Good PvP?

[Mr. Zolrane]

I'm something a newb (about six months into my first campaign) and reading this and other forums I've generally heard PvP described as a bad thing in DnD, and as a general rule I see why: party infighting generally is bad. But I had an experience recently with some PvP that really helped us solidify who we are as a party and made for some of the best RP of the campaign:

Basically, our party leader was the Neutral Good Half-Elf Bard, and she also was in charge of the party bag (which contained a sizable amount of GP and our all-important Staff of Restoration). She shared a room at the inn with the Chaotic Evil Elven Rogue-Assassin, on account of being the only two women in the party. Our party, while it started off fairly Evil and Chaotic has, due to character development (as well as a bit of... turnover) has become quite a bit more Lawful and Good.
Out of game, the Assassin's player realized that the Assassin was becoming more and more alienated from the party, due to her being, well, a cackling avatar of every negative stereotype of Rogues (primarily boundless greed). The player decided something needed to be done, so during the night, in-game, the Assassin killed and decapitated the Bard in her sleep, stole the party bag and made a rather ham-fisted attempt at framing the Blackguard for it (he's not Evil anymore, the DM allowed it, long, unrelated story). My character (Barbarian with an Evil-smiting homebrew PrC) didn't buy it for a second, and after seeing to it that the Bard's body was taken care of, the Blackguard and I, as well as the Fighter (Ostensibly Evil, but more of an overly flippant douche than Evil, really) and the Sorcerer (Neutral) quickly located the Assassin with several of her flunkies. I'll spare you the details of the fight, but long story short, we ground them into the dust. Surprisingly, by the end of the session, the Assassin's player had rejoined the party as, of all things, a Paladin.


I tell that long, rambling story to say this: we had PvP, and it worked tremendously well for the campaign. Has anyone else had this experience?

[Firechanter]

Not as such, but I'm interested in seeing more stories posted here.

Personally I am strongly opposed to party PvP, except of course if it's consenting and/or happens in an arena-style way. First off, I strongly believe that it's the responsibility of every player to make a party-compatible character from the beginning. Rule Zero is "Don't play with douches".

Regarding your story, in the place of your bard player I would have been majorly pissed -- the assassin player decides the character doesn't fit in the party, so she _kills another character_? I guess that's "putting the ass in the assassin". If I were the bard player, and that killed character meant anything to me, I would probably refuse to keep playing in the same group as the assassin player, paladin or not.
Just saying -- I'm a bit amazed that it worked out for your group; it could have easily gone the other way and alienated the players from each other.

[Mr. Zolrane]

Not as such, but I'm interested in seeing more stories posted here.

Personally I am strongly opposed to party PvP, except of course if it's consenting and/or happens in an arena-style way. First off, I strongly believe that it's the responsibility of every player to make a party-compatible character from the beginning. Rule Zero is "Don't play with douches".

Regarding your story, in the place of your bard player I would have been majorly pissed -- the assassin player decides the character doesn't fit in the party, so she _kills another character_? I guess that's "putting the ass in the assassin". If I were the bard player, and that killed character meant anything to me, I would probably refuse to keep playing in the same group as the assassin player, paladin or not.
Just saying -- I'm a bit amazed that it worked out for your group; it could have easily gone the other way and alienated the players from each other.

We got the Bard rezzed with relative ease, I guess I forgot to mention that. This was planned between sessions by the Assassin player and OKed by the DM, so the DM made sure it would be fun and interesting for everyone, and the Bard even got some roleplaying XP "for the experience of being dead" (my DM's words, verbatim) Plus, it helps that we're all pretty close friends IRL.

[Firechanter]

Oh yes, that changes that. I had assumed your party was of rather low level, where you don't yet have ready access to raise/ress. Good job if even the bard player had a good time. ^^

[Widdlyscuds]

An interesting experience but in most cases it does not go that way , most cases it just goes down south real quick with players going at each others throats , for example I was a jerk player (chaotic evil schizophrenic psychopathic rogue assassin) and I had to switch character mid-adventure because it was so unfitting with the group , but this experience is an interesting one and should used as an example.

[Mr. Zolrane]

An interesting experience but in most cases it does not go that way , most cases it just goes down south real quick with players going at each others throats , for example I was a jerk player (chaotic evil schizophrenic psychopathic rogue assassin) and I had to switch character mid-adventure because it was so unfitting with the group , but this experience is an interesting one and should used as an example.

