PDA

View Full Version : Request Help with Setting



Xanmyral
2011-03-14, 03:27 PM
I'm trying to figure out what would be a good population range for the setting, which takes place on a continent. (Yes, I do plan on eventually creating a full blown pseudo-earth, but these things take time...) The continent in question is roughly the size of Africa, with a good portion of Australia tact on. So, while pretty large, not that big in comparison to other continents. The technology level is somewhat vaguely in the Renaissance period, meaning that science and medicine is really starting to take off. Flintlock smooth-bore rifles, some early cannons and so such. The southern tip of the continent is quite warm, but quite a few good paces away from tropical. The northern part however, is pretty much tundra, ice, snow-etc. A good portion of the continent has been mapped, and explored, but still a good percentage is unknown, if I were to give an estimate it would be about ten, to twenty five percent. I think that should suffice details, hopefully.
The details are in the spoiler tags, to conserve on space.

I personally was thinking of about a good one, to two hundred and fifty million, somewhere in that ballpark. I don't know that much about subjects that would help me garner a better number though, so I was hoping someone here might be more knowledgeable. If more details are needed, I will try to give what I can.

The Big Dice
2011-03-14, 05:06 PM
I would suggest reading this (http://www.prismnet.com/~sjohn/demog.htm). Then revise your estimate downwards significantly. The modern USA has a population somewhere around 310 million. Canada the other country that takes up most of the North American continent has a population of around 35 million. Britain has a population of almost 70 million.

250 million on a continent is probably around the kind of population density seen in the 40s. Maybe a little earlier, but certainly within living memory.

Kuma Kode
2011-03-17, 08:20 PM
A naive equation follows.


[ (Population of France in 17th Century) / (Area of France) ] * [ (Area of Austrailia) + (Area of Africa) ]

[ 20,000,000 / 260,558 ] * [ 2,941,299 + 11,668,598.7 ]

[ 76.8 ] * [ 14609897.7 ]

1,122,040,143.36


A billion people, assuming the entire continent (which is only slightly smaller than Asia) is as prosperous as any other part. Remove however much land is inhospitable or uninhabited from the picture, reduce the population density as you see fit for however much land, and there ya go.

For more help, we'll need to know the breakdown of economic prosperity between countries and how much land is actually usable, since clearly the continent won't have such ideal conditions.

NOTE: The French had the highest medieval population density in Europe, so feel free to scale that back.

Odin the Ignoble
2011-03-17, 08:32 PM
Since you know the size of the area you are talking about, it depends on what sort of density you want.

All of North America probably had population of less then 18 million, pre-Columbus. If there are still unexplored parts of the continent, I'd put it around that mark. Anything more and you don't really get the whole "vast tracks of unexplored wilderness". Humans tend to explore pretty thoroughly before settling any area.

Another_Poet
2011-03-18, 07:34 PM
I was going to suggest 40 million. I think using highly-dense 1600's France will give you too high of a number. I think using hunter-gatherer-only North America will give you too low.

dsmiles
2011-03-18, 08:25 PM
1,122,040,143.36I really want to know what you're going to do with 36% of a person. :smalltongue:

Kuma Kode
2011-03-18, 08:52 PM
That's a gnome. :smallbiggrin:

Xanmyral
2011-03-18, 10:57 PM
I think a billion might be a tad too much. Crap, just remembered something that might throw a wrench in the population count. Specifically, a war that raged over most of the continent, with one side being a group (Coven, or would that be a cult...? Whatever the group name for wizards are.) of necromancers, with the other side being three of the four nations. So, roughly a good eighty percent of the land swept up in a war. This war was a good hundred, to a hundred and fifty years ago though, so there is that. I'm sure that should modify the numbers a bit.

Info Dump about Nations, if needed to help with numbers.
I guess a good overview of the nations might help, and their relative lands. Let us see here.... The smallest country resides in the tundra to the north, with only four cities. City states would be more accurate, as they are a nation, but in loose definition of the term. So, harsh weather, hard to find food, a vicious house system of nobility, with the three main houses warring, the fourth city actually being a city and under the rule of no house, acting as neutral ground. The technology is early medieval. The second smallest nation would be a capitalistic magocracy. Mostly developed by trade, the cities being near the ocean so they can disperse their goods to the rest of the coastal towns and so such. Can't really get to high in the society without magic. Best developed navy, and so such. Can't really place their tech on a time line, as it's a weird hybrid of medieval and magic. I'm going to skip the second largest, to the largest here. The largest reside in a hilly terrain, often dotted with forests and so such. Militaristic, very nationalistic, has a kind and advisers. At ends with the magocracy. Tech is around late Renaissance, so cannons, smooth-bore muskets, etc. Back down a peg to the second largest nation. Pseudo-monarchy, mostly ruled by a council that is comprised of the leaders of various guilds. Very much a middle ground between the largest, and the second largest nation. A bit lower on the tech scale than the largest. Mostly plains, so a good place farming.

Most of the portions that is unexplored is in the northern region, so it's mostly tundra, with a small portion being around the mountainous border that separates the tundra areas from the rest of the continent. I'm leaning towards somewhere around sixty, to eighty million right now.

Kuma Kode
2011-03-18, 11:12 PM
Of COURSE a billion is too much. That equation is using the entire continent with the highest real-world population density of the 17th century. :smalltongue:

For real calculations, you'll need percentages of uninhabited land, the percentage of land each country takes up, and a population density for each. Just find out the density of a country and time period you're modeling with and use that. Slap it all together and you'll have something more realistic than my ridiculous calculations.

Another_Poet
2011-03-18, 11:21 PM
I don't think the war will affect population count too much. The actual 17th century was in a state of near constant war. You could argue that necromancy kills more people than a real war, but then, D&D clerics heal more people than real Renaissance witch doctors physicians.

I'd choose a number in the tens of millions to 100 million tops and call it a day.

Out of curiousity, why does it matter? Will the PCs ever really count people or know whether there are 11 million versus 300 million?

Xanmyral
2011-03-18, 11:54 PM
No, they probably won't. But when it comes to creating something, I'm a perfectionist and I try not to leave a single stone unturned. It just feels... Wrong, to leave something like population count unknown. So I guess it's a case of the old question of "who's to know if you do this" with me answering "I will know." Sort of a silly reason I guess, but I'm nothing if not detailed and meticulous. Besides, it does factor in on a few other things that will matter, like the total count of how many magic users there are, which will directly effect how the Magocracy might run, as well as a few other things here and there. ...Although the argument that I just use however many I need to does come into play here.

awa
2011-03-19, 01:07 AM
populations jump back incredibly fast it might affect a race like elves but humans will be back up with in a generation or two unless were talking about black plague levels of death it shouldn't make that much of a difference.

(and if we assume decent medical care meaning low infant mortality rates then even the black plague would not slow you down after a hundred and fifty years

dsmiles
2011-03-19, 06:15 AM
That's a gnome. :smallbiggrin:

Rimshot. (http://instantrimshot.com/) :smallbiggrin:

Ravens_cry
2011-03-19, 11:13 AM
Really? I thought it would be a point-three-sixthling.

begooler
2011-03-20, 01:56 AM
I think rather than trying to come up with a total to begin with, I would put the puzzle together and then add up the pieces.

Figure out about how many of various sizes of cities and settlements you want, and how spaced out you want them to be, and how much land needs to be dedicated to providing the resources for those societies. Use the average values for city populations by size in the DMG. Then calculate from there. Conveniently, you have also created a sketch for your continent map in the process.

Yora
2011-03-20, 06:57 AM
Given that not all of the continent is heavily populated, I would stick with the original 250 million estimate.