So, I just got the Immortal's Handbook....

[LOTRfan]

Wow, this seems complicated. Okay, I knew this book was supposed to have rules for epic monsters that far surpass the ones given in the Epic Level Handbook, but wow, there are some monsters in here with d100 Hit Dice! The minimum Hit Dice for Mega-Fine Creatures are 131,072 HD! How do you even fight a monster ninety-six miles long???

So, I think I might have to stay with low-epic (20-40???), but I must ask, has anyone ever successfully used the more powerful creatures in this book? How did you keep track of everything?

[Yora]

How do you even fight a monster ninety-six miles long???
You stab its toe nail with a 3 feet long blade.

[Amnestic]

Back when I were a lad, we used to fight monsters 200 miles long with nothing but pointy sticks and harsh language! And we had to walk in the snow to our battles. Uphill! Both ways! And when we got home grandad would beat us all with his penny sock, before making us eat our dinner of worms and dirty watter.

And we were grateful! You young kids today with your "3 foot blades" and your "only 96 mile long monsters". You don't know how easy you've got it, I tell you.

[SurlySeraph]

My only experience with them is figuring out ways to kill them pre-epic, so I don't think I can be of much help. Dice rolling programs, graphing calculators, and never bothering to double check your calculations because that'll bog up the game too much seems like the only viable way of handling things if you're going to try to fight them "as intended" with level 400 characters and the like. Frankly, DnD doesn't remotely work at that scale, and nothing else rules-heavy works very well. It's standard to suggest switching to Exalted for epic levels, but I'd recommend Qwixalted (http://aakin.net/qwixalted/doku.php?id=daiklave_s_stuff) so you don't have to deal with such a complex rule set.

And yeah, fighting a 96-mile monster by hitting the same part of it with a sword over and over is stupid, but so's fighting a 64-foot monster by hitting the same part of it with a sword over and over, and that's just Colossal.

[The Glyphstone]

The Immortals Handbook is not rules. It is the result of putting boxing gloves on an epileptic monkey and letting it pound on a number pad for a few hours, then editing the typos and adding names to stuff.

Seriously, the book is close to worthless - it's just ridiculous strings of zeroes with some fluff and various [Immune to everything ever, yes, even that, except for [X] printed in this book] abilities.

[Eldan]

And then a level, what was it, 12, mage soloes the Neutronium Golem.

[Chess435]

The Immortals Handbook is not rules. It is the result of putting boxing gloves on an epileptic monkey and letting it pound on a number pad for a few hours, then editing the typos and adding names to stuff.


Isn't this about the third time I've heard (read) you say this? :smallwink:

Yeah, it's a little lot broken, but with a good DM and liberal application of the nerf bat and banhammer, it's usable, at least for the most part. The only reason I ever even look at it though, is that it's the only rulebook I know of for that kind of power.

[Eldan]

The problem is, the few monsters I've seen in such threads at least aren't that impressive.

There were a few challenges "defeat monster X with the lowest level mage possible". A lot of them have fantastically stupid weaknesses.

[The Glyphstone]

Isn't this about the third time I've heard (read) you say this? :smallwink:

Yeah, it's a little lot broken, but with a good DM and liberal application of the nerf bat and banhammer, it's usable, at least for the most part. The only reason I ever even look at it though, is that it's the only rulebook I know of for that kind of power.

I think it's the second - I came up with it the last time someone asked about the IH. It's still my opinion though...the name breaks down in levels 20-30+. By level 100+, it's effectively freeform anyways, so the rules aren't really that useful.

[BIGMamaSloth]

Isn't there stats somewhere for the turtle and elephants that discworld is on? I think it was mega-gargantuan.

[Boci]

Isn't there stats somewhere for the turtle and elephants that discworld is on? I think it was mega-gargantuan.

Yes, its the discworld turtle and should be on D&Dwiki. It has no spell reistence, no immunity to stat damage and 2 int. Needless to say it does not live up to its CR against players who know this.

[LOTRfan]

Yes, its the discworld turtle and should be on D&Dwiki. It has no spell reistence, no immunity to stat damage and 2 int. Needless to say it does not live up to its CR against players who know this.

That's.... wow. That's bad. I mean, really bad.

So, general consensus is I just wasted my money? :smallfrown:

[TroubleBrewing]

Not necessarily. I mean, you can threaten to use things from it against standard-level PCs if your players get unruly. It's like reaching for a newspaper when your dog is about to do something bad; they look at you, you look at them, back to you, back to them... it's a little like that scene from "The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly" at the end with the close-up shots on their faces. Humor value, too.

[The Glyphstone]

That's.... wow. That's bad. I mean, really bad.

So, general consensus is I just wasted my money? :smallfrown:

It makes a good coffee table decoration, or a bookend. And sometimes, it can be an effective prop for psyching out your players - you don't even mention it, just leave it out in the open on top of the rest of the books you intend to use during the session, near your GM screen. Let the players draw their own conclusions, likely the wrong ones.

[LOTRfan]

It makes a good coffee table decoration, or a bookend. And sometimes, it can be an effective prop for psyching out your players - you don't even mention it, just leave it out in the open on top of the rest of the books you intend to use during the session, near your GM screen. Let the players draw their own conclusions, likely the wrong ones.

I guess. I guess I should've sprung for Frostburn instead, though...

That would be an interesting thing to do, but I'm sure my players won't react at all. Oh well.

[theMycon]

Back when I were a lad, we used to fight monsters 200 miles long with nothing but pointy sticks and harsh language! And we had to walk in the snow to our battles. Uphill! Both ways! And when we got home grandad would beat us all with his penny sock, before making us eat our dinner of worms and dirty watter.

And we were grateful! You young kids today with your "3 foot blades" and your "only 96 mile long monsters". You don't know how easy you've got it, I tell you.

Bah, you had it good when you were a kid. We hadn't even developed languages to curse and spout oaths at monsters back when I was your age. It was all a system of grunts, clicks, pointing and whistles. I tell you, arranging a proper flanking manuever against a 300 mile-long god-killing abomination was an achievement, back in my day!

And we liked it, too!

[The Glyphstone]

I guess. I guess I should've sprung for Frostburn instead, though...

That would be an interesting thing to do, but I'm sure my players won't react at all. Oh well.

Admittedly, it only works if they know what it is. Otherwise it's just another book they don't recognize.