Looking to setup a ranged skirmisher Scout

[FireStorm]

Hello

Im setting up a scout char for optimized ranged skirmishing and am looking for suggestions as to prestige classes and feats.

Plan to have a catfolk with high dex, int, and con.

Feats- Point Blank Shot, Rapid Shot, Many Shot, Greater Manyshot

Considered Swift Hunter, and havent decided yet on it

Current plan is to go into Dragon Devotee, but not decided yet on the matter.

Any help would be greatly appreciated! :smallsmile:

[Andion Isurand]

There is at least one handbook (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19872750/The_Swift_Hunters_Handbook_--_2007) written over the Swift Hunter feat.

If the greater manyshot skirmish is going to be your signature attack... I'd say go for the Swift Hunter feat, and aim for Scout 4/Ranger X for a Base Attack Bonus of 16+ before going epic.

Pick up the Arcane Hunter ACF from Complete Mage to pick Arcanists as your first favored enemy... and from there pick favored enemies normally immune to critical hits and precision damage, so you can apply your skirmish damage against them using the Swift Hunter feat. Plants, constructs, undead, elementals, etc etc

[Curmudgeon]

As an alternative to Greater Manyshot (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/psionicFeats.htm#greaterManyshot), which you could at earliest take as your level 9 feat, you might want to see about solving the key Scout problem: getting 10' movement with a full attack.

A 1-level dip into Cloistered Cleric can net you Knowledge plus 2 other domains, and you can use the rules in Complete Champion (page 53) to convert domains into their associated domain feats. In particular, Travel domain converted to Travel Devotion will let you move your speed as a swift action, for 10 consecutive rounds 1/day. With a 12 CHA you'll also be able to use your turn undead attempts to do this 2 more times daily: good for 3 combats. The other domain can be something like Elf, which grants Point Blank Shot.

[Flickerdart]

You'll probably want the Improved Skirmish feat, to add +2d6 and +2 AC to your skirmish whenever you move 20 feet. With Greater Manyshot, that shouldn't be a problem.

I would advise not neglecting your Strength, as even a small bonus there will pay off may times over when you're firing a ridiculous number of attacks.

[begooler]

Expeditious Dodge from Races of the Wild would be good to go with if you are doing a Dodge feat chain, or just want a dodge bonus to AC. It grants a +2 dodge bonus when you move 40 ft, and can by used as Dodge to qualify for feats and prestige classes. The best part is the dodge bonus is against all creatures, not just one that you choose.


Edit:
I'm also wondering if there's any merit to a dip in Battle Sorcerer and then some levels of Unseen Seer. Both have the same BAB as the scout, and Unseen Seer gives skirmish damage advancement. (I think actually a little bit faster than scout does.) There are several low level arcane spells that can be useful for a archer, and you can pick up the ranger spell Hunter's Eye.

[Darrin]

I'm also wondering if there's any merit to a dip in Battle Sorcerer and then some levels of Unseen Seer. Both have the same BAB as the scout, and Unseen Seer gives skirmish damage advancement. (I think actually a little bit faster than scout does.) There are several low level arcane spells that can be useful for a archer, and you can pick up the ranger spell Hunter's Eye.

Battle Sorcerer isn't necessary if you take 4 levels of Dragon Devotee. DD3 gives you one level of Sorcerer, so pick at least two divination spells (true strike and sniper's shot, for example) and you can qualify for Unseen Seer (well, at least for the spellcasting portion of the requirements).

