Battle: LA (Spoilers)

[Silverraptor]

I liked the movie. Didn't drag out the beginning too long. Went straight into the action. And actually gave humanity a fighting chance. I've seen too many movies where they would give no chance of winning, but atleast this one they were doing damage from the beginning. Downsides, a few plot points were weak here and there or didn't make sense. And the camera was unsteady for a large portion of the movie where it was obviously shoulder mounted and wobbling around everywhere. But overall the plot and the movie was good in my opinion.

Anyone else's thoughts?

[Pie Guy]

I liked it. The water as fuel plot point was silly.

[Silverraptor]

I liked it. The water as fuel plot point was silly.

Indeed. Water is a renewable resource. If they were using it as fuel for the water to actually disappear, then they would be needing to actually break apart the molecules, which takes an icreadible amount of power to do so.

[Dienekes]

I liked it. The water as fuel plot point was silly.

Honestly that didn't bother me, alien tech and all that. It also made me smile thinking it as a "take that" to Signs.

Overall, I rather enjoyed it. The story was a bit cliched (the entire story arc played out like a video game) and some of the dialogue could have been incredibly cheesy but the actors managed to pull it off. They made the threat incredibly dangerous and hard to kill, but not unbeatable.

What got me was that each side was trying to play intelligently. Sure there were a few stupid decisions from both of them, but overall it was interesting.

[An Enemy Spy]

Battle LA is the the light at the end of tunnel after the ****storm that was Skyline. I can at last say that the last alien invasion movie I've seen was a good one.
Also, Aaron Eckhart(spelling?) is amazing.

[Silverraptor]

I heard Skyline was bad, and it looked like it from its trailers. For Battle: LA, I was iffy on it as well. But I'm really glad I watched it.

[Nomrom]

Just saw it and I thought it was really good. The action was nice and it managed to seem kind of realistic even though they were fighting an alien invasion force.

[An Enemy Spy]

I heard Skyline was bad, and it looked like it from its trailers. For Battle: LA, I was iffy on it as well. But I'm really glad I watched it.

You heard right. That movie was terrible. A massive worldwide invasion and it focused on five people hanging out in an apartment

[Soras Teva Gee]

I liked it. The water as fuel plot point was silly.

I suppose it would be too much to ask for the move to address the halo full of dirty snowballs as a presumably easier source of water right?

Seriously I'm not sold on going to see this movie. Looks like a dumb chance to play America Saves The Day straight, only without the even the level of threat posed by the aliens in Independence Day.

[Dienekes]

Seriously I'm not sold on going to see this movie. Looks like a dumb chance to play America Saves The Day straight, only without the even the level of threat posed by the aliens in Independence Day.

Would I ruin too much to say this is wrong?

[Silverraptor]

Would I ruin too much to say this is wrong?

No. I don't think so.

Anyways, one thing I really liked and was suprised about was how the aliens used projectiles and missles like us. Now true, the projectiles seemed to be coated in a thermo-lacing because when they hit they would leave burns, but atleast they ricochet off metal like our bullets. And it was nice to finally see an alien invasion without plasma weapons and energy fields. I actually thought, "OH MY GOD! Our tank's armor is actually *Protecting* the troops inside!" Seriously, some alien movies I almost think, "Why do you still throw tanks at this point when all they are is a little extra firepower that doesn't do much, yet provides a much larger and easier target for the enemy.":smallsigh:

[An Enemy Spy]

I suppose it would be too much to ask for the move to address the halo full of dirty snowballs as a presumably easier source of water right?

Seriously I'm not sold on going to see this movie. Looks like a dumb chance to play America Saves The Day straight, only without the even the level of threat posed by the aliens in Independence Day.

Why is it always wrong when America saves the day? If Austria saved the day, no one would hate them for it.

[Julian84]

I liked the movie, but I had some issues:

1. The shaky camera was incredibly annoying to me. One moment would focus on the main character, then to some cars parked on the side of the street, tha back to the main charac- oh wait, we're back to cars.

2. A large cast that was given a few random plot points per person to make them more "real". While it is good to have 3 dimensional characters, that was more "we're trying to make them 3d charatcers, but there are so darn many of 'em, most will be dead before you actually care". And the civilians. I despised every scene they were involved in.

3. The water thing. It was badly executed, imo, because it seemed to be breaking the fundamental writing law of "show, don't tell". There was not much in the way of showing, and a whoolllee lot of telling.

4. The marines had a definite conservation of ninjutsu thing going on, especially on the freeway. A large band of marines with a tank can't take out one mobile missile-gun turret, but a mere handful of marines can take out a much bigger hovercraft thing with only rpg's? :smallconfused:

I could probably go into detail about 2 and 4, but I don't feel like it right now. Thoughts?

[Silverraptor]

If you do feel like posting more of points 2 and 4, then we can analyze it better.

[Julian84]

Hm. Might be a tad long.


2. For the soldiers, we were given over-used archtypes from many band o' soldiers/war-focused movie. You had the lone wolf with a heart of gold who has a record, the inexplicably green officer (who was somehow younger than the lone wolf, but of higher rank), the plucky virgin, the nervous rookie, Michelle Rodriguez, and a small horde of faceless red shirts who get a moment in the limelight so they can die horrifically.

For the civilians, it just seemed everything they were involved in was... stupid. The dissection thing was the worst. Ms. "Veterinary powers as the plot demands so the lone wolf will have a female person who is actually feminine to bond with" offering to help with the dissection was utterly ridiculous in my book. She also later comments that "He [the lone wolf] reminds her of her brother- he never smiles either".

