Anime Dead question

[Shadowbite]

I'm confused about how animate dead actually works. My character is a a lvl 9 Dread Necromancer with the corpsecrafter feat. I just animated a Erinyes devil. I'm kind of confused about how many hit points and what type of attacks she will retain. Thanks for the help!

SRD links that may be helpful.

Erinyes SRD link http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/devil.htm#erinyes

Zombie SRD link http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/zombie.htm

[Zaydos]

As a zombie with corpsecrafter's +4 Str and +2 hp/hit die:

HD: 18d12+75 (192 hp); Init +6; Spd 30-ft, fly 50-ft (clumsy); AC 18 (+2 natural, +6 Dex), t 16, FF 12; BAB/Grp +9/+17; Atk Longsword +17 melee (1d8+8;1d8+12 if wielded two-handed) or Slam +17 melee (1d6+12) or +1 flaming composite (str +5) longbow +16 ranged (1d8+6 +1d6 fire); F/R 5/5; SA: None; SQ: Darkvision 60-ft (undead feature), DR 5/slashing, single actions only (why I pick skeletons over zombies); SV Fort +6, Ref +12, Will +11; Str 27, Dex 23, Con -, Int -, Wis 10, Cha 1.
Feats: Toughness.

You could also give it a greatsword and it would deal 2d6+12 damage with it. In short she retains only her basic attacks listed under "Attacks" and no special attacks.

Edit: Forgot the bonus Dread Necromancers apply to their undead.

[Shadowbite]

Regarding skeletons versus zombies, it seems that skeletons are in general much better. Is there any benefit to going zombies vs skeletons?

A guide on dread necros and animating dead, recommended making outsiders into zombies rather than skeletons. Any thoughts on this?

[Kaww]

Regarding skeletons versus zombies, it seems that skeletons are in general much better. Is there any benefit to going zombies or skeletons?

A guide on dread necros and animating dead, recommended making outsiders into zombies rather than skeletons. Any thoughts on this?


This (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19872470/New_Dread_Necromancer_Handbook) might help you.

[JaronK]

With Corpse Crafter and your natural Dread Necromancer abilities, all undead you make have their existing HD turned into d12+4 HP/HD, or +6 if it's done near a desecrated evil alter (get one of those to take around with you ASAP!). So, an 18 HD critter would end up having 189 hp, which would be 225 hp if you had a desecrated evil alter nearby.

In general skeletons are better than zombies, but zombies do get the natural AC of the starting critter, and get double HD (which is good if you're raising something with 10 or less HD and not worried about total HD raised, something DNs don't worry about). A 10 headed hydra would be better as a Zombie. So would anything else with lots of natural armor, 10 or less HD, and not much difference between standard action and full round action attacks. Also, only zombies get to keep wing based flight abilities (skeletons keep magical flight only).

Eventually you'll get Plague of Undead, which is a far superior spell since it gives max hp/hd (with the DEA, it's 18hp/HD) and costs much less, but that's a 9th level spell. Also consider the utility of Awaken Undead. Spell stitching a creature with that spell and Animate Dread Warrior would be very useful.

JaronK

[AtomicKitKat]

Really? Nobody pointed out the typo in the title? I was gonna bring up stuff like Shaman King and Jigoku Shoujo.:smallwink:

[Daftendirekt]

With Corpse Crafter and your natural Dread Necromancer abilities, all undead you make have their existing HD turned into d12+4 HP/HD, or +6 if it's done near a desecrated evil alter (get one of those to take around with you ASAP!). So, an 18 HD critter would end up having 189 hp, which would be 225 hp if you had a desecrated evil alter nearby.

Forgot to mention the total +8 strength and +4 dex from Corpsecrafter and Undead Mastery.

[Yuki Akuma]

I was gonna reference Soul Eater.

[Hazzardevil]

I noticed the mistake but didn't think of any anime refrences.
I do reccomend taking levels in plaemaster and taking the spellstiched template btw.
Spellstiched lets you cast one spell everyday withpout paying xp and palemaster lets you animate anything you kill as a zombie for free.

[JaronK]

Forgot to mention the total +8 strength and +4 dex from Corpsecrafter and Undead Mastery.

Enhancement bonuses don't stack, and all those Str and Dex bonuses are enhancement. So it's actually just +4 to Str and Dex.

JaronK

[grarrrg]

Really? Nobody pointed out the typo in the title? I was gonna bring up stuff like Shaman King and Jigoku Shoujo.:smallwink:

I was going to link to a bunch of (ir)relevant pics. But a few "Anime (un)dead" searches later...
Most image linking vetoed due to 1 or more of the following:
A: Not Anime enough.
B: Not (un)dead enough.
C: Too gruesome/bloody.
D: Too boobsome/slutty.

So you get this instead
http://th01.deviantart.com/fs12/300W/i/2006/286/c/e/Killer_Care_Bear_Family_1_by_Undead_Art.jpg

[monkey3]

Regarding skeletons versus zombies, it seems that skeletons are in general much better. Is there any benefit to going zombies vs skeletons?


90% of the time skeletons are better. There are only 2 exceptions. (Watch someone come in and add a third).

1) If you want flying. Only zombies retain the natural flight they had in life.

2) A monster that whose "standard attack" == "full attack"
zombies loose full attack, and are reduced to standard (single) attacks.
So, if you have nothing to loose, go for zombie.
Examples: Hydra, ogre, anything with a BAB (base attack bonus) of 5 or less.

[Hazzardevil]

Actyally I think Skeletons can retain flight but it has to be "magical" IE: something that flys because of magic, not wings.