You can use 4 levels of Dragon Devotee, 4 levels of Unseen Seer, and 2 levels of Highland Stalker to increase your skirmish damage by +5d6. Combined with Swift Hunter and Improved Skirmish, you can get up to +10d6 Skirmish damage by ECL 19, which almost puts you on par with the Rogue:

Race: Human, Azurin, Strongheart Halfing (you *need* that bonus feat)
1) Ranger 1. Feat: Travel Devotion, Bonus: PB Shot, Bonus: Track
2) Ranger 2. Bonus: Rapid Shot
3) Scout 1. Feat: Precise Shot. Skirmish 1d6
4) Scout 2. Skirmish 1d6.
5) Scout 3. Skirmish 1d6 +1
6) Scout 4. Feat: Swift Hunter. Bonus: Improved Skirmish. Skirmish 2d6 +1/4d6 +3.
7) Dragon Devotee 1.
8) Dragon Devotee 2. Skirmish 3d6 +1/5d6 +3
9) Dragon Devotee 3. Feat: Manyshot. 1st level Sorcerer casting (get at least 2 divination spells)
10) Dragon Devotee 4. Skirmish 4d6 +1/6d6 +3
11) Unseen Seer 1. Skirmish 5d6 +1/7d6 +3
12) Unseen Seer 2. Feat: Greater Manyshot. Advanced Learning: Hunter's Eye
13) Unseen Seer 3.
14) Unseen Seer 4. Skirmish 6d6 +1/8d6 +3
15) Highland Stalker 1. Feat: Improved Rapid Shot.
16) Highland Stalker 2. Skirmish 7d6 +1/9d6 +3
17) Ranger 3. Bonus: Endurance. Skirmish 7d6 +2/9d6 +4
18) Ranger 4. Feat: Knowledge Devotion.
19) Ranger 5. Skirmish 8d6 +2/10d6 +4
20) Anything +1 (Spellsword 1 is nice, +1 BAB and +1 CL)

If you can get the Precise property on your bow early, you can skip Precise Shot (or retrain/psychic reformation/chaos shuffle it later) and take something else (maybe EWP: Bone Bow, or move up taking Knowledge Devotion). If Travel Devotion + Rapid Shot is working well for you, you can delay Manyshot/Greater Manyshot until later.

Some general notes on weapons/magic items/enhancements for ranged combat:


Bone Bow (250 GP, Frostburn). Mechanically this functions the same as a Composite Greatbow, but it accommodates any Strength bonus without having to pay for each +1. If you use a lot of spells/powers/effects that changes your Strength score (bull's strength, rage, enlarge person, expansion, etc.), then this could be well worth spending a feat on Exotic Weapon Proficiency. It also offers the option to treat it as a martial weapon, but treating it as a non-proficient exotic weapon is actually better: you still take a -4 penalty, but you're not limited to one attack as a full-round action.

Elvencraft Bow (+300 GP, Races of the Wild). There are a variety of combination bow/melee weapons out there, but this is the simplest and cheapest. 300 GP and you can treat your bow as a club or quarterstaff even if you're still using it as a bow. If you're looking for something fancier, the MIC features three types of Swordbows (free action to switch), a Bowstaff (swift action to switch), and a Bladed Crossbow (no action to switch).

Footbow (150 GP + 100 GP/Str bonus, Races of the Wild). Pretty much identical to a non-exotic composite longbow. However, if you can fly (i.e., Dragonborn of Bahumat or Raptoran) and can draw it back with both hands, you can get 1.5 times your Strength bonus on damage.

Greatbow, Composite (200 GP + 200 GP/Str bonus, Complete Warrior). The Bone Bow is a much better choice (cheaper, auto-adjusts to your Str bonus) The 1 point of damage increase over a regular composite longbow may not seem like it would be worth a feat, but for a ranged build, you need as much extra damage as you can get your hands on.

Hank's Energy Bow (22600 GP, Animated Series Handbook or available online). One of the few ways you can get something similar to Power Attack on a ranged weapon (but unfortunately does not offer the same damage multipliers). On top of that, it's an extremely versatile weapon that does not require any ammo, does an impressive 2d6 force damage, can use regular arrows, and can accommodate any Strength bonus.

Precise Shot (+1 enhancement, MIC p. 40). No need to take Precise Shot as a feat.