Um, what?

They're in the middle of a warzone! Los Angeles is literally being destroyed around them, and she's surprised he doesn't smile?!? I literally face-palmed right there.

The Rincon father-son duo was also, in my book, very cliche and stupid. In the end, they were plot devices to show that Mr. Lone Wolf has a heart of gold, and they were immediately discarded the moment they weren't needed.

And when Mr. Lone Wolf told the kid "You're the bravest marine I've ever met", while I know this was meant to be heart-warming, considering that like over a dozen marines died to get them that far, you would think at least one of them would say "Hey, what about me? Didn't see that kid charging death in the face so the civilians could be safely lowered down the rope."

4. At the beginning of the movie, I would say there were what, 2 dozen marines in all? A good chunk of them get taken out pretty quickly by a small squad of aliens in the fog (which was heralded by the hideously cliche friendly-animal-de-tension scene). So they make it to the police station, and lose four guys. They are then forced from the relatively secure position by a force of... apparently 6-10 guys. About 3 of whom got blown up by grenades awfully quickly upon entering the building. In fact, you have to wonder why the marines didn't just spam grenades in the first place, since guns don't seem to be too useful at that point. Anyhow, they escape via bus, and th first real conservation of ninjutsu shows up when one marine (Senor Lone Wolf) takes out a ship (With a grenade! Aren't we smart?), when apparently F-16's can't take them in air combat.

Then they get stuck on the freeway, and we see a tank get owned by the little mobile missile turret, because of the law of conservation. And since there are more marines, obviously they'll be taken out in short order, but still somehow managing to keep the alien numbers small enough to keep up their plot-given advantage. But as soon as the marines retreat, it only takes one (armed with quite a bit of C4) to blow up the remaining aliens.

So now the marines have been cut down to size. They escape to the airport, somehow miraculously getting there unscathed with a seriously wounded man, grab weapons and ammo and vehicles, and plot their escape.

Now with smaller numerical force, they can combat the aliens with their own laws of conservation. Watch as aliens are hilariously wiped out wherever they go, and everyone is quite happy again, even though they had watched their closest friends get horrifically butchered hours before. Way to move on, guys. Anyhow, they escape, but decide to launch a suicide mission, because hey, they're the protagonists, how could they die now? (Though one does die later. One)

Anyhow, the small team destroys the massively huge and improbably located alien C&C. And then takes out a squad of aliens who, if it were the beginning of the movie, would have laughed gutturally and gunned them down.

The end.

[Silverraptor]

I don't know about point 2, but point 4:

They did start spamming grenades by popping one into the water and using the M203 to cover the entrance when the police station was breached. And don't forget, he set of the grenade right next to a gas station, so the explosion also included gasoline exploding. And the F-16's were taking them out, as you saw them doing damage in the few scenes that showed them. I guess you're suppose to picture the obvious that they're doing enough damage to destroy them, but that there are simply too many drones compared to our fighters.

As for them having fun taking out aliens, they were in armored vehicles facing aliens with only hand mounted guns that didn't penetrate the armor. They also had a "We're marines" scene and so they were at that point fighting to survive. And after seeing you're friends butchered, I would've loved killing the bastards who did so.

I'll admit, the scene taking out the C&C was really stretching it. But if you recall, they did have suprise on their side and they knew where the kill spot was on the aliens. They were also using laser guided surface to air missles to take out the C&C, and the AT4-HS was only used to stop the intercepting drone from blocking the copperhead missle.

[Julian84]

Yes, I referred to the M203, though I didn't know it's name. Also, I referred to the grenade being used at the gas station. As for the pool scene, I will admit I forgot about that one. That was awesome.


As for the "We're marines", I don't really buy it. They could take out tanks with a little turret. They couldn't spare one measly drone to deal with some humans in ground vehicles? There was no way they would have managed to kill all the aliens, and at least one of them should have been able to get out a distress signal. And considering how terrifyingly organized they were, you would think a squadron would be on them before they could say "We're saved!"

But it doesn't matter anyhow, since conservation of ninjutsu was their saving grace anyhow.

But as for C&C, I again don't buy it in the least. They were facing forces far superior to the battle at the freeway, with air support out the wazoo, and no amount of surprise would have saved a small ragtag band of 7 marines. It was a total author saving throw going on for everything. It doesn't matter if they had missiles, they were the ones guiding them in. If they were shot, woohoo, battle's over. Aliens: 1, Humans: 0. But there had to be a happy ending to that miswritten scene.

[An Enemy Spy]

Hm. Might be a tad long.

And when Mr. Lone Wolf told the kid "You're the bravest marine I've ever met", while I know this was meant to be heart-warming, considering that like over a dozen marines died to get them that far, you would think at least one of them would say "Hey, what about me? Didn't see that kid charging death in the face so the civilians could be safely lowered down the rope."



What kind of an @sshole would say something like that? He's just trying to make the kid feel better, not tell him that he's the best of a bunch of actual marines.

[Tavar]

For the soldiers, we were given over-used archtypes from many band o' soldiers/war-focused movie. You had the lone wolf with a heart of gold who has a record, the inexplicably green officer (who was somehow younger than the lone wolf, but of higher rank), the plucky virgin, the nervous rookie, Michelle Rodriguez, and a small horde of faceless red shirts who get a moment in the limelight so they can die horrifically.

Um...correct me if I'm wrong, but that's kinda how it works. A lieutenant is an officer, and higher in the chain of command than a sergeant. But sergeant is the highest rank outside of officers, so you can very well have a young officer in command of a veteran. This assumes that the people in question are a Officer/non-commissioned officer.

