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View Full Version : [3.5] How to hunt druids? (build advice)



Nepenthe
2011-02-21, 09:28 PM
I'm a new player and I'm getting bored with my current character, a dual-wielding barbarian/fighter (This was my first character EVER, so try not to snicker too hard). Now I want to take over an NPC who the DM introduced awhile ago. But the DM doesn't do character progressions for NPC's, so I need to build him first!

What I've got from the DM: His entire adventuring career has been devoted to hunting down and killing druids. He swore vengeance after druids drove my current character from his village (it's a long story). The DM joked that he's "an 11th level ranger with Favored Enemy: Druid."

General concept I'm looking for: I definitely want the ranger flavor, but almost definitely do not want to go straight ranger. He needs to be able to function in a party, so killing druids can't be his only trick (Although he does need to be good at it). Also, even though I have DM fiat for FE: Druid, I'm not sure I want to take it. It seems too specialized for a PC, though if there's a generic FE: Divinist out there somewhere, I'd love to hear about it (I've seen the Arcanist variant).

I also love the flavor of Occult Slayer, although I'm not sure if it's worth including in the build. I'm not sure if it's strong enough to stand toe-to-toe with a full caster, and at this point a druid's wildshape might be a bigger issue than his spells.

So I'm having trouble deciding because it seems like there are lots of directions to take this. Right now the biggest contenders are:

Sword of the Arcane Order Mystic Ranger, archery combat style most likely, with maybe some Occult Slayer thrown in. I realize this makes the character a complete hypocrite, but the RP opportunities are delicious. Defeat my enemies through raw arcane force!

OR

Ranger/Factotum, maybe some Occult Slayer again, probably two weapon style utilizing a reach weapon along with a gnome quick-razor or spiked gauntlet or something. Defeat my enemies with liberal use of UMD and by generally fighting dirty.

That's my line of thought so far. Any advice is appreciated, whether it be classes, PrC's, spell selection, equipment, tactics, or whatever.

Let's shoot for level 11 (party should be about that level by the time we catch up with him)
All first-party sources are accepted
Completely unoptimized party (we're all first time players) consisting of: a cleric/fighter, a barbarian/fighter, a rogue, and a druid (oh yes. intra-party conflict here we come...)

Thanks everyone!

true_shinken
2011-02-21, 09:34 PM
Well, you need to lock their spellcasting. Mage Slayer feat and her little broters Pierce Magical Protection and Pierce Magical Concealment say hi.
You need to avoid a druid's battlefield control. You're going to need teleports and protection against status effects. I'd take the Quick Recovery feat and use items to get immunities. Maybe dip Horizon Walker for immunity to fatigue.
You need to avoid a druid's melee attacks while in wild shape. You're going to need respectable AC and miss chance.
You need to deal enough damage to kill a druid. Charging is hard with all their weather effects and you can't do it in most natural areas due to difficult terrain. So I'd say your best bet are maneuvers or precision damage.
Ranged gets shut down pretty easy and natural areas have a lot of cover, so I'd go melee.
I think a Ranger 3/Swordsage 8 might be a good fit for what you want. Maybe drop a few levels of Swordsage for Fighter so you can get all the good feats.

Coidzor
2011-02-21, 10:02 PM
If you go with Mageslayer line feats, you could combo it with Abjurant Champion (Complete Mage) levels (I believe 4, maybe it's the capstone for all 5 though) in order to counteract having your CL shot up by setting it back equal to your BAB which should be equal to your HD or very close to it.

You should be able to easily enter Abjurant Champion immediately after you get Sword of the Arcane Order. Of course, Feat intensive.

Something to consider as well for Sword of the Arcane Order Mystic Ranger is either mixing that with Wildshape Ranger or using the Eilserv's School feat from Drow of the Underdark along with TWFing with a magical staff that either casts something nice on you or bad on the enemy whenever you hit them with both ends of the staff.

Nepenthe
2011-02-21, 10:37 PM
I'll be sure to look into Swordsage. Are there any particular maneuvers I should focus my attention on?

Eilserv's School sounds really neat too. Especially if I can buff the staff somehow. I seem to remember running across spells that changed a simple quarterstaff into something more powerful. It might have been druid only though. Anyone know what I'm thinking of?

Also a question on Sword of the Arcane Order: Will I be able to add new spells to my spellbook as I level, or can only wizards do that? For that matter, can I even have my own spellbook, or will I have to always borrow one?

true_shinken
2011-02-21, 10:43 PM
Also a question on Sword of the Arcane Order: Will I be able to add new spells to my spellbook as I level, or can only wizards do that? For that matter, can I even have my own spellbook, or will I have to always borrow one?
Hardcore RAW is that you always have to borrow one. Spellbook is a class feature, after all. RAW is also fuzzy on Abjurant Champion via SotAO and avoiding Mage Slayer's CL penalties with martial arcanist sounds like first class cheddar to me.

About Swordsage maneuvers, look for the heavy hitters. And of course, never forget FIVE SHADOW CREEPING ICE ENERVATION STRIKE.

Cog
2011-02-21, 10:47 PM
Hardcore RAW is that you always have to borrow one. Spellbook is a class feature, after all.
There's a workaround for that: the Magical Training feat, if you choose Wizard casting, gives you a spellbook. It's only 0-level spells, so you'll have to get the others the old-fashioned way, but at least it's your own.