Horizon Goggles (8000 GP, Complete Mage p. 133) or Helm of the Hunter (9000 GP, MIC p. 194). Provides the Far Shot feat.

Splitting (+3 enhancement, Champions of Ruin p. 42). I can haz moar arrowz.

Spellstoring Arrow +1 (166 GP each, DMG). With multiple attacks, allows you to cast multiple spells in a round. Works best with touch spells, but otherwise a swiss-army-knife of awesomeness if your DM isn't too picky about the spell requirements (i.e., if he allows "targeted spell" to include rays, some area effects, etc.).

Pitspawned template (+1000 GP, DMGII). +2 untyped bonus to confirm criticals.

Strongarm Bracers (6000 GP, MIC p. 139). Increase your weapon damage up one size category without mucking around with Powerful Build or Monkey Grip.

Bracers of Lightning (11000 GP, MIC p. 206). Adds the shock property to all your attacks, including ranged. Although somewhat expensive, in most cases it's probably cheaper to buy these bracers than trying to add another +1 property to an existing magic weapon. The biggest drawback is it takes a swift action to activate, and most ToB builds are going to need their swift actions for something else.

Crystal of Energy Assault, Lesser (3000 GP, MIC p. 64). Another great way to add +1d6 energy damage to your ranged attacks without spending a lot of gold. I recommend the Acid Assault, since fire, cold, and sonic damage can be added with spells, and electricity can be added with Bracers of Lightning.

Quiver of Energy (15000 GP, MIC p. 172). Adds 1d6 acid/cold/electricity/fire damage to 20 arrows.

Messenger Arrow (400 GP, Ghostwalk Web Enhancement (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20030607a)). Locates any named creature within 100' in 1 round, ignores invisibility/hidden/disguised targets, and also ignores the Darkstalker feat.


Add a Wand Chamber (100 GP, Dungeonscape) to your bow. If possible, add them to any other weapon you can carry around while also using a bow: armor spikes, spiked guantlets, gnome quickrazor, elbow/knee/sleeve blades, etc.

Swift and Immediate action spells for your wand chamber:


Arrow Mind (Spell Compendium, Rgr/Sor/Wiz 1). Actually, I don't recommend this spell, since you can spend +300 GP for an elvencraft bow (Races of the Wild), which lets you threaten squares around you and treat your longbow as a quarterstaff. However, Arrow Mind also allows you to make ranged attacks without triggering AoOs. But if you're good about staying out of melee range, have reliable flight, or a method to move + full attack, you can ignore Arrow Mind.

Arrow Storm (Spell Compendium, Rgr 3). Whirlwind Attack with a bow, up to a number of targets equal to your character level. Expensive, but a neat way to get that "I Am Pure Awesome" rush.

Critical Strike (Complete Mage, Asn 1). Ignore concealment on next attack. Note: this is different from the Critical Strike in the Spell Compendium, which is a melee-only spell. If you're only making one attack, this version is a little better than Guided Shot, since it works against total concealment. If you're making multiple ranged attacks, then Guided Shot is better.

Energy Surge, Lesser (PHBII, Sor/Wiz 2). Adds +1d6 energy damage to all your attacks for 1 round. Doesn't specify melee, and doesn't say anything about discharging after one hit, so this should work for bows.

Fly, Swift (Spell Compendium, Brd/Sor/Wis 2). A good "Get Out of Death Free" card in certain situations, although a permanent flight speed (Dragonborn of Bahumat, Feathered Wings graft, Winged Mask) is much preferred.

Golemstrike/Gravestrike/Vinestrike (Spell Compendium, Sor/Wiz 1, Clr/Pal 1, Dru/Rgr 1). Use sneak attack/skirmish on constructs/undead/plants.

Guided Shot (Spell Compendium, Rgr/Sor/Wiz 1). Ignore distance penalty and anything less than total concealment on all your ranged attacks for the round.

Haste, Swift (Spell Compendium, Rgr 2). Ranged characters need all the extra attacks they can get. Unlike other swift spells, this one lasts 1d4 rounds.