Another possibility is that the older guy is a bit of a troublemaker. It is possible to not go up in ranks after time.

[Julian84]

Um...correct me if I'm wrong, but that's kinda how it works. A lieutenant is an officer, and higher in the chain of command than a sergeant. But sergeant is the highest rank outside of officers, so you can very well have a young officer in command of a veteran. .

Hm, true enough. I can't say that military life interests me in any way, so I'll admit ignorance on that part :smallbiggrin:

As for the a-hole marine comment, yeah, that is a bit of a stretch on my part. I had chatted all of this out last night with a friend after we saw it, and we had joked about that. ::shrugs:: Perhaps not in the best taste.

[An Enemy Spy]

He probably went straight to officer training rather than working his way up.

[Force]

Um...correct me if I'm wrong, but that's kinda how it works. A lieutenant is an officer, and higher in the chain of command than a sergeant. But sergeant is the highest rank outside of officers, so you can very well have a young officer in command of a veteran. This assumes that the people in question are a Officer/non-commissioned officer.

Another possibility is that the older guy is a bit of a troublemaker. It is possible to not go up in ranks after time.

It's the difference between a non-commissioned officer (a NCO) and a commissioned officer. They're separate tracks of command. It's possible to graduate from Officer Candidate School and be commissioned at a lieutenant as young as, say, 22. Becoming a NCO, however, takes quite a bit more time and requires (as I understand it) that one come up from the ranks, so sergeants are older soldiers with quite a bit more experience-- but they are subordinate to that fresh-faced lieutenant. Technically, a day-out-of-OCS lieutenant outranks the Sergeant Major of the Marine Corps.

[Tavar]

Right. In my limited understanding, this is intentional, to try and provide young, inexperienced officers with veteran support without requiring an older officer holding their hand.

[Dvandemon]

Indeed. Water is a renewable resource. If they were using it as fuel for the water to actually disappear, then they would be needing to actually break apart the molecules, which takes an icreadible amount of power to do so.

Also, why not just search any other planet in the solar system? It'd be less of a hassle
No. I don't think so.

Anyways, one thing I really liked and was suprised about was how the aliens used projectiles and missles like us. Now true, the projectiles seemed to be coated in a thermo-lacing because when they hit they would leave burns, but atleast they ricochet off metal like our bullets. And it was nice to finally see an alien invasion without plasma weapons and energy fields. I actually thought, "OH MY GOD! Our tank's armor is actually *Protecting* the troops inside!" Seriously, some alien movies I almost think, "Why do you still throw tanks at this point when all they are is a little extra firepower that doesn't do much, yet provides a much larger and easier target for the enemy.":smallsigh:

On a related note, I enjoyed the fact that the alien tech didn't look squeaky clean as they tend to do. I almost thought Diesel Punk when I saw it.

[Silverraptor]

Also, why not just search any other planet in the solar system? It'd be less of a hassle


Well, were the only planet in the solar system with available water on the surface. That's why they're bothering.

[mangosta71]

Indeed. Water is a renewable resource. If they were using it as fuel for the water to actually disappear, then they would be needing to actually break apart the molecules, which takes an icreadible amount of power to do so.
We break water apart all the time - it's really easy. Though you're right in that it takes more energy to do than is released in the reaction.

Now, if that's a preparatory step to using raw hydrogen in a fusion reactor...

[Dvandemon]

Well, were the only planet in the solar system with available water on the surface. That's why they're bothering.

They did say that in the movie...

[Silverraptor]

They did say that in the movie...

So, what's the problem? If we were the alien race and we moved into a solar system and we need water, do we, a) Go to an ice planet and spend alot of effort drilling, harvesting, and melting ice from an ice planet or b) Go to an inhabited planet with water on the surface that all we need to do is suck up? Oh, and use military force to push the native population away from our water extraction posts where we surgically attach weapons to our soldiers to dedicate their cause to the effort, suggesting we are a war-like species.

[An Enemy Spy]

And maybe they want to start a colony on Earth, because it's the only neaby planet they can breathe on and they don't have the means to terraform other planets.

[Silverraptor]

And maybe they want to start a colony on Earth, because it's the only neaby planet they can breathe on and they don't have the means to terraform other planets.

An interesting fact that not too many people know about is our atmosphere is actually toxic. Oxygen, while a necessity for us to live, is also killing us with each breath. Oxygen rusts metals such as iron, and upon a closer look, its breaking down our bodies as well. That is why we die of old age from our bodies being broken down by the oxygen.

[Astrella]

An interesting fact that not too many people know about is our atmosphere is actually toxic. Oxygen, while a necessity for us to live, is also killing us with each breath. Oxygen rusts metals such as iron, and upon a closer look, its breaking down our bodies as well. That is why we die of old age from our bodies being broken down by the oxygen.

Eh, not really. While oxygen isn't that friendly to our bodies, the damage it deals gets repaired / damaged cells get replaced by new ones.

Ageing has more to do with deterioration of DNA / DNA copying errors.

[Tyrant]

What kind of an @sshole would say something like that? He's just trying to make the kid feel better, not tell him that he's the best of a bunch of actual marines.
Probably the one who called him out on them being expendable about a minute after he talked to the kid if I had to guess. That whole, "they're important but I guess we're just here to get killed" mentality isn't a far cry from the "well, I guess we aren't important/good marines" outlook that would cause someone to say something about what he said to the kid.