[Shadowbite]

Thanks everybody for the replies. At the moment, I'm rocking out with a ogre skeleton, my imp familiar, and now my soon to be zombie or skeleton erinyes. The double hp does seem kind of tempting but the 1 action does seem like crap. And she would be losing the +14/+9 attack or just +14 attack. Still mulling it over.

I'm thinking of naming her Tabitha and casting gentle repose to keep her looking fresh.

[ScionoftheVoid]

Thanks everybody for the replies. At the moment, I'm rocking out with a ogre skeleton, my imp familiar, and now my soon to be zombie or skeleton erinyes. The double hp does seem kind of tempting but the 1 action does seem like crap. And she would be losing the +14/+9 attack or just +14 attack. Still mulling it over.

I'm thinking of naming her Tabitha and casting gentle repose to keep her looking fresh.

Note that the double hp is due to double hit dice, zombies use up twice the normal amount of your controlled HD pool.

[Shadowbite]

Note that the double hp is due to double hit dice, zombies use up twice the normal amount of your controlled HD pool.

So with my lvl 8 class feature Undead Mastery I'm looking at 4 + 5 (cha modidifier off a score of 20) per lvl? So 81 HD worth of undead allowed to be controlled?

[absolmorph]

Really? Nobody pointed out the typo in the title? I was gonna bring up stuff like Shaman King and Jigoku Shoujo.:smallwink:


I was gonna reference Soul Eater.
Personally, I think Highschool of the Dead would be most appropriate.
:smallwink:

[Shadowbite]

Just noticed the post about flying. Hm... so I guess I'm wondering, is the Erinyes ability to fly magical or natural (based off wings)? Think that might be what makes my final decision.

[Shadowbite]

As a zombie with corpsecrafter's +4 Str and +2 hp/hit die:

HD: 18d12+75 (192 hp); Init +6; Spd 30-ft, fly 50-ft (clumsy); AC 18 (+2 natural, +6 Dex), t 16, FF 12; BAB/Grp +9/+17; Atk Longsword +17 melee (1d8+8;1d8+12 if wielded two-handed) or Slam +17 melee (1d6+12) or +1 flaming composite (str +5) longbow +16 ranged (1d8+6 +1d6 fire); F/R 5/5; SA: None; SQ: Darkvision 60-ft (undead feature), DR 5/slashing, single actions only (why I pick skeletons over zombies); SV Fort +6, Ref +12, Will +11; Str 27, Dex 23, Con -, Int -, Wis 10, Cha 1.
Feats: Toughness.

You could also give it a greatsword and it would deal 2d6+12 damage with it. In short she retains only her basic attacks listed under "Attacks" and no special attacks.

Edit: Forgot the bonus Dread Necromancers apply to their undead.

One question, under AC you have it listed as 18 (+2 natural, +6 dex) but the Natural Armor of the Erinyes is +8 and under the Zombie AC modifier, it says
"Natural armor bonus increases by a number based on the zombie’s size"

With medium zombies getting a +2 to AC. So the total would be natural AC +10, +6 dex so total AC 26.

Is that correct or am I missing something?

[JaronK]

Just noticed the post about flying. Hm... so I guess I'm wondering, is the Erinyes ability to fly magical or natural (based off wings)? Think that might be what makes my final decision.

If they have wings, it's winged flight. If their flight is listed as (Su), then it's magical flight.

JaronK

[lokoone]

yes, you are right Shadowbite



Armor Class

Natural armor bonus increases by a number based on the zombie’s size:

it says increase

[Shadowbite]

Just wanted to ask if this is viable. Could my flying Zombie Erinyes with her 27 strength, carry a party member up into into the air where they could stay up there and just shoot at enemies? I guess I don't really understand how flying (clumsy) works.

[Daftendirekt]

Maneuverability basically comes out to how sharp of a turn the flier can make. The worse it is, the more squares of movement it takes to make, say, a 45 degree turn.

K, found the rules. Page 20 of the DMG, states how maneuverability affects various aspects of flight.

[ScionoftheVoid]

Maneuverability basically comes out to how sharp of a turn the flier can make. The worse it is, the more squares of movement it takes to make, say, a 45 degree turn.

K, found the rules. Page 20 of the DMG, states how maneuverability affects various aspects of flight.

Also determines how much you need to move each round to not drop out of the sky, making zombies with flight not so great. They either use their actions flying or drop like a stone, and if their movement is blocked by an obstacle they find it hard to avoid without crashing.

[Shadowbite]

I guess I have 2 questions then:

Would the 27 strength zombie have any problem carrying a PC (I'm guessing weighing between 130-300 lbs for our characters) while flying.

And would a character have any problem firing a bow or casting spells while being flown around?

[ericgrau]

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/carryingCapacity.htm
27 strength, Medium size, light load: 346 lbs.
27 strength, Large size, light load: 692 lbs.

The main issue I see is the awkwardness of a medium creature holding a medium creature. Most mounts are 1 size larger. Maybe if you can get smaller or make it bigger. AFAIK there aren't hard and fast rules for it but IMO sitting on the thing's shoulders should be allowed with penalties (attack roll penalties (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/specialAttacks.htm#mountedCombat), concentration checks (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/concentration.htm) to cast similar to a vigorously moving mount, etc.). Unless you solve the size problems.

Even then it's a DC 10 ride check if you need both hands free and a DC 10 ride check to keep from falling when you take damage (both DC 5, plus 5 for an awkward/unusual mount). A military saddle gives you a +2 to keep from falling. No saddle gives you a -5 to both checks.

[AtomicKitKat]

Having it as a mount would allow you to negate damage to it with a Ride check.:smalltongue:

That being said, I could be wrong, but flying creatures are usually limited to no more than either a Medium or Light load to fly.