Armor Conundrum

[Dergmann]

Im most often the DM in between all of my friends. I kinda just dove in, never played any of the games before, so I realyy didnt know what I was doing. But the boys seem to enjoy my games so I figured all was well. I quickly realized, however, that I was a god-mod: I give the players mountains of gold and weapons and anthing they could want around every corner. Im getting better about it, but recently I blundered up. I allowed one player to buy a suit of diamond plate armor. Now, this is a bad thing, as his AC is now nigh-untouchable. But I dont want to just have him give it up. I want to have him lose it in a humorous way that would fit in to some sort of plot. Also, said character is an evil Half-orc fighter.

[MammonAzrael]

Diamond would be a terrible material to make armor out of. It can be very hard, but it'll shatter with the right impact.

From a mechanical standpoint, diamond is not an official material. So you'll have to tell us what the stats are for this homebrew armor.

From a general standpoint...so he is hard to hit. Then have his opponents ignore him in favor of easier to hit targets, like the wizard. Target his with touch attacks. Spells and abilities that don't require an attack roll. And so on.

It also sounds like you are not staying close to appropriate wealth by level, are you?

[arguskos]

It also sounds like you are not staying close to appropriate wealth by level, are you?
Given that a handful of diamond for a rez is 10k, and this guy's got a suit of armor of it, I find it doubtful. :smalltongue:

However, Mammon is correct. Abuse the fact that just because his AC is tough to handle, his saves sure aren't.

[Kadzar]

Well, I'd point out that diamonds burn (http://www.popsci.com/diy/article/2009-08/burn-diamonds-torch-and-liquid-oxygen), but this is a suit of armor that is somehow composed entirely of diamonds, so I might kill a lot of catgirls in the process.

[Leon]

All the armour in the world wont stop you falling into a deep pit.

[Eldan]

Have every thug, criminal, evil wizard, poor cleric looking to raise someone and greedy devil in the multiverse try to hunt down this enormous source of valuable gems?

[Alpha0010]

Is the armor made of diamond? If it is, I think an earth elemental can ignore it.

[WinWin]

Nets.

Alchemical items.

Shadows.

Spells.

[Vladislav]

Ray of Enfeeblement, Ray of Clumsiness, Scorching Ray, Eldritch Blast, Lesser Orb of Acid, Charm/Hold/Dominate Person, Web, Grease, Cloudkill, Stinking Cloud, Magic Missile, Black Tentacles, other grapple attacks, pit traps, nets, breath weapons, ...

There are a lot of things in the game that don't care about your AC.

[Fineous Orlon]

I wonder if he would have some sort of reduced save versus a LIGHT attack, or a multiplied effect, as the facets of the armor channel the light inwards...

Searing light, anyone?

[Shadowleaf]

I wonder if he would have some sort of reduced save versus a LIGHT attack, or a multiplied effect, as the facets of the armor channel the light inwards...

Searing light, anyone?Uh, there's a vast difference between diamonds and prisms/lenses. I'd assume the armor was crafted like one might craft a glass armor: I.E. with plates, not prisms/lenses.

[herrhauptmann]

I wonder if he would have some sort of reduced save versus a LIGHT attack, or a multiplied effect, as the facets of the armor channel the light inwards...

Searing light, anyone?

Well if so, and the armor has been in use for a while, it would probably be fair for the DM to tell him he was getting a nerf, and give hm a chance to replace it (especially if he already had the option of selling).

Diamond armor. Well, you don't automatically get more protection from having a harder material for your armor. It's about how well it covers your vulnerables. And if the material is really strong, you can make it thinner and still get the same protection as normal steel (hey, sounds like mithral, right?). Also, if you check out Magic of Faerun, they've got a few options for Platinum and Golden armor. It's not anymore protective vs regular attacks, it just gives you a boost in other areas (small amounts of elemental resistance). Perhaps changing the diamond armor to something like that would be a better option.

But yeah, if he's now an unkillable tank, and he's against smart enemies. Have one face him using combat expertise, proving to be just as tanky and unkillable as he is, while the other enemies go off to kill the rest of the party. Trip him, sunder his shield, there goes 6 or more points of AC. Deadly percussion out of dragon magazine? Now you can sunder armor, and the person under it.
Plus all the spells you can hit him with.

Have a metagame conversation with him. It might actually go better than tailoring all the fights to counter him:
I can't challenge you with enemies that are fair fights while you've got that on. If I up their level so they can hit you, the rest of the party is going to get destroyed. Would you please change your armor so everyone else has fun?

[Shadowleaf]

A Cleric from a poor church wants to steal the armor in order to be able to cast Resurrection a few times. Seeing as the PC is an Evil Half-Orc, he has no quarrels about this.

Queue Touch-AC spells like Harm, Slay Living, etc.

[Gaius Marius]

As said earlier, Diamond armor is a very bad choice of armor material. But you want to run on Comic Book logic, apparently, which is a perfectly valid choice.

In that case, I have 2 recommendation:

Make your player fight Toph (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toph_Bei_Fong)
Or make your player fight ennemies that do sonic damage. By Comic Book logic, sonic damage will ALWAYS shatter diamond.

[Cieyrin]

I can't believe no one has mentioned Shatter (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/shatter.htm) yet...

cackle cackle cackle

[BenInHB]

What are the stats on this diamond full plate??

really i don't think it should give any higher AC. Higher hardness and HP maybe and either more or less armor check penalty but i don't see why it would give better AC.

[Sacrieur]

I can't believe no one has mentioned Shatter (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/shatter.htm) yet...

cackle cackle cackle

I was going to, but does diamond... Meh.

---

He's an evil half-orc. He had to have pissed off someone with very powerful connections along the line.

You remember that commoner you bullied and stole a purse from? He just happens to be good friends with a level 26 Archmage.