[Dvandemon]

An interesting fact that not too many people know about is our atmosphere is actually toxic. Oxygen, while a necessity for us to live, is also killing us with each breath. Oxygen rusts metals such as iron, and upon a closer look, its breaking down our bodies as well. That is why we die of old age from our bodies being broken down by the oxygen.
I knew that. It makes sense (from speculation) for a reactive element to be used to create energy I guess

[Pie Guy]

Wouldn't it just be easier to throw a rather large chunk of matter at one of those iceballs? If I have any knowledge of physics (I don't) that should melt the ice, right?

[Silverraptor]

Wouldn't it just be easier to throw a rather large chunk of matter at one of those iceballs? If I have any knowledge of physics (I don't) that should melt the ice, right?

No, not necesarrily. And water expands when it turns into ice, meaning that there is actually less water in the same volume of ice. Also, throwing large objects at the ice will cause it to scatter in every direction, so unless they have something capable of grabbing thousands of multiple objects at the same time...

[Tyrant]

No, not necesarrily. And water expands when it turns into ice, meaning that there is actually less water in the same volume of ice. Also, throwing large objects at the ice will cause it to scatter in every direction, so unless they have something capable of grabbing thousands of multiple objects at the same time...
Like a legion of remote control drones with enough control accuracy to throw themselves into incoming missiles?

[Silverraptor]

Like a legion of remote control drones with enough control accuracy to throw themselves into incoming missiles?

But do they have any way of catching tiny bits of ice? It just sounds like more trouble then saying, "Oh look, a planet with actual liquid water. Oh, and some natives that need to be taken care of to, but we can actually start extracting the water right at the beginning."

[Tyrant]

But do they have any way of catching tiny bits of ice? It just sounds like more trouble then saying, "Oh look, a planet with actual liquid water. Oh, and some natives that need to be taken care of to, but we can actually start extracting the water right at the beginning."
Maybe it's just my way of thinking, but I will try to steal from the planetoid/space object that can't fight back. Especially if the other one has people with weapons that can kill me and even an hour of recon tells me that they are absolutely willing to use them in their own territory with reckless abandon. They almost have to have larger ships because otherwise their plan is absolute suicide. If they have larger ships in space, capturing or otherwise looting a ball of ice in space I would have to believe would be easier than fighting off a highly violent native species that has the means to kill your soldiers and ships.

I guess I look at it like this: I want a drink and I have two choices of how to get it. One requires me to put forth some effort and there is potentially some danger, the other requires me to walk into a bar known for violent bar fights and try to fight someone so I can take their drink from them (and keep fighting bar patrons for each additional drink).

[Dienekes]

Ehh, they said they were there to colonize. Maybe yes they want the water supply, but room to live is also a nice benefit of colonization.

[VanBuren]

I really don't have any interest in seeing this movie, and reading this thread has done little to change that.

[The Glyphstone]

I guess I look at it like this: I want a drink and I have two choices of how to get it. One requires me to put forth some effort and there is potentially some danger, the other requires me to walk into a bar known for violent bar fights and try to fight someone so I can take their drink from them (and keep fighting bar patrons for each additional drink).

That depends on who you're fighting. If you looked through the bar window and saw a group of kindergarten-aged children, you might be more willing to go in and fight them for that drink. Now, after you fight the first one and find out that the entire class is packing switchblades and .44 magnums in their pockets, reconsidering might be a worthwhile option.

similarly, the aliens may have simply not done the research, or underestimated how effective our weapons would be. They are spacegoing and we aren't, after all. A bit of arrogance on their part wouldn't be unthinkable. And once they were stuck in, they might as well finish the job.

[Killer Angel]

Why is it always wrong when America saves the day? If Austria saved the day, no one would hate them for it.

'Cause America already saved lots of days, so another movie where America saves the day, is old since the beginning?
If it's Austria saving the day, at least it would be original.

That said, I'll watch it. :smallbiggrin:

[An Enemy Spy]

Maybe it's just my way of thinking, but I will try to steal from the planetoid/space object that can't fight back. Especially if the other one has people with weapons that can kill me and even an hour of recon tells me that they are absolutely willing to use them in their own territory with reckless abandon. They almost have to have larger ships because otherwise their plan is absolute suicide. If they have larger ships in space, capturing or otherwise looting a ball of ice in space I would have to believe would be easier than fighting off a highly violent native species that has the means to kill your soldiers and ships.

I guess I look at it like this: I want a drink and I have two choices of how to get it. One requires me to put forth some effort and there is potentially some danger, the other requires me to walk into a bar known for violent bar fights and try to fight someone so I can take their drink from them (and keep fighting bar patrons for each additional drink).

Maybe they're just recklessly overconfidant and underestimated the aboriginals they were trying to destroy. It wouldn't be the first time in history that's happened.

[Silverraptor]

That depends on who you're fighting. If you looked through the bar window and saw a group of kindergarten-aged children, you might be more willing to go in and fight them for that drink. Now, after you fight the first one and find out that the entire class is packing switchblades and .44 magnums in their pockets, reconsidering might be a worthwhile option.

similarly, the aliens may have simply not done the research, or underestimated how effective our weapons would be. They are spacegoing and we aren't, after all. A bit of arrogance on their part wouldn't be unthinkable. And once they were stuck in, they might as well finish the job.

Thanks Glyph. I was having trouble finding out how to explain it, but this is perfect.

[The Glyphstone]

Thanks Glyph. I was having trouble finding out how to explain it, but this is perfect.