Hunter's Eye (PHBII, Rgr 2). +1d6 sneak attack for every 3 caster levels.

Instant of Power (Forge of War, Brd/Dru/Rgr 1). +4 enhancement bonus on your next attack, save, or damage roll.

Invisibility, Swift (Spell Compendium, Brd 1). Full attack, go invisible, 5' step, watch your enemies *whiff* for a round.

Master's Touch (Spell Compendium, Brd/Sor/Wiz 1). Use an exotic ranged weapon without wasting a feat on Exotic Weapon Proficiency. Bone Bow (Frostburn) is very nice: functions as a composite longbow regardless of your Strength bonus.

Nerveskitter (Spell Compendium, Sor/Wiz 1). Going first means all targets are flat-footed.

Sniper's Shot (Spell Compendium, Asn/Rgr/Sor/Wiz 1). Sneak attack/skirmish at any range.

Wings of Cover (Races of the Dragon, Sor 2). Negate one attack as an immediate action.


Other non-swift/immediate spells for adding energy damage to ranged attacks:


Burning Sword (Spell Compendium p. 41, Sor/Wis 2). Flaming burst weapon 1 min/level.

Frost Weapon (Frostburn p. 95, Clr/Dru/Sor/Wiz 2). +1d6 frost damage 1 round/level.

Sonic Weapon (Spell Compendium p. 195, Brd/Sor/Wiz 2). +1d6 sonic damage 1 min/level.

[begooler]

If you can squeeze a cloistered cleric level in there somewhere you can free up three feats, and also get knowledge devotion earlier. (Domains: Knowledge(Devotion) Travel(Devotion) and Elf(Point Blank Shot)

Do you have to take multiclassing penalties into account for this campaign?

[Curmudgeon]

A 1-level dip into Cloistered Cleric can net you Knowledge plus 2 other domains, and you can use the rules in Complete Champion (page 53) to convert domains into their associated domain feats. In particular, Travel domain converted to Travel Devotion will let you move your speed as a swift action, for 10 consecutive rounds 1/day. With a 12 CHA you'll also be able to use your turn undead attempts to do this 2 more times daily: good for 3 combats. The other domain can be something like Elf, which grants Point Blank Shot.

If you can squeeze a cloistered cleric level in there somewhere you can free up three feats, and also get knowledge devotion earlier. (Domains: Knowledge(Devotion) Travel(Devotion) and Elf(Point Blank Shot)
Gee, I wonder why I didn't think of that? :smallwink:

[begooler]

Gee, I wonder why I didn't think of that? :smallwink:

Your idea is a good one (as well as commonly used one,) which is why I reiterated it in response to Darrin's build as it uses each of those feats, but not the cloistered cleric shortcut to getting them.


Another possibility: Knowledge (Devotion,) Travel (Devotion,) Time (Domain)
Being a catfolk, it might be inappropriate for OP to have the Elf domain, in which case he might want to get PB shot elsewhere, and take something like Time that gives Improved Initiative. (This is the domain selection that the cloistered cleric-dip-swift-hunter in the party that I DM has)

Or, Celerity, to increase his already fast movement speed even more.

[FireStorm]

Okey dokey, apparently DM is restricting the use of spells, and he is going for a Captain Planet gish theme.

Current plan is-
Catfolk
Ranger 2
Scout 5
Dragon Devotee 2

Feats-
Point Blank
Rapidshot
Manyshot
Greater Manyshot
Improved Skirmish
Swift Hunter

Have and obscenely high dex so high ac- around 28, 32 with skirmish

Was seeing a severe lack of prestige classes for scouts.
Highland stalker seems situational and not as good as scout
Considering Dread Commando

Thoughts?

Thank you for suggestions so far, yall are amazing :)

[FireStorm]

And special thanks for all the research on the spells, i liked a couple of them, and am also looking at ones outa champions of ruin.