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2011-02-21, 11:13 PM
I'd go one of two ways:
Mystic Ranger all the way, Magical Training regional feat (PGtF), Sword of the Arcane Order (Champions of Valor). You'll lose martial weapon proficiency in everything but ranged weapons, so you may as well go archery. Rapid Shot and Manyshot as bonus feats, Point-Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Improved Rapid Shot, and Woodland Archer (RotW) will do, though you'll need to use flaws to get all that. At level 11 you'll be able to cast 5th level spells, so use Overland Flight and get some lesser and standard rods of extend. Get a standard Strand of Prayer Beads which has had the Bead of Smiting removed, as per the DMG it should only cost 9,000 gp. Use the Bead of Karma to get +4 CL when you buff yourself, and you should also have an Orange Prism Ioun Stone. Put (lesser rod of extended) Greater Magic Weapon on your bow to make it +4. The bow itself should probably be a +1 Seeking and put Bane on it specifically for Druids. During combat you can fly around shooting arrows with spell buffs, and between your skills and other spells you should be extremely capable outside of combat.

WS Ranger (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#ranger) 4/ Ape Totem Barbarian (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm) 1/ Horizon Walker 6, taking the Barbarian level relatively early. That Ranger variant is to get Fast Movement at 1st level, you can combine it with Mystic Ranger if desired. Use a reach weapon such as a Glaive and wear armor spikes so you still threaten adjacent squares. Get Combat Reflexes, Extra Rage, Power Attack, and possibly Leap Attack. Get the Mage Slayer line of feats from Complete Arcane if you're not using Mystic Ranger, or Practiced Spellcaster if you are. Your terrain masteries should be Mountains, Desert, Hills, Plains, Underground, and Shifting. Keep Rhino's Rush (SC) prepared, and get some 1st level Pearls of Power to recover them between fights. Get Sandals of the Light Step in MIC, for 50 ft. base land speed, 30 ft. climb speed, and you're not slowed by difficult terrain. Another extremely useful character, and a powerful melee combatant as well. Edit: Pick up Sword of the Arcane Order if you use Mystic Ranger and can get reliable access to a spellbook containing Wraithstrike, in which case you may want some 2nd level Pearls of Power as well, and always cast that with a Lesser Rod of Extend.

Arbane
2011-02-21, 11:25 PM
IEilserv's School sounds really neat too. Especially if I can buff the staff somehow. I seem to remember running across spells that changed a simple quarterstaff into something more powerful. It might have been druid only though. Anyone know what I'm thinking of?

Sounds like Shillelagh (sp?) and I think it's Druid-only.

Coidzor
2011-02-21, 11:33 PM
Hardcore RAW is that you always have to borrow one. Spellbook is a class feature, after all. RAW is also fuzzy on Abjurant Champion via SotAO and avoiding Mage Slayer's CL penalties with martial arcanist sounds like first class cheddar to me.

Even without obviating the penalty, it's still better than the interpretation that has mystic rangers as having 1/2 HD in CL. 16 being superior to 6 or 10. Practically required for a Mystic Ranger, really, if that interpretation is being used.

If we're bringing in TOB as kosher, if homebrew is negotiable at all, there is the Sublime Way variant Ranger which is pretty well respected.

Viz: Spellbooks, if your DM lets you, you can even attune yourself to another wizard's spell book, and they can do the same with yours, ala Complete Arcane so that the two of you can either A. both use a single one or use one another as back-ups.

Otherwise, if you have a party wizard, then success in deciphering the spells in his spellbook are automatic if he lets you piggyback on him. Then between Aid Another and maybe an eternal wand of an appropriate buff and skill ranks, the DC 16-20 checks should be easily passed. But that's just convoluted and rather unpleasant for the DM to bog himself down with requiring that much rolling, so I find the possibility unlikely.

Oh... and a dip of 1-2 in Totemist/Incarnate could be an attractive option for a wildshape ranger

LordBlades
2011-02-22, 06:39 AM
Sounds like Shillelagh (sp?) and I think it's Druid-only.

Brambles and Spikes works as well, and it's not Druid only.

Kaww
2011-02-22, 06:53 AM
Changestaff PHB works too...

LordBlades
2011-02-22, 07:25 AM
Changestaff PHB works too...

Changestaff is druid only sadly. Blackstaff (i think) from one of the FR books is another awesome quarterstaff spell, but if you get 8th level arcane spells, there are better ways to kill druids than Blackstaff:smallbiggrin:

HunterOfJello
2011-02-22, 07:26 AM
Burn down forests until Druids come after you. Then burn down the druids.

Merellis
2011-02-22, 10:15 AM
Metal armor, even just a little metal in the armor makes them lose a lot of features. So sneak in while they bathe, while they sleep, and make up a wooden armor that has steel slipped in. Bam, no spellcasting or wildshape. Toss a shield at them, is there a spell that can give them actual armor?

true_shinken
2011-02-22, 05:36 PM
Metal armor, even just a little metal in the armor makes them lose a lot of features. So sneak in while they bathe, while they sleep, and make up a wooden armor that has steel slipped in. Bam, no spellcasting or wildshape. Toss a shield at them, is there a spell that can give them actual armor?

Suggestion + called armor, maybe.