I admit to being very amused by the mental image of a group of kindergarteners brandishing switchblades.:smallbiggrin:

[Silverraptor]

I admit to being very amused by the mental image of a group of kindergarteners brandishing switchblades.:smallbiggrin:

That is why switchblades are banned. They make you just want to *Stab* someone.:smalltongue:

[Eric Tolle]

No, no, no, no. Not ANOTHER ****ing idiotic movie where the aliens are after our water. That plot point right there makes the movie too stupid to even qualify for MST3K. It's right up there with "The aliens are stealing our blonde women so they can mate with them". Arrgh! stupid stupid STUPID! Nothing can ever justify that level of idiocy!

God damn it, why won't the writers actually learn that the "water" plot is one of the most idiotic ideas possible? Oh right- it doesn't matter how idiotic the movie is, people will defend it because it has a lot of explosions and kewl special effects. ****.

[The Glyphstone]

No, no, no, no. Not ANOTHER ****ing idiotic movie where the aliens are after our water. That plot point right there makes the movie too stupid to even qualify for MST3K. It's right up there with "The aliens are stealing our blonde women so they can mate with them". Arrgh! stupid stupid STUPID! Nothing can ever justify that level of idiocy!

God damn it, why won't the writers actually learn that the "water" plot is one of the most idiotic ideas possible? Oh right- it doesn't matter how idiotic the movie is, people will defend it because it has a lot of explosions and kewl special effects. ****.

Why is it stupid? The only other movie I can think of that involved Water was Signs, and that was exactly the opposite.

Remember that Earth, among all the planets we've looked at so far, is unusual in how much liquid water it has on its surface, apparently a very rare trait among planets. Unless we've been looking in all the wrong places and keep missing the thousands of water-rich worlds, it's a fair assumption that planets with abundant liquid water are rare; in such a case, if the profit margin of squashing some pathetic semi-orbital native lifeforms outweighs the expense of setting up a spaceborne industry to capture and defrost comets/iceballs, why not go for it?

[Tavar]

In fact, if I remember correctly, one of the big reasons Signs was mocked was because, out of all the places the Aliens could have gone, they chose the one place where water was extremely common, yet it was extremely toxic to them. These one's don't sound quite as stupid.

[Eric Tolle]

Why is it stupid? The only other movie I can think of that involved Water was Signs, and that was exactly the opposite.

Remember that Earth, among all the planets we've looked at so far, is unusual in how much liquid water it has on its surface, apparently a very rare trait among planets.

The aliens have star travel. That is inherently several tens of orders of magnitude greater in difficulty and power requirement than the ability to make a boiler and a condenser for the most common compound in the universe. And it's even more problematic to go out of one gravity well, to another for that compound. Period. End of story.

The whole scenario depends on the writers no knowing basic physics, and also trusting that the audience will be similarly idiotic.


if the profit margin of squashing some pathetic semi-orbital native lifeforms outweighs the expense of setting up a spaceborne industry to capture and defrost comets/iceballs, why not go for it?

Once again, they have star travel. Any movie where the cost to travel to another star to steal liquid water is less than the cost to build a simple condenser, is de facto idiotic beyond belief.

[The Glyphstone]

The aliens have star travel. That is inherently several tens of orders of magnitude greater in difficulty and power requirement than the ability to make a boiler and a condenser for the most common compound in the universe. And it's even more problematic to go out of one gravity well, to another for that compound. Period. End of story.

The whole scenario depends on the writers no knowing basic physics, and also trusting that the audience will be similarly idiotic.



Once again, they have star travel. Any movie where the cost to travel to another star to steal liquid water is less than the cost to build a simple condenser, is de facto idiotic beyond belief.

WARNING: Epileptic Trees and Tinfoil Hat Theories abound beyond. Read at your own risk.

Consider this then - what if it's not water they want, but Earth Water? Earth science has only progressed so far (i.e., not to the level of star travel). If Earth happens to be one of a very small number of planets where an extremely rare element/alloy/particle/thingamajigger (one we have not yet discovered, due to our lack of ability to detect it) can be found in great abundance, and is water-soluble. This Plotinium Macguffinide material is the key element for star travel engines - no race has ever found a means of moving interstellar distances without this stuff, so when it's discovered that a bunch of primitive monkeys are sitting on a gold mine of the stuff, there's a rush to be the ones to conquer them first.

Now it's just a writer fail to explain a key plot element, rather than utter idiocy in and out of universe. Admittedly, explaining said plot element would inevitably be done in a horribly ham-handed and horrible manner, to the degree where it'd be better to not explain it at all and just leave the audience wondering why the aliens want our water specifically instead of building a condensor. Like this movie.

[faceroll]

That is why we die of old age from our bodies being broken down by the oxygen.

Oxidative stress as an aging mechanism is a current hypothesized, but relatively unsupported so far. Has a lot of promise, though.


WARNING: Epileptic Trees and Tinfoil Hat Theories abound beyond. Read at your own risk.

Consider this then - what if it's not water they want, but Earth Water? Earth science has only progressed so far (i.e., not to the level of star travel). If Earth happens to be one of a very small number of planets where an extremely rare element/alloy/particle/thingamajigger (one we have not yet discovered, due to our lack of ability to detect it) can be found in great abundance, and is water-soluble. This Plotinium Macguffinide material is the key element for star travel engines - no race has ever found a means of moving interstellar distances without this stuff, so when it's discovered that a bunch of primitive monkeys are sitting on a gold mine of the stuff, there's a rush to be the ones to conquer them first.

Now it's just a writer fail to explain a key plot element, rather than utter idiocy in and out of universe. Admittedly, explaining said plot element would inevitably be done in a horribly ham-handed and horrible manner, to the degree where it'd be better to not explain it at all and just leave the audience wondering why the aliens want our water specifically instead of building a condensor. Like this movie.

