) and then applied the template modifiers, it is a lot easier to see if you applied the template correctly. I cannot tell from just the stat line.
You're right, should have added the details:
Started with an elite array:
Str 8, Dex 14, Con 13, Int 12, Wis 10, Cha 15
Applied Ogre modifiers:
Str 18, Dex 12, Con 17, Int 8, Wis 10, Cha 11
Applied template modifiers:
Str 16, Dex 12, Con 15, Int 8, Wis 6, Cha 17


Organization seems like it should be: Solitary or Band (2-4) or Band (2-4 with Illithid Master). Additional troops would be listed under the Illithid master's stat block as part of its troops.

If they are never encountered alone, then the CR needs to reflect that. It seems odd they are never encountered alone. The Ogre isn't controlling the the slave squads so those probably should be listed under the Illithid Master rather than under this creature. Yes, it's a vessel for control but you'd still need to stat out the master for this to make sense.
True enough, I wasn't thinking about operational organization but rather their place in Illithid structure of organization. Yet, I'm leaning toward:

Work squad (one taskmaster thrall and 20-40 humanoids of CR 1/2) or Company (2-4 taskmaster thralls, each in charge of 20-40 humanoids of CR 1/2) or Entourage (2-4 taskmaster thralls, each in charge of 20-40 humanoids of CR 1/2, and one mind flayer).


Since you didn't stat up the Master, I cannot tell what bonuses should be added. You should remove any and all references to bonuses that come from the master since you didn't identify the master's stats that indicate which bonuses should apply.
My bad again, should have added:
"The standard master for a taskmaster thrall is a mind flayer with no class levels, whose stats relevant to the taskmaster thrall are Will +9, Concentration +11, and Cha 17)."


Skills should be fixed to just show the basic creature with its template. You were supposed to Maximize Intimidate, Listen and Spot as per the template and Ogres have a Climb skill.
I should have specified that "maximize" in this context implies assigning maximum possible skill points to each of those skills, first with Intimidate, next with Listen and next with Spot (which can result in no ranks acquired in any of these if skill points available are less than three per HD).
About the Climb skill, the template states that skillpoints are reassigned.


Attack lines are wrong. Mind Scourge is missing the -1 size penalty to attack. Besides the Unarmed Strike / Fist issue I fail to see how attack lines are wrong.

Touch AC doesn't include Natural armor either. And I didn't include it:
touch 13 = 10 (base) + 1 (Dex) - 1 (Size) + 3 (Insight)


You probably need a full write up of the Thrall robe as a true magic item, including cost and creation.

DebbyOnce again, I agree with you, and will add it asap. (As well as a less vague ruling about the mind scourge).

Thrall Robes: These insconpicuous robes offer a great boon in exchange for "loyalty". After creation they must be attuned to a creature designed as the "master" of the threall robes in a four-hour ritual involving the temporary loss of 1 hit point (which is restored when the robes are destroyed).
Thereafter the robes grant to any creature donning them -save for the one designed as master- an insight bonus to AC equal to master's Charisma bonus to a maximum of +5 (usually +3, given the standard mind flayer) and an equal penalty to Will saves against said master.
Faint Abjuration; CL 3rd; Craft Wondrous Item; Price 22,500 gp.
(price based on a +3 bonus... accounting for the wisdom penalty and the variable, possibly lower Charisma scores)

Thanks a ton! I was worried I wasn't getting any replies with 110 views approx... (maybe I'm doing something horribly wrong... or the creature just wasn't appealing, any ideas?).

Debihuman
2011-02-16, 08:54 PM
I was rushing through the stat block and am not sure why I changed the initiative but it's right now, and I did somehow miss the Feat so AC is now corrected. Insight bonuses aren't subtracted from touch AC. I may have slipped when going back and forth and looked at the Hound's AC line by mistake.

From a design point, K.I.S.S. is the best principle. The sample creature should just showcase the template.

Debby