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Choco
2011-03-15, 11:25 AM
Because these issues will likely come up with the Ranger I am going to play in a 4e game shortly:

1) Since an unarmed strike is listed as a 1-handed weapon, and a ranger can dual-wield 1-handed weapons, could I dual-wield unarmed strikes? I can't find anything that says I can't do this, and if I ever lose (by any means) even 1 of my 2 weapons most of my powers will be unusable, so I gotta know this for sure.

2) Do defense bonuses from Predator hide armor stack? Basically the text of the armor says that when you hit the enemy you have your hunter's quarry on you get +x (x scales with quality of armor) to all defenses against attacks made by that enemy until the end of your next turn. That bonus is untyped, so if I hit the enemy 3 times would the defense bonus stack 3 times? Or does it not stack because it is from the same source?

Also some DDI character builder ranting/questions....

I encountered these issues and I wonder if they are bugs or if the rules have been changed:

1) I am dual-wielding bastard swords, and one of them is a Farbond sword. It basically can be used as a heavy thrown weapon. However, my OTHER bastard sword (a Harmony one, though I dont think that makes a difference) is also listed as being a thrown weapon. I think this is a bug, or is it?

2) Heavy thrown weapons still use strength instead of dexterity for attack and damage rolls right? I ask this because on DDI my ranged attacks (all with a heavy thrown weapon) are still listed as using dex. Is this a bug too?

Badgerish
2011-03-15, 11:40 AM
1) Technically yes. Get spiked gauntlets (AV1) or wrist blades (Dark Sun) so there isn't any confusion and you have a better weapon.

2) Untyped bonuses from the same source don't stack.

3)

4) 'Heavy Thrown' weapons use Str for hit/damage on basic ranged attacks. If you use a power, it uses whatever stat is listed in the power.

Kurald Galain
2011-03-15, 11:42 AM
(1) Most ranger powers specify "you must be wielding two melee weapons or a ranged one". When you're unarmed, you're by definition not "wielding two melee weapons". However, this isn't really a big problem considering the overall lack of sunder-effects in the game. You can always dual wield two improvised whatevers if you really need to.

(2) Bonuses from the same source never stack.

(3 and 4) Yes. Whenever the charbuilder contradicts your books, the latter take precedence.

Gillric
2011-03-15, 12:04 PM
The issue with the latter taking precedence with relation to the books is the errata. The character builder is updated periodically with the errata (changes to the material in the books). For example, the battlerager fighter as written in PHB1 is way different then the errata'd version of the class.

Kurald Galain
2011-03-15, 12:39 PM
The issue with the latter taking precedence with relation to the books is the errata.

Errata > Books > FAQ > Charbuilder.

Bagelz
2011-03-15, 03:47 PM
1) as said "Most ranger powers specify "you must be wielding two melee weapons or a ranged one". When you're unarmed, you're by definition not "wielding two melee weapons"."
you are also not wielding an offhand weapon for the purposes of feats (such as the one that grants +1ac if you wield a light weapon in your offhand).

you can however use unarmed attacks for powers that have the weapon keyword if they don't specify further.

i'm guessing the farbond is a character builder glitch,

Choco
2011-03-15, 04:53 PM
K thanks for clearing that up guys. If nothing else I'll just have to grab any random item to use as an improvised weapon so I'll count as wielding it. I'll also look into the gauntlets and wrist blades, can't hurt since I am already loaded with weapons anyway :smallamused:.

I misread the heavy thrown weapon text and glossed over where it says it only applies to ranged basic attacks, but that means there is still a bug in the character builder because my ranged basic attack entry still uses dexterity.

Mando Knight
2011-03-15, 04:58 PM
1) I am dual-wielding bastard swords, and one of them is a Farbond sword. It basically can be used as a heavy thrown weapon. However, my OTHER bastard sword (a Harmony one, though I dont think that makes a difference) is also listed as being a thrown weapon. I think this is a bug, or is it?

2) Heavy thrown weapons still use strength instead of dexterity for attack and damage rolls right? I ask this because on DDI my ranged attacks (all with a heavy thrown weapon) are still listed as using dex. Is this a bug too?

First one is a bug, probably caused by how the Farbond (and similar enchantments) adds the Heavy Thrown keyword to the weapon. For the second one, though, the Character Builder is indeed correct. Only Ranged Basic attacks use your Strength modifier if you're using a Heavy Thrown weapon. None of your class powers are changed unless you've got something else that specifically alters it (i.e. Combat Virtuoso).