Yeah, maybe we have especially deuterium rich water or something. Though you could get that in a nuclear reactor.

Space travel might not be that hard, and if humans hadn't put all their resources into killing each other, we'd have figured it out by now.

[Silverraptor]

WARNING: Epileptic Trees and Tinfoil Hat Theories abound beyond. Read at your own risk.

Consider this then - what if it's not water they want, but Earth Water? Earth science has only progressed so far (i.e., not to the level of star travel). If Earth happens to be one of a very small number of planets where an extremely rare element/alloy/particle/thingamajigger (one we have not yet discovered, due to our lack of ability to detect it) can be found in great abundance, and is water-soluble. This Plotinium Macguffinide material is the key element for star travel engines - no race has ever found a means of moving interstellar distances without this stuff, so when it's discovered that a bunch of primitive monkeys are sitting on a gold mine of the stuff, there's a rush to be the ones to conquer them first.

Now it's just a writer fail to explain a key plot element, rather than utter idiocy in and out of universe. Admittedly, explaining said plot element would inevitably be done in a horribly ham-handed and horrible manner, to the degree where it'd be better to not explain it at all and just leave the audience wondering why the aliens want our water specifically instead of building a condensor. Like this movie.

This... is gold!:smallbiggrin: Have an internet!

[An Enemy Spy]

Oxidative stress as an aging mechanism is a current hypothesized, but relatively unsupported so far. Has a lot of promise, though.



Yeah, maybe we have especially deuterium rich water or something. Though you could get that in a nuclear reactor.

Space travel might not be that hard, and if humans hadn't put all their resources into killing each other, we'd have figured it out by now.

Actually, most of our best technology has come out of our never ending quest to exterminate every member of the human race apart from the ones within our borders. We always have to be one step ahead of the other guy, and thus, new technology is born.

[Trog]

Okay, before I get to my review of the movie I want to address the water issue.

If an alien force strikes all the major seaports across the globe they are not here for the water. Water may indeed provide fuel for their technology, perhaps, but it only serves as a way to fuel their war effort. If they just came to take the water it'd be a bazillion times smarter to land in the middle of the Pacific and just suck it all up and pwn any vessel that gets too close.

Clearly, they were there to exterminate the humans to take over the planet.

A planet with abundant water would be a great place to be if your technology ran off it but there's no way to tell that they had a shortage of water where they came from, they just needed access to it to fuel their invasion/war effort.

Furthermore the "They're here to take our water" "explanation" was not given by someone in military command, it was hypothesized by some quack on a talk show in the movie. Just because the movie has the line "they're here for our water" doesn't mean it's the correct answer, it's just the writers having what's left of the media speculating and talking out of their asses like they always do.

So that (in my mind anyway) is that.

My review:

I liked the film. A lot. It was just a notch above technology as we have it today which gave the enemy the edge which always makes for exciting stuff.

About the only parts I didn't care for were some of the non-in-combat dialogue between characters. Which seemed wooden and put there intentionally to cover the "emotional bases" of the movie. If they had done the emotional things with... I dunno... more unique and downplayed dialogue and situations it would have improved the movie, I think.

But the aliens were damn cool. I freakin' LOVED the Big Dog-like large gun weapon the enemy forces brought in. Yaaay a use for the Big Dog robot! :smallbiggrin:

The only thing I didn't care for was the drones dropping out of the sky once the main station was destroyed. I expected Gungans to pop out somewhere. :smalltongue: I understand that they did so to emphasize the enormity of what the troop had just accomplished in a visual manner, but I'd have rather seen a shot of two drones crashing into one another and armed forces finally able to successfully take them down now that they were not able to communicate with one another or something other than blow-up-station-everything-drops-lifelessly-from-the-sky.

Anyhow, I give the movie a thumbs up for gritty firefight action, plausable alien tech and aliens, and a fun ride.

[pita]

Yeah, pretty much the only logic fail that annoyed me was that the drones weren't an AI, but needed constant communication to stay flying.
I liked this movie. IMO, the best alien invasion movie that isn't Mars Attacks. Eckhart makes a great action hero, even if (at times) I felt like he was doing a Batman voice. Your normal voice is man enough, you don't have to make it deeper.
EDIT- Also, FINALLY AN ALIEN INVASION MOVIE WHERE HUMANS AREN'T HOPELESSLY OUTMATCHED! I also liked the fact that even though the protagonists were instrumental to the victory, they weren't by any means the only human resistance, especially considering the international title for this movie is Global Invasion: The Battle for Los Angeles, which means we could get others.
I was a little disappointed, also, in the beginning. I loved how we started with the action, and flashing back from there seemed unnecessary.

[Pie Guy]

I was a little disappointed, also, in the beginning. I loved how we started with the action, and flashing back from there seemed unnecessary.

Then it would just be Explosions: Screw LA.

[Silverraptor]

Then it would just be Explosions: Screw LA.

That's what they were planning on doing in the beginning with the bombing run.:smalltongue:

[KillianHawkeye]

'Cause America already saved lots of days, so another movie where America saves the day, is old since the beginning?
If it's Austria saving the day, at least it would be original.

America is usually the protagonist country in movies, but that's just because most movies are made in America. Y'know, like how Harry Potter takes place in Great Britain, because the creator of Harry Potter is British? Same thing. I'm sure Austria is the main setting of most Austrian movies, but most foreign films don't get seen in the US except at film festivals and similar events. That doesn't mean they don't exist, you're just not seeing them.