You think so? If so, then I may just use it as an example if this topic ever comes up again.

Honestly, I really think the people involved are what really make the difference. For example, earlier in the campaign, my previous character was murdered by the Blackguard (still just a fighter then) rather unceremoniously as soon as the opportunity presented itself. At the time, I was pretty mad at the Blackguard's player. My new character (though it wasn't revealed right away) was the brother figure of my previous character, and initially was created just to make the Blackguard's life miserable. Out of game, I got past a lot of personal issues that were affecting every aspect of my life, including how I played the game. The result was better RP on my part (my old character, while well-meaning was kind of a tool at the end of the day) and far less argument at the table. And the Blackguard is now my most reliable friend and ally in-game. Just goes to show how important our IRL attitudes are to the game I guess.

[VarianArdell]

I don't know if this counts as PvP, but in a campaign I'm playing in, I played a Neutral Evil Raptoran Artificer, in a party with a couple monks, an anthro bear barbarian, a fire elf rogue, and a dark knight (homebrew class). My character's mentality could be summarized in one sentence: "Knowledge is power." Enter an artifact-level demonic spellbook (DC 50 for UMD). The ensuing battle threatened to kill all of us, and the barbarian got the bright idea to sacrifice my character to the book. It worked, but three other characters died beforehand.

[HalfDragonCube]

Recently there was a sort of a PvP in the campaign I'm in.


The party was in a library about to fight a couple of spider swarms (everyone either lvl 1 or 2). Me, Good Drow Cleric/ Rogue (watered-down homebrew drow with no LA), was roped to the Chaotic Evil Barbarian/ Warlock who had Spider Climb as his invocation. The plan was that he would carry me up the bookcase from where I would have a vantage point to rain down spells and flasks of acid.

In the my first turn of combat I cast Nimbus of Light, command my Unseen Servant to float above the spiders with a flask of acid and a ball from a bag of tricks, and throw a ball from a grey bag of tricks with is strapped to a flask of acid.

Warlock's turn next, but instead of hearing the words 'I climb the bookcase'; I hear 'I reverse into the spiders'.:smalleek:

We were both dead by the end of the round.


The story is kind of condensed; I had (sort of) conned the PC out of all of their money earlier, but does this count as PvP? Although the spiders actually killed me, the PC certainly caused my death.

[Mr. Zolrane]

Recently there was a sort of a PvP in the campaign I'm in.


The party was in a library about to fight a couple of spider swarms (everyone either lvl 1 or 2). Me, Good Drow Cleric/ Rogue (watered-down homebrew drow with no LA), was roped to the Chaotic Evil Barbarian/ Warlock who had Spider Climb as his invocation. The plan was that he would carry me up the bookcase from where I would have a vantage point to rain down spells and flasks of acid.

In the my first turn of combat I cast Nimbus of Light, command my Unseen Servant to float above the spiders with a flask of acid and a ball from a bag of tricks, and throw a ball from a grey bag of tricks with is strapped to a flask of acid.

Warlock's turn next, but instead of hearing the words 'I climb the bookcase'; I hear 'I reverse into the spiders'.:smalleek:

We were both dead by the end of the round.


The story is kind of condensed; I had (sort of) conned the PC out of all of their money earlier, but does this count as PvP? Although the spiders actually killed me, the PC certainly caused my death.

I think it feeding someone to a horrible monster counts. My current character was sacrificed to a Pit Fiend (now the ostensible Big Bad of our campaign) by the Blackguard to gain his powers (as I said earlier, the Blackguard's reformed and my character is, at heart a very forgiving soul). I got better. At the time, it certainly felt like PvP to me.

[Gnaeus]

An interesting experience but in most cases it does not go that way , most cases it just goes down south real quick with players going at each others throats ,

This. In most cases, it means at least that some PCs can no longer be played (because the party won't accept them back, or they wouldn't come back). It is disproportionally likely to lead to ooc accusations like DM bias, metagaming, etc (you killed me because you didn't like what I did outside the game, or because you had information out of character).

In mature parties, if backed by good roleplaying and solid IC reasons, it can work. It causes problems in most groups.