Oh and all the full plate in the world won't protect you against a touch attack.

[Telonius]

Plot hook! The player realizes too late that he's actually bought a set of Cubic Zirconia armor. Side quest to find the salesman and wring his lost gp out of him.

[erikun]

A Cleric from a poor church wants to steal the armor in order to be able to cast Resurrection a few times. Seeing as the PC is an Evil Half-Orc, he has no quarrels about this.
Something like this is what I would recommend. Rather than trying to destroy his new armor, or punish him from getting it, or trying to bribe it off him, turn the possession of such armor into a quest.

Perhaps the local thieves guild saw him walking around with it, and figures that setting up an assassination would be worth the risk. Perhaps some snubbed church has decided that this half-orc "heathen" doesn't deserve to be in possession of that much diamond. Perhaps there is some local legend that someone believes can be resurrected from a thousand-year death with such diamond armor, and thus the local government is willing to grant full pardon and immunity for it. (The last might be especially tempting if some local authorities are forced to publicly apologize to the characters.)

Or, heck, all the above could be happening. After all, I would assume that such armor is rather rare. A lot of different people will be interested in acquiring 50+ pounds of worked diamond.

[Cieyrin]

I was going to, but does diamond... Meh.

The beauty of shatter is if it targets one object of up to 10 lbs/level (so a 5th level caster or so should be able to break it), it can be broke regardless of it's composition. Since the half-orc is attending it, it'll require a Will save but I kinda doubt he has a particularly good will save, either.

Alternatively, along the lines of Telonius' suggestion, the armor is actually made of rock salt, illusioned up to be shinier and Magic Aura'd so there's no illusion aura to find. So, whenever they're camped out in the wilderness, he tends to find on his guard shift/when he wakes up in the morning that there are wild animals licking his armor to pieces. Congrats, you have a mobile salt lick. :smallbiggrin:

[Kobold Esq]

The item has to be non-magical for shatter. The OP hasn't said yet whether this is the case.

[Cieyrin]

The item has to be non-magical for shatter. The OP hasn't said yet whether this is the case.


Alternatively, you can target shatter against a single solid object, regardless of composition, weighing up to 10 pounds per caster level.

I was using that line. Using the targeted version, as opposed to the area version, the spell doesn't care about whether it's magical or not. All that it being magical means is that is always gets a save and uses either its own or its owner's saves, which ever's better.

[tyckspoon]

I was using that line. Using the targeted version, as opposed to the area version, the spell doesn't care about whether it's magical or not. All that it being magical means is that is always gets a save and uses either its own or its owner's saves, which ever's better.

Very first line of the spell says "sunders a single solid, nonmagical item." The specific rule for how that is done (10 lb/caster level, doesn't have to be of 'brittle' composition) doesn't have to restate the nonmagical for it to be in effect.

[Jack Zander]

Take a look at your mundane plate armor, now look at me, now back at your armor, now back to me. Your armor is now diamonds!

Sorry, it had to be said...

[Sacrieur]

Isn't there a rogue in the group who would want to steal his armor while he slept?

Or better yet have an NPC Kinder try to do it.

[DwarfFighter]

Take a look at your mundane plate armor, now look at me, now back at your armor, now back to me. Your armor is now diamonds!

Awesome!

-DF

[Cieyrin]

Very first line of the spell says "sunders a single solid, nonmagical item." The specific rule for how that is done (10 lb/caster level, doesn't have to be of 'brittle' composition) doesn't have to restate the nonmagical for it to be in effect.

Hmm, this is what I get for checking only parts of spells and basing the rest off of memory. Well, here's hoping this 'diamond' armor cost him enough that he hasn't got it enchanted yet.

[MammonAzrael]

You know without the OP responding to the initial questions, I think any further discussion is rather unproductive. I think we've covered all the bases from dealing with the armor to taking it away to changing it. For anything more specific we need to know just what this diamond armor is doing.

[herrhauptmann]

Hmmm, he's got two posts to his credit.
I don't think he's coming back.

[Gnaeus]

What levels are these characters? This is a FIGHTER for crying out loud. He will eventually fade into obscurity even if Diamond Armor gives AC 500. Everything he fights should just ignore him, kill his teammates, then deal with him last.

[herrhauptmann]

What levels are these characters? This is a FIGHTER for crying out loud. He will eventually fade into obscurity even if Diamond Armor gives AC 500. Everything he fights should just ignore him, kill his teammates, then deal with him last.

It sounds like a new/inexperienced group, not just DM. In such a situation, they usually tend towards blaster wizard and healbot cleric. Which means the warrior could probably shine for a much longer period of time.

As for solutions, well we've already covered those, and why they're useless at this point. The OP hasn't come back to answer a single question, so I'm starting to have thoughts about him/her in a particular, not good, direction.

[Alpha0010]

Or better yet have an NPC Kinder try to do it.

"Oops, you dropped your armor. I must have picked it up..."

[Dergmann]

The game in which this takes place is Microlite 20, essentially a boiled down version of 3.0 DnD. The diamond armor was really just something I tried o use to decrease the party's wealth. I whipped it up entirely on the spot, no reference, no nothing. Its not enchanted, just really hard mineral. Sorry for wasting anyone's time.

[Seerow]

What levels are these characters? This is a FIGHTER for crying out loud. He will eventually fade into obscurity even if Diamond Armor gives AC 500. Everything he fights should just ignore him, kill his teammates, then deal with him last.

You're missing the biggest advantage of diamond armor: It makes everyone who sees him instantly want it for their own profit, thus giving him effectively a permanent WoW-style taunt applying to all enemies, and even to some normally neutral NPCs. So everything wastes -all- of their time attacking the Fighter who shrugs off their attacks thanks to his awesome diamond armor, while the rest of the party kills it.