[The Glyphstone]

For reference on that point, Bollywood movies are very frequently set in India. They're also incredibly trippy, if the last one I saw clips from was any indication.

[Don Julio Anejo]

For reference on that point, Bollywood movies are very frequently set in India. They're also incredibly trippy, if the last one I saw clips from was any indication.
Like the aliens starting to sing and dance when they land and marines joining in?

[The Glyphstone]

Like the aliens starting to sing and dance when they land and marines joining in?

I was thinking more of the Elvis-clone hive mind terminator army, but yeah.

[arguskos]

I was thinking more of the Elvis-clone hive mind terminator army, but yeah.
Ever seen Bubba Hotep? It's a B-movie from the states. The plot involves Elvis (in his late 70s/80s) and his only friend, Jack (who claims to be JFK, dyed black, and dumped in a nursing home by Lyndon Johnson) in a nursing home fighting an ancient egyptian mummy who eats souls and looks like a cowboy.

Who says American movies don't make you go "wait what"? :smallamused:

[The Glyphstone]

Ever seen Bubba Hotep? It's a B-movie from the states. The plot involves Elvis (in his late 70s/80s) and his only friend, Jack (who claims to be JFK, dyed black, and dumped in a nursing home by Lyndon Johnson) in a nursing home fighting an ancient egyptian mummy who eats souls and looks like a cowboy.

Who says American movies don't make you go "wait what"? :smallamused:

That sounds awesome.

[arguskos]

That sounds awesome.
It was, actually. I fully recommend it.

[Dienekes]

That sounds awesome.

Awesome is an understatement. Partially because Elvis is played by Bruce Campbell.

[JonestheSpy]

Bubba Ho-tep is one of the best B-movies ever. Lots of folks don't get it because so much of it is about age, looking back, regret, and redemption. In other words, it's not nearly as meaningful for anyone under 35 or so.

Makes a great double-feature with Six String Samurai; musical genius Brian Taylor did the soundtrack for both.

As for Battle o' Lala (as we call it in Northern California), I'll wait for Attack the Block (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cD0gm7dHKKc&feature=fvst), I think.

[Ricky S]

I am torn on this movie. Judging it from an entertainment side, I liked it immensely. The action scenes were intense and pretty realistic in terms of the marines. It was gritty and showed how it would feel to be a grunt on the ground. It had good build up and I liked the film techniques. It was no where near cloverfield on the handycam which is a good thing. It had enough to make the scenes dramatic but not enough to make you feel sick.

The civilians annoyed me a lot though. Especially the "little marine." I felt their characters were transparent and unecessary. I cringed when the women turned out to be a vet. Of course. Someone with medical qualifications was just there when they were dissecting the alien. The marines were all realistic and well thought out. It would have been more dramatic if the civilians got on the chopper and it was destroyed. I am tired of civilians being immune to damage because they are civilians. Fricking die already!

On the realistic level I thought the aliens were ridiculously stupid. The entire premise that they have achieved space travel and yet could be killed so easily annoyed me.
-I thought it was ridiculous that the aliens weapons had been fused to their bodies. It doesnt make them more effective soldiers!
-Their armour was less than special consisting of little more the metal plates which isnt any better than what we have now.
-They still used missiles and projectile based weaponry yet they had hover technology and space travel. I thought at least when the first time I saw the aliens squad weapon powering up that it was a railgun, laser cannon, plasma cannon, something sci fi. But no! It just fired missiles.
-They were almost impossible to kill in the beginning of the movie but by the end of the movie a 3 round burst would take them down. I know that they found their "weakness" But in the heat of battle you would not be able to aim so efficiently at a moving target.
-The main thing that annoyed me was that the aliens had no redundancy. Their entire force was crippled by taking out the command node? Really? That was completely retarded. No military would be that stupid. Even if they were that stupid, they would definately have more protection than what was in the movie. Also each drone should have some sort of basic computer system. Falling out of the sky was pretty unrealistic. Even our planes can take off, fly and land on auto pilot. Surely their alien technology would allow for that at the very least?
-Water as a reason for invasion was very weak. There is plenty of water everywhere else in the universe. Couldn't their reason just have been colonisation? Also I didn't see massive ships sucking up water so how could the earths water levels drop so dramatically?

For once I wish that someone would make a movie where humanity dies. Every movie that shows humans fighting aliens we always win. Sure there are a few deaths but how can we always win against such advanced technology.

[JonestheSpy]

For once I wish that someone would make a movie where humanity dies. Every movie that shows humans fighting aliens we always win. Sure there are a few deaths but how can we always win against such advanced technology.

You do realize that such a movie would be incredibly depressing and only a few die-hard sci-fi geeks who would just like it on the meta-level would want to pay to see such a film, right?

Anyway, there is a rather well known alien invasion story where the aliens' tech makes them unbeatable. It also happens to be the first alien invasion story - you might have heard of it, it was written by this guy named Wells?

[warty goblin]

You do realize that such a movie would be incredibly depressing and only a few die-hard sci-fi geeks who would just like it on the meta-level would want to pay to see such a film, right?

Humanity dying, as in extinction-o-rama wouldn't make for a particularly good story. Humanity losing and becoming a subservient, colonized species however could be very interesting, particularly if the story is set in the aftermath of the actual invastion. It's always struck me as a pity that the only two options for most first contact stories are "we come in peace here's the cure for cancer" or "we're going to disintegrate every last one of you."

[Syka]

I just saw it this morning, and really enjoyed it. I thought the shaky cam was well executed and at the right moments, without overdoing it. The combat sequences got a little repetitive, but the characters were realistic.

