[Exalted] What is up with Terrestrial Aspect associations anyway?

[Weimann]

Here's just something that bother me. Have a look at what is usually considered within the purview of the different Aspect thematics.

Fire - flames, heat
Water - water
Earth - rock, earth
Wood - wood, plants
Air - winds, cold, lightning

Of course, there are other associations to the different aspects, such as Fire representing passion and Water fluency and so on, but these seem to be the purely elemental things that come to each Aspect.

What strikes me is that Air is clearly favoured. Not only does it have the most numerous of associations, it also has the most diverse. The others are pretty tightly tied to manipulations of their core concept, but cold isn't obvious as an offshoot from air (it does get cold when it blows hard, but it can be cold in doldrums too) and the only connection I can see to lightning is that it's high up in the sky.

Question is, how could one expand the other Aspects to include other secondary associations? Magma, for example, could be associated with Fire or Earth. Personally, I'd like cold to go with Water so that one could use associate it with ice in good conscience, but the North is Air aspected in Creation, so it's not an easy transition. Metal could be associated with Earth.

Any other ideas?

[Reynard]

Well, a lot of that oddness is to do with the way WW assigned the elements in the first place.

Air = North = Cold, windy, and very stormy.
Fire = South = Very hot.
Wood = East = Trees and stuff.
Water = West = Er... islands and oceans and not much else.
Center = Earth = Big-ass mountain. Also the lynchpin of Creation.

[Morph Bark]

If you make the links primary to the poles and such, you could associate sand with Fire, probably light as well (cuz hey, few deserts are really cloudy).

[Kyeudo]

Do those associations actually give Air Aspects any sort of advantage? No. Dragon-Blooded all have access to the same Charms, with only the out-of-Aspect surcharge to actually make it matter what element a particular Charm falls under.

[golentan]

I view this as kind of a non-issue personally. If you're concerned, some thematic expansions (both within and unmentioned by the rules) can include
Water: Blood, Acid, Kinetic Energy. Just generally liquid and motion are major themes.
Wood: Poison, "Chi," animals. Not to mention the wide ranges you get from plant life in creation.
Earth: metal, Sonic waves. And they have that whole focal crystal/awareness thing going on.
Fire: Light, Shockwaves. And c'mon, it's bleeping fire!

And I disagree about lightning not really belonging with air. Meterological effects and all, and one without an obvious other element to group with (rain goes with water as an obvious example).

[MickJay]

Sonic waves seem much more fitting for Air than Earth. Tremors and the like, fine, but sound?

Unrelated, but I still don't really understand why Performance ended up in Wood, as pretty much any other element (except for Earth) seems more fitting. Lack of space in other aspects?

[golentan]

Because flowers are there purely as a display (probably even more so in creation)?

Anywhoo, I tend to think of tremors and echolocation as being associated with the deep earth (and ocean), but maybe it's just me on the sonic.

[Tavar]

No, sonic makes sense. Heck, those waves travel a bit better through rock rather than air.

[Indon]

Do those associations actually give Air Aspects any sort of advantage? No. Dragon-Blooded all have access to the same Charms, with only the out-of-Aspect surcharge to actually make it matter what element a particular Charm falls under.

It matters to determine what elemental associations a TMA might have, and it provides additional flavor options for developing new charms.

You can also draw upon features of elemental dragons and elemental martial arts styles for further inspiration.

[IcarusWings]

Personally, I've always wanted to change it so that Ice falls under Water (for obvious reasons), and Lightning doesn't fall under anything, considering it's already an Autochthonian Element on its own, and shouldn't be part of another (same reasoning for why I always oppose giving Earth metal, and giving Water blood and acid (Blood and Vitriol respectively)). I've also always wanted to jig things around so that the Elemental Pole of Air is high in the sky (a sixth direction of 'up'), and the north is replaced by something (maybe an element that got destroyed during Primordial War/Great Contagion).

[Kyeudo]

If you move ice to fall under the aspect of Water, then the West becomes freezing and the North and East get their temerature bands screwed up because the cold Elemental Pole is no longer opposite the hot Elemental Pole.

[IcarusWings]

If you move ice to fall under the aspect of Water, then the West becomes freezing and the North and East get their temerature bands screwed up because the cold Elemental Pole is no longer opposite the hot Elemental Pole.

I suppose, that's why I suggested rejigging the location of the elemental poles though. To be honest it's just a half-baked idea spawned from a pet peeve.

[The Rose Dragon]

Personally, I've always wanted to change it so that Ice falls under Water (for obvious reasons), and Lightning doesn't fall under anything, considering it's already an Autochthonian Element on its own, and shouldn't be part of another (same reasoning for why I always oppose giving Earth metal, and giving Water blood and acid (Blood and Vitriol respectively)).

The problem is that Lightning, Vitriol and such have no effect on Creation's metaphysics, and they did not even exist before the Primordial War. As such, all of them have to exist in Creation somehow, without being tied to alien metaphysics.

[Kyeudo]

I suppose, that's why I suggested rejigging the location of the elemental poles though. To be honest it's just a half-baked idea spawned from a pet peeve.

If you put ice under the aspect of Water and switch the Pole of Air and the Pole of Water, then the north turns into iceberg-land (not just snow covered land) and the West dries up. What would be left out West? What climactic effect would the Pole of Air have if it lost cold as an aspect association?

You can see that I doubt you can move cold out of Air's aspect without completely rewriting the entire Exalted map.

[golentan]

Yeah. Removing Ice from air causes the exalted map to make approximately 0 sense from either an in or out of story context.

[Indon]

If you put ice under the aspect of Water and switch the Pole of Air and the Pole of Water, then the north turns into iceberg-land (not just snow covered land) and the West dries up. What would be left out West? What climactic effect would the Pole of Air have if it lost cold as an aspect association?

You can see that I doubt you can move cold out of Air's aspect without completely rewriting the entire Exalted map.

Without cold under its' purview, I imagine the Pole of Air as a smoke ring (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Integral_Trees).

[golentan]

I loved those books! And I always viewed the far north as a little like that, but with no trees (too eastern).