On the LT being younger than the SS: Not uncommon. For instance, I have a friend who will be commissioning as an officer when we graduate in a couple months, not unlike the Martinez character. He already knows a lot, if not all, of his platoon leaders will be A. older than he is and B. more experienced than he. Like in this movie, a good commander isn't threatened but rather considers such a person (older, more experienced) to be an asset.

The impression I got is we were able to take them out better at the end not only because we knew more, but also because they'd had the element of surprise. Once humans had a chance to regroup, we were just at a bit of a disadvantage.

Also, we don't know that everywhere else fell. From the sounds of it, the other nations were fighting just as hard as America. An American (quite literally) chanced upon the way to eliminate the air force portion of the aliens. The aliens were still fighting, but their air support was gone which is HUGE.


I thought the 'water'/colonization thing and all that was just a back drop. Not definite, etc. To me, Battle: LA was a war movie more than an alien movie. Kinda like how District 9 is a social commentary just set against the back drop of aliens.



My main issue: One particular line of dialog and the follow through. "I'm a vet" with a pause before it is just so...cheesy. Then she proceeds to do...nothing. Aside from Eckhart just stabbing at the alien, I'm pretty sure Doc would've been able to identify "Oh, that looks like an organ...try that!" Her being a vet had essentially no bearing.

[Tyrant]

Also, we don't know that everywhere else fell. From the sounds of it, the other nations were fighting just as hard as America. An American (quite literally) chanced upon the way to eliminate the air force portion of the aliens. The aliens were still fighting, but their air support was gone which is HUGE.
I was also under the impression that there would be multiple control ships and each was directing a specific area's drones. So their efforts only helped L.A. (maybe other areas once they started to spread the word though). Of course, I would've thought they would stick around for a few minutes and debrief so they could pass on everything they had figured out.

Humanity dying, as in extinction-o-rama wouldn't make for a particularly good story. Humanity losing and becoming a subservient, colonized species however could be very interesting, particularly if the story is set in the aftermath of the actual invastion. It's always struck me as a pity that the only two options for most first contact stories are "we come in peace here's the cure for cancer" or "we're going to disintegrate every last one of you."
Battlefield Earth?

[The Glyphstone]

I'd like to see a sort of 'quest for the stars' movie set post-First Contact with extraterrestrial life...after they're gone. Aliens came to Earth, found humans, said 'eh, you're boring, goodbye', and went away. But now humans know that aliens exist, driving us to be the ones to visit the stars and find them.

[Syka]

Oh, I remember the other thing that bugged me some- time jumps.

Hours would pass without much for the audience to base it off of. From what I could tell, aside from the flashback to the previous day, the film covers somewhere in the venue of 24-36 hours with 12-24 being the main bit. Like, suddenly after the fire bombing was supposed to happen it's sometime only a little bit before 3 AM for them to get to the check point. Then, after they get out of the alien controlled sewers it's suddenly dawn (so about 7am or so). They weren't in the helicopter more than an hour I'd guess to get to where they were dropped, so...yeah.

The pacing bugged me a couple times.

[An Enemy Spy]

Oh, I remember the other thing that bugged me some- time jumps.

Hours would pass without much for the audience to base it off of. From what I could tell, aside from the flashback to the previous day, the film covers somewhere in the venue of 24-36 hours with 12-24 being the main bit. Like, suddenly after the fire bombing was supposed to happen it's sometime only a little bit before 3 AM for them to get to the check point. Then, after they get out of the alien controlled sewers it's suddenly dawn (so about 7am or so). They weren't in the helicopter more than an hour I'd guess to get to where they were dropped, so...yeah.

The pacing bugged me a couple times.

Well they were dropped off some distance(5km) from the control center and would have had to move cautiously(slowly) to get there.

[RTGoodman]

I saw it this past weekend, and I was VERY surprised. I thought it would be a hum-drum, cliched-riddled sci-fi action movie. It still had its share of cliches, but I think it was honestly one of the best action/war movies I've seen in a LONG time. Aaron Eckhart was particularly good, but I thought the other "main" characters were decent as well. The dialog wasn't stellar throughout, but for the most part I think it was realistic.

The only big problem I had production-wise was the egregious overuse of teal and orange (http://theabyssgazes.blogspot.com/2010/03/teal-and-orange-hollywood-please-stop.html) (the race to the evac point was a particularly offensive part), but that's a Hollywood-wide problem.

[Ricky S]

You do realize that such a movie would be incredibly depressing and only a few die-hard sci-fi geeks who would just like it on the meta-level would want to pay to see such a film, right?

Anyway, there is a rather well known alien invasion story where the aliens' tech makes them unbeatable. It also happens to be the first alien invasion story - you might have heard of it, it was written by this guy named Wells?

It cant be more depressing than "the road". Also you could make a movie where we lose and it could still be epic and not depressing. Like having an epic last stand.

[Syka]

It cant be more depressing than "the road". Also you could make a movie where we lose and it could still be epic and not depressing. Like having an epic last stand.

Ugh, The Road. So good but so darn depressing. :smallfrown:



Also, someone mentioned the "You remind me of my brother" and attributed it to the Vet. IIRC, it was actually Michelle Rodriguez's character, and I think it was mostly an attempt to try and keep him from falling too far into the pit of despair.

I was actually impressed with the character Rodriguez got. I'm SO used to her just being a hard ass warrior woman. She was tough and could hold her own and all, but she was also brainier. And she didn't have the 'abrasive' personality she is given a lot.